4593 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr.House]

On the lobby, I get a massive P2 vibe from it.   

[Ellyria]

And then getting punched by Dojima (his design is awful as always)

 *snip*

 

*sniff*   Dojima, y u be so mean to Adachi?

[Dominus]

A Glimpse Into the Mind of Persona's Art Director.

Soejima strives to make his designs as realistic as possible. He noted because the Persona series has traditionally been set somewhere in Japan, it already has a "root." The team first sits down and tries to talk about a theme color for each game. Persona 4 was more lighthearted and had livelier characters, and every time he envisioned its rural setting he kept thinking of the color yellow, "like the wildflower you see along the streets," he said. But he also liked yellow because it was a color of warning, so he felt that worked well for the murder-mystery premise. Persona 3 had a darker storyline and more serious characters, so blue worked well to represent that and its urban style.

When he gets down to the actual character designs, he looks to existing people for inspiration. Be it celebrities or people he sees around, he always looks at what someone's appearance says about their personality. If his vision gets too close to their actual image, he does a rough design and tries to keep the feeling and personality of the person.

[TheChris92]

[TheChris92]

Looks like Margaret's up next as new playable character.

[Mr.House]

This is getting fucken ridicules. Adachi is one thing(afterall we know he can fight, he has a big fanbase and he's still alive) but now Marget AND Marie? Screw this, I want Minako now Atlus, if you're pulling this ****.

 

We don't need two velvet room workers and a old worker Atlus....

[TheChris92]

Well, I'd rather have Margaret over Marie for sure even if her new voice actress sucks. But it seems a bit redundant to have another Velvet Room Attendant step into the fight anyway.

 

I'm going to agree with the ****** on Gamefaqs with his opinion about Marie's inclusion, but not him throwing a hissy fit over the blue-haired berk not showing up in this game. Even if he did show up it wouldn't seem right to include him as DLC either way. I think the roster is fine as it is now, don't need anymore characters, so yeah.

[TheChris92]

Soejima's second favorite character is Yukari -- That's a plus!

[AventuroLegendary]

I don't mind an appearance of "The Hollow Forest's Tsundere Poet" (her actual title), but I would have much preferred a non-canon appearance by Minako rather than forced writing. 

 

Come to think of it, I would love to see Izanami's original avatar playable, since I dig the appearance. 

[TheChris92]

Yet Marie is forced writing too? I wouldn't mind if it wasn't for the fact that they need to implement a forced reference to her existence in Ultimax even if you didn't buy the DLC, at least from what you can gather of Teddie's trailer.

 

Izanami is gone -- I'd rather not have any more retcons, just to have her show up again in some form.

[Mr.House]

Izanami is not gone. In fact Izanami is playable in ultimax now because of Marie is Izanamis avatar now and has full access to her powers(which is hwy giving her a persona in the first place is useless)

[CrazyRah]

I totally want them to add Ai Ebihara, them slaps be serious yo!

 

[TheChris92]

Marie was a part of Izanami yes -- But teh Izanami is gone, same as Nyx, and thank **** for that. No need to retcon the games any more than Arena already did in the first place, just to bring back old villains for a good 'ol times sake.

[TheChris92]

Also, screw Ai -- The character they really need to add most of all is Funky Student!

[Mr.House]

Rewatch Maries last conversation after you beat Izanami. Yes the Izanami we beat is gone(the one who was a misguided dick), because she has again formed up with her other selves  thus Izanami is whole again and doing her duties as a benevolent divine being. Marie is simply a body she is using now, just like Ryoji was the physical body for Nyx(Nyx is also not gone, Nyx is simply being sealed. If she was truly gone there would be no need for a seal) Now why Marie is still able to walk around where Ryoji(who is believed to in fact be Thanatos as not only does he fit the role, but personality in myth along with the fact only certain groups can exist in the sea as stated in the Answer) had to return to the sea of souls, that's a whole new debate, but I think it can be summed easily.

 

Atlus wants to continue shoving Marie at people even if it makes no sense at all and goes against established material.

[TheChris92]

Rewatch Maries last conversation after you beat Izanami. Yes the Izanami we beat is gone(the one who was a misguided dick), because she has again formed up with her other selves  thus Izanami is whole again and doing her duties as a benevolent divine being. Marie is simply a body she is using now, just like Ryoji was the physical body for Nyx(Nyx is also not gone, Nyx is simply being sealed. If she was truly gone there would be no need for a seal) Now why Marie is still able to walk around where Ryoji(who is believed to in fact be Thanatos as not only does he fit the role, but personality in myth along with the fact only certain groups can exist in the sea as stated in the Answer) had to return to the sea of souls, that's a whole new debate, but I think it can be summed easily.

 

Atlus wants to continue shoving Marie at people even if it makes no sense at all and goes against established material.

Izanami is effectively gone because like Nyx she's but a manifestation of the subconcious desires of mankind. I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to prove here. First of all -- It's abundantly clear that Izanami isn't misguided, she's following what mankind wants and it's clear even to the end that she wanted mankind to succeed in the end. She wanted what was best -- there was nothing misguided about her at all. Izanami is effectively gone, just like Ryojii is gone, and won't come back. And no, Ryojii isn't "Thanatos" incarnate, the image of Thanatos was used to ilustrate through metaphors his role as a harbinger of death -- these names, these appearances, these myths though: They are all trivial fabrications created by mankind to give pictures to their inner demons and desires. Gods are, after all, created by humans and their image are painted by humans. It's a long term reference to Jungian philosophy, where patients would paint the demons in their dreams in pictures that resemble well-known legends, myths or so. This is the reason why the Personas look the way they look. Nyx isn't really the goddess of death, she's but one of many demons, manifested entirely by mankind to fulfill their desire for death. The reason why Marie is still around is because she's simply badly written.

 

Also, you got it backwards. If you want to make references to The Answer then get those references, right -- Nyx isn't being "sealed" -- The seal exists to keep "Erebus" away from coming into contact with Nyx. But the truth of the matter is that it isn't necessary to have it all. Because what it is that makes Erebus come back again, and again, is mankind itself. 

 

But ignoring the plot -- Nyx, Izanami, they both played their parts in their respective games and there is litterally no reason to bring either of them back.

[Milan92]

Guess P5 is gonna have the "goddess of emancipation" or whatever it is humans are desiring this time.

[TheChris92]

Emancipation is a broad term, usually associated as a summary of the need for political freedoms and equality. Evidently, it's not meant to be taken litterally, like the previous games, it's just a word used to describe some of the underlying themes. In Persona 5's case, it's about the strive for breaking the norm of society's expectations placed upon the modern day youth, while we are no longer bound by honor or sense of tradition to follow in our parents footsteps, there's still that nagging from our student councilors, teachers, or others, that unconsciously weighs us down. Hashino describes it as such "I feel that in today’s world, there’s no shortage of people that are bored and discontent with their lives. They’re at a dead end, chained down to a world of which they resent being a part. Persona 5, in that sense, is a game about freedom, the kind that those sorts of people haven’t had living in the real world."

 

Whether there's actually going to be "godly" being trying to sway the main characters away from their path again remains to be seen, but there most likely will be. I hope there'll be more villains like Adachi again though.

[Mr.House]

Persona series has never really focused on the divine beings as much as say SMT and the devil games(summoner, digital and survivor)  They're there but for them ost part the main focus is normally a human or human group mostly getting the spotlight(Kadori, Masked Circle, New world order, Strega, Adachi) Also each game has so far tackled different mythos and mythology. Persona 2 was very lovecraftian, Persona 3 was greek and Persona 4 was Japanese. This is normally why Lucifer is put at a high fusion level and YHVH is never ever mentioned, not even by his other titles.

[TheChris92]

Persona series has never really focused on the divine beings as much as say SMT and the devil games(summoner, digital and survivor)  They're there but for them ost part the main focus is normally a human or human group mostly getting the spotlight(Kadori, Masked Circle, New world order, Strega, Adachi) Also each game has so far tackled different mythos and mythology. Persona 2 was very lovecraftian, Persona 3 was greek and Persona 4 was Japanese. This is normally why Lucifer is put at a high fusion level and YHVH is never ever mentioned, not even by his other titles.

Mythology has nothing to do with the themes of the games -- Sure, there are tiny references to it, but the convienient usage of Nyx, Thanatos, Hypnos & Eros is simply to add to the symbolism, and to provide clarity, when illustrating its point. The theme of Persona 3 was Memento Mori, it was Death and how people deal and fight their own battles with death every day of their lives. The concept of death (and Death for that matter) in Persona 3 transcends its place as a theme or motif, becoming a core construct integral to the plot, concept and dynamic of the game. The idea of death is interwoven with the very fabric of the macrocosm at every turn as characters, enemies, themes, imagery and plot all concern themselves with the intricacies of death. Some of this exploration of death occurs at a fairly basic ‘surface’ level and makes use of symbolism and finite reference, while much more investigation into the complex construct occurs deep within the psyche of the game itself.

 

It's all in reference to Sigmund Freud's writings and studies of mankind's strive to actively seek death. It's a state of being, where the subconcious needs are fulfilled  and pleasure is sought, where the absence of negative feedback, stress or other such constructs exists. He discussed that this was one of the larger centric parts of the human Psyche. In those readings, there's a reference to a higher tier, drive, beyond the "Pleasure Principle and that's the ‘Death Drive’.

 

According to Freud, it can best be described as a state of being, where an individual has accepted their own death and its inevitable arrival. It discusses, that at the point where the individual as come to this realization, where death has been realised, the human psyche forms a ‘death drive’, and begins subconsciously working towards their own demise, reconciling their life in preparation for their exit of the ‘mortal coil’. In Persona 3, it is this realisation of impending death that allowsthe Persona users to summon their Personae, and it is heavily implied throughout the story that the increasing strength of the protagonist is derived from his accelerating journey as he progresses to his death at the close of the game. Ironically, the first, and one of the last Personae the protagonist has access to is (as spoken of above) Thanatos, the Greek god of death. Curiously, the death drive spoken of in Freud’s theory is colloquially given the same name. It's here where the image of Thanatos comes into play in accordance with the purpose of the game's themes.

 

Persona 4 is closer to Jungian, where the acceptance of the self, the Shadow, becomes a Persona, is heavily drawn from his four principles of individuation.

Where you strive for your own truth and come to terms with who you are -- I could evidently go on but I've already done enough analysis on Persona a while back anyway.

[AventuroLegendary]

Yet Marie is forced writing too? I wouldn't mind if it wasn't for the fact that they need to implement a forced reference to her existence in Ultimax even if you didn't buy the DLC, at least from what you can gather of Teddie's trailer.

 

Poor wording when I meant how painfully Marie was forced in.

 

On Izanami, I meant that I wouldn't mind a character who has no place in the story. A guest character, essentially. Given how ArcSys loves story-driven singleplayer, I doubt they would even attempt that.

 

Offtopic, but do you have a blog separate for Persona analysis, Chris? Not being snarky, just curious

[Mr.House]

Dat tangent.

[AventuroLegendary]

In P4A, I've always wondered why the P4 cast members had their original, non-ultimate Personas. Was Yu a complete introvert in that timeline?

[Milan92]

In P4A, I've always wondered why the P4 cast members had their original, non-ultimate Personas. Was Yu a complete introvert in that timeline?

 

I remember reading that Atlus simply prefered the first Persona designs.

[AventuroLegendary]

I remember reading that Atlus simply prefered the first Persona designs.

 

That makes sense. Aside from Chie's sith lord persona, I thought they all looked kind of silly.