14909 réponses à ce sujet

[veeia]

Nods I feel that.

Sebastian and Blackwall would be very interesting. I think his brand of righteousness would be very appealing to Blackwall, as well as his general affability.

But he is also a noble, and very soaked in that kind of privilege, so I think it would be an interesting conflict there too.

[Ashelsu]

@Gilsa

Late to the party, but it was a great comment about Isabela. I had my doubts before the duel with the Arishok, but never after.

 

Solas reminds me Loki too. One should remember though that despite being all funny and charming, Loki still became the main force behind the Death of the Gods. Caution is recommended dealing with the Tricksters.

 

I can see Blackwall getting along with Hawke's siblings. Aveline... would probably go the same way as Cassandra.

[Bugsie]

Yeah that would be the only failing in the Sebastian/Blackwall dynamic. But from what I gather Sebastian isn't a nob about it.

@Ashelsu, I think you're right about Aveline/Blackwall dynamic being similar to the Cass/Blackwall one.

I feel maybe a little invested in seeing something in Nathaniel and Blackwall interaction.
Blackwall: "So about your dad being a bit of a SOB and aligning himself with the wrong faction..."

LOL

[Caddius]

@MrsHairyLummox -- Great thoughts! From my completely scientific observations on forums and tumblr and elsewhere, people don't like feeling like the joke's on them. His past was a hard reveal. (Major props to the voice acting in prison. His intensity is what took me aback.) I had a toddler sleeping on my lap at the time and when the deaths of the children came out, I stopped breathing. I remember alt-tabbing out to find out more information on Blackwall's crimes, if he personally put a blade to them or if he didn't know they were there until after the fact. It turns out that it was somewhere in the middle. He realized they were there, but they died because he froze or hesitated too long. I saw someone say that you just don't come back from being a child-killer. I agree. That's probably a large part of what damns Blackwall. Some people have been in RL relationships where they've been lied to and Blackwall's story arc hits too close to home for them.

 

I totally get that other characters have done similar stuff, but it's not thrust up in our faces the way Blackwall's was. Blackwall also has his hypocrite moments throughout the game that adds salt to the wound. For example, the Crestwood stuff:

 

Inquisitor: "A letter from the mayor? It says he was the one who flooded Old Crestwood ten years ago. To stop the Blight from spreading."
Blackwall: "That sorry bastard. He left before he could get caught."

 

He would have been better off if he kept from making comments like these. It just makes people madder on subsequent playthroughs. =/

 

Why do I like Blackwall in light of his past? Because he decided on his own to be a better man. He followed through on it. He had nothing to gain from joining the Inquisition. Asked nothing of the Inquisitor. Discouraged the romantic relationship multiple times. He turned himself in on his own accord. Didn't try to escape the gallows by asking for leniency or mercy. If the Inquisitor breaks up with him, he accepts it and drops the conversation. These, to me, are all hallmarks of a someone taking it like a man and is sincere in his repentance.

 

Blackwall is also at further disadvantage because so much information about his character relies on outside sources. How many people even know to talk to that farmer before recruiting Blackwall? They don't hear about how Blackwall saved them, how he roused them to defend their homes, how he demanded nothing in terms of payment. How many people have Cole in their party to hear about Blackwall's inner turmoil? And then there's the bugged dialogue post-Revelations. Would that change anything? I don't really know.

 

After I finished my first game, I thought wow, they dared to go there with Blackwall's story. I love that they pushed the boundaries. It had the same elements that I liked about Isabela's romance in DA2. She had her own secrets, kept her cards to her chest, and constantly exasperated my Hawke. She ran off with that tome, put Hawke in a bad situation, and came back when she put Hawke's needs ahead of hers. That was the kind of moment that tested a relationship -- did I want to walk through fire for this woman? Was she worth walking through fire for? Once I decided yes, I was all in. Their burdens and their chains became my protagonist's. Both Blackwall and Isabela showed enough emotional vulnerability and personal growth for me to feel rewarded for my investment into their character arcs.

Many excellent points.

I think many of Blackwall's 'hypocrite' moments are him casting further judgement and hatred on himself from the relatively safe vantage of the Blackwall persona. Forever reminding himself that his actions were not excusable, and cannot be allowed to repeat. Solas has something similar when he calls out Blackwall, but later apologizes for being unfair, since Solas is well-aware he's made his own share of mistakes.

[Gilsa]

Topic whiplash, but what characters from earlier games do you see Blackwall getting along well with?
 

 

 

I can see Blackwall getting along with Hawke's siblings. Aveline... would probably go the same way as Cassandra.

 

I'm gonna call it and say definitely Aveline. Yeah, she'd likely spurn him for what he did to the soldiers under his command, but she also developed respect for Isabela over time. Really, it's up to Aveline's writer who is Lukas Kristjanson ... who also wrote Blackwall's BFF, Sera ... =p

 

 

(@Ashelsu -- re: Isabela comment - thanks! )

[kalasaurus]

D'awwww, Blackwall said that my Lavellan and Cassandra make an adorable couple :3

[vertigomez]

D'awwww, Blackwall said that my Lavellan and Cassandra make an adorable couple :3

He's a romantic!

[veeia]

Stumbled across another Blackwall hate post (my fault it was tagged I just didn't have xkit on) and I have seen the accusation that Blackwall fetishizes Sera/lesbians before, but never with any actual sources or references to the dialogue, just thrown out there in the long litany of his many sins..but does anyone know what lines they are talking about? I don't agree that Blackwall is a stalker or a rapist but I at least know where people are getting that. I trod searching but I can only spend so much time poking around in the Blackwall hate tags before I get angry, haha.

[vertigomez]

Probably referring to the "elbow deep in... circumstance" banter.

[veeia]

Blinks. Okay, I think yore right, that's probably the line where he "keeps asking sera about her sex life", now where's the one where he "fetishizes Sera/Quizzie"?

[Caddius]

Blinks. Okay, I think yore right, that's probably the line where he "keeps asking sera about her sex life", now where's the one where he "fetishizes Sera/Quizzie"?

Dunno about Sera and the Inquisitor, but when Sera wonders why he keeps asking about Circumstance and similar stories, he mutters, "I can't stop thinking about it." 

[veeia]

(Not trying to be too blasé here, I'm sure it's possible he has a line like that...after all iirc, Alistair did that, and Blackwall has that one line to Dorian that can read as homophobic and I find genuinely upsetting, it's just that I've seen it posted over and over without any "proof", which reads to me like one person asserted it and then everyone just accepted it but no one knows exactly what it is...which is obnoxious because if he really does have a line like that, I want to know, and if he doesn't, I want to know what they're considering that...but I don't want to reach out and ask someone who posts it along with "Blackwall literally raped u, love urself", lmao)

[Sabreenei]

I don't see how it is anything bad against Blackwall, with the story and Sera. She started telling the story and never finished it, purposely so you don't get the end, and keep thinking about it. So of course he's going to think  about it!

 

Here's the banter:

 

Blackwall: Right, how's it end?

Sera: What, the tavern tale?

Blackwall: Come on, you left off, elbow deep in... circumstances. That can't be it.

Sera: That wasn't her name, but yeah. That's as far as the story ever gets. Why are you complaining?

Blackwall: Because I can't stop thinking about it. I need to know the end.

Sera: Why would you want to stop? The whole point of the good bit is thinking about the good bit. If I tell the end , it ends. Bunch of moaners, this. Drag out the sad sh*te, yes please. But hang on to the good bit, oh can't have that. F*****ng daft.

[Gilsa]

I've googled to see if I could find something that would shed some light on this and didn't have much luck. I'm starting to think it's actually that banter. Check out this tumblr post -- it's got over 10k likes/reblogs and it's a partial quote of that banter. Maybe that creates the impression that Blackwall's a horndog for her stories?

 

http://biowarefangir...dras-cheekbones

 

I really like tumblr as a source of inspiring artwork and funny GIFs, but wow, it's not really useful as a conversational blog. It's hard to have threaded conversations and it's easy to say whatever you want on your blog with minimal consequences because people can't come onto your blog and tell you you're wrong. They have to do it on their own page.

[veeia]

Yup, that must be it. Huh, I had actually heard that whole banter before but I didnt' even remember it well enough to note it, I think. Confused. BUt okay! That's good to know. I was just perplexed by those posts because I romanced Sera and Blackwall was like "aww, good for you guys" and I brought them everywhere and he never made any comments that I read that way? But I can see how it as a partial could be seen as gross, and if you're already thinking Blackwall is a rapist stalker misogynist you wouldn't investigate futher.  

[Avejajed]

I wanted to say thank you to those that helped me earlier with my glitch in my canon. I considered going back to have it but I can't give up like 70 hours just for Blackwall.

I did get the scenes during my first playthrough, so I have at least seen them.

Anyway thanks you guys are super nice. Xox

[vertigomez]

Yeah, I really don't read that as "gross". If my best friend told me a raunchy story and dropped off in the middle of it, I'd wanna know how it ends too lolol.

[Sabreenei]

And if you listen to it, you can totally hear in their voices how great of friends they are. And she's pushed him before about sex, like when she offers to teach him with a peach, and whatnot. They just have that kind of relationship. If he wants to know how the dirty story she was telling ended, it only seems natural to me. I know I would! And when she says "That wasn't her name" you can hear her laughing that he used "circumstances" as a euphemism instead of being explicit, and she's teasing about it.

 

But really, I think no matter what, people will find bits and pieces to use against characters they don't like. Taken out of context just about anything can seem bad.

 

And I totally agree with what was said earlier in the thread by veeia, I think? A lot of times I'll like a character, and then find myself slowly coming to dislike them because of the fanbase. Whenever that happens I have to take a step back and start blocking a whole bunch of stuff, so I can try to remember how I felt about the character before the fans stepped in. Not just with dragon age, but across all fandoms. Before I got into fandoms, I always thought fans of a show/game/etc would always be nice to eachother, because fans of the same thing! How little did I know back then! Inter-arguing within fandoms can be super toxic, more so than fandom against fandom. It's a weird phenomena.

[Joe25]

Okay, I think I have an idea for my DA Dream Team. Blackwall, Wynne and Nathaniel I think they would make for a good team. Any thoughts?

[veeia]

Yeah now it sounds like mega reaching from someone who hates the character and wants everything to be wrong with them, ever.  But I wanted to double check and figure out where it was coming from, cuz you never know, and also I was hella confused, lmao. 

[Sabreenei]

Now that I'm thinking about it too, Sera has that banter about wanting to teach him with the peach. If he was really a horndog for lesbian activities, he would have been all, "yes, tell me all about how you've done that, describe all of it to me!" Instead of being all noooo, stop talking about it! (paraphrasing)

[veeia]

Yes that's what dialogues I thought of immediately, like Sera is the one who is like boundaries?? What?? Lmao, but he loves it even though he's all "nooooo". Cries more about sera and Blackwall friendship, cries so much.

[sandman2190]

Okay, I think I have an idea for my DA Dream Team. Blackwall, Wynne and Nathaniel I think they would make for a good team. Any thoughts?

Nathaniel and Blackwall would have an understanding (especially AFTER revealations.) on the likes of redemption..though I wonder if Nathaniel would see right through him if he pressed blackwall enough.

Wynne/Blackwall would be much like himself and solas (sadly, due to some unforeseen circumstances, I'm kind of  rushing right now.)

[Joe25]

Now that I'm thinking about it too, Sera has that banter about wanting to teach him with the peach. If he was really a horndog for lesbian activities, he would have been all, "yes, tell me all about how you've done that, describe all of it to me!" Instead of being all noooo, stop talking about it! (paraphrasing)

Get the grapefruit sounds out of my head!

[Sabreenei]

I actually think Blackwall and Alistair would get along pretty well. (If we're talking Alistair as he was when we met him in DAO, and not the older Alistair). Alistair has such a good heart and is always trying to do the best thing and give people the benefit of the doubt (except Loghain, and Blackwall agrees with him on that point). I think he might see Alistair as someone to protect. They'd get along with the silly humor (I see Alistair being shocked but getting along with Sera too --- and boy, would Sera love shocking him!). Alistair is a follower like Blackwall (at least when we meet him, and he is "unhardened"), but  he is someone who always strived to follow a good person. Blackwall might see some of himself in Alistair, had he gone a different way in life. If he were still pretending to be a Warden, there would be guilt, but Alistair was such a new warden, he probably would've believed anything Blackwall said. Causing more guilt, of course. I think Alistair would've understood about the truth, after the shock of it. He'd probably focus on Blackwall idolizing the real Blackwall, as he did with Duncan, and that all wardens have pasts. The truth of Alistair being of noble blood might also put a test to their friendship, but Alistair was never raised like a noble -- so actually, I think Blackwall would feel for that. It would be just what he'd expect nobles to do, throw their bastard in with the dogs and then off to the chantry.

 

Blackwall seemed to get along well with just about everyone in DAI, with the exception of Vivianne. And he and Dorian sparred at the beginning, but I loved how their friendship grew. The biggest thing Blackwall has a problem with is nobility and wealth. I don't think any of the other companions from the other games had status or money (well, except for the PC depending on the background).

 

I do like the idea of Blackwall and Nathaniel. I can imagine their banter would be more on the dour, dry side. They'd need a lighthearted companion to liven things up!