1875 réponses à ce sujet

[Rainbow Wyvern]

Ok I will say it a third time. Maybe three times is a charm. I will write it in big letters for you too. "I AM NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT IT".

 

I am just pointing out why "100 PERCENT of all the people interested in a person IN THE SPAN OF TEN YEARS is abit of a stretch." I am not saying that bisexual people wanting to be friends with you and me is anything unusual or whatever. Everyone else seems to get this, by the way.

 

I NEVER said 4 bisexual characters cause any problems. READ SLOWLY. I said :"100 PERCENT of all the people interested in a person IN THE SPAN OF TEN YEARS is abit of a stretch." That is all.

 

No they don`t think I am over exagerating anything, because I have allready said it didn`t ruin the gaming experience for me at all. How can it b a problem for me if it didn`t affect my gaming experience at all?

You did seem to be complaining in your previous posts.

Fits the definition of 'complain' rather nicely.

[Xilizhra]

Given that we don't actually know the proportions of bisexual people to non-bisexual people in Thedas, it seems highly premature to claim anything about their representation is a "stretch."

[WildOrchid]

Isabela had a few instances that indicated a larger attraction to females, actually, at least to me. Mostly it's because she seems more emotionally connected or possessive of FemHawke, or that's what I get from her jealousy of Tallis when FemHawke flirts with her. (ManHawke garners a less emotional response, if I am not mistaken.)

 

Yeah, it seemed like that to me too. And I loved it.

[Rawgrim]

Alright I will take your word for it that you were not complaining, you were just talking in a very complainy way and now wish to say you were not complaining.

 

 

If I had been complaining I would have said I wanted it gone from the next game etc. Have a look, and check if I said anything like that at all. I was simply pointing out why something is abit of a stretch. Not the came as "Talking complainy".

[Rawgrim]

You did seem to be complaining in your previous posts.

Fits the definition of 'complain' rather nicely.

 

 

I "seemed" to be complaining? Or you assumed I were complaining? Or I was complaining?

[Rainbow Wyvern]

If I had been complaining I would have said I wanted it gone from the next game etc. Have a look, and check if I said anything like that at all. I was simply pointing out why something is abit of a stretch. Not the came as "Talking complainy".

Complain; to express dissatisfaction, pain, uneasiness, censure, resentment, or grief; find fault.

 

Seemed like what you were doing in regards to every LI being bi.

[Rawgrim]

Complain; to express dissatisfaction, pain, uneasiness, censure, resentment, or grief; find fault.

 

Seemed like what you were doing in regards to every LI being bi.

 

 

Nope. I said 100 percent of anyone interested in Hawke, in 10 years, was a stretch. Extremely hgh odds.

 

Dissatisfaction? Nope. I never said I wanted it gone, did I? I also said it didn`t ruin my playthrough.

 

Pain? Nope Never said it hurt.

 

Uneasines - See what I wrote after Dissatiscaftion

 

Censure - Never wanted anything removed.

 

Resentment - Look at Dissatisfaction and Uneasiness

 

Grief - Look above

 

Find a fault - I said it was a stretch. Not a fault.

 

So if it seemed like this to you, give me an example.

[Darth Krytie]

Nope. I said 100 percent of anyone interested in Hawke, in 10 years, was a stretch. Extremely hgh odds.

 

Dissatisfaction? Nope. I never said I wanted it gone, did I? I also said it didn`t ruin my playthrough.

 

Pain? Nope Never said it hurt.

 

Uneasines - See what I wrote after Dissatiscaftion

 

Censure - Never wanted anything removed.

 

Resentment - Look at Dissatisfaction and Uneasiness

 

Grief - Look above

 

Find a fault - I said it was a stretch. Not a fault.

 

So if it seemed like this to you, give me an example.

Okay, so maybe this is an odd question...but if you don't care about it, it doesn't bother your playthrough, you don't want it gone, and you don't care if it's in the next game, what's the point of commenting on it, in what is obviously an inflammatory way in the first place?

[Rawgrim]

Okay, so maybe this is an odd question...but if you don't care about it, it doesn't bother your playthrough, you don't want it gone, and you don't care if it's in the next game, what's the point of commenting on it, in what is obviously an inflammatory way in the first place?

 

I just said it was stretching the odds. How is this inflammatory? I never said anything with the intention of hurting someone`s feelings. And if this actually upsets people, someone saying this is stretching the odds, the person has some serious issues.

 

This forum is for discussions about Bioware games. I care about bioware games, so I discuss them here. I shouldn`t do that if something I find odd in a game doesn`t ruin the game for me?

[Rainbow Wyvern]

Nope. I said 100 percent of anyone interested in Hawke, in 10 years, was a stretch. Extremely hgh odds.

 

Dissatisfaction? Nope. I never said I wanted it gone, did I? I also said it didn`t ruin my playthrough.

 

Find a fault - I said it was a stretch. Not a fault.

 

So if it seemed like this to you, give me an example.

Just because you're dissatisfied with something doesn't mean you want it gone, or that it ruined your playthrough... I was dissatisfied with the Magi Origin in DA:O, but that doesn't mean I wanted it gone or that it ruined anything. 

 

And it being a stretch can be seen as a fault of the system. It is an unattractive or unsatisfactory feature of an all-bi-LI system that it seems 'unrealistic'  or a 'stretch' to some. 

 

And if you are not complaining, then what are you doing? Arguing for the sake of arguing? 

[Rawgrim]

I just said it was ait of a stretch, then you guys ganged up on me and started claiming I said stuff I never did and added meanings to what I said etc.

 

I am not even arguing, I am just pointing out that "All I said was that it was abit of a stretch". It isn`t really my fault that I have to repeat it 50 times for it to sink in.

 

 

Earlier, in a different thread, I said that Leliana doesn`t strike me as the advisor type. Does this mean I want her gone from the game? Or that if I am not bothered by it, I should never talk about Leliana on this forum?

[Rainbow Wyvern]

Yeah... I'm done with this internet skirmish, it seems like you didn't even read my last post.

[Rawgrim]

Yeah... I'm done with this internet skirmish, it seems like you didn't even read my last post.

 

Yes I did. Look at previous posts, alot of them, and you will find the answers to the questions you asked in yours.

 

 

I only said a feature was abit of a stretch.

 

I spoonfed you, several times, that it wasn`t a biggie, that it didn`t ruin anything, and that I didn`t think it needed removing.

 

You and a few others went haywire over a "side comment", wich wasn`t meant to flame anyone or anything like that.

 

 

But yes. This "skirmish" you made is over . Have a nice evening.

[wright1978]

Isabela had a few instances that indicated a larger attraction to females, actually, at least to me. Mostly it's because she seems more emotionally connected or possessive of FemHawke, or that's what I get from her jealousy of Tallis when FemHawke flirts with her. (ManHawke garners a less emotional response, if I am not mistaken.)
 
I do realize that my point of view is largely coloured by my personal experiences, though.

I never got the feeling of a larger attraction to females and I've romanced Isabela multiple times with both genders of hawkes.

[Eveangaline]

Yeah... I'm done with this internet skirmish, it seems like you didn't even read my last post.

Probably the best choice.

[Eveangaline]

I never got the feeling of a larger attraction to females and I've romanced Isabela multiple times with both genders of hawkes.

Yeah I didn't get the feeling she was more attracted to women (I did get that from leliana though, only character I ever accidentally romanced)

[Allan Schumacher]

I am saying it is quite the stretch that 100 percent of a persons possible romance options, during 10 years, are all of the same sexuality. The odds of that are sky high.

 

It's quite a stretch that there's predefined characters that will be willing to engage in a romance with you, and that that number is immutable and cannot be influenced in any capacity with no other options under any circumstances.  Independent of their sexuality.  I mean, if we *reduce* the number of romances, the issue becomes exacerbated.  There's only one, maybe two people in the whole world that will romance me?!  Forever alone!!!

 

You're describing an issue with creating a video game.

 

 

In a video game, you can only influence the narrative in the ways that you want.  If you're suggesting that having zero non-bisexuals is a stretch, you're making a problematic statement because you're stating that that is "weird" (whether or not you intend to) because it's not only unusual enough for you, but SO unusual that it's actually a talking point.

I am skeptical that you'd have the same reservations if it was 4 exclusively heterosexual characters.  And if you do, then it reinforces it's an issue with the realities of game writing.

[Blackrising]

Yeah I didn't get the feeling she was more attracted to women (I did get that from leliana though, only character I ever accidentally romanced)

 

*shrug* Guess it's open to interpretation.

Maybe it's not entirely accurate to say she's more attracted to women...I just got the feeling that she's more emotionally involved with FemHawke. But again, very open to interpretation.

[Rawgrim]

It's quite a stretch that there's predefined characters that will be willing to engage in a romance with you, and that that number is immutable and cannot be influenced in any capacity with no other options under any circumstances.  Independent of their sexuality.  I mean, if we *reduce* the number of romances, the issue becomes exacerbated.  There's only one, maybe two people in the whole world that will romance me?!  Forever alone!!!

 

You're describing an issue with creating a video game.

 

 

In a video game, you can only influence the narrative in the ways that you want.  If you're suggesting that having zero non-bisexuals is a stretch, you're making a problematic statement because you're stating that that is "weird" (whether or not you intend to) because it's not only unusual enough for you, but SO unusual that it's actually a talking point.

I am skeptical that you'd have the same reservations if it was 4 exclusively heterosexual characters.  And if you do, then it reinforces it's an issue with the realities of game writing.

 

Actually I would have the same reservations if it was 4 hetero sexuals only. In DA:O I did all the romances. Played a gay templar when romancing Zevran (got the achievement to prove it). I considered the stretch to be "The same sexuality for 100 percent of the options. Over a period of ten years (or is it 7 in DA2?)". The time period was also a facor here, by the way. I thought that was unusual to make a comment on, yes. But as I said: 100 percent hetero love interests would get the same comment.

 

And I do realize it is an issue with making a game, no worries about it.

[WildOrchid]

Yeah I didn't get the feeling she was more attracted to women (I did get that from leliana though, only character I ever accidentally romanced)

 

It's probably the fact that she seems more overprotective with ladyHawke than dudehawke, her jealousy to Tallis hinted at that. Then again, the line was probably added just to show the gender difference.

[JCFR]

From your tactless use of slurs, it's pretty clear that you wouldn't recognise tolerance if it smacked you in the face, but just because a society is intolerant in some areas doesn't mean it can't be tolerant in others. Our modern society still sees different levels of tolerance and intolerance for different groups.

 

Nobody is accusing fictional characters of being intolerant. If there are any accusations of intolerance in Dragon Age, and I haven't seen any, they would be levied at the creators, because they are the ones responsible for any intolerant messages.

 

You know what's really ridiculous? Talking about medieval attitudes in a fantasy world.

 

Yes, the Western World has a history of homophobia. But the Western World is not the only society that exists in reality, nevermind in fiction, and not all societies develop along the same trajectory. You might be incapable of conceiving of societies that develop a concept of tolerance earlier than your own did, but conceiving of societies that differ drastically from their own personal experience is pretty much the entire job of a fantasy author.

What does "tolerance" mean in your world? I am neither a Nazi, nor a religous fanatist and whatever sexual orientation you got, feel free to live it - i don't mind.

 

All i wanted to mention is, that i don't see how his "idea" would fit into any kind of society which reflects aspects of medieval reality.  Thedas - as it was expressed in DAO and DA2 is no gene-roddenberry-star-trek-like universe where -astonishingly- 90% of humanity is so good hearted that it begs the question, why all those wars in the past?

Thedas is a world of extremes , of strict social paradigms and his idea of an evolved sexual attitude would just not FIT in!  Like: Boy, i don't care if you're into men or women, but don't even dare to vring an elf, dwarf or mage home!" Can't you SEE the point? Or are you just one of those oporutnists that have NO idea about the true face of Hmanity and society.

 

If so, don't call anyone "intolerant" just because he's  disillisioned, realistic and maybe a bit cynic.

[oceanicsurvivor]

 Having all-bi cast is ridiculous AND - for me personally - unpleasant.

Yes, I'm very sorry you're forced to fake sleep with a bisexual individual if you want to pursue Bioware's optional side content. That must be positively dreadful.

 

Still. Only 4 people interested in Hawke in 10 years, and all of them are bisexual. Quite the odds. Not a single straight or gay person was interested in him\her in that time.

 

It is just the game being simplfied. That is what it is. Same as the caves in the game, and Kirkwall never changing. The game was rushed, and the romances got hit by it too.

 

Poor Sebastian. Nobody ever remembers he exists.

[Hazegurl]

Still. Only 4 people interested in Hawke in 10 years, and all of them are bisexual. Quite the odds. Not a single straight or gay person was interested in him\her in that time.

 

It is just the game being simplfied. That is what it is. Same as the caves in the game, and Kirkwall never changing. The game was rushed, and the romances got hit by it too.

They are only bisexual from your omnipotent/metagaming pov. Otherwise you have no idea of knowing that they are all bisexual in your individual play though.

 

If your PC is a female Fenris can basically be seen as straight man. He will express his interest in you and if you don't want him he will sleep with Isabella.  Tell me where can you see that Fenris is bisexual or gay in a female PC playthrough?

 

If your PC is a man Fenris can be seen as either gay OR bi depending upon your choices. If you romance him, he shows zero interest in any female characters. He's gay. If you choose not to romance him, he sleeps with Isabella and you can view him as bisexual.

 

In the end it's all in the pov of the PC during the play through, the characters are not responsible for your own assumptions.

[Rawgrim]

They are only bisexual from your omnipotent/metagaming pov. Otherwise you have no idea of knowing that they are all bisexual in your individual play though.

 

If your PC is a female Fenris can basically be seen as straight man. He will express his interest in you and if you don't want him he will sleep with Isabella.  Tell me where can you see that Fenris is bisexual or gay in a female PC playthrough?

 

If your PC is a man Fenris can be seen as either gay OR bi depending upon your choices. If you romance him, he shows zero interest in any female characters. He's gay. If you choose not to romance him, he sleeps with Isabella and you can view him as bisexual.

 

In the end it's all in the pov of the PC during the play through, the characters are not responsible for your own assumptions.

 

 

I DID say that. It was only an "issue" after the first playthrough.

[Jorji Costava]

What does "tolerance" mean in your world? I am neither a Nazi, nor a religous fanatist and whatever sexual orientation you got, feel free to live it - i don't mind.

 

All i wanted to mention is, that i don't see how his "idea" would fit into any kind of society which reflects aspects of medieval reality.  Thedas - as it was expressed in DAO and DA2 is no gene-roddenberry-star-trek-like universe where -astonishingly- 90% of humanity is so good hearted that it begs the question, why all those wars in the past?

Thedas is a world of extremes , of strict social paradigms and his idea of an evolved sexual attitude would just not FIT in!  Like: Boy, i don't care if you're into men or women, but don't even dare to vring an elf, dwarf or mage home!" Can't you SEE the point? Or are you just one of those oporutnists that have NO idea about the true face of Hmanity and society.

 

If so, don't call anyone "intolerant" just because he's  disillisioned, realistic and maybe a bit cynic.

 

Made this point upthread already, but there's absolutely no reason to assume that just because a society is open-minded and progressive about sexuality, it will be tolerant in all other ways as well. It's just not the case that you either have every prejudice or have no prejudice. There's also the fact that while a lot of Thedas is modeled on medieval history, it's obviously not an exact replica. For one, the writers have constructed a religious mythology for the game world centered on a messiah-figure who just so happens to be a woman (Andraste), quite a bit different from Christianity in the medieval period. It's plausible to think that a religious system like this would give rise to social attitudes very different from what was seen in medieval Europe.