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[Magister Caedus]

when the word slavery comes up, we think the whipping the torture, the blood rituals....  who's to say that some magisters dont practice such things and only take in live in servants with no pay (ie slaves) without any form of the bad stuff....  slavery isnt all just black, there is some grey in there too....  im not condoning it by any means, but writing off everybody who has one as evil is severely narrow minded

This. 

 

The concepts of good and evil are created by societal norms. If slavery was a vital facet of the economy where you grew up - as it is in Tevinter - it may seem odd to you that other places don't have slaves, and even consider you evil for owning them. If it is all that you have ever known, are you evil because of the world you live in? I should hope not. If we were to introduce people from ~400 years ago to our current society, they would likely think it very strange that slavery is illegal, and would likely consider us debauched and evil for our acceptance of other things. 

 

Anyway... DHMG HAS A NAME! I'm afraid that waiting till Oct. 7 will kill me...

[renfrees]

when the word slavery comes up, we think the whipping the torture, the blood rituals....  who's to say that some magisters dont practice such things and only take in live in servants with no pay (ie slaves) without any form of the bad stuff....  slavery isnt all just black, there is some grey in there too....  im not condoning it by any means, but writing off everybody who has one as evil is severely narrow minded

I prefer to be narrow minded, rather than liberal and accepting with things like slavery. If we go by with "just because how it is", it'll never change. I have no doubt, that there are men, who don't torture and kill their slaves without a reason, but that doesn't make the system less atrocious. 

[Eveangaline]

who's to say that some magisters dont practice such things and only take in live in servants with no pay (ie slaves) without any form of the bad stuff.... 

Slavery itself falls under bad stuff so it's pretty much impossible to do it without doing the bad stuff. Owning people falls under bad, regardless of your culture and regardless of whether you treat them like fine pets or like whipping boys. Slavery itself is bad.

[ElitePinecone]

I wouldn't say Dorian hates Tevinter. He reminds me of Garrak from DS9. He acts against the Cardassian tyranny 'Because I love Cardassia'. Dorian wants to reform Tevinter because he loves Tevinter (the Tevinter that could be, anyway).

 

Exactly.

 

His bio says he wants to rid his homeland of its corruption - not destroy it.

[Wolfen09]

Slavery itself falls under bad stuff so it's pretty much impossible to do it without doing the bad stuff. Owning people falls under bad, regardless of your culture and regardless of whether you treat them like fine pets or like whipping boys. Slavery itself is bad.

 

slavery falls under bad stuff because the society you were raised in has labeled it as such, a lot of conservative people  view homosexuality as evil as well, but we seem to accept it.  im not for or against it, but im saying we cant write it off as bad if their society accepts it as a whole, thats like viewing the entirety of afghanistan as evil for 9-11 when there are good people there

[BioFan (Official)]

I wonder if after you romance Dorian you can run off into the sunset and be Magisters together 



 

[Chari]

Slavery is bad
And that's it

[Eveangaline]

slavery falls under bad stuff because the society you were raised in has labeled it as such, a lot of conservative people  view homosexuality as evil as well, but we seem to accept it.  im not for or against it, but im saying we cant write it off as bad if their society accepts it as a whole, thats like viewing the entirety of afghanistan as evil for 9-11 when it was a small group doing it

Yeah I'm not going to budge on this one. Owning people is evil. You can be morally relativistic about this but I'm going to say that slavery is evil and saying it isn't just because you aren't violent about it is stupid.

 

Also you can't really say their society accepts it as a whole, we don't know that. I'm betting the slaves for instance, are quite against it. And that commoners aren't too happy with the idea they can be kidnapped and put into it at a whim. Even when slavery was legal in the US for example there were massive amounts of people trying to work to get it abolished. Hell the founding fathers were already worried it would rip the country apart when the country was brand new. Just because slavery exists doesn't mean people aren't aware that it is evil.

 

But yeah. I'm just. I'm not going to at any point agree that slavery is somehow ok just because of when you live.

 

 

 

Exactly.

 

His bio says he wants to rid his homeland of its corruption - not destroy it.

 

I like this. A lot of people seem to think the best way to end the tevinter problem is just to conquer it but why not just take out the worst magisters and prop up some good ones? Honestly if you take out the slavery and blood magic it won't be any worse than the other nations.

[Battlebloodmage]

Slavery is bad
And that's it

Unless it's at home or in a dungeon. 

 

[Wolfen09]

I like this. A lot of people seem to think the best way to end the tevinter problem is just to conquer it but why not just take out the worst magisters and prop up some good ones? Honestly if you take out the slavery and blood magic it won't be any worse than the other nations.

 

THIS IS THE POINT IM TRYING TO MAKE ^^^^

 

there are good people in tevinter, we know this...  alls im trying to say is that to label tevinter as a whole as evil because slavery is legal is not right.  It boils down to more of a specific group, magisters, not the common people and the people probably out number the magisters

[Ymirr]

By ellyshepard

 

by bottleshark

[The Qun & the Damned]

With the new confirmation, are we now Dorianites? 

Dorianation has a better ring I think

[Eveangaline]

THIS IS THE POINT IM TRYING TO MAKE ^^^^

 

there are good people in tevinter, we know this...  alls im trying to say is that to label tevinter as a whole as evil because slavery is legal is not right.  It boils down to more of a specific group, magisters, not the common people and the people probably out number the magisters

 

Yeah I never said the people in a country where slavery is legal are all necessarily bad. All the people who own slaves certainly are evil but odds are most of the common people just don't have the power to end slavery.

[Wolfen09]

Yeah I never said the people in a country where slavery is legal are all necessarily bad. All the people who own slaves certainly are evil but odds are most of the common people just don't have the power to end slavery.

 

yeah, the whole thing me riding on that was because someone had posted earlier about tevinter being full of nothing but evil people, thats what lead to all this misunderstanding

[Eveangaline]

yeah, the whole thing me riding on that was because someone had posted earlier about tevinter being full of nothing but evil people, thats what lead to all this misunderstanding

To be fair you probably should have gone with "There are probably plenty of people against slavery in the country" instead of "there are probably some magisters who are nice to their slaves"

 

I mean it's not like we've never heard of anti-slaver magisters. Fenris mentioned one who publicly came out as anti-slavery. And then got assassinated. We can maybe presume there are more anti-slavery ones in secret who maybe try more covert methods of expression their dissatisfaction with the practice of slavery. Underground railroads, maybe trying to work in restrictions slowly to ease the other magisters off the practice.

[ElitePinecone]

In much the same way, one would think, that Americans continue to revere their founding fathers despite many of them owning slaves and having no particular issue with the institution of slavery. 

 

At any rate, I don't think there's any evidence that Dorian* supports slavery. He seems like the antithesis of a typical magister, which is part of the whole "he delights in not being what you'd expect" thing. 

 

* wow I totally went to write DHMG WHAT IS THIS NEW FEELING IS IT FREEDOM

[Ymirr]

Considering how economically dependant Tevinter is on slaves, I don't see it ending any time soon. 

If owning a slave is enough to deem one evil, and they are normal/kind beyond that point, then that is a very black and white view to have. 
If I lived in a nation where owning slaves were normal, and didn't like the general treatment of them. Not owning some would only leave them to the treatment I saw unfair. If I'd own them in order to be able to give them a better living, I'd still be evil by that account.
 

[Eveangaline]

* wow I totally went to write DHMG WHAT IS THIS NEW FEELING IS IT FREEDOM

 

Later we will find out his full name is Dorian Habberdash Minchin Green and realize we were calling him his initials all along.

[Eleinehmm]

To be fair you probably should have gone with "There are probably plenty of people against slavery in the country" instead of "there are probably some magisters who are nice to their slaves"

 

I mean it's not like we've never heard of anti-slaver magisters. Fenris mentioned one who publicly came out as anti-slavery. And then got assassinated. We can maybe presume there are more anti-slavery ones in secret who maybe try more covert methods of expression their dissatisfaction with the practice of slavery. Underground railroads, maybe trying to work in restrictions slowly to ease the other magisters off the practice.

 

I wonder how their version of Chant looks, considering it's a rather Anti-slavery work. If the anti-slavery sentiments are still in there I would guess people will be anti-slavery, considering its being the MAIN religion in the country.  Plus, economic factors ought to be very important.

[Gearwarden]

Later we will find out his full name is Dorian Habberdash Minchin Green and realize we were calling him his initials all along.

Make it happen Bioware

[Ispan]

Later we will find out his full name is Dorian Habberdash Minchin Green and realize we were calling him his initials all along.

 

Love this

[Gearwarden]

Idk im still feeling that Kaiden vide...

[Eleinehmm]

Idk im still feeling that Kaiden vide...

 

Must be the hair

[Chari]

Considering how economically dependant Tevinter is on slaves, I don't see it ending any time soon.

If owning a slave is enough to deem one evil, and they are normal/kind beyond that point, then that is a very black and white view to have.
If I lived in a nation where owning slaves were normal, and didn't like the general treatment of them. Not owning some would only leave them to the treatment I saw unfair. If I'd own them in order to be able to give them a better living, I'd still be evil by that account.

In my country there was no slavery but a similar system when nobles owned peasants and could trade sell and buy them
Lots, lots of nobles who also were either artists or writers and still owned peasants showed in their art how evil the system is. They tried to give freedom to their folk, but just like in many similar cases people were so used to serve they didn't know how to live on their own
But they still demanded change and freedom
And once the ruler of country realised that the serfdom was getting in the way of progress (slavery is actually a very weak economical system which helps to make country at first stage but later becomes a burden) he tried to abolish it and give land to people
Many rich nobles fought him, so in the end though it was abolished the peasants still had to pay to their exmasters to buy the land they lived on
As a result, people were mad and overthrew the government. Maybe if nobles listened there wouldn't be a revolution in the first place

So, yeah, even if slavery is considered a norm good people will still understand its evil. Greedy and selfish will try to save it, though and keep the country away from progressive development

[Gearwarden]

Must be the hair

You saw right through me.