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[DarthGizka]

Games like NWN were finely balanced such that warriors, mages and rogues all had a fair chance of opening a difficult chest or making a spell/ability stick on an enemy, provided they had invested heavily into their primary ability stats. Translated to DA:O that would be strength for a warrior and spellpower for a mage, for example. With progressing levels, you could keep ahead of the competition to the degree that you kept the stat decidedly above average.

Not so in DA:O, which has several problems related to progression and DC scaling. And these problems are part of what keeps it from being the truly great game it could have been (among other problems, like the unfinished state of pretty much everything that is not strictly related to the superb visuals and audio). For DA:I it is not too late to avoid some of that, hence this post.

(1) Some abilities are completely broken with regard to character/level progression.

The freeze chance of Winter's Grasp, for example, depends only on the level of the target and reduces to a flat 5% for level 19 and higher. The benefits from abilities like Berserker and Reaver is fixed and absolute, which makes them sort of meh at the time you can first get them and totally useless soon after. Dito Song of Courage. Glyph of Warding is similar, except that here the drop is from totally awesome to 'merely' very, very good.

Momentum, Haste and so on do not have that problem because their fixed benefit is relative (percentage).

(2) Many formulas do not scale correctly.

For example, the contribution of attack stats to damage is halved for daggers and bows, so that dagger wielders and archers fall more and more behind compared to characters wielding other weapons. The problem doesn't become noticeable until late in the game, though, because it is masked by the considerable constant benefits from abilities and attack rate. A similar problem exists for the contribution of magic to attack for Arcane Warriors, which is less than half of what other characters get out of strength and dexterity.

Primary stats go directly into 'attack DC' for resistance checks, but the contribution of stats to resistances is always halved. This means that the attacking side would always get more and more ahead of the victims/defenders as the levels rise, if it weren't for problem #3.

(3) Some kit is so powerful that it completely breaks balance.

+25 resistance items like Grandmaster Hale Runes and the Rock-Knocker helmet correspond to an investment of 50 points into the corresponding attribute group, or about 17 levels' worth. That is totally insane. And these are only the most egregious examples; +10, +15 and +20 items abound. I just beefed up Oghren with some 60 points of physical resistance to keep his wife from knocking him on his ass all the time, and that is about 40 levels' worth of points into strength, dexterity or constitution. Entirely from stuff lying around and gathering dust.

It also means that characters can suddenly become immune to many spell/ability effects, regardless of spellpower or strength, simply because of the cap at 100 implied by the way the resistance check formula works.

Conversely, a lot of bonusses from kit and abilities seem to have been nerfed beyond the point of ridicule, lest some inventive player find a use for them. +1% spirit resistance anyone? +2.5% crit chance for learning the assassin specialisation? +3 mental resistance for becoming a templar?

Last but not least, level difference is multiplied by five in DC checks and rank by ten, making them more important than 'attacking' attributes by precisely these factors. Not to mention ten and twenty times as important as 'defending' attributes. Since DA:O has no concept of levelling in a certain class - like taking a couple of Paladin levels on top of Warrior - it makes no sense at all to factor level into DC checks.

In general it gives unfair advantages to the player and their party, but in connection with broken level scaling settings it means that a level-7 toon fresh out of Lothering will have needless further disadvantages heaped upon them when they go against bounter hunters who are two or three levels higher. As if having to work with auto-levelled toons and ability progressions that are artificially delayed until level 12 or later were not disadvantage enough at that point in time. Enemies can have access to high-level abilities many levels earlier than the player, who is thus denied effective means of levelling the playing field.

For example, the earliest time one of my toons faced an enemy using Rally was at level 2 in the Korcari Wilds, but player-controlled characters cannot take Rally before level 12. Same problem as with the mind-boggingly stupid (though fun if you get to use them yourself) Superior War Cry and Scattershot.

The gratuitous general rank bonusses - like bosses taking only normal damage where everyone else would be hit for critical, stunning/paralysing effects not working or lasting only one fifth of the normal duration and so on - make no sense either. Like rank-based blanket resistance caps. But that is a different topic.
 

[Mike3207]

I think Winter Grasp's freeze percentage scales to the enemy level, not your own. You might not run into a Level 19 creature except in the end game, most of the main areas are 18 or less.

 

You don't ever get Physical resistance to the level where you don't suffer stuns or knockdowns, unless you have a relevant ability. You'll resist the effect better, but it will still happen, even in Awakening.

[Blazomancer]

What you say about WIntrer's Grasp is very true, but I don't think Berserker and Reaver gets useless with level progression. Berserk is probably not much useful for a tank, but for a DPSer +8 damage per hit is quite nice, especially for a dual wielder. Frightening appearence is a nice augmentation for a tank, along with Aura of Pain; the DoT is nothing out of the league of a competent healer. Also regarding SoC, I think it's a killer ability to be had on a CUNN focussed rogue as it improves with level up. The fact that it can be stacked makes it even more powerful.

 

It is true that archers are comparatively weaker in terms of damage dealing, except when using the aim time reduction means in which case I believe they have a more continuous flow of DPS than SnS or 2Handers. Afterall, they don't have to move much to switch targets, which is especially true in wide spaces. Anyway, I agree in general with you that the attribute based dmg for bows and daggers is pretty poor. I'm not so sure about daggers lagging behind other weapon types though. In my experience, the only weapon type that can arguably surpass a dual dagger wielder, rogue or warrior, is a dual full sized weapon wielding warrior, or some combo in between, say Starfang - Rose's Thorn.

 

Attack rating issue for arcane warriors is a genuine one. The one time I played a melee arcane warrior, I ended up investing quite a few points in DEX. But from another perspective, it seems to me more like a balancing mechanism rather than anything else. After all having a very high melee attack rating and damage, and a very high SP with it would be overkill. Not that Shimmering Shield is not ridiculous to begin with.

 

I agree with you regarding Hale and Dweomer runes. Personally I never like taking the 100% spell resistance route. Runes and certain abilities get even more ridiculously powerful in Awakening, although they are fun at times. I don't really bother with boosting mental/physical resistances in addition to what is achieved through attributes; like you mentioned the resistance check makes them rather pointless.

 

I'm not quite fond of the challenge scaling in DAO; I liked it better in DA2. Sad that we are going to have area scaled enemies in Inquisition. Let's see how it turns out.

 

Regarding the effect duration on higher ranked creatures, I think it balances things a bit. If a high dragon were to be petrified for 20 seconds, a high level backstabbing rogue warden can potentially slay it before it can move again. Even if the duration were reduced to half, between the multitude of debilitating spells that a mage have access to, not to speak that the number of mages can be as high as 3, the so called Elite bosses would simply lose their sting. May be there are better ways to design the boss battles but I wouldn't know much about it.

[DarthGizka]

I think Winter Grasp's freeze percentage scales to the enemy level, not your own.

 

The freeze chance of Winter's Grasp, for example, depends only on the level of the target and reduces to a flat 5% for level 19 and higher.

 

Don't forget that it works the other way around as well. Desire Demons in particular like to cast Winter's Grasp.

 

 

You don't ever get Physical resistance to the level where you don't suffer stuns or knockdowns, unless you have a relevant ability.

 

rank-based blanket resistance caps

 

Player resistance chance is capped at 75%. See Creature Resistance Table in the wiki entry on combat mechanics.

[Cobra's_back]

I agree there are many spells, abilities and poisons that are broken in this game.

 

 

I do use song of courage because it is cunning base and does increase with more cunning. If I’m playing two-handed warrior I like two champions and one SOC on NAT or Leliana. Champion because 10 attacks and 10 defense is a big increase. 

 

The effects of Rally are stackable. However, for example, if warrior B activates Rally within the AoE of Rally activated by warrior A, the effects on warrior B will be reset, resulting in warrior B not having stacked effects even though he/she is covered by two waves of Rally. To resolve this, simply move warrior B out of the AoE of Rally activated by warrior A, then re-enter.

 

I use this for 20 defense and 20 attacks. I also use warding for another 30 defense. It really helps if my two-handed is taking on multiple targets at one time.

 

I found this:

 

mental resistance: Captivating Song, Blood Control, Horror; not a percentage (score of 100 or more does not confer immunity)

 

Physical resistance: Knockdown, Earthquake, Paralyze; not a percentage (score of 100 or more does not confer immunity)

 

Spell resistance of 100% does work.

[DarthGizka]

Regarding the effect duration on higher ranked creatures, I think it balances things a bit. If a high dragon were to be petrified for 20 seconds, a high level backstabbing rogue warden can potentially slay it before it can move again. Even if the duration were reduced to half, between the multitude of debilitating spells that a mage have access to, not to speak that the number of mages can be as high as 3, the so called Elite bosses would simply lose their sting.

 

Either it is ridiculous to be able to petrify anyone for 20 seconds, or it isn't. Why would ranked enemies - especially bosses - warrant special protection? I mean beyond the many advantages they already have, like implausible amounts of health and lots of gratuitous abilities, immunities and resistances? Not to mention that things like level, feat and stat requirements exist only to be used against the player but enemies are exempt.
 

And it's not just 'higher-ranked'. All ranked enemies have stun durations shortened to 60% or less, down to  20% for elite bosses.

 

As regards sting: in RtO, the enemy encampment opposite the entrance to the Tower of Ishal area is almost perfect. The only flaws are that the emissary is too far away to keep the player party from wreaking havoc and that enemies are too readily drawn away from the fortified area. One of the nicest bits of tactical placement in the game, and a major headache for low-level toons until you find the holes you can slip through. All perfectly within the game's rules.

 

Even if the duration were reduced to half, between the multitude of debilitating spells that a mage have access to, not to speak that the number of mages can be as high as 3, the so called Elite bosses would simply lose their sting.

 

A team of two or more mages can already kill anything at all in at most 7 seconds, including a High Dragon. It would include Archi as well if the game didn't teleport him to a different location when he takes the first hit, even if he is stunned, paralysed, petrified or whatnot. Like the spider queen that can overwhelm you or rappel away even when she is incapacitated.

 

Just more nonsense where the game designers failed to play by the rules which they themselves had invented, without giving adequate pretext (like a Lifeward-like emergency auto-teleport spell or whatever).

[Blazomancer]

Bosses warrant special protection may be because it's a video game! After all, how is anyobody going to make AI challenging for a human player? By making the AI cheat of course. Even strategic gems like Civilization and Age of Empires do this in higher difficulties. People would start complaining that the high dragon and such and such boss battle is completely trivial and didn't really give them a feeling of epicness otherwise. I think such considerations are in the developers' minds in addition to adherence to the combat rules. I'm not competent enough to judge from a game development perspective whether it's ridiculous or not that a high dragon can't be petrified for the same duration as others, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't do anything to break my suspension of disbelief. I don't think getting rid of rank duration modifiers would have made DAO any greater of lesser game than what it is.

 

Normal and lower ranked enemies are actually penalised in effect duration; only elites and higher have negative modifiers.

 

I can relate to the example of the darkspawn encampment you've given. But not every encounter in the game can be ambushes or a test of the player's strategic abilities. Especially not now that the franchise have moved on to the action-RPG realm. More so with the scripted events in boss battles. Judging by what we saw in DA2, such scripted events are most probably there to stay whether we like it or not.

[DarthGizka]

Cut the stun durations for everyone - to the same length - and slap some regen on the dragon. That'll give you epic in spades.

 

One consequence of the rank-based duration nonsense is that your mirror team during The Gauntlet gets out of one and the same stun much faster than your real team. For some reason the game treats the mirrors as lieutenant-class ranked while your own toons are classed somewhere between critter and normal.

 

That defeats the whole purpose of the mirror image fight gimick - to show you how ridiculously overpowered your own toon(s) are compared to normal enemies, by making you fight your mirror image on a perfectly level playing field.
 

[Blazomancer]

Cut the stun durations for everyone - to the same length - and slap some regen on the dragon. That'll give you epic in spades.

Probably. But how much, +100? Folks will start shouting that such a large bonus doesn't make any sense. Swap one bonus with another, nothing changes.

 

 

 

One consequence of the rank-based duration nonsense is that your mirror team during The Gauntlet gets out of one and the same stun much faster than your real team. For some reason the game treats the mirrors as lieutenant-class ranked while your own toons are classed somewhere between critter and normal.

 

That defeats the whole purpose of the mirror image fight gimick - to show you how ridiculously overpowered your own toon(s) are compared to normal enemies, by making you fight your mirror image on a perfectly level playing field.
 

This is true. The mirrors also have different abilities chosen. The modifier for the player is off I agree, it'd have made more sense if it were same as a lieutenant. I wouldn't fault the whole mechanic though.