Aller au contenu

Photo

Is WoT a sign that the Dalish perspective will be omitted?


344 réponses à ce sujet

#326
LobselVith8

LobselVith8
  • Members
  • 16 993 messages

No Spirit spells for Dalish mages!

 

Kiddding, kidding. Since no one gave a damn about your blood mage specialization (not even a spell, a whole specialization) in past games, I doubt there will be any kind of restriction for Dalish mages. After all, people can roleplay their characters however they want.

 

I'm more interested about a possible Keeper specialization, and if so, if there would be differences for Dalish and non Dalish mages trying to get it. Developers said that they would try to make specialization feel more important.

 

Gaider stated that they haven't actually decided on the specializations that will be chosen (I believe when the topic of blood magic came up in another thread where specializations were being discussed) since another department handles that, so I'm not certain if there will be any reactivity towards the protagonist's specialization. I'm hoping that this isn't the case, since I think it would be really interesting if characters like Vivienne could react to magic from other cultures, like the Vashoth and the Dalish. Possibly healing (as mentioned in WoT), the ability to change shape (as mentioned by the Dalish Warden to Morrigan), or summoning sylvans to attack your foes (like Velanna accomplished).



#327
Mistic

Mistic
  • Members
  • 2 199 messages

Gaider stated that they haven't actually decided on the specializations that will be chosen (I believe when the topic of blood magic came up in another thread where specializations were being discussed) since another department handles that, so I'm not certain if there will be any reactivity towards the protagonist's specialization. I'm hoping that this isn't the case, since I think it would be really interesting if characters like Vivienne could react to magic from other cultures, like the Vashoth and the Dalish. Possibly healing (as mentioned in WoT), the ability to change shape (as mentioned by the Dalish Warden to Morrigan), or summoning sylvans to attack your foes (like Velanna accomplished).

 

From a pure gameplay perspective, the only instances of Keeper specialization we have seen (Awakening and Merrill's Dalish Pariah) tend to focus on area effects. They create fields around them (One with nature, Wrath of the Elvhen), can summon attacks or special effects in them, and with the right spell (Replenishment, Artlathan's Grace) they can regain some health.



#328
CybAnt1

CybAnt1
  • Members
  • 3 659 messages

The elves seem to favor the magic schools dealing with nature and elemental forces (Primal, Elemental) and less so the Spirit school. Keeper/Dalish Pariah have a definite "druidic"/nature control flavor to them. Given their distrust of spirits, I guess they probably wouldn't take spirit healer, either. Also, while Merrill was dabbling in blood magic, it was clear the rest of her Dalish clan, especially Marethari, weren't too keen on it. 



#329
lyleoffmyspace

lyleoffmyspace
  • Members
  • 499 messages

That's certainly the Chantry version about the inception of the war with the Dales, but the Dalish version differs in saying there was human incursion on their sovereign territory. That's my point: there are two versions about the fall of the Dales, and even the elven Warden can express the alternative to the one espoused by the Chantry by saying the Dales was invaded because the elves refused to convert.

History is written by the winners. The Chantry won, so they obviously painted the elves as the aggressors. What really happened? It's too soon to say.



#330
Hanako Ikezawa

Hanako Ikezawa
  • Members
  • 29 692 messages

@OP

 

Considering that the Elven Inquisitor will only be Dalish, I think the answer to your thread is no, it is not a sign of the Dalish perspective being omitted.



#331
Mistic

Mistic
  • Members
  • 2 199 messages

@OP

 

Considering that the Elven Inquisitor will only be Dalish, I think the answer to your thread is no, it is not a sign of the Dalish perspective being omitted.

 

And that's a pity, really. After reading the post, I thought that it's a loss of a unique Elven perspective.



#332
Hanako Ikezawa

Hanako Ikezawa
  • Members
  • 29 692 messages

And that's a pity, really. After reading the post, I thought that it's a loss of a unique Elven perspective.

Tell me about it. I was looking forward to playing a City Elf which I loved in Origins, but now I'm stuck with being a Dalish. Not that there is anything wrong with the Dalish, just I loved the City Elf perspective much more.



#333
Riverdaleswhiteflash

Riverdaleswhiteflash
  • Members
  • 7 914 messages

Gaider stated that they haven't actually decided on the specializations that will be chosen (I believe when the topic of blood magic came up in another thread where specializations were being discussed) since another department handles that, so I'm not certain if there will be any reactivity towards the protagonist's specialization. I'm hoping that this isn't the case, since I think it would be really interesting if characters like Vivienne could react to magic from other cultures, like the Vashoth and the Dalish. Possibly healing (as mentioned in WoT), the ability to change shape (as mentioned by the Dalish Warden to Morrigan), or summoning sylvans to attack your foes (like Velanna accomplished).

I remember reading that Gaider intended to make specializations mean more than they did in previous games. A good choice for that would be Blood Magic, especially given how little it meant previously.

 

Speaking of Velanna's abilities... sylvans are spirits in a host. So if the Dalish don't like that kind of magic, why would she use those? Zathrian's abilities make slightly more sense, since I don't think he drew on anything from the Fade for that. Then again, Zathrian used Blood Magic for that. So Velanna's not the first Dalish mage to use abilities the Dalish are leery of. (Or the last, given Merrill.)



#334
Jedi Master of Orion

Jedi Master of Orion
  • Members
  • 6 910 messages

Velanna went rogue from the rest of her clan. There were many things she did that her former comrades would have disapproved of.



#335
CybAnt1

CybAnt1
  • Members
  • 3 659 messages

Well, the other thing I would say about Velanna that always confused me is while I understand gameplay/story segregation, it didn't quite make sense that she was summoning sylvans against me when we were enemies, but then no longer had the power to summon sylvans to help us out once we were allied. 



#336
Jedi Master of Orion

Jedi Master of Orion
  • Members
  • 6 910 messages

The other thing is the writers may not have thought up the "Dalish are wary of all spirits" thing at that point. I don't believe we ever got any indication of it until Merrill in DA2.



#337
Riverdaleswhiteflash

Riverdaleswhiteflash
  • Members
  • 7 914 messages

Velanna went rogue from the rest of her clan. There were many things she did that her former comrades would have disapproved of.

Yes, but the difficulty is that she had to have learned these spells somewhere. That's what I find off-putting about how Merrill, Zathrian, and Velanna are able to do things that their teachers wouldn't likely have been okay with: how would they have learned it?



#338
Jedi Master of Orion

Jedi Master of Orion
  • Members
  • 6 910 messages

Well, Merrill learned it from a demon or something, didn't she? I remember she had a conversation about Anders about where she learned blood magic. With the other two, well it's possible that game play and story segregation is the only answer there is.



#339
dragonflight288

dragonflight288
  • Members
  • 8 852 messages

Well, Merrill learned it from a demon or something, didn't she? I remember she had a conversation about Anders about where she learned blood magic. With the other two, well it's possible that game play and story segregation is the only answer there is.

 

For all we know, Velanna may have sought out a demon as well for the power to get revenge on the humans, and that may have contributed to her exile. 

 

Or something. It's not impossible. 



#340
Jedi Master of Orion

Jedi Master of Orion
  • Members
  • 6 910 messages

That doesn't sound out of character for Velanna.



#341
LobselVith8

LobselVith8
  • Members
  • 16 993 messages

For all we know, Velanna may have sought out a demon as well for the power to get revenge on the humans, and that may have contributed to her exile.

Or something. It's not impossible.


It could be Dalish magic. According to WoT: "Their spells have evolved to be deeply rooted in nature, manipulating earthly forces with a heavy emphasis on herbalism and healing." (page 104)

Perhaps the activated sylvans aren't possessed by spirits, but are manipulated by the elven mage? I'm certainly hoping for clarification about this, either way.

#342
dragonflight288

dragonflight288
  • Members
  • 8 852 messages

It could be Dalish magic. According to WoT: "Their spells have evolved to be deeply rooted in nature, manipulating earthly forces with a heavy emphasis on herbalism and healing." (page 104)

Perhaps the activated sylvans aren't possessed by spirits, but are manipulated by the elven mage? I'm certainly hoping for clarification about this, either way.

 

It wouldn't be Dalish magic, but why wouldn't she learn it and move on from there, develop her own style?

 

You know...now I'm dang curious. How the heck is shapeshifting achieved? It most certainly doesn't involve spirits of the Fade. 



#343
themageguy

themageguy
  • Members
  • 3 176 messages

It wouldn't be Dalish magic, but why wouldn't she learn it and move on from there, develop her own style?
 
You know...now I'm dang curious. How the heck is shapeshifting achieved? It most certainly doesn't involve spirits of the Fade.

Morrigan explains it in origins. To shapeshift you have to copy the forms Soul. Now for mages whose power is rooted deeply in nature, surely it'd be easy for a dalish to be able to adopt the form of an owl, wolf, bear or halla.
Also in origins, if you're a dalish elf, you mention to Morrigan that some keepers were known to have the ability, in which the apostate wonders whether her magic and dalish magic are similar if not the same.
I really do hope we get some more 'naturey' spells in inquisition. Judging by the spells displayed by Vivienne in the 30 minute gameplay footage, it looks like they're doing a marvelous job ( I like my frost spells). Either way, my dalish Mage will be focusing on primal and creation magics, and will not like spirits ( using WoT info and Marethari in the short story to influence my character).

#344
LobselVith8

LobselVith8
  • Members
  • 16 993 messages

The two accounts can be reconciled very easily.  The elves are upset at human domination of the world, and attack at Red Crossing

 

That doesn't reconcile the differences between the two accounts. At the time, the Dalish had their own homeland: the Dales. As for the elven historical account, the codex entry on the Dales (for the Dalish Warden) reads: "But it was not to last. The Chantry first sent missionaries into the Dales, and then, when those were thrown out, templars."

 

According to the History of the Elves entry expands on this by addressing that the attack on Red Crossing was in provocation to the forced conversion of the elves attempted by the missionaries and their templars: "It was a home, a new chance to gather and rebuild all that we had lost. In our centuries of slavery we had lost our immortality, our language, our culture, our crafts… but never our sense of belonging to each other. From across Thedas we came to the Dales. We walked on foot, sometimes crossing thousands of miles with naught but our will to sustain us. Many of us perished on the Long Walk, but those of us that arrived at our new home were all the more determined.

 

"There, in the Dales, our people revived the lost lore as best they could, and even turned to worship the old gods in their ancient prison. They called their first city Halamshiral, 'the end of the journey,' and founded a new nation, isolated as elves were meant to be. They created an order called The Emerald Knights and charged them with watching the borders for trouble with the humans.

 

"But you already know that something went wrong. Our ancestors' worship of the old elven gods angered the human Chantry, which constantly sent missionaries to our land. The Chantry wanted to convert our people to their worship of the Maker, but the Dalish would not submit. In protest, a small elven raiding party attacked the nearby human village of Red Crossing, an act that prompted the Chantry to attack and, with their superior numbers, conquer the Dales. We were not enslaved as we had been before, but our worship of the ancient gods was now forbidden. We were allowed to live among the humans as second class citizens and worship their Maker, slowly forgetting once more the scraps of lore we had maintained through the centuries. Those that refused were forced to wander, landless and friendless in their wagons, across a world that told them they were unwelcome.

 

Two homes we elves have lost, but it is the loss of the Dales that hurt us most. When I see the vhenadahl, the 'tree of our people', that is planted in the middle of our poor alienage here in the human city… I weep. It is a strong and mighty tree with many branches, but it bears only bitter fruit." - The tale of “The Rise and Fall of the Dales,” as told by Sarethia, elder of the Highever Alienage.



#345
Hanako Ikezawa

Hanako Ikezawa
  • Members
  • 29 692 messages

Since anyone who wants to play an elf are forced to be Dalish, no their point of view will not be omitted.