196 réponses à ce sujet

[EmissaryofLies]

Fenris was pro-mage, what are you all on about?

[Lotion Soronarr]

Both Warden siblings support the mages in The Last Straw, and CircleBethany says that the Maker has called her to help free her fellow mages.

Alistair either declares the Circle free or hides fleeing apostates.

Leliana helps out the protagonists in Asunder against the templars.

So only Sten, Aveline and Fenris are really against mage freedom.

 

I'm sorry, but that doesn't make those people anti-Circle.

 

It may make them Anti-Meredith, or Anti-Lambert.

But that they hate and wish to disassemble the entire system? Nope.
 

 

And, if we assume you are correct (which you are not), that only means we need more opposing views in Da:I, thus everyone in DA:I should in the end side against the mages!

[Hellion Rex]

Fenris was pro-mage, what are you all on about?

I certainly turned him pro-mage.

[Hellion Rex]

And, if we assume you are correct (which you are not), that only means we need more opposing views in Da:I, thus everyone in DA:I should in the end side against the mages!

How about...no?

[Grieving Natashina]

How about...no?

I'm tired and my insomnia is acting up, but how about we not be forced to have our ending revolving around the angry men and women without pants?  Just a thought.

 

And yeah, I turned Fenris "pro-Mage" too in one of my sessions.

 

Giggity goo!

 

[Mistic]

It's quite possible for us to love someone as a character and hate them as a person.

 

Agreed. After all, that's part of the villains' charm, isn't it? And DA and other RPG don't have parties of characters just to have them all agreeing with you. That isn't interesting. Looking for different "bases" is part of the writing, in fact.

 

I'm OK with Cassandra hating mages, since she has a good Freudian excuse (quickly, let's get a time machine and save her family! Poor girl ), but after the events in Dawn of the Seeker I suppose she will have mellowed a little.

[Xilizhra]

I'm sorry, but that doesn't make those people anti-Circle.

 

It may make them Anti-Meredith, or Anti-Lambert.

But that they hate and wish to disassemble the entire system? Nope.
 

 

And, if we assume you are correct (which you are not), that only means we need more opposing views in Da:I, thus everyone in DA:I should in the end side against the mages!

Bethany explicitly does, Alistair is strongly implied to do so (after all, it's not like he's directly going against Meredith in Ferelden), Wynne joins the cause of mage freedom, and Leliana goes with the Divine who didn't oppose the Circle's secession when it happened, so your statement only might work for Carver. And even he disliked templars and was fine with keeping apostates free.

 

In any case, as I said, if things are less extreme in DAI, we likely won't have anyone more extreme than, or even as extreme as, Fenris. So no loyalist templars for you.

 

I'm tired and my insomnia is acting up, but how about we not be forced to have our ending revolving around the angry men and women without pants?  Just a thought.

Templars do wear pants. In any case, the only other thing I'd want it to revolve around is elves.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Bethany explicitly does, Alistair is strongly implied to do so (after all, it's not like he's directly going against Meredith in Ferelden), Wynne joins the cause of mage freedom, and Leliana goes with the Divine who didn't oppose the Circle's secession when it happened, so your statement only might work for Carver. And even he disliked templars and was fine with keeping apostates free.

 

In any case, as I said, if things are less extreme in DAI, we likely won't have anyone more extreme than, or even as extreme as, Fenris. So no loyalist templars for you.

 

 

 

Templars do wear pants. In any case, the only other thing I'd want it to revolve around is elves.

 

What? I can agree with alistair but rest not at all.. Wynne is pro-circle and leliana is pro-chantry not-mage same with divine they were acting against mages in da 2 so it is your imagination... Eee not rly carver didn't disliked templars but some of their methods and he wasn't fine with keeping apostates free...

[Xilizhra]

What? I can agree with alistair but rest not at all.. Wynne is pro-circle and leliana is pro-chantry not-mage same with divine they were acting against mages in da 2 so it is your imagination... Eee not rly carver didn't disliked templars but some of their methods and he wasn't fine with keeping apostates free...

See Asunder. And Carver kept one or two apostates free for quite a bit of his life.

[TheKomandorShepard]

See Asunder. And Carver kept one or two apostates free for quite a bit of his life.

I saw asunder that divine helped mages escape is rather shady and destroyed peace and order so she may be agent of chaos but as i said she is pro-chantry not mage neither leliana they barely tolerate libertarians so well... and that was carver family so that doesn't make him don't care about apostates he let only hawke go... every other time you want help mage or let them go he dislike it...

[Xilizhra]

I saw asunder that divine helped mages escape is rather shady and destroyed peace and order so she may be agent of chaos but as i said she is pro-chantry not mage neither leliana they barely tolerate libertarians so well... and that was carver family so that doesn't make him don't care about apostates he let only hawke go... every other time you want help mage or let them go he dislike it...

Note that I said Warden Carver earlier.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Note that I said Warden Carver earlier.

 

And? when there are differences carver still dislikes magic so yep...

[Xilizhra]

And? when there are differences carver still dislikes magic so yep...

He gets over it and supports the mages over the templars at the end, getting quite angry if Hawke sided with Meredith.

[TheKomandorShepard]

He gets over it and supports the mages over the templars at the end, getting quite angry if Hawke sided with Meredith.

He doesn't support mages he is angry because you sided with meredith who she called crazy bi*** or something i know because i played mage...

[Xilizhra]

He doesn't support mages he is angry because you sided with meredith who she called crazy bi*** or something i know because i played mage...

If you want.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Bethany explicitly does, Alistair is strongly implied to do so (after all, it's not like he's directly going against Meredith in Ferelden), Wynne joins the cause of mage freedom, and Leliana goes with the Divine who didn't oppose the Circle's secession when it happened, so your statement only might work for Carver. And even he disliked templars and was fine with keeping apostates free.

 

- no. Bethany was pretty much OK with it until the very end. She rises up against Meredith. Her line can easily be explained as being taken by the moment or Orsinos influence

 

- no. Alistar is definitely not anti-Cirlce.

 

- Wynee pretty much joins under duress, after being manipulated and put into a no-choice scenario

 

- Leliana is an agent of the Divine. She carries out the mission regardless of personal misgivings. At no poitn does she come off as anti-circle

 

- and the divine not opposing the circle secession? There' snot much she could have done and no one was asking her. So you can't even label her as anti-circle.

 

- Carver? He was protecting his siblings, but he still doesn't think that circles are a bad idea.

[Xilizhra]

Orsino never said anything about freeing mages, only that the fleeing mages from Kirkwall should inform the other Circles. The line about freedom was all Bethany.

 

Alistair appears solidly opposed to the templars as they are now.

 

Wynne simply had to realize how bad things had gotten.

 

Leliana never comes across as specifically pro-Circle either, nor does Carver. You appear to be reaching rather badly.

[renfrees]

I certainly turned him pro-mage.

Fenris had a very distinctive list of priorities:

 

1. Personal loyalty;

2. Slavery;

3. Magic.

 

So it's not surprising he put his first priority above everything else, if you actually earned it.

[EmissaryofLies]

Fenris had a very distinctive list of priorities:

 

1. Personal loyalty;

2. Slavery;

3. Magic.

 

So it's not surprising he put his first priority above everything else, if you actually earned it.

 

Agreed.

 

It was enlightening, repeatedly advising him to make his own decisions. But that same aspect of his personality that one can argue is a weakness, turns out to be his greatest strength.

[renfrees]

Agreed.

 

It was enlightening, repeatedly advising him to make his own decisions. But that same aspect of his personality that one can argue is a weakness, turns out to be his greatest strength.

Fenris, sticking in with pro-mage Hawke in the end was one of the most satisfying achievements i've had in DAII. Unlike that bitter taste with pro-Templar Anders   

[EmissaryofLies]

Fenris, sticking in with pro-mage Hawke in the end was one of the most satisfying achievements i've had in DAII. Unlike that bitter taste with pro-Templar Anders 

 

Which is why I absolutely love the character, despite my pro-mage opinions.

 

Fenris is a great argument as to how and why compromise can be reached. It's akin to getting Magneto to fight for the humans.

[Master Warder Z_]

Which is why I absolutely love the character, despite my pro-mage opinions.

 

Fenris is a great argument as to how and why compromise can be reached. It's akin to getting Magneto to fight for the humans.

 

Which he actually does, Four times, well more then that if you count alt timelines that "didn't happen in the canon universe.

 

I don't mind Magneto but ironically enough? My favorite cameo of the character is him fighting a character not even of his fictive world state.

 

Red Skull Vs Magneto will forever be the most awesome stand off between two Antagonists in comic history.

[EmissaryofLies]

@MWZ

 

Will definitely have to check that out now.

[TK514]

Alistair appears solidly opposed to the templars as they are.

Granted it's been a while, but as I recall Alistair's only complaints about the Templars stemmed from his resentment for being sent there by Eamon, and his correct feeling that he was a poor fit, personality-wise. I don't remember him ever making a serious comment about their policies or duties either way.

I'm also having difficulty remembering a single organization outside the Grey Wardens that he doesn't mock, belittle, or whine about at least once.

[renfrees]

Which is why I absolutely love the character, despite my pro-mage opinions.

 

Fenris is a great argument as to how and why compromise can be reached. It's akin to getting Magneto to fight for the humans.

Uhm, i think either you slightly misunderstood his motives, or i misunderstood your meaning.

 

He sticks with pro-mage Hawke solely because of utter personal loyalty to that person, his overall views on magic doesn't change much. You'd be hard pressed to find many persons as devoted as him, for this kind of compromise to be anything more than exception.

 

Forgive if i misinterpreted your words.