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[Master Warder Z_]

And he also happened to have a book on translating ancient elvish, whereas the Dalish didn't have that book. 

 

Bummer for them?

 

Maybe some one could chat up a Magister, they apparently had interest in such devices as well.

[dragonflight288]

Bummer for them?

 

Maybe some one could chat up a Magister, they apparently had interest in such devices as well.

 

And all they got was long-distance communication devices. No darkspawn, no demons. Not even the portal that Morrigan had. 

[Master Warder Z_]

And all they got was long-distance communication devices. No darkspawn, no demons. Not even the portal that Morrigan had. 

 

And that was what you wanted out of it no?

 

._.

 

Seems like a better prospect then me then a chick who utterly failed and a witch who disappeared into one.

 

Just saying.

[dragonflight288]

And that was what you wanted out of it no?

 

._.

 

Seems like a better prospect then me then a chick who utterly failed and a witch who disappeared into one.

 

Just saying.

 

I'm saying that the eluvians are not dangerous in and of themselves. Nor do they appear in any lore to have a corrupting influence. There is no credible source that says otherwise. 

[LobselVith8]

And he also happened to have a book on translating ancient elvish, whereas the Dalish didn't have that book. 

 

Which isn't surprising, since Ariane infers that the Circle stole some elven tomes and artifacts during the fall of the Dales. Given that Merrill was studying lore, the Sabrae clan may have had access to information that Ariane's clan lacked.

[dragonflight288]

Which isn't surprising, since Ariane infers that the Circle stole some elven tomes and artifacts during the fall of the Dales. Given that Merrill was studying lore, the Sabrae clan may have had access to information that Ariane's clan lacked.

 

And they had the book, so it's equally possible they have information Merrill also lacked, and simply didn't know it because they can't read the darn book. 

[Master Warder Z_]

I'm saying that the eluvians are not dangerous in and of themselves. Nor do they appear in any lore to have a corrupting influence. There is no credible source that says otherwise. 

 

They represent a page of history long since closed, to me that's a curruptive thing in and of it self, but i suppose our perspectives may differ on that.

 

 

 

Which isn't surprising, since Ariane infers that the Circle stole some elven tomes and artifacts during the fall of the Dales. Given that Merrill was studying lore, the Sabrae clan may have had access to information that Ariane's clan lacked.

 

"Stolen" Implies wrongfully taken.

 

Seizure of anything after a war is legitimate by any notion of warfare of the day.

[Senya]

They represent a page of history long since closed, to me that's a curruptive thing in and of it self, but i suppose our perspectives may differ on that.

 

 

 

 

"Stolen" Implies wrongfully taken.

 

Seizure of anything after a war is legitimate by any notion of warfare of the day.

Particularly if it's seized from the aggressor. The elves did not wage a defensive war.

[dragonflight288]

They represent a page of history long since closed, to me that's a curruptive thing in and of it self, but i suppose our perspectives may differ on that.

 

 

 

Our perspectives indeed differ greatly, especially since I truly don't comprehend how studying a relic of an age gone by is corruptive in and of itself. Not when that relic has the potential to help out the Dalish significantly. 

 

Imagine if you will if Merrill taught all the clans how to build an eluvian so they each had one. If one clan ended up like the Sabrae clan on sundermount, they could send out a message and the closest clan could help them within a few months tops. Or if a clan made a huge discovery, rather than waiting ten years to share this knowledge with the other clans, they can share it immediately, pool resources and become more cohesive. 

 

Or if during the time of a blight, the elves could contact one another and let them know they're honoring their treaty, and other clans can be on their way to join the fight. 

[Master Warder Z_]

Our perspectives indeed differ greatly, especially since I truly don't comprehend how studying a relic of an age gone by is corruptive in and of itself. Not when that relic has the potential to help out the Dalish significantly. 

 

Imagine if you will if Merrill taught all the clans how to build an eluvian so they each had one. If one clan ended up like the Sabrae clan on sundermount, they could send out a message and the closest clan could help them within a few months tops. Or if a clan made a huge discovery, rather than waiting ten years to share this knowledge with the other clans, they can share it immediately, pool resources and become more cohesive. 

 

Or if during the time of a blight, the elves could contact one another and let them know they're honoring their treaty, and other clans can be on their way to join the fight. 

 

Advantage over progress then? See that's the very notion i disagree with, Why not forge something anew to achieve the same end? Why do the Dalish not simply craft speaking stones or another method of communion? 

 

Instead of building for tomorrow, you invite obsession with the past, if the mirror can help or people what other methods become applicable? Communing with Demons? Blood Rituals, You invite the oaths and ways of the dead to dictate the terms of the present and you forsake what can be forged in the modern day.

 

Thinking of what could be rather then what, was is my point.

 

It's the same obsession i found intolerable about Merril as well, And its one of the few things i agree with the Qunari about.

[dragonflight288]

Advantage over progress then? See that's the very notion i disagree with, Why not forge something anew to achieve the same end? Why do the Dalish not simply craft speaking stones or another method of communion? 

 

Instead of building for tomorrow, you invite obsession with the past, if the mirror can help or people what other methods become applicable? Communing with Demons? Blood Rituals, You invite the oaths and ways of the dead to dictate the terms of the present and you forsake what can be forged in the modern day.

 

Thinking of what could be rather then what, was is my point.

 

It's the same obsession i found intolerable about Merril as well, And its one of the few things i agree with the Qunari about.

 

The elves don't have the opportunity to sit down, research and develop something new. They're always on the move, ekking out a meager existence. Merrill left the clan to research and build a new eluvian, and decided to blend in with the city elves and be a face in the crowd to avoid getting caught. 

 

Unless the Dalish have a place to settle and advance technology and magic for themselves, they are kind of stuck in a rut. 

[LobselVith8]

Particularly if it's seized from the aggressor. The elves did not wage a defensive war.

 

That depends on which historical account you read; the Chantry and the Dalish differ on the inception of that conflict.

[Master Warder Z_]

The elves don't have the opportunity to sit down, research and develop something new. They're always on the move, ekking out a meager existence. Merrill left the clan to research and build a new eluvian, and decided to blend in with the city elves and be a face in the crowd to avoid getting caught. 

 

Unless the Dalish have a place to settle and advance technology and magic for themselves, they are kind of stuck in a rut. 

 

We were discussing principle over reality though weren't we?

 

Besides its likely you already know my views on a "elven" Homeland, So i don't see the need to state what has already been stated.

[TK514]

Our perspectives indeed differ greatly, especially since I truly don't comprehend how studying a relic of an age gone by is corruptive in and of itself. Not when that relic has the potential to help out the Dalish significantly. 
 
Imagine if you will if Merrill taught all the clans how to build an eluvian so they each had one. If one clan ended up like the Sabrae clan on sundermount, they could send out a message and the closest clan could help them within a few months tops. Or if a clan made a huge discovery, rather than waiting ten years to share this knowledge with the other clans, they can share it immediately, pool resources and become more cohesive. 
 
Or if during the time of a blight, the elves could contact one another and let them know they're honoring their treaty, and other clans can be on their way to join the fight.

Of course, the flip side is the 'Unintended Consequences'. Say they're able to start building fancy mirrors again, and Tevinter finds out. Thus far, they haven't had anyone actively persuing them with a direct goal of capture or extermination.

[Master Warder Z_]

That depends on which historical account you read; the Chantry and the Dalish differ on the inception of that conflict.

 

Yeah just listen to that Dalish storyteller!

 

._.

 

Seriously though WOT basically confirmed the Elves were marching on Orlais when the call to war came.

[LobselVith8]

Of course, the flip side is the 'Unintended Consequences'. Say they're able to start building fancy mirrors again, and Tevinter finds out. Thus far, they haven't had anyone actively persuing them with a direct goal of capture or extermination.

 

Tevinter seems a little preoccupied with their never-ending war with the Qunari.

[Master Warder Z_]

Tevinter seems a little preoccupied with their never-ending war with the Qunari.

 

To directly move against them? Perhaps.

 

To fund mercenaries to go after them? They manage to do so quite often despite that handicap.

 

Mostly to keep their slave markets intact, but i'm certain they could make an exception if it came to securing something shiny and rare.

[LobselVith8]

Yeah just listen to that Dalish storyteller!

 

You mean the Dalish Keeper, Gisharel, who provides verbal and written history, as opposed to the Chantry author, Sister Petrine?

 

._.

 

Seriously though WOT basically confirmed the Elves were marching on Orlais when the call to war came.

 

WoT never reads that either account is correct or incorrect. When I made a thread on the issue, no developer participated to say that either historical account was more accurate than the other.

[dragonflight288]

We were discussing principle over reality though weren't we?

 

Besides its likely you already know my views on a "elven" Homeland, So i don't see the need to state what has already been stated.

 

True, and we also disagree on that point.

 

But principle and reality both need to be taken into account when deciding on a course of action.

[LobselVith8]

To directly move against them? Perhaps.

 

To fund mercenaries to go after them? They manage to do so quite often despite that handicap.

 

Mostly to keep their slave markets intact, but i'm certain they could make an exception if it came to securing something shiny and rare.

 

I think the Qunari pose a more important concern for Tevinter than the Dalish communicating with one another.

[Master Warder Z_]

You mean the Dalish Keeper, Gisharel, who provides verbal and written history, as opposed to the Chantry author, Sister Petrine?

 

 

WoT never reads that either account is correct or incorrect. When I made a thread on the issue, no developer participated to say that either historical account was more accurate than the other.

 

No i meant the Dalish Storyteller from Origins, The Keeper can keep his codex's accurate or incorrect they may be.

 

It did however state within the front page that it was written to be God Canon class lore however, and it stated within the book Orlais only moved to assault the Dales when they were already under attack by them.

 

That isn't perspective, its how the book was structured and the lore within it written.

 

And given dev's haven't contradicted that accounting, i'll take their word for it.

[Hellion Rex]

Tevinter seems a little preoccupied with their never-ending war with the Qunari.

Not enough to stop magical experimentation, a la Magister Titus.

[Lord Raijin]

Only Raijin can outdo Rassler in Terms of Anders.

 

Hey how did my name get involved in this discussion?

 

Anyhow the templars are traitors of the Chantry. They deserve to go down for what they did. At least the Divine wanted to give some freedom to the mages whereas the seekers wanted to furthur control them to the breaking point.

 

Why are the templars leadeerless? Because their a bunch of drug addicted morons who lose their sanity.

[Master Warder Z_]

I think the Qunari pose a more important concern for Tevinter than the Dalish communicating with one another.

 

They tended to like shiny magic things, just saying.

 

 

True, and we also disagree on that point.

 

But principle and reality both need to be taken into account when deciding on a course of action.

 

From the standpoint on the mirror? I think principle is enough, it represents a page of a book that should remain closed.

 

Truly? You don't think they should endear themselves and become a useful portion of society?

 

Well it's ultimately off topic anyway so i suppose we can just agree to disagree.

[LobselVith8]

No i meant the Dalish Storyteller from Origins, The Keeper can keep his codex's accurate or incorrect they may be.

 

The Dalish historical account about the fall of the Dales is provided by an individual who has spoken and written a great deal of history for the Elvhen. It isn't surprising that the hahren would educate the younger members of the clan about this event.

 

It did however state within the front page that it was written to be God Canon class lore however, and it stated within the book Orlais only moved to assault the Dales when they were already under attack by them.

 

Actually, WoT read that the Chantry called an Exalted March after Red Crossing. I even provided, word for word, the exact description of the fall of the Dales in my elven thread, to address the brevity given to the event. Nowhere in WoT does it state or imply that the Dalish historical account is incorrect.