4593 réponses à ce sujet

[Ozzy]

"Don't let his looks fool you. He's still an *******!"

 

ahahaha

[Mr.House]

"Don't let his looks fool you. He's still an *******!"

 

ahahaha

Watch as he gets Yukari, Mitsuru or Junpei killed knowing my luck.

[Ozzy]

Nah, they'll all realise how much they actually care about Ken and how they should follow him to the promised land. Ken becomes the new wild card.

 

And P5 protagonist. 

[CrazyRah]

Nah, they'll all realise how much they actually care about Ken and how they should follow him to the promised land. Ken becomes the new wild card.

 

And P5 protagonist. 

 

That's nightmare fuel if i've ever known of any 

[Mr.House]

Nah, they'll all realise how much they actually care about Ken and how they should follow him to the promised land. Ken becomes the new wild card.

 

And P5 protagonist. 

I don't think Atlus is suicidal.

[Ozzy]

Come on guys.

 

You know you want it.

 

Come on.

 

[TheChris92]

Well, that was a load of fun -- Anyway, here's the actual translation.

[Mr.House]

Ken is trying too hard to be badass.

[Matieo]

There's alot of reasons I dislike the character. First he has only one purpose, a purpose that is resolved in one month, once that purpose is done, he has NO point in the game. Koros purpose was to show that persona users where not just humans(all persona users till P3 where humans) so Koro had a purpose to show how vast persona was, and since he was a dog he didn't need a super complex arc to make him needed. So after October 4th, Ken is now a gloried paperweight character who does NOTHING. Everyones arc is still on going but Ken? He's done, finished.
 
Second, Ken is a ten year old kid, joining a group that is filled with 16/17 year old. Am I the only one that has a massive issue with this? This is not Final Fantasy or your typical JRPG. These teens/young adults do things and say things that are NOT for a kid his age and while Ken can try to act like a mature adult, he simply is not, ffs he has not even gone through puberty and still has his baby voice. It's also not believable that a group of a16/17 year olds that are in a official school group would even have a ten year old with them and before someone mentions Aigis, Aigis was made to combat shadows and has the body of a teenage woman so she is in fact very believable to join the group.
 
Third, October 4th. Yup you knew this was coming. This event only fuels my dislike for the character, but not just because of what he wants to do, but because he outright left the group two people short, AT A MOON OPERATION. What the bloody ****!? Ken knows every well moon operations are very important and vital and anything can happen(no moon operation has always gone according to plan after all, sure they where all successful but something always happen) so for him to pull that stunt is just extremely stupid
 
Fourth, his social link and how awkward, creepy and horrifying it is, even if you don't romance him. The lines are creepy, Ken assumes you want him, makes creepy ass advances ect. It's overall a horrifying experience and to make it worse, his social link is unnecessary complex wto the point he's the only s-link I use a guide for so I don't click a flag by accident because Atlus thought it would be funny to put flags with dialog that did not sound flirty with a ten year old kid, as a 16/17 year old female. That's pedophilia people.

Haha, poor Ken. Some good points, though. I had no idea you could 'romance' him in P3P, but I guess that's because I went with Minato and not Minako.

I can't say I really have a problem with him - he assumes the trope of not just someone who's out for vengeance, but also the young and naive member of the group well enough. I quite like his two persona, and have always been a fan of spear and lance users in RPGs. In battle he can heal and revive, use zio and hama, and perform pierce attacks. You're right that it's strange for someone 10-11 years old to be hanging out with a group of people around 16-17. Maybe it's more common place in Japan? I mean, Ken's mainly around the group because he's a persona user and lives at the dorm, right?

I guess, to be fair, if there were a party member I least liked, it's probably Ken, if only for those scandalous shorts he wears. Though he does play soccer.

I think I'm still looking forward to using him if I decide to get Ultimax later this year.
 

Overall Ken is one of the worst aspects of Persona 3 along with Tartarus.

Have to ask: what's wrong with Tartarus? is it different from what's offered in the other Persona games?

[Ozzy]

I found Tartarus monotonous and draining. Two factors that were further exacerbated by the 'Tired' system placed in the game.  

[CrazyRah]

Only Tartarus is ever able to compete with my dislike for Ken. It's possible i that i actually dislike Tartarus more than Ken but i'm not going to gather any proof of that. Just thinking of that place is death by boredom

[Mr.House]

The problem with Tartrus is there's no diversity that P2 and even P4 had in it's dungeon design. Tartus is 260+ floors of the samething  just recloured. The love hotel and train where the only true unique dungeons int he game.

 

P2 had things like bomb shelters, shopping malls, mountains, a spaceship, a CD shop ect and each dungeon in P4 was not just a recolour, it also had it's own truly unique BGM. Tartarus would be fine if it was just a place to grind and the plot dungeons where more like the love hotel and train, but it';s not and that's the issue. You need to climb 260+ floors which by the 40th floor it becomes a total drag, it also does not help the default exploration music is very boring. There's also the fact you can't backtrack, you have to keep moving forward or leave then enter from either the start or a access point that is probably not even near where you want to go so oyu can farm gems.

 

I love dungeon crawling, but if the dungeon is boring, the crawling is simply not fun and that is the issue with Tartarus, had each block been truly unique Tartarus would have been a great dungeon crawler.

[Matieo]

I agree that not being able to backtrack is a poor design choice. I'm not sure what they were thinking having rescue missions assume a range of floors with the first one, more often than not, being one behind the mini-boss checkpoint. Though thankfully the missing persons were rarely on that first floor.

[Mr.House]

I will admit despite being old, for me, P2 set the bar high on alot of things, somethings P3/4 have done better, but others PO2 did better I hope Atlus looks back at that (dungeon design, more complex gameplay, real fusion spells, good mix of upbeat and dark themes ect)

I don't want to see the removable of the social aspect mind oyu, but I do want to seet he return of a more focused story that does not have bad pacing or flip flops around, just my opinion though.

 

Also I want a adult cast again, plz Atlus?

 

Case to the point, here's a stat card for boss in in P3.

 

Now P4

 

And now P2

[TheChris92]

Took the liberty making of some Persona 4 Golden themed wallpapers for Vita users -- I've designed one for every character, some I decided to do alternatives since I couldn't decide on which was best etc. Feel free to use them at your disgression, they've all been rendered with the right format to fit the Vita's background. Simply download them directly from the Vita and you're in business.

Narukami

http://i796.photobuc...zpsc24f63ae.png

 

Alt. Narukami

http://i796.photobuc...zpsf86ecc3f.png

 

Yukiko

http://i796.photobuc...zps3312b483.png

 

Chie

http://s796.photobuc...html?sort=3&o=5

 

Rise

http://i796.photobuc...zpsa00ad6d6.png

 

Epilogue-Rise (This one is particularly awesome and it's also the only epilogue design I actually like)

http://i796.photobuc...zpsa535a50e.png

 

Kanji

http://i796.photobuc...zpsf2a70685.png

 

Naoto

http://i796.photobuc...zpsb996e3a0.jpg

 

Adachi (Could have been better but there it is)

http://i796.photobuc...zps04d62f3e.png

[Mr.House]

*grabby hands*

[Liamv2]

Wow they look great. I'm definitely gonna use one of them when I get a vita. Now how to decide.

[Milan92]

You didn't like Naoto's epilogue design?

[Mr.House]

I already have Naotos summer design on my vita anyways, so now I have both! Yessssssssssssss

[CrazyRah]

Took the liberty making of some Persona 4 Golden themed wallpapers for Vita users -- I've designed one for every character, some I decided to do alternatives since I couldn't decide on which was best etc. Feel free to use them at your disgression, they've all been rendered with the right format to fit the Vita's background. Simply download them directly from the Vita and you're in business.

Narukami

http://i796.photobuc...zpsc24f63ae.png

 

Alt. Narukami

http://i796.photobuc...zpsf86ecc3f.png

 

Yukiko

http://i796.photobuc...zps3312b483.png

 

Chie

http://s796.photobuc...html?sort=3&o=5

 

Rise

http://i796.photobuc...zpsa00ad6d6.png

 

Epilogue-Rise (This one is particularly awesome and it's also the only epilogue design I actually like)

http://i796.photobuc...zpsa535a50e.png

 

Kanji

http://i796.photobuc...zpsf2a70685.png

 

Naoto

http://i796.photobuc...zpsb996e3a0.jpg

 

Adachi (Could have been better but there it is)

http://i796.photobuc...zps04d62f3e.png

 

Arigatou!

[TheChris92]

You didn't like Naoto's epilogue design?

Not really and I couldn't make it anyway since I can't find it. I only found Rise's Epilogue design so that's really the major reason why she's only one here.

[TheChris92]

Made two more just for the road

 

Alt. Chie

http://i796.photobuc...zps45ee57a0.png

 

Alt. Naoto

http://i796.photobuc...zpsd4c038e3.png

[Mr.House]

 

Alt. Naoto

http://i796.photobuc...zpsd4c038e3.png

hnnnnnnnnng

[TheChris92]

I've got several of beefs with Persona 2 that I really hope and wish they'd never take away too much from that game beyond what it managed to accomplish with its ending, and otherwise some decent characters and the overall tone. First of all the gameplay is shite. Combat feels like pulling your own teeth out -- it's a clusterfuck and it's based on the usual overly complex model of the usual fetishized nightmare model of older JRPGs, when the combat was about as fulfilling and fun as filing a tax return paper.  Sometimes the game would force to question if steps were not taken to ensure that the player could not end battles without frustration. Having forced you to choose the "confirm" tab instead of their own character and pushing the designated confirm button was one such annoyance, but also forced demon negotiations. The negotiations were just dumb, and in the long run they became more of a nuisance, especially when it results not allowing the player the option of opting out of a negotiation. Beyond this, basing character growth upon the acquisition of hundreds of cards from demons is a tedious, poorly conceived variation upon the game's theme, and I can only be thankful it would die a silent death later on in the series. Demon deals does not hold up with the Persona games of today, which have finally broken away from the chains of the main series and become its own -- it's leaning further towards the writings of Jung detailing dreams, the other self, the ego, Personas & Shadows.

Let all the demon business safely rest in the arms of the main series, Shin Megami Tensei.

 

Now I'll explain why I don't particularly cared as much about the characters as I did for 3 & 4 -- Partly it's because the story feels like it's starting in the middle of things, the relationships between the characters are already partially developed, the game sort of presents this in small bites as it develops, like it's strictly telling me how I NEED to care about these characters instead of letting myself decide whether or not I want to end up liking them at my own volition. The game is sort of wobbling back and forth, and never takes its time to develop things properly, or does so in unusual, almost rushed manner.

In Persona 3 you have this protagonist arriving in a new city, straight forward, it's the perfect beginning for a game that places emphasis on character growth and also providing room for role-playing. The protagonist does not know any people in the city he/she arrives, the relationships are platonic at first but they grow as the game progresses, and thus the game paves way for twists and turns that never seem forced or out of line.

 

In Persona 2, the narrative becomes a bit of a mess, mostly when Lisa and Tatsuya's shadow self comes into play, and I would also like to direct it toward the character of Jun. I ended up disliking him a lot, and while I feel that cramming most of his own backstory into Xibalba was an unwise move on the game's part, Jun's true sin is that the game insists upon a closeness between him and Tatsuya that it does not properly construct. Jun's friendship with Tatsuya in particular is only shown to and extend beyond the boundaries of the rest of the Masked Circle in one or two very brief flashbacks, in which Tatsuya remains as wordless as ever, and while one could argue that Tatsuya's habit of checking his lighter is meant to illustrate this or imply it, Tatsuya continues this habit well after their reunion, often when Jun is present, making the lighter as a reminder or surrogate feel sort of unusual, redundant and ultimately distancing Tatsuya from Jun if this is meant to be its purpose. Now this brings me to my next point -- Tatsuya, the main character, why the hell is he a silent protagonist? The fact of the matter is that it doesn't work with him at all. Unlike later Persona games, the character of Tatsuya has too much baggage & backstory with these characters that it becomes sort of hollow when he doesn't utter anything other than the occasional grunts like he was taking lessons from Link. This is what I'd also call a 'Dead Space' situation here, friends -- It's like the game is telling us to feel sorry for a brick, because all of its brick children never writes it any letters, with the main difference being that this particular brick has been characterized more than a brickshit-house. 

In later Persona games, and other RPGs, western or Japanese alike, the player's silence felt natural. Beyond shouting a few phrases in battle, the rest that would make up my character was mine to choose, the blanks were deliberately left for me to fill out, including the voice, and the characters in the game would not ram me over my fingers-- telling me how I'm supposed feel about this or that situation. Frequent dialogue options likewise allowed me to express the character and get a feeling for their implicit personalities without feeling that that personality was more alleged than actual.

In Persona 2, however, the silent protagonist seems to only exist solely to complete the tedious spectrum of JRPGs tendency to have one.

 

In fact, the character Maya would recurringly report to the player how Tatsuya must be feeling, or things about how Tatsuya must be, like he's suffering from down syndrome or something. It makes me disconnect with Tatsuya, as my character, as the protagonist, because it is simply not reflective of the dialogue options or the character's actions. The game would have been much better off simply giving him a voice of his own, so that he himself could talk about how close he was with Jun, or Lisa, or how he was trying to flee from his own responsibilities, rather than just telling me that that was how it was. There was no permission of insertion or immersion with the character of Tatsuya -- In retrospect, I don't think many people would have asked to be like this.

 

Now here's another complaint, which I'm really glad Knights of the Old Republic 2 didn't do. The sheer amount of references to the first game, a game of which I have not played, but the game somehow expects me to have to played. The worst part is that they are delivered in such an untimely fashion I'd almost think it was something out of Family Guy or Dreamworks -- KOTOR 2 had references to its predecessor, it had certain characters from the first game join you, but it never requires of you to actually know what went on there. It's superficial to the story it wants to tell there, and it doesn't cram it all in your face. Most of the references also happen to be characters that conveniently show up again to do this or that, like an old relative showing up unannounced after years of no-contact, to ask for birthday presents. 

At times I feel the game's zany over-the-top presentation of a resurrected Hitler, now being the legendary immortal physics defying Son of Zeus, utilizing absurd alien technology and cyber-commandoes to annex the world, existed solely to distract how incomplete the character development felt, and there were times where I was left pondering the final importance of some characters, like Ixquic. I was not a fan of the way Yukino completely vanishes at the end of the game, as if she no longer matters to the party at all, her replacement with Jun, and finally, I really, really did not like that it was not until the very end of the game that the game's story really started to become about its cast.

 

This is where I'll mention what the game does right though -- The characters aren't bad, in fact they are pretty good, and their occasional funny antics are endearing despite the otherwise supposed seriousness of their situation, even if that situation involves Hitler using the Lance of Longinus that speared Christ, to use Crystal Skulls to pilot an ancient Mayan Spaceship to gain Godhood as he leads an army of steampunk mech warriors in fighting psychic teenagers for control of a Japanese city with angels and demons created by rumors running amok is absolutely nuts, it's still okay because the game presents it in a fashion that makes you accept it. 

 

I get what it is people like about this game, but I don't particular think it's on par with what a like Persona 3 managed to do. What I do feel that Atlus should take with them from Persona 2 is how the ending was handled. It was actually quite perfect, it wrapped itself up so well with a heartbreaking conclusion, something which could probably serve well for the them of Persona 5 I imagine.

[Mr.House]

Depends what you mean by the ending. IS ending is the middle of the game, EPs ending is still sad but it's not your typical tragic that Atlus is known for because it decided to do tragedy without death.

 

Not to mention I also like Jun, Lisa and Michel I didn't mind, butt he true heart of the cast was EPs cast. Katsuya, Ulala and Baofu where utterly amazing that dealt with extremely heavy stuff( Katsuya and Tatsuyas strain relationship that goes very deep and is not your simple sibling spat along with the love triangle with Maya, Ulalas extreme jealousy of Maya that almost led to Maya being killed and makes Chie and Yukis friendship pre shadows look functional, Baofus horrific past that would make the characters in 3 and 4 thank their stars they where not in his shoes) and then Tatsuya, a man who must pay eternal punishment for one innocent sin he committed. Not to mention Nyarl is in full force in EP, in IS he was behind the scenes as the game was building up to his reveal, which was clear was going to happen after all the references that where being slowly revealed during the game(unlike the massive info dumps P3/4 decided to do which I hope Atlus changes, slowly reveal info of the big bad, don't just dump it all in big info dumps and have the player wonder half the time why they are doing X), in EP however he is very involved, and he is not playing anymore. He makes the life of the EP characters a living hell and shows what happens when you mess with the crawling chaos, who is still the best villain of the series imo.

 

This is where I get pissed off at Atlus because you guys have a unfinished story, and IS is the weak part of P2(however I still enjoyed it's story more then P3/4) but EPs side was just amazing overall. Also playing with a mature grown up cast is what truly makes EP unique.