22176 réponses à ce sujet

[Arlee]

May be he objects to the fact that she prolonged the civil war by playing one side off against the other, or may be he is afraid of what Briala could do in Tevinter if she had a mind to.    I must admit I couldn't understand why Sera had such a downer on her either; I know Sera doesn't identify specifically with elves but she is meant to think of herself as a champion of the common people and the lowest of these are the elves, who Briala is trying to help.   This is why I find Sera's attitude so difficult to fathom much of the time but this thread isn't about her but about Dorian.      Calling someone a Harpy is a really insulting thing to do and it is one of the few times when I really do object to his attitude and disagree with him.  

 

Common people, not common elves for Sera. She views elfy elves to be completely different and although they are in need of help they aren't who Sera is trying to help at all. Also the argument can easily be made Briala does what she does to obtain power for herself more than to help the elves.

 

I'm not sure what Dorian's thing with Briala is though. I don't think he says anything bad about her if you reunite Celene and Briala... so it has to be something to do with putting her as puppeteer of Gespard.

[Arlee]

Let me just drop this screen I took of Dorian with the Ardent Blossom, I think you guys might like it.

 

 

*swiftly goes back to the Solas thread*

 

Gah, going to have to remember look at this when not at work so I can actually see it!

[Zobert]

Not to be that person but, what is the difference between gay and queer? I used to think they were the same thing but in the last few years I've noticed people using the terms as if they are different and I never contextually figure out what is exactly meant >< I also don't want to ask because ima afraid people will get mad >< I have a fair number of personal issues ><

 

Queer can be identified as those who aren't fully involved in gender conformity.  A drag queen would be "queer", Carson Kressley (sp) would be queer, Boy George would be queer, Neil Patrick Harris would not be considered queer.  Matt Bomer would not be queer.  RuPaul...queer.

[Dr. Doctor]

I should make a Neil Patrick Harris Inquisitor. That guy is one talented actor/singer.

[Gervaise]

Yes, he only criticises Briala if you put her in power.   If you reconcile Briala and Celene, the latter is the one who is really in charge.   She may have given Briala a title and make the odd improvement to the lot of elves (rather as in Masked Empire) but nothing major is mentioned at the end.   By contrast, if you put Briala in charge the changes are definite and cause the nobles to think about rebellion but are held back by her relationship with the Inquisitor (if elven) and their overall respect for the Inquisition.   So Briala owes her continued power to the Inquisitor and I'm sure she knows it; not being a stupid person she would continue to co-operate with the Inquisition so long as it didn't conflict with her aim of helping her people, that is the elves of Orlais.    

 

Dorian's suggestion that Briala might eventually "bite" the hand of the Inquisitor would seem to indicate that he regards her as power hungry and ungrateful and also unaware of what she owes to the Inquisitor.   To be honest it is Dorian who seems to be lacking in insight, certainly if you are an elven Inquisitor, since it should be pretty obvious, as it is to the nobility of Orlais, that the Inquisitor has a good relationship with Briala (or you'd never have put her into power in the first place).     

 

I really feel that given the contrast between his attitude to Briala when not really in power with Celene and when she is controlling Gaspard, that he doesn't like the fact that a lowly commoner has achieved such status through playing the game better than the nobles and taking the chance offered to her by the Inquisitor.    In other words he is a bit of a snob.      When he makes the "Harpy" comment to my elven Inquisitor, I would really like to respond "So what does that make me?"

[Forsythia77]

Honestly all you people who find the evidence to make all three of them work together or to make Briala the string puller.. you get mad props because that whole mission exhausts me.  The idea of the game with the masks and all that.. nope.  I feel like finding a hidden room like Varric and just hiding out with the smokers in the lower courtyard.

[Gervaise]

I'm not mad about the mission itself; I just would like to know why Dorian responds as he does.   This is a thread about Dorian after all.   Which is why I brought it up.  

[Fredward]

Wall o' text incoming. My bad. It kinda ran away from me.

 

Dorian is  a snob, it becomes super obvious if you bring him along with Blackwall and/or Sera. On the upside the majority of his snubbery seems to be relatively surface snobbery, he's consciously aware of it which is good since he won't let it influence his reasoning overmuch. BUT. There are flashes of more ingrained snobbery.

 

Firstly when you ask him about slavery in Tevinter he says he hasn't given it much thought and 'it's just the way things were' to which I say: horseshit, Dorian. He's keenly aware of the political and cultural milieu of Tevinter, he has an interest in changing it and I doubt slavery is so completely without dissenting voices that a politically sensitive young firebrand would not hear about it. Pick up on it. Be sensitive to it. Unless he wasn't interested  in hearing. Mind you this is not to say he doesn't care about it at all/endorses it wholeheartedly but it doesn't rank as high as his other concerns about his homeland like the shortsighted hording (and abuse) of power. His primary concerns are inherently upper class, understandable but also snobbish. [I'm not even going to dignify the Dorian-only-cares-about-changing-Tevinter-because-he's-gay thing because it's just really, really dumb]

 

Second would be some of the stuff he says. For instance 'elves running Haramshiral' and some of his banters with Blackwall specifically. These things aren't hostile at all, but it reflects a sort of shallow thinking. Surface thinking. Elves running Haramshiral is used as an example of something ridiculous, laughable. For obvious reasons, on the surface, it just seems so damn unlikely to happen. But is there anything inherently BAD about it? WHY is it laughable? Ask him why the abuse or even wide-scale introduction of blood magic could have terrible ramifications and he could probably give you a dissertation ask him why it's laughable that elves should run Halamshiral and he's answer you but he'd have to think some on it more. With Blackwall you can tell he expects the peasantry to act a certain way but doesn't bother asking himself why  they do, he just accepts/assumes that they will.

 

Third, Dorian sometimes comes across as condescending with his interactions with the Inquisitor. Which makes sense if you consider that 3 out of 4 times the Inquisitor has no kind of formal education. I'm thinking specifically of the time he says to Mother Giselle 'you might have to spell it out for him my dear' but there's a lot of other times too. And it's a baseless thing to assume because the Inquisitor is probably  highly intelligent (though this is just suppostion on my part based of the fact that the Inquisitor, with no formal education, can educate themselves in Theodosian culture, history, religion and relatively obscure magical theory in less than a year... if you take those perks).

 

Anyway my point is that Dorian simply does not give the same amount of thought to the nuances and influences at play with the lower classes. So with Briala he probably sees an upjumped peasant, which usually means ambition. Not a wrong assumption but because he sees upjumped peasant he doesn't consider her motives as closely as he should (or the Inquisitor's!), he just sees dangerous ambition. He misses the part where they actually share quite a bit of similarities.

 

So yeah. Snobbish. Not with intent or a core belief that some people are just better, he's just invested his interest in the floaty upper crust. There's not much consideration left for the lower parts. If you HAVE to be a snob I'd rather you be this kind than the 'some people are just born superior' kind.

[Arlee]

Queer can be identified as those who aren't fully involved in gender conformity.  A drag queen would be "queer", Carson Kressley (sp) would be queer, Boy George would be queer, Neil Patrick Harris would not be considered queer.  Matt Bomer would not be queer.  RuPaul...queer.

 

Oooh. Thanks

 

Yes, he only criticises Briala if you put her in power.   If you reconcile Briala and Celene, the latter is the one who is really in charge.   She may have given Briala a title and make the odd improvement to the lot of elves (rather as in Masked Empire) but nothing major is mentioned at the end.   By contrast, if you put Briala in charge the changes are definite and cause the nobles to think about rebellion but are held back by her relationship with the Inquisitor (if elven) and their overall respect for the Inquisition.   So Briala owes her continued power to the Inquisitor and I'm sure she knows it; not being a stupid person she would continue to co-operate with the Inquisition so long as it didn't conflict with her aim of helping her people, that is the elves of Orlais.    

 

Dorian's suggestion that Briala might eventually "bite" the hand of the Inquisitor would seem to indicate that he regards her as power hungry and ungrateful and also unaware of what she owes to the Inquisitor.   To be honest it is Dorian who seems to be lacking in insight, certainly if you are an elven Inquisitor, since it should be pretty obvious, as it is to the nobility of Orlais, that the Inquisitor has a good relationship with Briala (or you'd never have put her into power in the first place).     

 

I really feel that given the contrast between his attitude to Briala when not really in power with Celene and when she is controlling Gaspard, that he doesn't like the fact that a lowly commoner has achieved such status through playing the game better than the nobles and taking the chance offered to her by the Inquisitor.    In other words he is a bit of a snob.      When he makes the "Harpy" comment to my elven Inquisitor, I would really like to respond "So what does that make me?"

 

That all makes sense.. but it also feels a bit out of character for him to be like that :/ I would say maybe he views, in this case, Briala as having used Celene for power considering to get this result Celene has to die and Briala barely bats an eye about that aside from pouncing in to get power. Power for the sake of power is something Dorian is very judgmental about. If in this situation that is how he views her, I can understand him being quite scathing.

 

I have you taken any of the options in conversations with him with amount to "All I want is power give me all the power"? He is very quick to bite at the Inquisitor for even insinuating they like power.

 

Honestly all you people who find the evidence to make all three of them work together or to make Briala the string puller.. you get mad props because that whole mission exhausts me.  The idea of the game with the masks and all that.. nope.  I feel like finding a hidden room like Varric and just hiding out with the smokers in the lower courtyard.

 

I actually enjoy pretty much everything about Wicked Hearts. My only issue is I don't like in order to put anyone who isn't Celene on the throne you have to let her die. I also have mixed feelings about reuniting them ><

[Dr. Doctor]

Briala is kind of portrayed as doing the rebellion thing as a way of getting back at Celene for hurting her rather than for her people.

Come to think of it, Corypheus could have just manipulated her to get access to the Crossroads. She had Eluvian access and the password.

[Gervaise]

The link between Briala and the eluvians was rather disappointingly played down; it only really gets mentioned in the War Table mission for Michel.  You'd think it would be a bigger deal than that, particularly after your conversation with Morrigan.   Pretty daft if you've read Masked Empire but there you go.   

 

Although it could seem like Briala is just getting revenged (if you haven't read the book), actually she does say how she is working for her people.   If you put her in power she does make changes that directly help them, not simply herself.   Also to say she doesn't bat an eye and simply pounces in for power does her an injustice if it is meant to imply that she is any different from the other two players.    Gaspard demonstrates shock immediately after Florianne strikes; we aren't shown Briala's reaction but it may well have been the same.    However, once you have dealt with the situation, naturally both of them are going to be ready to capitalise; that is the way the Game works.   After all she has sacrificed to get to that place, Briala is not going to suddenly reject the opportunity offered her by the Inquisitor out of some sort of guilt complex.    How would that help her people?

 

It may be that Dorian has misjudged the situation and sees her merely as power hungry but I think Fredward is right and this is partly because he is a snob.    Also I'd forgotten about his joke about "elves running Halamshiral", so that may have something to do with it as well.     I would never choose the dialogue where the Inquisitor says they are doing something for their own power because to my mind only an idiot admits that is what they are doing it for.   Naturally you say what people want to hear so they will go along with your schemes.    So I suppose it is fair enough if Dorian assumes that Briala is lying about her motivations because no one is going to admit they are power hungry, unless they are a crazed darkspawn Magister aiming for godhood.     However, if he is generally sceptical about people's alleged motivations, you'd think he'd be a bit more wary about the Inquisitor, yet it would seem he always takes what you say at face value, unless you are an idiot and admit to your ambition.

 

.   

[Yuyana]

Spoiler

Wall o' text incoming. My bad. It kinda ran away from me.

 

Dorian is  a snob, it becomes super obvious if you bring him along with Blackwall and/or Sera. On the upside the majority of his snubbery seems to be relatively surface snobbery, he's consciously aware of it which is good since he won't let it influence his reasoning overmuch. BUT. There are flashes of more ingrained snobbery.

 

Firstly when you ask him about slavery in Tevinter he says he hasn't given it much thought and 'it's just the way things were' to which I say: horseshit, Dorian. He's keenly aware of the political and cultural milieu of Tevinter, he has an interest in changing it and I doubt slavery is so completely without dissenting voices that a politically sensitive young firebrand would not hear about it. Pick up on it. Be sensitive to it. Unless he wasn't interested  in hearing. Mind you this is not to say he doesn't care about it at all/endorses it wholeheartedly but it doesn't rank as high as his other concerns about his homeland like the shortsighted hording (and abuse) of power. His primary concerns are inherently upper class, understandable but also snobbish. [I'm not even going to dignify the Dorian-only-cares-about-changing-Tevinter-because-he's-gay thing because it's just really, really dumb]

 

Second would be some of the stuff he says. For instance 'elves running Haramshiral' and some of his banters with Blackwall specifically. These things aren't hostile at all, but it reflects a sort of shallow thinking. Surface thinking. Elves running Haramshiral is used as an example of something ridiculous, laughable. For obvious reasons, on the surface, it just seems so damn unlikely to happen. But is there anything inherently BAD about it? WHY is it laughable? Ask him why the abuse or even wide-scale introduction of blood magic could have terrible ramifications and he could probably give you a dissertation ask him why it's laughable that elves should run Halamshiral and he's answer you but he'd have to think some on it more. With Blackwall you can tell he expects the peasantry to act a certain way but doesn't bother asking himself why  they do, he just accepts/assumes that they will.

 

Third, Dorian sometimes comes across as condescending with his interactions with the Inquisitor. Which makes sense if you consider that 3 out of 4 times the Inquisitor has no kind of formal education. I'm thinking specifically of the time he says to Mother Giselle 'you might have to spell it out for him my dear' but there's a lot of other times too. And it's a baseless thing to assume because the Inquisitor is probably  highly intelligent (though this is just suppostion on my part based of the fact that the Inquisitor, with no formal education, can educate themselves in Theodosian culture, history, religion and relatively obscure magical theory in less than a year... if you take those perks).

 

Anyway my point is that Dorian simply does not give the same amount of thought to the nuances and influences at play with the lower classes. So with Briala he probably sees an upjumped peasant, which usually means ambition. Not a wrong assumption but because he sees upjumped peasant he doesn't consider her motives as closely as he should (or the Inquisitor's!), he just sees dangerous ambition. He misses the part where they actually share quite a bit of similarities.

 

So yeah. Snobbish. Not with intent or a core belief that some people are just better, he's just invested his interest in the floaty upper crust. There's not much consideration left for the lower parts. If you HAVE to be a snob I'd rather you be this kind than the 'some people are just born superior' kind.

 

I would love to write a wall of text. You have no idea how jealous I am every time I see one .

If I remember correctly, he compared free mages to elves running Halamshiral. I think that he was pretty happy with free mages .

 

I wanted to write something about the other problems you mentioned, but I'm not able to express myself. I wrote so many things and deleted them... I will just say that I belive him that he "hasn't given it much thought" .

[Dr. Doctor]

Dorian can be and is snobby, but he's very seldom intentionally cruel. The only time where I was at the "Oh come on man" point was in my Sera romance playthrough doing her romance side quest. That entire mission was Claptrap's Birthday-level depressing.

[Sabreenei]

I have only had Celene ruling so far, but I'm guessing the wiki must be wrong then?

 

Celene rules alone - Cole Greatly Disapproves

Celene rules with Briala supporting - Cassandra, Cole & Dorian Greatly Approve

All 3 forced to work together - Cassandra Slightly Disapproves; Cole Greatly Approves

Gaspard rules alone - Blackwall & Cole Greatly Disapprove; Dorian Disapproves; Sera Slightly Approves; Cassandra Greatly Approves

Gaspard rules, Briala in power - Cassandra Greatly Disapproves; Sera Slightly Disapproves; Dorian Slightly Approves

 

 

Edit: I went back to read the original post. I thought people were talking about Dorian not liking Briala because he disapproved of her. But it sounds like it was because he made the harpy comment?

 

Does anyone know if he makes it only if Briala is ruling with Gaspard? Or does he make it if she is supporting Celene also?

 

I haven't heard the comment myself, so I can't be the best of judges. I would hazard a guess that what he truly wants to do is warn the inquisitor to be careful, because he's worried the choice may backfire. Since this is Dorian, he covers concern with snark and cutting comments, which he turns on Briala at that point, since she's the one that could hurt the inquisitor.

[FenPhile]

[FenPhile]

I have only had Celene ruling so far, but I'm guessing the wiki must be wrong then?

 

Celene rules alone - Cole Greatly Disapproves

Celene rules with Briala supporting - Cassandra, Cole & Dorian Greatly Approve

All 3 forced to work together - Cassandra Slightly Disapproves; Cole Greatly Approves

Gaspard rules alone - Blackwall & Cole Greatly Disapprove; Dorian Disapproves; Sera Slightly Approves; Cassandra Greatly Approves

Gaspard rules, Briala in power - Cassandra Greatly Disapproves; Sera Slightly Disapproves; Dorian Slightly Approves

 

 

Edit: I went back to read the original post. I thought people were talking about Dorian not liking Briala because he disapproved of her. But it sounds like it was because he made the harpy comment?

 

Does anyone know if he makes it only if Briala is ruling with Gaspard? Or does he make it if she is supporting Celene also?

 

I haven't heard the comment myself, so I can't be the best of judges. I would hazard a guess that what he truly wants to do is warn the inquisitor to be careful, because he's worried the choice may backfire. Since this is Dorian, he covers concern with snark and cutting comments, which he turns on Briala at that point, since she's the one that could hurt the inquisitor.

I just finished with Celene in power, Briala supporting.  I didn't get any approval change but I might be at max approval.  When does the conversation happen?  at Halamshiral, or back at Skyhold?

[happy_daiz]

Honestly all you people who find the evidence to make all three of them work together or to make Briala the string puller.. you get mad props because that whole mission exhausts me.  The idea of the game with the masks and all that.. nope.  I feel like finding a hidden room like Varric and just hiding out with the smokers in the lower courtyard.

You're not the only one. It took me three days to get through it this time. Just a little bit each night, because yawn. I had to push myself like crazy, because I just wanted out of that godforsaken place.

I actually got the three to work together in my last run, but I went with Celene/Briala this time. Poor Gaspard, he never makes it in my games. I want to try it sometime, but those stupid halla statues. Ugh.

[Fredward]

Does anyone know if he makes it only if Briala is ruling with Gaspard? Or does he make it if she is supporting Celene also?

 

I haven't heard the comment myself, so I can't be the best of judges. I would hazard a guess that what he truly wants to do is warn the inquisitor to be careful, because he's worried the choice may backfire. Since this is Dorian, he covers concern with snark and cutting comments, which he turns on Briala at that point, since she's the one that could hurt the inquisitor.

 

Nah, actually he approves if you put Briala over Gaspard. Not as much as he approves if it's Briala AND Celene but more if it's just Gaspard (I think). Which I just think ratifies the point. Dorian, when he thinks about it, has no reason to disapprove of  Briala ruling or think she'd 'bite' any more or less than Celene (and if you ask me Celene is much more likely to bite), he doesn't make the comment with Celene because he's thoroughly analyzed her motives and come to the conclusion that it's in her best interest to stay chummy with the Quisie. He mulls Briala over less because she's not noble.

 

Anyway this situation always brings up an extra 'Inquisitor slightly disaproves' for me personally because my Quisie's are usually extremely manipulative shits. They know  Briala might bite and they DID want to improve the lot of elves but they also know that fostering slight instability in the empire will make the people (and even some nobles) look more to the bastion of stability (the Inquisition) for guidance/leadership. Plus as Briala's position gets more unstable over time (blackmail tends to get stale) she'll be looking to the Inquisition to shore her up. Played right the Inquisition could be the puppeteer behind puppetmaster. And if you couple this instability with the added instability of hardened Divine Leliana's wide-reaching change I'm hoping the people will be looking at the organization that carried them through the start of all this.

 

Like Dorian, love, I know I keep telling everyone that I'm but a simple elf that fell into this role but I'm taking over the world. Try and keep up.

[Sabreenei]

Nah, actually he approves if you put Briala over Gaspard. Not as much as he approves if it's Briala AND Celene but more if it's just Gaspard (I think). Which I just think ratifies the point. Dorian, when he thinks about it, has no reason to disapprove of  Briala ruling or think she'd 'bite' any more or less than Celene (and if you ask me Celene is much more likely to bite), he doesn't make the comment with Celene because he's thoroughly analyzed her motives and come to the conclusion that it's in her best interest to stay chummy with the Quisie. He mulls Briala over less because she's not noble.

 

<snip>

 

Where I'm getting confused over the discussion in the thread is that it seems to be solely based on the one comment? Unless I'm misunderstanding. Since I've never gotten it, I don't know when the harpy comment happens (at the Winter Palace during the quest? or when you get back to Skyhold?), or what it is exactly. I couldn't find it with a quick google/wiki search.

 

According to the wikis he doesn't give approval if you put Celene on the throne alone. He only gives approval if it's Celene & Briala, or Briala puppeteering Gaspard. If it was only a noble thing, he should approve of Celene ruling by herself the most, but he doesn't.

 

I would think he wouldn't be as worried about Celene because she's a known entity; she's been on the throne and we've seen how she rules. Briala is new to it, and therefore it's unknown how she will use her power. To me it's telling that the only endings he gives approval for are ones that have Briala holding some sort of power. I think that speaks to his true feelings on the matter more than one cutting remark.

 

Not to say Dorian can't be snobbish and classist, because he can! (though with a good heart!) Sometimes I just have to roll my eyes at him. My quizzie would totally be giving him that look -- you know, like the look he gives Dorian during the amulet quest, when Dorian's all, "he's not my friend, he's my..." and the IQ knits his eyebrows at him. I imagine that happens whenever Dorian says something supremely classist. (Or maybe that's just how it looked with my quizzie! It would be a look, nonetheless!)

 

I also like to think the longer Dorian is away from top tier life in Tevinter, and the more exposure he gains to other types of people, the more his world view will expand. Hopefully he'll start to modify a few of those views. We do see a certain growth in some of his banters with other companions, and his eyes have definitely been opened to the true history of his country.

[Hazegurl]

@Fredward, lol! You think sort of like I do.  I've chosen Briala and Gaspard and let Celene die. Celene is the rightful ruler who holds more clout so she just had to go. While Briala can keep Gaspard in check while at the same time relying heavily on the Inquisition for our...silent behind the scenes support. My Mage wants these fools reliant on him.

 

As for "Elves running Halamshral" comment. I also think it's something totally ridiculous. All you have to do is look at the society they live in. They are at the bottom and everyone is used to them being there. It doesn't mean it's a bad thing but laughable to think that humans would be bowing to elves in a place known for throat cutting, power plays, and silent betrayals anytime soon.

 

"Spell it out my dear." I thought I was the only one who thought that line was a bit iffy. But I took it to mean that the IQ has no idea what their little personal squabble is about so it's better to give him the details.  Dorian does make some  inducing comments. Like alluding to my IQ being stupid for conscripting the mages and assuming I would put them all back in the Circle under the same conditions....he also doesn't seem to think that I want them to remain with me if possible.  I just see Dorian as a nerd and a bit of a softie and sometimes nerds think they are so much smarter than everyone else.  Sometimes while Dorian is prattling on about conscripting mages, and how Briala would bite me (like I don't already know that and have head canoned a full plan to deal with her way before letting Celene die) I just wanna pat him on the head and call him a big ole softie. Cause my Treveylan Mage is also a nerd and thinks he's smarter than Dorian. lol!!

[Yuyana]

Please don't do this to me... I need to defend my scared little Dorian and I can't find the right words! Yes, he can say "evil" things, when he thinks it is funny or when he is in some stressful situation, but he usually apologizes and he can also be really nice.

 

When I played the game for the first time, I was afraid that he will be a snob and he will.. terrorize other party members. And then I was really surprised, because my "other party members" (Solas and Cole) started "terrorizing" him...   And I was like: didn't they say that this guy is confident, even arrogant? Where? He is just trying to be friendly and they are bullying him!  

I admit that I am a little biased, probably because he reminds me of.. me. I can be reeeally evil cynical monster and I know it.

[Fredward]

Just to be clear here: I don't like Dorian less cuz he's a snob (well on a personal level I might but probably not since like I said I think his snobbery is relatively surface snobbery but as a character it's nice). We all have our biases and favourites and if we think we don't we're deluded. He'd be boring if he was perfect.

[TheRatPack55]

Just to be clear here: I don't like Dorian less cuz he's a snob (well on a personal level I might but probably not since like I said I think his snobbery is relatively surface snobbery but as a character it's nice). We all have our biases and favourites and if we think we don't we're deluded. He'd be boring if he was perfect.

 

Indeed, I doubt I would have liked Dorian at all had he been a 'blood magic is evil, mages should be controlled, Tevinter is irredeemable, free the slaves!' kind of guy... Besides, I don't believe in black and white morality.

 

But then, most of my favorite characters are... how should I say it... 'less than perfect paragons of goodness' would be not so much an understatement as an outright lie... Compared to them Dorian is a saint.

 

_{Peace through tyranny!}   

[Yuyana]

Just to be clear here: I don't like Dorian less cuz he's a snob (well on a personal level I might but probably not since like I said I think his snobbery is relatively surface snobbery but as a character it's nice). We all have our biases and favourites and if we think we don't we're deluded. He'd be boring if he was perfect.

I never said that he is perfe... oh, wait, I did.

[Gervaise]

The Harpy comment is made back at Skyhold and I believe you only get it if you choose the heart icon response, which you can still do as a flirty friend.    It just seemed an odd comment considering he has just said how much he enjoyed you getting the Orlesian court to dance to your tune and part of that was putting Briala on the throne.  

 

I have a feeling that this is another of those conversations that was written with a human noble in mind because in that case Briala might stab you in the back but to an elven Inquisitor it sounds odd.    You've just manipulated the situation to put an elf into power, stood by and let the Empress die, blackmailed Gaspard into being a puppet and he thinks you are the one who should be worried?    

 

I suppose it is bothering me more his time round because my latest elven incarnation is way more confident, clever and politically aware than either my lady mage or elven hunter lover, so it irks me when Dorian speaks to him like he is an naïve idiot.    This male mage is more than a match for Dorian in every way but chose not to romance him in favour of Cassandra.    He can actually sympathise with Dorian's rebellion against the traditions of his culture that keep his countrymen mired in the past because he feels much the same way about his own people the Dalish.   He already thinks the elven gods are a waste of space and can't understand why his people spend so much time trying to earn their approval.   So when he is has been handed the opportunity to achieve a position of real power in Thedas, he jumped at it, including happily playing along with the whole Herald of Andraste thing.     He adopts the Pascal idea that he is in a win/win situation so far as the Maker is concerned since it is very difficult to prove categorically he doesn't exist (since Chantry teaching is that left the Golden/ Black City the moment the Magisters entered it) and if he does exist he feels the Maker is not going to object to being given credit for inspiring him.     He feels desire for power is not itself a bad thing; it is how you use that power once gained that defines you.     Actually he and Dorian have a lot in common which I suppose is why they are good friends, in spite of the occasional crass comment on Dorian's part.