626 réponses à ce sujet

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Killing for "greater good" makes you better than killing for money? nah it just makes you think that you are better it is only justification mostly for person who is pulling that out... at least person who kills for money is honest in that matter.

 

And well murder is the best solution when you want solve problem permanently as in this world always follow rule might makes right...
 

You're right about people who kill for the "greater good." On the other hand, some people do actually kill for the greater good, and they're better than those who do so for money.

[KainD]

And you're adding in weakness to demonic suggestion when you already encounter said malign spirits every time you close your eyes.

 

So...I don't know, him advising retreat seems more appropriate then a temporary boost of power, you didn't get to enjoy long because you gave into a demon one evening.

 

Blood magic adds no extra risk of demonic possession. 

[The Baconer]

Maybe I take things a tad too far, but I very much enjoy actually envisioning myself in these situations.  After all, Dragon Age is a role-playing game.  It makes for good food for thought.

 

But to what extent can you really pretend to value the lives of Bandit 137 or Coterie Thug 45? Is there really a line being crossed when someone chooses to steal their blood to power the next spell, as opposed to say, searing the very armor they wear to their skin with fire? Or, sending electricity to course through their body, causing them to release their bowels and die without any semblance of dignity? Am I really expressing in some way that the lives of the people I kill are no less important than mine by choosing to do the latter?

[KainD]

You're right about people who kill for the "greater good." On the other hand, some people do actually kill for the greater good, and they're better than those who do so for money.

 

Greater good is subjective.

[TheKomandorShepard]

You're right about people who kill for the "greater good." On the other hand, some people do actually kill for the greater good, and they're better than those who do so for money.

 

Yeah to point when you ask whose greater good... and what makes them better?

[Master Warder Z_]

Blood magic adds no extra risk of demonic possession.

 

 

Pretty sure WOT directly contradicts that very statement.

[KainD]

Pretty sure WOT directly contradicts that very statement.

 

No it doesn't. 

[Master Warder Z_]

No it doesn't. 

 

Again i'm pretty sure it does in the section mentioning blood rituals and sacrifices and what have you.

 

Something to the effect of the risks pertaining to the magic resulted in those performing said ritual to become possessed.

 

Ergo blood magic increases the risk of possession.

 

Pretty cut and dry.

[KainD]

Again i'm pretty sure it does in the section mentioning blood rituals and sacrifices and what have you.

 

Something to the effect of the risks pertaining to the magic resulted in those performing said ritual to become possessed.

 

Ergo blood magic increases the risk of possession.

 

Pretty cut and dry.

 

I've read those sections. 

 

A bunch of mages did a bunch of experimental rituals, that they didn't completely know how those would turn out, they only had assumptions. These rituals could have been done with lyrium, but blood magic game more power, and they didn't have enough lyrium so they can perform said rituals. 

 

These rituals have nothing to do with blood magic, other than it was a source to fuel it. 

[Master Warder Z_]

I've read those sections. 

 

A bunch of mages did a bunch of experimental rituals, that they didn't completely know how those would turn out, they only had assumptions. These rituals could have been done with lyrium, but blood magic game more power, and they didn't have enough lyrium so they can perform said rituals. 

 

These rituals have nothing to do with blood magic, other than it was a source to fuel it. 

 

So forgo the result of the use of it and blame it on impenitence?

 

Blood mages tend to go abomination far more often in lore then their non blood mage counterparts, seems to me the conclusion of usage of it is pretty much set in stone.

[TheKomandorShepard]

So forgo the result of the use of it and blame it on impenitence?

 

Blood mages tend to go abomination far more often in lore then their non blood mage counterparts, seems to me the conclusion of usage of it is pretty much set in stone.

 

Well it possible because blood mages are only who can summon demon and thus deal with it see uldred so it may be reason.

[JoltDealer]

Reasons are always discernible, no one ever does anything for no reason. You are not supposed to think kindly of people you disagree with, they can be your enemies after all. You just always have to realize that they are people just like you, not some monsters. Respect is earned through doing different things , depending on the values of one you are trying to impress, and whose respect you want to acquire. 

 

You are suggesting fighting with one hand tight behind your back, there is no reason to do so. 

One would think so, but there are those who do things without legitimate reasons.  Sometimes, people just do things.  That is a life lesson that is very much worth learning.  And I often have amicable relationships with those I disagree with.  I am a liberal, but my girlfriend is conservative.  I am a Catholic, yet my brother is an Atheist.  In both situations, we get along just fine.  We understand that we have differences in opinion and respect the other nonetheless.  However, there is a line of what is and isn't acceptable.  

 

Also, if you're saying that fighting without magic is fighting with one hand tied behind your back, then you obviously rely too heavily on magic.  Surrender and running like hell are still options. 

 

Blood magic adds no extra risk of demonic possession. 

 

I may need to double check the lore, but I'm fairly certain that blood magic usually requires that you form a pact or communicate with some kind of demon in order to learn it.

 

But to what extent can you really pretend to value the lives of Bandit 137 or Coterie Thug 45? Is there really a line being crossed when someone chooses to steal their blood to power the next spell, as opposed to say, searing the very armor they wear to their skin with fire? Or, sending electricity to course through their body, causing them to release their bowels and die without any semblance of dignity? Am I really expressing in some way that the lives of the people I kill are no less important than mine by choosing to do the latter?

 

I'm not pretending to value any lives.  If I was actively involved in the universe of Dragon Age, I would value every life.  The line being crossed when it comes to blood magic is that is requires loss of life in order to use it.  Even the act of learning blood magic shows an intent to use others' lives for your own power.  It's different from setting someone on fire, shocking someone, or plunging a blade into their heart.  These things are done in the moment in order to survive.  Blood magic basically means that you have to kill in order to kill, as opposed to kill in order to survive.

[KainD]

Blood mages tend to go abomination far more often in lore then their non blood mage counterparts, seems to me the conclusion of usage of it is pretty much set in stone.

 

Seems to me that lore doesn't suggest any relations between blood magic and possessions. I don't care if it just so happened that a lot of blood mages became abominations, there is no suggestion in the lore that it was because they were blood mages. 

[KainD]

One would think so, but there are those who do things without legitimate reasons.  Sometimes, people just do things.  That is a life lesson that is very much worth learning.  And I often have amicable relationships with those I disagree with.  I am a liberal, but my girlfriend is conservative.  I am a Catholic, yet my brother is an Atheist.  In both situations, we get along just fine.  We understand that we have differences in opinion and respect the other nonetheless.  However, there is a line of what is and isn't acceptable.  

 

Also, if you're saying that fighting without magic is fighting with one hand tied behind your back, then you obviously rely too heavily on magic.  Surrender and running like hell are still options. 

 

I may need to double check the lore, but I'm fairly certain that blood magic usually requires that you form a pact or communicate with some kind of demon in order to learn it.

 

Your legitimate reasons are different from my legitimate reasons and different from other people. But everybody has a reason and that reasons is legit to them. 

You can disagree as long as you don't affect each others life in a meaningful way with those different things you do. 

 

For mages that just ran away from a circle, magic sure is everything, and it would take years to teach them any meaningful ways to do martial arts, and then they face a group of people that are a lot better at it than them anyway - recipe for disaster. 

 

No you don't HAVE to learn blood magic from demons, you can however. 

[Master Warder Z_]

Seems to me that lore doesn't suggest any relations between blood magic and possessions. I don't care if it just so happened that a lot of blood mages became abominations, there is no suggestion in the lore that it was because they were blood mages. 

 

You don't care that the school you advocate for has abominations due to the summoning of demons, sundering the veil and other blood mage concentrated intrinsic traits? Even if it isn't the school it self, it doesn't magically make all those possessions just random occurrence.

[KainD]

Well it possible because blood mages are only who can summon demon and thus deal with it see uldred so it may be reason.

 

No they are not the only ones that can summon demons. 

[KainD]

You don't care that the school you advocate for has abominations due to the summoning of demons, sundering the veil and other blood mage concentrated intrinsic traits? Even if it isn't the school it self, it doesn't magically make all those possessions just random occurrence.

 

Yes I don't care for the fact that blood magic allows easier access to such things as long as it is not THE reason for those things. It is all up to individual at the end of the day. You can do all the same things without blood magic if you really want to, it's just a lot harder. 

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Yeah to point when you ask whose greater good... and what makes them better?

Volume of the people screwed (and the extent to which they're screwed) versus the people saved (and what they're saved from.) That's what you fight for if what you're after is the legitimate greater good.

[Master Warder Z_]

Yes I don't care for the fact that blood magic allows easier access to such things as long as it is not THE reason for those things. It is all up to individual at the end of the day. You can do all the same things without blood magic if you really want to, it's just a lot harder. 

 

Just seems to me is all, it IS the reason for those things.

[KainD]

Just seems to me is all, it IS the reason for those things.

 

There is no lore to back you up on that. Blood magic is a tool, nothing more nothing less. 

[KainD]

Volume of the people screwed (and the extent to which they're screwed) versus the people saved (and what they're saved from.) That's what you fight for if what you're after is the legitimate greater good.

 

Aaand the definition of your greater good is - might makes right. Congratulations. In your case it is screw all the minorities and carter to the majority, power in numbers. 

[TheKomandorShepard]

No they are not the only ones that can summon demons. 

 

Yep only blood mage can summon demon to thedas not counting becoming abomnation.  

 

 

Volume of the people screwed (and the extent to which they're screwed) versus the people saved (and what they're saved from.) That's what you fight for if what you're after is the legitimate greater good.

 

And you are able judge that by own moral standarts others will have various opinions blow up city a to save city b you blow up a for greater good city b will think that was greater good when city a won't rly think that way and vice versa.You are just screwing someone to reach your goal same with doing same for money so ultimately you are doing that what is convenient to reach your goal in both cases only in first case you are think that you are morally superior.

[Master Warder Z_]

There is no lore to back you up on that. Blood magic is a tool, nothing more nothing less. 

 

There isn't any lore for its defense of those attributes either.

 

It just seems to me happenstance supports my claim.

[The Baconer]

Even the act of learning blood magic shows an intent to use others' lives for your own power. 

 

There are a multitude of ways that you can do that, both figuratively and literally, without using blood magic.

 

 

It's different from setting someone on fire, shocking someone, or plunging a blade into their heart.  These things are done in the moment in order to survive.  Blood magic basically means that you have to kill in order to kill, as opposed to kill in order to survive.

 

That Blood Magic can't be used as a means of survival is demonstratively untrue. That, and the killing that we do in the franchise has often gone beyond simple survival.

[The Hierophant]

That's not a joke, it does happen.
 

Lol that page is priceless.

Also my post was inspired by Duncan's story in the Magi origin in which he witnessed a hidden Templar ambush a blood mage as they were using blood magic on his friends.