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[Divine Justinia V]

I find the Tranquil very creepy, but fascinating.

 

I pity them.

[EmissaryofLies]

The Tranquil are nothing more than a bluntly honest depiction of what the Chantry/Templar organization ulimately desires for mages whether they know so or not.

[AresKeith]

The Tranquil are nothing more than a bluntly honest depiction of what the Chantry/Templar organization ulimately desires for mages whether they know so or not.

 

Eh not really

[Grieving Natashina]

@Emissary That's a bit of a blanket statement, don't you think?  We cannot and should not assume that is what every member of the Templars and Chantry want.  Shoot, even crazy-as-hell Meredith rejected such a solution, as well as the Divine herself.

[Divine Justinia V]

@Emissary That's a bit of a blanket statement, don't you think?  We cannot and should not assume that is what every member of the Templars and Chantry want.  Shoot, even crazy-as-hell Meredith rejected such a solution, as well as the Divine herself.

 

We also have to keep in mind that the Divine is pretty pro-Mage :') and with Meredith being the total opposite, I was shocked to see her deny that.

I can't help but wonder, at least a little bit, if she only denied such a "solution" so she could continue this crusade against them?

[Mirrman70]

I am jealous of Tranquil, having emotions affect your judgement leads to wars over stupid things.

[Grieving Natashina]

We also have to keep in mind that the Divine is pretty pro-Mage :') and with Meredith being the total opposite, I was shocked to see her deny that.

I can't help but wonder, at least a little bit, if she only denied such a "solution" so she could continue this crusade against them?

Fair enough, but the point remains that not every member of the Templars or the Chantry want all mages Tranquil.

[KaiserShep]

The Tranquil are nothing more than a bluntly honest depiction of what the Chantry/Templar organization ulimately desires for mages whether they know so or not.

 

I would imagine that Alrik is symptomatic of what some templars may desire, but I doubt very much that even half of the Chantry and Templar order would actually desire to strip people of their personality.

[Divine Justinia V]

Fair enough, but the point remains that not every member of the Templars or the Chantry want all mages Tranquil.

 

Oh absolutely, I never assumed otherwise or got that vibe from DA2. There were a lot of nice Templars just like I'm sure there were lots of bad Templars.

 

I just question Meredith's decision because I always thought she'd go for something like that.

[Master Warder Z_]

I just question Meredith's decision because I always thought she'd go for something like that.

 

She still viewed them as human for one. Cursed people, but still people.

 

That's a difference between her and me i suppose, but even i wouldn't cast aside such a useful asset in such a manner.

 

So it could be a mixture of sentimentalism and practicality who knows?

 

She ultimately rejected it and took the reasoning for it to her grave.

[EmissaryofLies]

I would imagine that Alrik is symptomatic of what some templars may desire, but I doubt very much that even half of the Chantry and Templar order would actually desire to strip people of their personality.

 

Control over magic, destruction of magic. The docile nature, the logical obedience to authority helps as well. After all, you believe what the Chantry decrees or you'll find yourself like the elves.

 

**THAT IS NOT AN INVITATION TO DEVOLVE INTO A MOST DISTASTEFUL OF DISCUSSIONS.**

[EmissaryofLies]

@Emissary That's a bit of a blanket statement, don't you think?  We cannot and should not assume that is what every member of the Templars and Chantry want.  Shoot, even crazy-as-hell Meredith rejected such a solution, as well as the Divine herself.

 

I do not mean that literally. But the figurative aspects speak for themselves. They seek ultimate control over mages.

[LobselVith8]

We also have to keep in mind that the Divine is pretty pro-Mage :') and with Meredith being the total opposite, I was shocked to see her deny that.

 

If the Divine is anything like you, I may have to modify my opinion of the Chantry.

 

I can't help but wonder, at least a little bit, if she only denied such a "solution" so she could continue this crusade against them?

 

Maybe. Or perhaps the Knight-Commander realized it could potentially cause unrest in all the Circles if the Tranquil Solution was utilized throughout an entire Circle Tower?

[Master Warder Z_]

Or perhaps the Knight-Commander realized it could potentially cause unrest in all the Circles if the Tranquil Solution was utilized throughout an entire Circle Tower?

 

Or maybe it had something to do with the Divine rejecting it, Ultimately Meredith's reasoning is her own.

[KaiserShep]

Control over magic, destruction of magic. The docile nature, the logical obedience to authority helps as well. After all, you believe what the Chantry decrees or you'll find yourself like the elves.

 

**THAT IS NOT AN INVITATION TO DEVOLVE INTO A MOST DISTASTEFUL OF DISCUSSIONS.**

 

Perhaps, but I guess in the end, what they want doesn't matter as much as what they may consider the better option long-term. Trying to destroy mages, either by killing them outright or making them tranquil doesn't seem like a good plan for the long haul. Whatever kind of "Circle" they'd be trying to establish wouldn't last very long.

[Master Warder Z_]

Perhaps, but I guess in the end, what they want doesn't matter as much as what they may consider the better option long-term. Trying to destroy mages, either by killing them outright or making them tranquil doesn't seem like a good plan for the long haul. Whatever kind of "Circle" they'd be trying to establish wouldn't last very long.

 

Or you know that could merely be pro mage hyperbole and most folks within both the Templars and Chantry just want a return to the status quo

[KaiserShep]

Or you know that could merely be pro mage hyperbole and most folks within both the Templars and Chantry just want a return to the status quo

 

Well really, the status quo would not involve a willy-nilly use of the rite of Tranquility anyway.

 

I am jealous of Tranquil, having emotions affect your judgement leads to wars over stupid things.

 

 

This is assuming that conflict won't still exist in an emotionless world. Heck, there's no telling what people might do because they lack the emotional response to stop them.

[Mockingword]

I have yet to see the Tranquil employ anything even remotely close to logic or critical thought. Bioware can keep telling me that the Tranquil are capable of making their own decisions, but I won't believe it. Whatever conception of 'logic' the writers are basing this assertion on, it's not one I've ever encountered, and they haven't explained it adequately at all.

 

I have no idea how Bioware plans to treat the Tranquil. The only outcome that makes sense to me is that individual tranquil would obey whoever happens to give them orders.

[AresKeith]

I have yet to see the Tranquil employ anything even remotely close to logic or critical thought. Bioware can keep telling me that the Tranquil are capable of making their own decisions, but I won't believe it. Whatever conception of 'logic' the writers are basing this assertion on, it's not one I've ever encountered, and they haven't explained it adequately at all.

 

I have no idea how Bioware plans to treat the Tranquil. The only outcome that makes sense to me is that individual tranquil would obey whoever happens to give them orders.

 

So it's your word against the devs?

[Mockingword]

So it's your word against the devs?

More like actual logic against the devs.

 

Thedas is a fantasy world populated with fantasy people, so obviously the writers can make up whatever absurd nonsense they want about how brains work over there. They already have done that, because they've shown us that, in this universe, dreams (and apparently emotions) come from another dimension.

 

But in the real world, despite popular opinion, the human brain is not a continuum with 'emotion' at one end and 'logic' at the other. It is impossible to ever truly separate yourself from your emotional responses, and the notion that being able to do so would somehow make your judgement 'better' is just flat-out incorrect.

 

So before I accept the bold assertion that the Tranquil are beings of 'pure logic', I need the developers to properly explain to me just what the hell 'logic' in Thedas even is, because it's not anything like real logic.

[spirosz]

More like actual logic against the devs.

 

Thedas is a fantasy world populated with fantasy people, so obviously the writers can make up whatever absurd nonsense they want about how brains work over there. They already have done that, because they've shown us that, in this universe, dreams (and apparently emotions) come from another dimension.

 

But in the real world, despite popular opinion, the human brain is not a continuum with 'emotion' at one end and 'logic' at the other. It is impossible to ever truly separate yourself from your emotional responses, and the notion that being able to do so would somehow make your judgement 'better' is just flat-out incorrect.

 

So before I accept the bold assertion that the Tranquil are beings of 'pure logic', I need the developers to properly explain to me just what the hell 'logic' in Thedas even is, because it's not anything like real logic.

 

You seen to forget that writers tend to "write lore" that follow a strict path, rules, etc.  

 

But let's forget about that and "logic".

[Grieving Natashina]

@Mocking: There is a cure for Tranquility, as discussed in Asunder.  It's a dangerous and risky, but there is a cure.

[Mockingword]

You seen to forget that writers tend to "write lore" that follow a strict path, rules, etc.  

 

But let's forget about that and "logic".

But the lore of Thedas is not the same thing as the facts of Thedas.

 

I'm afraid I can't just 'forget' about it. Any proper discussion of how the Tranquil would act in any given situation requires us to first understand how they think, and we don't, because their portrayal is uneven and self-contradictory.

[AresKeith]

But the lore of Thedas is not the same thing as the facts of Thedas.

 

I'm afraid I can't just 'forget' about it. Any proper discussion of how the Tranquil would act in any given situation requires us to first understand how they think, and we don't, because their portrayal is uneven and self-contradictory.

 

How so?

[EmissaryofLies]

Perhaps, but I guess in the end, what they want doesn't matter as much as what they may consider the better option long-term. Trying to destroy mages, either by killing them outright or making them tranquil doesn't seem like a good plan for the long haul. Whatever kind of "Circle" they'd be trying to establish wouldn't last very long.

 

Agreed to an extent.

 

All that they care about is control when it comes to the mages. Tranquility is the ulimate form of control as we've seen in the past two games. I will not deny that they have free will. But I find all it too telling that most completely submit to their masters. Some to the extent that they are violated. The entire Karl scene in DA II is evidence along with every other tranquil you ever seem to find with few exceptions. They are the true face of the Chantry.