1079 réponses à ce sujet

[Lorien19]

Saying that the humans treat elves as sub-human doesn't really mean much

 

A.  Its not like humans have it easy

B.  Elves aren't human in the first place

C.  They are literally sub(under)-humans economically, socially, and physically

[Steelcan]

Because I doubt that we will be able to do anything so largest establishing a new elven nation, when we already had that retconned after DA:O

[Grieving Natashina]

uh... If you two expect race choices ot have unique plots then you're going to get sorely disappointed. If there's an elven rebellion plot in, it was planned prior to race choices making their way in and it'll play the same for a human as it will for an elf. You'll do the same things, kill the same enemies and see the same cutscenes. At best you'll get unique dialogue options...

 

They won't have an elven rebellion plot because you can play a Dalish elf. If you're in a position to help the elves win a homeland, then all inquisitor's will be in that position.

That first paragraph is what I expect.  Unique racial flavor is part of what I'm talking about.  I'm not sure why you think that I believe that every race will get a completely different story.  I'm not sure how you got that from my post.  I do think it'll play out slightly differently, just like it's different in Orzammar as a Noble or Castless, or that's a little different if you're a Dalish elf or a City Elf when meeting the clan the first time.

 

 I think that they included the Dalish as the elf race and not the City Elf because of the rebellion.  I know it's something that most likely all Inquisitors can help with, but it strikes me as pointless to include elves if they can't give their perspective on a rebellion involving their own race.  If everything involving the elves is resolved off-screen, there would be no point to including them as a playable race.  They would be pointy-eared humans, and not much else.

[Steelcan]

I am enjoying whiskey monday

[Sir JK]

That first paragraph is what I expect.  Unique racial flavor is part of what I'm talking about.  I'm not sure why you think that I believe that every race will get a completely different story.  I'm not sure how you got that from my post.  I do think it'll play out slightly differently, just like it's different in Orzammar as a Noble or Castless, or that's a little different if you're a Dalish elf or a City Elf when meeting the clan the first time.

 

 I think that they included the Dalish as the elf race and not the City Elf because of the rebellion.  I know it's something that most likely all Inquisitors can help with, but it strikes me as pointless to include elves if they can't give their perspective on a rebellion involving their own race.  If everything involving the elves is resolved off-screen, there would be no point to including them as a playable race.  They would be pointy-eared humans, and not much else.

 

That's a much more reasonable expectation... I guess I got a bit confused. And yeah... the choice of Dalish as a race is not an accident. It'll tie in with the dalish plots in the game, no doubt.

 

now what those are I don't know... but they'll be no more than side quest material. Chained, no doubt. But no bigger than say... Brecilian forest in DAO vis-á-vis the rest of the game.

[Lorien19]

I am enjoying whiskey monday

It's Tuesday here!

[Grieving Natashina]

It's Tuesday here!

I guess I'm the Designated Driver then.  Coffee anyone?

[Parmida]

YESSSSS! I WANT TO PLAY A DALISH MAGE!  With hot pants..   

[Grieving Natashina]

YESSSSS! I WANT TO PLAY A DALISH MAGE!  With hot pants..   

I want a Dalish that can look like your avatar.  Yes, I'm an X-2 fan and Paine got me through the game the first time after the brain damage that Rikku appeared to have suffered.

 

Btw, the X/X-2 HD Remix is due out very soon (the 18th in the US.)  It'll be one disc for the PS3 versions, and two discs for the Vita.  It's on Blu-Ray and has all the international features us Western folk didn't get.  That includes Last Mission.

 

Sorry for the off-topic there, but fans of X-2 are rare.  I figured I'd share that with you, in case you'd be interested.

[Master Warder Z_]

Doing something nice, like the Circle mages participating in fighting the darkspawn during the Blights, and in repelling the Qunari 

 

Ahem if you are referring to the Second Blight again...

 

And The Dalish were present during the Qunari Wars?

 

I don't recall that bit of Lore.

[Parmida]

I want a Dalish that can look like your avatar.  Yes, I'm an X-2 fan and Paine got me through the game the first time after the brain damage that Rikku appeared to have suffered.

 

Btw, the X/X-2 HD Remix is due out very soon.  It'll be one disc for the PS3 and PS4 versions, and two discs for the PSP.  It's on Blu-Ray and has all the international features us Western folk didn't get.  That includes Last Mission.

 

Sorry for the off-topic there, but fans of X-2 are rare.  I figured I'd share that with you, in case you'd be interested.

 

 

*Scratches head* Uh...Okay...but I'm not an FF fan. I actually don't know anything about it. I haven't played any FF game. I just saw the picture and liked her looks....*Scratches head harder....*

[Master Warder Z_]

Are you just in the thread to be a killjoy or what?  

 

If the writers and devs were uninterested in having players experience different races and their perspectives, we would have gone back to just a human protagonist.  I don't think anyone is expecting story miracles coming out of the Inquisitor's rear end, just to have some influence and perspective on the overall story.  This includes seeing things from a Dalish perspective and having influences on the greater narrative.

 

I'd say changing the power balance of Orlais would be shifting the narrative far too much to be applicable in sequels.

 

I'd say any efforts we make will be token at best, even if mentioned in the sequel.

 

That's the main issue with DA, everything that goes into Lore has to be similar or the same for the Sequel, Free Mages, New Evlish Nation, Etc.

 

If you have widely differing outcomes it becomes difficult to use such a narrative in game.

 

So unless if the elves were just going to randomly have a Nation and you can just speed it up by a game, i don't think this plot line will be overly through.

[Divine Justinia V]

I'd say changing the power balance of Orlais would be shifting the narrative far too much to be applicable in sequels.

 

Dragon Age: The Elven Rebellion.

[Shadow Fox]

I want a Dalish that can look like your avatar.  Yes, I'm an X-2 fan and Paine got me through the game the first time after the brain damage that Rikku appeared to have suffered.

 

Btw, the X/X-2 HD Remix is due out very soon (the 18th in the US.)  It'll be one disc for the PS3 versions, and two discs for the Vita.  It's on Blu-Ray and has all the international features us Western folk didn't get.  That includes Last Mission.

 

Sorry for the off-topic there, but fans of X-2 are rare.  I figured I'd share that with you, in case you'd be interested.

I named my Surana after Yuna.

[Master Warder Z_]

Dragon Age: The Elven Rebellion.

 

Dragon Age: DEATH TO MAGICKERS!

[Grieving Natashina]

*Scratches head* Uh...Okay...but I'm not an FF fan. I actually don't know anything about it. I haven't played any FF game. I just saw the picture and liked her looks....*Scratches head harder....*

Ah, okay.  She's a character from Final Fantasy X-2, named Paine.  She's ever bit as awesome and stoic as her appearance might suggest.  Good choice for an avatar and an idea I now have for my Inquisitor's personality.

 

Final Fantasy X-2 originally came out in 2003 as a sequel to Final Fantasy X (10.)  Square did an HD update to FF X and X-2 which is due out in about a week for current consoles.  I thought you were a fan of the game series due to the avatar.  My apologizes for the confusion.

[LobselVith8]

Ahem if you are referring to the Second Blight again...

Circle mages participated in fighting the darkspawn during the Blights, including the Second Blight. And they have fared very poorly, despite their efforts. I see no reason to think the Dalish would be any different, especially with their free mages and their elven religion.

And The Dalish were present during the Qunari Wars?

I don't recall that bit of Lore.

That's because you decided to disagree with me without properly reading what I wrote.

[Master Warder Z_]

That's because you decided to disagree with me without properly reading what I wrote.

 

I did misread i suppose but i wouldn't compare having the right decision when it came to the containment of magic to dealing with a bunch of ingrates who decide to invade when they need more land.

 

In fact if anything the circle mages are rewarded for their service, free room and board, education, and having the resources to properly conduct their craft in a safe and stable environment.

 

No...Not an accurate comparison at all.

[Dean_the_Young]

I'd say changing the power balance of Orlais would be shifting the narrative far too much to be applicable in sequels.

 

I'd say any efforts we make will be token at best, even if mentioned in the sequel.

 

That's the main issue with DA, everything that goes into Lore has to be similar or the same for the Sequel, Free Mages, New Evlish Nation, Etc.

 

If you have widely differing outcomes it becomes difficult to use such a narrative in game.

 

So unless if the elves were just going to randomly have a Nation and you can just speed it up by a game, i don't think this plot line will be overly through.

 

Orlais is pretty easy to get around, though- just place the next games in contexts where the power balance in Orlais matters as much as it did in DAO or DA2. Orlais existed, but it was never central to the overall setting: the Chantry is far more important and universal.

 

With pretty marginal actors (local powers and actors), big differences are easy. As long as Orlais isn't a big actor in the next few settings, who leads it doesn't strike me as terribly important: the reformist could spend the next many years preoccupied with reforms, while the revaunchist rebuilds the military and puffing chest at someone else. Or they could both be active, from different motivations. Who knows.

[LobselVith8]

In fact if anything the circle mages are rewarded for their service, free room and board, education, and having the resources to properly conduct their craft in a safe and stable environment.

That must explain the continental war, then.

No...Not an accurate comparison at all.

Two groups who don't have their freedom - I think there are comparisons to be made.

[Master Warder Z_]

Orlais is pretty easy to get around, though- just place the next games in contexts where the power balance in Orlais matters as much as it did in DAO or DA2. Orlais existed, but it was never central to the overall setting: the Chantry is far more important and universal.

 

With pretty marginal actors (local powers and actors), big differences are easy. As long as Orlais isn't a big actor in the next few settings, who leads it doesn't strike me as terribly important: the reformist could spend the next many years preoccupied with reforms, while the revaunchist rebuilds the military and puffing chest at someone else. Or they could both be active, from different motivations. Who knows.

 

I do grant you that if the game was removed from Orlais said changes could go through intermediaries to be present to the PC, Its just from a narrative standpoint i find widely diverging paths to be slightly...unattainable, for example if you support an Elven Nation and it actually occurs, Does that negate those that saw said dream die on the vine? If the Location will never be present it becomes moot i suppose.

 

This isn't like the Templar/Mage issue where its involving thing day to day, I grant you so it would be easier to implement even rapidly differing stories, its just if this does become a crux it becomes important, i just don't see PC choices mattering overly here because if Bioware is smart they will just avoid the whole issue.

 

Less of a Headache.

[Master Warder Z_]

Two groups who don't have their freedom - I think there are comparisons to be made.

 

The Dalish did that to themselves and Mages need be contained.

 

And really?

 

One Faction's stupidity is equal to the threat prevalent within every mage to you?

 

It isn't to me.

[LobselVith8]

The Dalish did that to themselves and Mages need be contained.

Your opinions aren't fact.

And really?

One Faction's stupidity is equal to the threat prevalent within every mage to you?

It isn't to me.

I think it's sufficient to address that the Chantry controlled Circles aren't an idyllic paradise when they have lead to revolts, rebellions, acts of genocide, and now an all-out war.

With the dissolution of the Circle, some elven mages may seek refugee with the Dalish.

[Dean_the_Young]

I do grant you that if the game was removed from Orlais said changes could go through intermediaries to be present to the PC, Its just from a narrative standpoint i find widely diverging paths to be slightly...unattainable, for example if you support an Elven Nation and it actually occurs, Does that negate those that saw said dream die on the vine? If the Location will never be present it becomes moot i suppose.

 

This isn't like the Templar/Mage issue where its involving thing day to day, I grant you so it would be easier to implement even rapidly differing stories, its just if this does become a crux it becomes important, i just don't see PC choices mattering overly here because if Bioware is smart they will just avoid the whole issue.

 

Less of a Headache.

 

Just to clarify: are you saying the PC won't have much influence on something succeeding or not if it's going to be important going forward? As in, you couldn't make it fail if it's doomed to succed, and vice versa?

 

I'd agree on that. I don't think the setting is necessarily static, but I don't think the player will get to make world-altering choices. OGB is about as important as it will (not) be.

 

 

I can see future stories reflecting the fall of the Chantry or the destruction of the Templars and a number of other things, but not because the players were trying to aim for that goal.

[Master Warder Z_]

Your opinions aren't fact.


I think it's sufficient to address that the Chantry controlled Circles aren't an idyllic paradise when they have lead to revolts, rebellions, acts of genocide, and now an all-out war.

With the dissolution of the Circle, some elven mages may seek refugee with the Dalish.

 

I never stated they were.

 

And i'd disagree given that given that even the act of containment is viewed as horrid by some factions of Mages, the Circles could be Paradises given shape but it wouldn't be enough. And really? Genocide   why i am not surprised though. Sure killing a circle because they are turning into abominations or seeking to rebel is the same as killing them for religion or a skin color or where they were born.

 

And i really don't see why this last bit is even vaguely relevant.

 

 

Just to clarify: are you saying the PC won't have much influence on something succeeding or not if it's going to be important going forward? As in, you couldn't make it fail if it's doomed to succed, and vice versa?

 

I'd agree on that. I don't think the setting is necessarily static, but I don't think the player will get to make world-altering choices. OGB is about as important as it will (not) be.

 

 

I can see future stories reflecting the fall of the Chantry or the destruction of the Templars and a number of other things, but not because the players were trying to aim for that goal.

 

You got it, My main view of this, if it does later become a focal point of the storyline then it will be addressed, much like the Mage Templar war, however if it isn't a focal point then its basically background happenings.

 

You may or may not be able to interact with it and if you do it may or may not do anything.

 

And you really think such extreme happenings will happen to such elder institutions? Well...I can see the Chantry as it currently sits falling, just not their faith given how wide spread it is, and given if the faith weren't to die then wouldn't the Chantry just be reforged?

 

I can see a few troubling events on the Horizon for DA, even beyond all this current main quest stuff.