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Say Cassandra is straight, allow female Inquisitors to flirt with her and Cassandra to say in a way she is not interested in you that way. There we go. Sexuality confirmed and done in a way that makes sense.
Honestly that's pretty much all I ask for lol 
I'll add that I am convinced of Isabela's bisexuality, and have no problem with it, since she was consistently established that way since Origins. I don't feel the other three have that benefit, though.
Yeah, I feel a bit squicky about doubts around Anders sexuality when his writer has confirmed it. Did you see the post that Ispan provided with the quote from Gaider? I get that it's not as clearly established, but there is evidence for it (although it requires you to do some of the work since it's not explicitly stated) and it's confirmed by the writer. I don't know what else you need at this point. It's not like they can go back and change how they implemented his story in DA 2, so you have to work with what you've been given and it's pretty clear. I mean, objectively, it's pretty clear.
I really, really don't like the idea that a character has to declare themselves as bisexual (either in words or actions) in their very first appearance (I don't mean in their first scene, I mean their first game/book/comic/etc) or people will doubt their sexuality forever. It just doesn't always work that way in life, so why would it have to work that way in the game. And, the irony is that it's usually also the people who ask for more "realism" in the game that also want to see bisexual declarations.
Guest_Catch This Fade_*
The story is what we do in the world. What we do in the world is constrained by the mechanics. There cannot be a separation between those things, as they directly affect each other.
So what you're saying is gameplay and story segregation doesn't exist. LOL
Yeah, I feel a bit squicky about doubts around Anders sexuality when his writer has confirmed it. Did you see the post that Ispan provided with the quote from Gaider? I get that it's not as clearly established, but there is evidence for it (although it requires you to do some of the work since it's not explicitly stated) and it's confirmed by the writer. I don't know what else you need at this point. It's not like they can go back and change how they implemented his story in DA 2, so you have to work with what you've been given and it's pretty clear. I mean, objectively, it's pretty clear.
I really, really don't like the idea that a character has to declare themselves as bisexual (either in words or actions) in their very first appearance (I don't mean in their first scene, I mean their first game/book/comic/etc) or people will doubt their sexuality forever. It just doesn't always work that way in life, so why would it have to work that way in the game. And, the irony is that it's usually also the people who ask for more "realism" in the game that also want to see bisexual declarations.
Edited my post before you posted yours to address Gaider's (none too easily available) quote. Beyond that, to be fair, DA2 wasn't Anders' first appearance. And the game's plot takes place over several years. Why wouldn't there at least be suggestions of his bisexuality during that whole time? My earlier example was just a couple of lines of offhanded comments. Even, again, the wandering eye or similarly subtle hint would have made me happy. In the end, what's provided in-game is what matters the most to me (like, I would have never known about Gaider's quote if Ispan didn't provide it in this very thread).
Edited my post before you posted yours to address Gaider's (none too easily available) quote. Beyond that, to be fair, DA2 wasn't Anders' first appearance. And the game's plot takes place over several years. Why wouldn't there at least be suggestions of his bisexuality during that whole time. My earlier example was just a couple of lines. Even, again, the wandering eye or similarly subtle hint would have made me happy.
Yeah, I was actually referring to DA: A. If he wouldn't have expressed opposite sex interest in DA: A, I don't think people would be adamant that his sexuality was changed or as dubious to accept his bisexuality.
It's not like bisexuality is this 'I am attracted to men and women, equally, and at the same exact time'. Some people can be more attracted to one gender over the other and some people go through phases where they're more attracted to one gender over the other. And there are some people who aren't actually bisexual, but like a person for their personality and the connection they share and the person's gender is irrelevant to that attraction.
So, having all romances be available to a player doesn't suggest, to me, that their sexuality is dependent on the player's gender unless they have divergent dialogue affirming a different sexuality based on that gender.
It's not like bisexuality is this 'I am attracted to men and women, equally, and at the same exact time'. Some people can be more attracted to one gender over the other and some people go through phases where they're more attracted to one gender over the other. And there are some people who aren't actually bisexual, but like a person for their personality and the connection they share and the person's gender is irrelevant to that attraction.
So, having all romances be available to a player doesn't suggest, to me, that their sexuality is dependent on the player's gender unless they have divergent dialogue affirming a different sexuality based on that gender.
This^. 100% this^.
I think it's mostly because people are just unfamiliar with the range of bisexuality (and other sexualities, frankly) and that makes it difficult for them to understand a character who doesn't wear their sexuality as a unwavering consistent identifier.
Edited my post before you posted yours to address Gaider's (none too easily available) quote. Beyond that, to be fair, DA2 wasn't Anders' first appearance. And the game's plot takes place over several years. Why wouldn't there at least be suggestions of his bisexuality during that whole time? My earlier example was just a couple of lines of offhanded comments. Even, again, the wandering eye or similarly subtle hint would have made me happy. What's provided in-game is what matters the most to me (like, I would have never known about Gaider's quote if Ispan didn't provide it in this very thread).
I literally googled "is anders bisexual" and David Gaider's blog entry "Answering Questions: On Anders" came up.
I bet a writer wouldn't waste time repeating themselves in a thread like this because some of the participants here still wouldn't believe them. Is there a lore authority greater than the head writer?
Which leads me to my third thing: while I get that some people might not like the discovery that those followers can potentially romance either gender (something you can really only discover on subsequent playthroughs or by reading about it), a lot of the things people post on the subject is… awkward. “It makes the characters inconsistent.” Meaning that… bisexuality itself is indicative of inconsistency? Only people who can’t make up their minds are bisexual? “It’s unrealistic that everyone is bisexual!” Which ‘everyone’? Everyone in Thedas? Or are we talking four people in your party of folks who already exceptional in a large number of ways, two of which have no sexual past or preferences that they even discuss with you? “It just made them seem like they were all sexually available to me!” So… was it having three romance options for any PC gender, just like in Origins, that threw you off? Or does the idea of potentially sleeping with either gender just make them seem inherently wanton to you?
Modifié par Ispan, 20 mars 2014 - 01:39 .
This^. 100% this^.
I think it's mostly because people are just unfamiliar with the range of bisexuality (and other sexualities, frankly) and that makes it difficult for them to understand a character who doesn't wear their sexuality as a unwavering consistent identifier.
Again, I will note that bisexual people do not tell people they've met, even if they've started to become friendly to them, or even if they start dating them, that they have slept with both men and women in the past. In general, people don't discuss past sexual history with new relationships, and bisexual people are no different from any other kind of people.
I get what people are saying, "why don't the bisexual people discuss their bisexual nature/history before I start flirting with them or they start flirting with me," but bear in mind, the two 'straights' don't really discuss it in DAO either.
Yes, we do find out ol' Al is a virgin. But Morrigan kind of clues us in that she has slept with other men before (at various points), but you'll note she never really chooses to discuss it that much with you. Most people would rather not go into detail about the sexual pasts of their real-world LIs, which is why most of them also never bring it up. And bi people are no different.
BTW, one other thing about Isabela. I personally think her lusty promiscuity is her version of commitment-phobia. As you find out in her romance, she had a husband, (so there was a point in her life where she didn't mind being "tied down"), but he died tragically, and that has made her "gun shy" about getting too involved with anybody. In some ways, she's just chosen ever since to pursue one night stands, so her life will not again be complicated by a commitment that could end up hurting her again. Well that, and she's afraid getting too involved with anybody (man or woman) will keep her from her life of freedom at the helm of her big boat on the sea. As with many characters, I think some of her swagger hides an inner vulnerability (and that's exactly what pursuing the romance to completion enables you to learn about her).
I literally googled "is anders bisexual" and David Gaider's blog entry "Answering Questions: On Anders" came up.
I bet a writer wouldn't waste time repeating themselves in a thread like this because some of the participants here still wouldn't believe them. Is there a lore authority greater than the head writer?
I didn't realize the impetus was on us to actively seek out these answers outside the games. In a medium where the issue is brought up, is it really so unreasonable for me to expect consistently presented supporting material along with it?
Whatever, the reason I weighed in on this at all was to provide reasons besides bias against non-heterosexual preferences for why some might not like playersexuality. Reasons that were also rational and fair-minded. If, after all that, some still wanna assume I'm just trying to cover up such a bias or what have you, so be it.
I get what people are saying, "why don't the bisexual people discuss their bisexual nature/history before I start flirting with them or they start flirting with me," but bear in mind, the two 'straights' don't really discuss it in DAO either.
I'm not saying that. In a game whose plot takes place over several years, I've already suggested how their preferences could come up naturally over time.
I didn't realize the impetus was on us to actively seek out these answers outside the games. In a medium where the issue is brought up, is it really so unreasonable for me to expect consistently presented supporting material along with it?
Whatever, the reason I weighed in on this at all was to provide reasons besides bias against non-heterosexual preferences for why some might not like playersexuality. Reasons that were also rational and fair-minded. If, after all that, some still wanna assume I'm just trying to cover up such a bias or what have you, so be it.
Well, I, for one, don't think you are trying to cover up a bias against non-heterosexual preferences. In fact, if you wouldn't have said that in the this post, this idea wouldn't have crossed my mind ever. I think thought that you are arguing that Bioware needs to do a better job in providing clear sexualities for their characters.
I also don't think that it's on us to seek out answers outside of the game. However, when the game doesn't provide us with enough information, but outside source material does, AND people bring this outside source material right to you, then I do think that it's on you to accept that material.
Completely agree, OP. When I romanced Leliana or Merrill (as a straight male character) there was no indication to me that either one could have been bisexual. To my character, they were straight. It wasn't immersion breaking at all.
Why limit a player's options? Isn't it ultimately for the player's enjoyment?
BTW, one other thing about Isabela. I personally think her lusty promiscuity is her version of commitment-phobia. As you find out in her romance, she had a husband, (so there was a point in her life where she didn't mind being "tied down"), but he died tragically, and that has made her "gun shy" about getting too involved with anybody. In some ways, she's just chosen ever since to pursue one night stands, so her life will not again be complicated by a commitment that could end up hurting her again. Well that, and she's afraid getting too involved with anybody (man or woman) will keep her from her life of freedom at the helm of her big boat on the sea. As with many characters, I think some of her swagger hides an inner vulnerability (and that's exactly what pursuing the romance to completion enables you to learn about her).
I agree about the promiscuity as committment-phobia, but Isabella was sold into a loveless marriage by her mother, and she hired Zevran to assassinate her husband. I think she was determined to control her own destiny in all matters, private and public, because having to submit to the control of others had caused her pain, and for her, to be in a relationship was to surrender control.
Under my gentle guidance, she got better. 
Modifié par Threat300, 20 mars 2014 - 02:31 .
I'm not saying that. In a game whose plot takes place over several years, I've already said how their preferences could come up naturally over time.
Maybe it would be helpful to think of it this way: How often do you explicitly state your sexuality? Let's assume that you are a straight male. How often do you tell someone, "I am straight and not bisexual."? Keep in mind that this is different than just expressing interest in women. To identify explicitly and without any room for doubt you would have to not only express interest in women, but also express that you are not interested in men. This has probably happened. But how many of your friends does this happen with in reality? Probably not as many as you think. And I say "friend" because people have already suggested that information that comes up from romance dialogue isn't enough evidence because they could still be playersexual.
This is why bisexuality is tough to identify because people make assumptions as soon as you identify as being attracted to one gender. If I say that I am married to a man, then immediately, everyone assumes that I'm gay. But I could very easily have had dated women beforehand and it just doesn't come up because it's kind of odd for me to discuss my sexuality like that unless the context arises. Maybe it does, but also maybe it doesn't.
Completely agree, OP. When I romanced Leliana or Merrill (as a straight male character) there was no indication to me that either one could have been bisexual. To my character, they were straight. It wasn't immersion breaking at all.
Why limit a player's options? Isn't it ultimately for the player's enjoyment?
Leliana as completely straight? i always thought it was obvious with she liked women with some of the things she says.
Leliana talks about Marjorlaine and loving her if you follow the correct dialogue tree.
Well, I, for one, don't think you are trying to cover up a bias against non-heterosexual preferences. In fact, if you wouldn't have said that in the this post, this idea wouldn't have crossed my mind ever. I think thought that you are arguing that Bioware needs to do a better job in providing clear sexualities for their characters.
Great, then I've done my job! But you know the unreasonable folks are out there . If not in this thread, then beyond.
I didn't realize the impetus was on us to actively seek out these answers outside the games. In a medium where the issue is brought up, is it really so unreasonable for me to expect consistently presented supporting material along with it?
Whatever, the reason I weighed in on this at all was to provide reasons besides bias against non-heterosexual preferences for why some might not like playersexuality. Reasons that were also rational and fair-minded. If, after all that, some still wanna assume I'm just trying to cover up such a bias or what have you, so be it.
He implies they are all bisexual, not playersexual.
Your arguments sound like they're against what you might consider ineffective writing, not necessarily the defined/undefined sexualities of the characters. That makes sense to me. I personally feel that writing was well done and I didn't feel like it was necessary to label them with a sexual orientation. They're "people" who like what they like, and that's enough for me.
Saying that a companion MUST make it clear to you at some point that they're interested in both genders (through banter, direct conversation, etc) is making another choice for them. Playersexuality taking "choice" away from our companions has been a hot issue in this topic. I find that the need to know their sexual orientation is just another form of taking their choice to not divulge this information away from them.
@CybAnt1 since it won't let me quote for some reason. Isabella got sold to her husband by her mother, she was very happy when Zevran killed him. Was another guy that fell in love with her & asked to marry her that made her afraid of commitment since it broke his heart when she refused.
Ninja'd ^
Sorry. You and the previous poster are correct. The marriage to her husband was arranged and loveless (well, worse than arranged, she was sold to him). (Just checked the Wiki, because yes, my memory of game dialogue can get hazy.)
However, there was another man she did love, and who did ask to marry her, but perhaps because of her previous marriage, she refused him (and seems to have regretted that ever since). That's who I was thinking of.
Aside: one of my favorite James Bond movies is On Her Majesty's Secret Service. Bond throughout the films is of course the classic Casanova, but if you see that film, you realize one reason why he chooses never to get too deeply involved with any woman is the one woman he actually married was killed by his enemies shortly after the nuptials. As a spy/secret agent, he knows getting too deeply involved with a woman will simply put her in future danger (you'll notice that same dilemma often plagues super heroes in the movies).
Leliana talks about Marjorlaine and loving her if you follow the correct dialogue tree.
Leliana as completely straight? i always thought it was obvious with she liked women with some of the things she says.
Yeah, I was going to point this out too. I thought that a romanced Leliana would definitely have a character quest which would introduce Marjolaine who is clearly identified as a past lover of Leliana.
He implies they are all bisexual, not playersexual.
I'm glad that you brought this up because I was wondering if I was the only one who picked up on this from that post. Again, it's not completely obvious, but it's alluded to and adds even more support to my idea that they are not playersexual at all.
Here's the quote from his blog:
"Quite frequently on our forums someone will come along with a rant on how they hated how “all the followers in DA2 were bisexual”. Sometimes you’ll even get someone who counters that by saying, no, they weren’t bisexual… the same-gender romance options were gay and the opposite-gender romance options were straight, depending on your player character."
Bolded is my emphasis. Here's the link for the full article: http://dgaider.tumbl...tions-on-anders
Galsic, I think your point of wanting more effective writing to convey their bisexuality is a perfectly understandable opinion. I don't need them to express their sexuality to me because I accept that the companions have their reasons for returning my advances, be it bisexuality or something else, and haven't seen anything in my gameplay experience that contradicts that. So while I feel the writing doesn't need to change, I do see how the change you recommend could add to the experience for some people. We have different perspectives on that issue and that's fine, I just hope they don't force the characters to expose their sexual orientation if it's written into their character to "choose" not to share that info. Bisexuals shouldn't have to prove themselves to you or anyone else, but they can if they want to.
I guess that I find it so believable that 4 people I meet happen to be bisexual and potentially interested in my character that the need to include a few lines of dialogue to make it explicit seems trivial.
Edit edit: I'm having trouble choosing the right phrasing to convey my idea apparently so I changed most of it... again
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