22176 réponses à ce sujet

[(Disgusted noise.)]

My favorite Bioware guy taking fashion inspiration from my favorite Bioware lady. (Sorry, Cassandra.)

 

http://cynellis.tumb...-into-the-trash

[nightscrawl]

If his father hadn't been so repentant, Matteo may have gone back to the Gull and Lantern and used his daggers to make some 'repairs' to Halward.  Though that may have put a damper on his blossoming relationship with Dorian. 

Lol... yeah I think it might have just a bit.
 
 

The problem I have with this quest is that it is also tied up with the act that as a noble, Dorian is SUPPOSEd to be beget a heir. That has always been an essential part of any medieval story yet I find this aspect underplayed (True, most fans don't care since we're modern day people but if the game is to be internally consistent, this aspect should've been emphasized much more than it was)

I don't think it's downplayed at all as far as its importance to Halward or Tevinter (upper) society at large. I think it's very clear why Dorian was supposed to get married; breeding is specifically referenced on two separate occasions and alluded to in a third. Dorian is an independent person -- ironically, Halward raised him this way with such thoughts as "blood magic is the resort of the weak mind" -- and he doesn't give a damn and even seems to have disdain for the whole concept. I will go as far as saying that if Dorian were straight he might have a similar response, particularly given his feelings on his parents' marriage.

[Dr. Doctor]

It can?! That would be hysterical! I am so sad this has never happened to me now
 
Pretty sure the concept of someone using blood magic to forcibly change someone else is horrific no matter how you slice it. I generally err on the side of forgiveness, but that's a huge thing. And it's not just because it was to change his sexuality; it'd be equally horrific if he had been trying to any aspect of Dorian's personality. I'm equally horrified at the Qun brainwasher guys too. To me it's all on the same level because the very idea of one person (or hell a group of people) deciding someone else must change to suit them is repugnant. Not that I have strong feelings on it or anything

When I first tried to capture the keep in the Western Approach Dorian resurrected the door right after the Inquisitor walked through. So I got mowed down, and because I didn't know that Spirit Mark could be toggled off the rest of the party had to wait to move in to assist.

What the Re-educators do isn't so much brainwashing but a mashup of 1984's Thought Police meets A Clockwork Orange. Whatever the Kossith did with dragon blood (Aurelian Titus, Iron Bull, and Kieran all suggest this) it rendered them into a people who need rigid discipline to keep themselves from going berserk. Its similar to how the Templars use faith, ritual, and brotherhood to cope with the side effects of lyrium consumption.

[tklivory]

You are absolutely correct, I came across wrong. Dorian is a great character as is. Its just the storyline with his father seems to be a slightly clumsy commentary on real life issues.

 

I think it's impact depends a great deal on your personal life experience, honestly. For some people, it felt like watching a Lifetime movie. For those who have been through it (or something similar) or seen a loved one go through it, the way it resonated could be quite profound, and Gaider himself said that that's who that scene was written for. 

[Zarro-Morningstar]

My favorite Bioware guy taking fashion inspiration from my favorite Bioware lady. (Sorry, Cassandra.)

 

snip

http://cynellis.tumb...-into-the-trash

This is all fine and dandy, but where are the assets that made that outfit fill out?

[Fredward]

The problem I have with this quest is that it is also tied up with the act that as a noble, Dorian is SUPPOSEd to be beget a heir. That has always been an essential part of any medieval story yet I find this aspect underplayed (True, most fans don't care since we're modern day people but if the game is to be internally consistent, this aspect should've been emphasized much more than it was)

 

It's not really underplayed? It's an integral part of why his father does. Maybe the  integral reason. I don't think House Pavus is in danger of going extinct if Dorian doesn't breed (though I could be wrong) it was just that his father but all his eggs in that basket. Or felt like he had. The castigation towards Dorian for his rejection of these traditional values is more implicit than explicit I know but it's not underplayed.

[Zarro-Morningstar]

Yea, i usually don't roam too deep into the BSN, I prefer to stay in Dorian's thread most of the time because the BSN is dark and full of terrors....

 

 

OMFG what is she doing here??

 

 

Sorry, I couldn't help it lol.

Cersei may be, well, Cersei...but she does have some pretty amazing lines and facial expressions.

[tklivory]

It's not really underplayed? It's an integral part of why his father does. Maybe the  integral reason. I don't think House Pavus is in danger of going extinct if Dorian doesn't breed (though I could be wrong) it was just that his father but all his eggs in that basket. Or felt like he had. The castigation towards Dorian for his rejection of these traditional values is more implicit than explicit I know but it's not underplayed.

 

Agreed. I don't think it's underplayed as much as it just doesn't register significantly for people to whom the concept of HAVING to have a child of the body is an anachronistic notion (ie, most Americans/Europeans playing this game). I didn't feel that the scene with Dorian's father was homophobic in the modern sense (ie, thought his son was WRONG to prefer men because that's icky) so much as it was his father doing the ****** wrong thing to achieve his ends of a grandchild of his bloodline (ie his son was WRONG to not beget an heir). HOWEVER, I know I'm in the minority in that, and I arrived at that after watching the scene a few times and seeing all the dialogue options in full. The most homophobic bit is if the Inquisitor flirts with Dorian, and the father says 'oh, so THAT's why you did this' and Dorian says 'no, you don't know the Inquisitor'  (paraphrasing, too lazy to look up the exact words).

 

Anwyay. The lack of heir begetting is HUGE for Dorian and his father's motivation, but his sexuality is huge for his character, so it's easy to see people conflate the two and think that they are one and the same.

[Nymeria Stark]

Cersei may be, well, Cersei...but she does have some pretty amazing lines and facial expressions.

*snip*

 

Rofl  I especially like the 2nd gif  

 

 

 

And about Dorian, i found this silly gif + comment:

 

Imagine this not being a looping gif, but Dorian just keeps throwing away the books in Skyhold’s library:

- another copy of the ‘Maleficar Imperium’?
- ‘Swords and Shields’ … never again
- ‘A Guide to the Grand Game - part 15 of 24’
- ‘Cultivating a mustache for beginners’? Are you trying to insult me?
- oh, what’s this? ‘A Collection of Antivan Ru-’ good bye
…

http://everythingdra...g-a-looping-gif

 

And the bonus

 

Spoiler

http://inquisitortre...roko-pringtella

[nightscrawl]

‘A Guide to the Grand Game - part 15 of 24’

 

I dunno... I think there might be even more than 24 in that series. x_x

[Yuyana]

‘A Guide to the Grand Game - part 15 of 24’

 

I dunno... I think there might be even more than 24 in that series. x_x

It is one of those "Master the X in three easy steps" editions. It does not work, but people will buy it.

[Arlee]

What the Re-educators do isn't so much brainwashing but a mashup of 1984's Thought Police meets A Clockwork Orange. Whatever the Kossith did with dragon blood (Aurelian Titus, Iron Bull, and Kieran all suggest this) it rendered them into a people who need rigid discipline to keep themselves from going berserk. Its similar to how the Templars use faith, ritual, and brotherhood to cope with the side effects of lyrium consumption.

 

That's an interesting way to view it, but it seems more like gradients of the same thing to me. I do remember the idea" because something with dragon blood they need the rigid discipline"... but idk. In both the case of the Qun and Templar Order I feel like the stories of "the peril of leaving" have been greatly exaggerated. I mean I don't doubt they are rooted in some truth, but just exaggerated (or the worse cases have been focused on to make the point) in order to reinforce the idea one shouldn't even consider leaving. I mean even Iron Bull is afraid he might go insane despite operating mostly on his own for years, I don't think he came to that fear on his own.

 

I'm not saying getting off lyrium or leaving the Qun are easy things... just they aren't really the "doomed to failure" thing they are described as.

 

There's a deeper concept I am trying to get at but failing at the words for >< (which is embarrassing because I am a writer). This must mean I need more coffee! Coffee is always the answer right?

[Marlena_8]

 

And the bonus

 

Spoiler

http://inquisitortre...roko-pringtella

I nearly spit-taked my soup lol.

[nightscrawl]

Thought you all would get a kick out of this... From Danaduchy on tumblr:
 

Character descriptions from the game files:
<CharacterName> Dorian Pavus
 
<CharacterDescription> Dorian is an aristocratic mage from the Tevinter Imperium— a foreign land where mages rule (even though everywhere else it’s the opposite, and mages are oppressed). Mages from his homeland are considered evil, and for good reason. They’re corrupt, and use forbidden arts as a matter of course. Dorian wants to change that. He’s an idealist, fighting to change his homeland even if he knows it might be hopeless. He’s intelligent, witty and talented— and also confident, to the point of being cocky.
 
<SpeechPattern> Dorian is very educated, coming from an aristocratic background. He should come across as intelligent, witty and sarcastic. He speaks quickly, a patter which could leave others in the dust, and he’s not about to wait for them to catch up. It’s important that he still come across as likeable— for all his witty banter, he is still a good person at heart.
 
<Appearance> Stylish, slicked-back black hair, piercings— Dorian is handsome and he knows it. He wears Tevinter mage robes of high quality, and is very fussy about his appearance.

<CharacterArchetype> The Clever Rogue

OH bonus Halward!
 

<CharacterName> Magister Pavus

<CharacterDescription> This is Dorian’s father, a respected and wealthy magister back in Tevinter. Deep down he’s a principled man, but he’s very traditional. He believes that duty to the family should come first, and thus he doesn’t understand why his son and heir would willingly cast aside everything he considers important to pursue “idle pleasures”. Since Dorian wouldn’t see reason, he resorted to forbidden magic to try and change him— and that’s what split Dorian and his father apart. He knows it was wrong, but he was desperate. Appearances in Tevinter are everything, and to Dorian’s father this is just his duty to keep the family legacy from falling apart.

<SpeechPattern> Cultured, stern but not unkind. He’s a good man, a paternal authority figure.

 
Heh I think the bit on the speech pattern is my favorite part.

[Arlee]

"for all his witty banter, he is still a good person at heart" to me that reads like he's a good person despite his witty banter? Seems weird... I'm not sure why being witty would preclude someone from being a good person.

[Lady Artifice]

I've gotten to the point where I need to choose between following the Templar or the Mage path for Alaric. Since he's going to romance Dorian, it almost seems like a no brainer to pursue the Mages for more Dorian time. On the other hand, the entire premise for Alaric is that he was dedicated to becoming a Templar, in the most idealistic way possible. He believes in protecting Mages as much as non-Mages, and he believes being a Templar is the best way to do it. The idea is that all his preconceptions about Magic and his own role as a Would have been Templar are challenged by his feelings for Dorian. It seems more organic for him to pursue the Templars, and then see Dorian for the first time after the latter has practically ran to Haven to warn them. I do like that "You were very brave" flirt option available in that instance.

 

I'm conflicted, has any romanced him on both paths? Are there any flirt options available for Dorian within the In Hushed Whispers quest that I would miss out on otherwise?

 

Here's Alaric, by the way...I'm very pleased with him. His face turned out to look sad in most situations, and he's seems positively huggable most of the time. 

Spoiler

[tklivory]

I'm conflicted, has any romanced him on both paths? Are there any flirt options available for Dorian within the In Hushed Whispers quest that I would miss out on otherwise?

 

There are no opportunities to flirt with Dorian before he officially joins the Inquisition (unlike, say, Blackwall). (Except for possibly the exact moment he joins the Inquisition, I suddenly can't recall. Oh well). It won't impact your ability to carry out the romance, however.

 

Just keep in mind that if you go the Templar route, you start out at a much lower Approval rating when he does join up and have to work extra hard to raise it to the point where the romance quest is introduced. It's possible, it just takes longer. There was a debate a while back in this thread about which entrance is 'best' for Dorian's characterization (mage vs templar path), I'm just not sure how far back it was. I've only thus far romanced him on the mage path because my first templar path was IB, and my second is Cassandra, but I know others can chime in.

 

And Alaric is a cutie! 

[Voragoras]

You are absolutely correct, I came across wrong. Dorian is a great character as is. Its just the storyline with his father seems to be a slightly clumsy commentary on real life issues.

I think it's clumsily written, for reasons I don't really want to get into. You can be an accepting person with no inclination at all towards homophobia while still disliking one 10 minute sidequest in a video game.

[Yuyana]

Spoiler

 

http://slugette.devi...Pavus-515117308

[Joe25]

My favorite Bioware guy taking fashion inspiration from my favorite Bioware lady. (Sorry, Cassandra.)

 

http://cynellis.tumb...-into-the-trash

Well...All the generations of careful breeding have given a very handsome body. 

[Voragoras]

http://slugette.devi...Pavus-515117308

 

Was browsing their art. Saw this.

 

 

Move your pecs, Esmeraldorian!

[Dr. Doctor]

"for all his witty banter, he is still a good person at heart" to me that reads like he's a good person despite his witty banter? Seems weird... I'm not sure why being witty would preclude someone from being a good person.

Dorian can come off as a jerk sometimes, (see the whole "I am a terrible ass at accepting gifts" thing) but he's a good man under all that bluster.

As for Halward's description, given that his position might have kept him away from home and that Dorian was probably at the Circle for most of his early years he could come off the way his father sees him if you didn't know him better.

[Joe25]

Was browsing their art. Saw this.

 

Spoiler

 

Move your pecs, Esmeraldorian!

The Thirst   

[Arlee]

Dorian can come off as a jerk sometimes, (see the whole "I am a terrible ass at accepting gifts" thing) but he's a good man under all that bluster.

 

Ah I see, I would have filed that under snark, but that makes sense

[d4eaming]

Spoiler

 

http://slugette.devi...Pavus-515117308

Hot. Damn.

 

/fans self