1875 réponses à ce sujet

[GreyLycanTrope]

Only in the sense that...they're...relationships...with other people?

In the sense that if you romance Isabella this entourage of "bisexual" characters turns into a don't ask don't tell policy.

[Mockingword]

1.)  The tone is really not appropriate for a thread that up until the past few hours has been really mellow and respectful, allowing it survive much longer than other threads like it.  If we can keep the polite and respectful tones, we can continue the conversation, but it people start to incite each other, it will definitely get closed down and then the conversation ends.

Having a "polite and respectful" tone is really not the same as actually saying polite and respectful things.

 

In the politest way that I can possibly say it; I think you're paying too much attention to the words people are using rather than to the ideas they are communicating.

[Mockingword]

And? 

And so accusing a specific media product of being pandering is stupid.

 

Doubly so when that 'pandering' is aimed at an audience that typically goes ignored.

[daveliam]

Oh yay.  All of the trolls are here to spam gifs and/or solely comment on the state of the thread and not offer anything substantive about the topic.  And then they'll blame the thread getting closed on others.....

[spirosz]

And so accusing a specific media product of being pandering is stupid.

 

 

So you realize you are getting pandered.  As am I and as is everyone else with this optional content. 

[AresKeith]

Oh yay.  All of the trolls are here to spam gifs and/or solely comment on the state of the thread and not offer anything substantive about the topic.  And then they'll blame the thread getting closed on others.....

 

Yea can we not do that guys

[CybAnt1]

Ideally tho, why are we taking the romance content in a video game so seriously?

 

This is a curious question to me. It seems people take battles and combat in games seriously, but all you are killing and defeating are bunches of pixels. No?

 

I mean, nobody says "you know, we should take the combat out of games, just because after all, all you are really fighting, killing, and defeating bunches of pixels".

 

Or, perhaps we should remove the dialogue from games, because after all, "all you are really talking to is a bunch of pixels". 

 

The romances in RPGs are there for the imagination of the player to flesh out in their mind, just as is the combat, or the non-romance dialogue. 

 

Some people enjoy them, they are optional content, Bioware says their specialty within the CRPG world is creating companions with fleshed-out interactions with the protagonist, and one kind of interpersonal relationship humans have is sexual/romantic. 

 

I get why Lord Gaider gets impatient and upset over how much haranguing they receive for writing them into their games, which is why he has probably mostly out of frustration talked about no longer including romances anymore, but I honestly think THIS is NOT a problem with Bioware's approach to game development. (Though I have others.) 

 

On one final point, the fantasy genre is based on medieval capital-R Romances, because they often contained what we today call ROMANCE as a central element: see the Romances of Lancelot and Guinevere, or Tristan and Iseult. So, when we talk about fantasy games, we should also point out that the genre of stories they are based on (maybe more than sci-fi space opera) OFTEN contains "romantic" content. It may not be the central aspect of the cycle of tales, but it plays a key role. 

[spirosz]

I'm dying

[daveliam]

In the sense that if you romance Isabella this entourage of "bisexual" characters turns into a don't ask don't tell policy.

 

Again, untrue.  If you are a male who romances Isabela, then Anders still explicitly states that he was in a relationship with Karl.  Given his past interest in women, he's also indicating that he's bisexual.

 

Although, I concede that it was poorly done with female Hawkes, however, see my other posts to understand why Anders is definitely bisexual.

[CybAnt1]

Ideally tho, why are we taking the romance content in a video game so seriously?

 

I repeat: why take the combat in a game seriously?

 

It's all just pixels and code, too, but we spend a lot of time on it here (including me, of course). 

 

It's a relevant question.

[Mockingword]

Ideally tho, why are we taking the romance content in a video game so seriously?

Like, I dunno. Maybe it's like, not really about that? Maybe it's like, actually about LGBT representation in media, which is like, kind of important because media plays an important role in shaping the way a society thinks and acts?

 

Like, maybe the debate is only framed in the context of romance content because, like, that is literally the only place where gay content exists, tho.

[GreyLycanTrope]

Incorrect though.  The romance storylines between these four LI's are completely different.  In Isabela, you get the character who is sexually open, but emotionally reserved.  In Merrill, you get the naive ingenue who is wrestling with tempation.  With Anders, you get an overly passionate man who struggles with controlling his emotions.  And with Fenris you get the damaged and guarded man who is afraid of leaving himself vulnerable.  They are completely different story types.

 

And you are completely wrong about Isabela being the only one who you can give an orientation to.  See the numerous posts about why Anders is bisexual (with evidence supporting the argument).  I posted one just a few hours ago, so you should be able to find it fairly quickly.

I'm talking about orientation.

 

I'll get back to you on this Anders business once I scroll back.

[spirosz]

kind of important because media plays an important role in shaping the way a society thinks and acts?

 

 

First mistake^

 

[daveliam]

I'm talking about orientation.

 

I'll get back to you on this Anders business once I scroll back.

 

So simply because they are all bisexual, you immediately dismiss the value that they have as stories?  Really, that's the "level" at which you are evaluating the story?  If they are all bisexual characters, even if they are all different and their romance stories are different and there is different dialogue for males and female, they are "completely the same"? 

 

Well, then, I guess I don't have anything else to say to you because I'm looking at them at a different level and don't really have much interest in look at them at that superficial level. 

[CybAnt1]

Dragon Age is a fantasy game - fantasy story - it has its roots in medieval Romances. 

 

http://en.wikipedia....ivalric_romance

 

Many medieval romances recount the marvellous adventures of a chivalrous, heroic knight, often of super-human ability, who, abiding chivalry's strict codes of honor and demeanor, goes on a quest, and fights and defeats monsters and giants, thereby winning favor with a lady.^[41] The Matter of France, most popular early, did not lend itself to the subject of courtly love, but rather dealt with heroic adventure: in The Song of Roland, Roland, though betrothed to Oliver's sister, does not think of her during the course of events.^[42] The themes of love were, however, soon appear, particularly in the Matter of Britain, leading to even the French regarding King Arthur's court as the exemplar of true and noble love, so much so that even the earliest writers about courtly love would claim it had reached its true excellence there, and love was not what it was in King Arthur's day.^[43] A perennial theme was the rescue of a lady from the imperiling monster, a theme that would remain throughout the romances of the medieval era.

 

[snip][end]

 

I think the only thing Bioware does differently, along with others who create modern fantasy tales, is allowing the knight of any gender to win the heart of a lad/lady of any gender. But I don't get why people say romance is not a typical part of fantasy tales; they don't know the origins of the genre!

[sandalisthemaker]

Yes. Fabulous Miley. Unfortunately, I can't contribute because I am under excessively high botMod scrutiny.

[GreyLycanTrope]

Again, untrue.  If you are a male who romances Isabela, then Anders still explicitly states that he was in a relationship with Karl.  Given his past interest in women, he's also indicating that he's bisexual.

 

Although, I concede that it was poorly done with female Hawkes, however, see my other posts to understand why Anders is definitely bisexual.

No he doesn't, he only talks about that if you romance him in my experience, that goes for both Male and Female Hawkes.

 

He does tell you.  He says (paraphrased), "I like girls.", then "I like boys", then "I am attracted to the person, not the body."  How much more explicit does he need to make it?

This what you referring to? Because again that only popped up for me in his romance route.

[GreyLycanTrope]

So simply because they are all bisexual, you immediately dismiss the value that they have as stories?  Really, that's the "level" at which you are evaluating the story?  If they are all bisexual characters, even if they are all different and their romance stories are different and there is different dialogue for males and female, they are "completely the same"? 

 

Well, then, I guess I don't have anything else to say to you because I'm looking at them at a different level and don't really have much interest in look at them at that superficial level. 

No I'm saying the characters can always use more depth, it's an issue of immersion for me. I want to know as much about my companions as possible favorite foods and who I could help them flirt with included. Plus if we're really being inclusive of various groups of people than let's actually be inclusive

 

Assumptions man, please don't be Mockingword.

[daveliam]

No he doesn't, he only talks about that if you romance him in my experience, that goes for both Male and Female Hawkes.

 

This what you referring to? Because again that only popped up for me in his romance route.

 

Yeah, and?  Sten only told me about his sword if I got his "friendship" high enough.  By your logic, that means that he never actually lost his sword unless you are his friend.

 

Anders mentions it in one of his dialogue trees.  If you chose not to explore that dialogue tree, that doesn't mean that it doesn't exist anymore.

[daveliam]

No I'm saying the characters can always use more depth, it's an issue of immersion for me. I want to know as much about my companions as possible favorite foods and who I could help them flirt with included.

 

Assumptions man, please don't be Mockingword.

 

Okay, but how does this statement connect with the fact that you've stated that because all of the LI's are bisexual, they are "the same"?  I'm trying to understand you.  I really am, but you aren't making it easy for me.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

An astute observation my friend. It seems like they are actors in this thread that are spamming it with an image compression mechanism known as a gif or jif(if you are italian). They work in a calculated method and paradigm of saying what is happening in the thread and posting a gif like this.
 
Person1 : "Wow this thread has gone to the shitters"
 
Person1 : 

That dancing is mesmerizing.........