Alexius was in that brothel too, and I doubt he was there to cause a scandal. We don't know why he picked that place, or if he wanted people to find him there.
Oh, I know. I mentioned being curious about his choice, and that's one possibility. My initial reaction was to believe he wanted to go out of the way and not be found.
I will say that, what irritates me the most about the slavery convo is that no matter what, you're railroaded into fighting with him about it no matter your race.
I seem to remember you can end on a somewhat 'I see your point' - ...ish note? When he compares Tevinter slavery to poverty in the Alienages. Or do I remember it wrong? It's been a while since I last had that convo.
I seem to remember you can end on a somewhat 'I see your point' - ...ish note? When he compares Tevinter slavery to poverty in the Alienages. Or do I remember it wrong? It's been a while since I last had that convo.
Yea, there's an option where you basically say you guess he has a point.
Yeah the option to see his point comes after you're forced to jump down his throat about it. You get three options, and all three are to start the fight with him.
Yeah the option to see his point comes after you're forced to jump down his throat about it. You get three options, and all three are to start the fight with him.
True. And I don't like that either, I prefer my Dorian with all his controversial opinions intact. But the 'no real choice' issue plagues DAI's quests all throughout the game: (spoiler image I've already posted in another thread but still relevant)
Yea there are a number of points where the choice is more about picking tone than picking what you do or think.
I seem to remember you can end on a somewhat 'I see your point' - ...ish note? When he compares Tevinter slavery to poverty in the Alienages. Or do I remember it wrong? It's been a while since I last had that convo.
I will say that, what irritates me the most about the slavery convo is that no matter what, you're railroaded into fighting with him about it no matter your race.
Yea, there's an option where you basically say you guess he has a point.
Yeah the option to see his point comes after you're forced to jump down his throat about it. You get three options, and all three are to start the fight with him.
Here is how I approach the conversation (yes, some head canon is involved...)
For the first option I pick "You don't question it?" While the tone from the IQ is harsh, I look at it as being surprised to hear that from Dorian, who, up until that point, has seemed like the type to question everything. So I can, in my mind, place more emphasis on the "you," to have "You don't question it?" and append the question with, "You question everything, Dorian." This is at once a criticism and a compliment, and Dorian is then free to take my commentary on his character in any way that he wants.
For the second option I do pick the "I see your point," because I actually do. Dorian is approaching the argument from a logical standpoint, rather than from an emotional one, which I can appreciate. For a Trevelyan IQ in particular, while southern Thedas doesn't have the blatant slavery that Tevinter does, it is hypocritical to assume that the poorer masses are so much better off with their technical "freedom." Unfortunately, there are more nuances to the discussion on both sides of the issue that aren't shown in the game, which makes the options presented seem lacking.
That said, I can see how the conversation with an elven IQ would be seen as problematic, but the conversation system in ANY of the DAI games has never been so nuanced as to take those things into consideration, beyond providing the occasional extra dialog option for the player, and for the most part the NPC will respond in the same way regardless of race.
While on the one hand it can come across as "good for the NPC" for sticking to their guns, I believe it is actually more realistic that we moderate our conversation based on who we are speaking to -- people do this unconsciously every day with different types of people.
That said, I can see how the conversation with an elven IQ would be seen as problematic, but the conversation system in ANY of the DAI games has never been so nuanced as to take those things into consideration, beyond providing the occasional extra dialog option for the player, and for the most part the NPC will respond in the same way regardless of race.
While on the one hand it can come across as "good for the NPC" for sticking to their guns, I believe it is actually more realistic that we moderate our conversation based on who we are speaking to -- people do this unconsciously every day with different types of people.
I think the conversation system got simpler and simpler until there wasn't much room for nuance. In Origins, at least, you had specific dialogue options if you were an elf (I never finished a playthrough as a dwarf, so I can't say much about that). This video as an example: Leliana asks Warden about life in the alienage. I don't remember this conversation or topic coming up in a Cousland playthrough.
I think they could have added more specific options here and there.
I will have to get WoT2 just for the bit on Dorian (I find it difficult to read the Reddit post even with my glasses). However, I get the general gist and it comes as no surprise to me that he was such a mess. It makes me that much more glad that my Lavellan fought to keep their relationship going through all Dorian's mockery of his devotion so that they would be together post Cory. I only hope they don't do something horrible to the Inquisitor in the next instalment because it is clear had badly Dorian needs them, whether as a friend or a lover, but to lose his Amatus Lavellan might well destroy him. Alternatively, I would pity the person responsible when Dorian caught up with them.
Also, I said I thought Dorian had a bit of a drinking/gambling problem - turns out that was an understatement; Dorian simply had a problem. All things considered it's remarkable he turned out as well as he did when we meet him; you have to hand it to Alexius, he did something worthwhile with his life.
I was on tumblr and saw people claiming Dorian's age to be 23 and that it was apparently "confirmed by David Gaider in an interview". However, the ones spreading these rumors didn't have any sort of proof or link to this supposed interview, curiously enough. Someone then decided to ask DG on twitter if there was any truth to this, and this is what he had to say:
Then there was this post (contains possible spoilers for Dorian's age and the name of his mother):
Take this information as you want, we won't know anything for sure until the book is released. I thought it was interesting nonetheless and wanted to share it with you all. One thing's for sure though; there will be more pages about Dorian than what's already been leaked. Yay!
I was on tumblr and saw people claiming Dorian's age to be 23 and that it was apparently "confirmed by David Gaider in an interview". However, the ones spreading these rumors didn't have any sort of proof or link to this supposed interview, curiously enough. Someone then decided to ask DG on twitter if there was any truth to this, and this is what he had to say:
Then there was this post (contains possible spoilers for Dorian's age and the name of his mother):
Spoiler
Take this information as you want, we won't know anything for sure until the book is released. I thought it was interesting nonetheless and wanted to share it with you all. One thing's for sure though; there will be more pages about Dorian than what's already been leaked. Yay!
Ohh, thank you for this. I think 23 is too young, and I don't say that because I think he looks "old" (he doesn't). It's more to do with experience and where he is in life. I think 30 makes the most.
If he ends up being 23, though... 
What do you guys consider "young" and "old"?
True. And I don't like that either, I prefer my Dorian with all his controversial opinions intact. But the 'no real choice' issue plagues DAI's quests all throughout the game: (spoiler image I've already posted in another thread but still relevant)
Spoiler
I will wait to see the actual book. I've tried the "Look Inside" search feature on Amazon before and it is... not perfect. I mean, we only have a month, it's not THAT far away. I'm actually inclined to think that that tooltip is misrepresenting and it's actually 9:10 or in the teens; it's not a coherent sentence.
But, to take the bait, if that is accurate and he was born in 9:1 that makes him 40-years-old in DAI. Now, I will say that for David Gaider to make Dorian this age is not surprising. In Asunder Rhys is described as "approaching is fortieth year," which I took to be 37-39 years. Rhys is also a senior enchanter, and Dorian was (supposed to be) working on attaining that rank -- yes, I get that Tevinter Circles work differently.
And, I dunno, 40 just seems to be too old to be having these sorts of parental issues. You'd think that after a time Halward would have just given up. That said, I understand that Dorian is his only child and all his eggs are in that one basket, so there is that element to consider as well.
Again though, we'll just have to wait and see. I am torn on wanting to know and wanting it to be left ambiguous.
BUT, I am super pleased that we get to learn mom's name.
[edit]
After doing a new search, I am now VERY inclined to think the tooltip is wrong. If you do a search for "was born in" you will find that the 9:<YEAR> in single digits are written as 01-09, such as, "Claudio Valisti was born in 9:08 Dragon to the Valisti dynasty."
I was on tumblr and saw people claiming Dorian's age to be 23 and that it was apparently "confirmed by David Gaider in an interview". However, the ones spreading these rumors didn't have any sort of proof or link to this supposed interview, curiously enough. Someone then decided to ask DG on twitter if there was any truth to this, and this is what he had to say:
Then there was this post (contains possible spoilers for Dorian's age and the name of his mother):
Spoiler
Take this information as you want, we won't know anything for sure until the book is released. I thought it was interesting nonetheless and wanted to share it with you all. One thing's for sure though; there will be more pages about Dorian than what's already been leaked. Yay!
There are also people who think the 'I' after 1 is a typo and actually means '8'(since 8 and I are neighbors on the keyboard), which means 9:18 and would put Dorian indeed at an age of 23. Personally, I don't believe that, I'd put Dorian at somewhere around 30. Makes the most sense story-wise. Anyway, we'll have to wait until the book is released I suppose 
Before this information came out we discussed his likely age and on the whole seemed to agree it was likely late 20s. 40 seems too old to me and 23 a tad too young, so if the mistype is 9:11 that would make him 30 at the beginning of Inquisition, which would be about right. Whilst a number of the companions are put in their late 30s/early 40s, not all are that age. Sera is definitely younger and she and Dorian get on rather well despite him being a mage, which I don't think would be the case if he was so much older. Dorian is a very talented mage and could well have progressed quite quickly once Alexius took him in hand. Also I tend to place my Inquisitors in their mid to late 20s and Dorian doesn't strike me as that much older than they are.
[edit]
After doing a new search, I am now VERY inclined to think the tooltip is wrong. If you do a search for "was born in" you will find that the 9:<YEAR> in single digits are written as 01-09, such as, "Claudio Valisti was born in 9:08 Dragon to the Valisti dynasty."
I just made a search myself and found Dorian's name to be spelled as "Dorian Pants" in some results... *laughs* So yeah, it shouldn't be taken very seriously. But it seems random words are replaced with similar ones (Pants instead of Pavus), so it is likely that "9:1 I" really means 9:11. I've always pictured him to be in his late 20's or early 30's, so that would make the most sense to me. I also have to add that one of the results stated Alistair to be born in 9:10, so the year counter does go beyond 01-09.
I really hope he's not 23 though as that would suggest he was still very young when Alexius found him in the brothel, and that thought disturbs me. 40 seems too old, just looking at Halward makes it hard for me to believe he would have a child of that age. He doesn't look too old himself, in my eyes.
I just made a search myself and found Dorian's name to be spelled as "Dorian Pants" in some results... *laughs* So yeah, it shouldn't be taken very seriously. But it seems random words are replaced with similar ones (Pants instead of Pavus), so it is likely that "9:1 I" really means 9:11. I've always pictured him to be in his late 20's or early 30's, so that would make the most sense to me. I also have to add that one of the results stated Alistair to be born in 9:10, so the year counter does go beyond 01-09.
I really hope he's not 23 though as that would suggest he was still very young when Alexius found him in the brothel, and that thought disturbs me. 40 seems too old, just looking at Halward makes it hard for me to believe he would have a child of that age. He doesn't look too old himself, in my eyes.
"Vivienne: I presume you know what they'll say about Corypheus, Dorian?
Dorian: Darkspawn? Madman? Relic of an unwanted past? Don't keep me in suspense.
Vivienne: They will say he is Tevinter.
Dorian: *sarcastic voice* No!
Vivienne: I am aware you claim to be here to counter that. But the damage is done.
Dorian: I'm not here on behalf of my nation's reputation, Vivienne. I'm here to do what is right.
Vivienne: If only more of your countrymen felt as you do."
I haven't heard this one so far but I love trying to imagine Dorian's dramatic tone, kinda like "Dissing my homeland? Oh no! Anything but that!"
He's too jaded at this point for the Tevinter card to work as an insult.
Yea that's one of the early ones with the two of them, before Vivianne accepts him. It's great, the inflection in his voice for all of it is just perfect 
Before this information came out we discussed his likely age and on the whole seemed to agree it was likely late 20s. 40 seems too old to me and 23 a tad too young, so if the mistype is 9:11 that would make him 30 at the beginning of Inquisition, which would be about right. Whilst a number of the companions are put in their late 30s/early 40s, not all are that age. Sera is definitely younger and she and Dorian get on rather well despite him being a mage, which I don't think would be the case if he was so much older. Dorian is a very talented mage and could well have progressed quite quickly once Alexius took him in hand. Also I tend to place my Inquisitors in their mid to late 20s and Dorian doesn't strike me as that much older than they are.
Yea i remember that conversation, I was a bit of a dissenting voice I'd say the youngest it would make sense for him to be is mid twenties.
Top of the page Dorian! 
http://namiyammi.dev...Pavus-499040827
Also bonus one because this is awesome!
http://sandara.devia...Pavus-505195105
I also have to add that one of the results stated Alistair to be born in 9:10, so the year counter does go beyond 01-09.
You misunderstand. If the single digit years (1-9) are represented as 01-09, then he could not have been born in the first year of the Dragon Age, as that would be shown as 9:01. So, with the date partially shown as "9:1_" his birth year can only be from 9:10-9:19. At the very most, this puts him at 31 when DAI takes place, as the Concave was held in 9:41.
Moving onto another topic... I know I've posted on here about Dorian's armor before, but I recently noticed something that has really made me appreciate the artists a lot more. (As an aside, I do HIGHLY recommend getting the DAI Art Book. The section on architecture alone is worth the money, particularly that on Tevinter; "dire opulence" indeed, what a phrase.)
It actually takes looking at it this large to appreciate it...
After looking at the art book and going around in the game to look at the various Tevinter set pieces, you can really see how they incorporated the serpent (snake as well as dragon) elements into the design, and this extends to Dorian's armor as well. Not only are there the prominent, obvious snakes: the large one embroidered on his robes, the snake-head ornaments and shin guards, but there are also more subtle elements. The diamond ornaments are evocative of scales, and the leather straps -- which I've derided in this very thread -- are suggestive of a snake coiling around Dorian's body, similar to that of his romance tarot card.
Of course, this doesn't change the fact that his armor looks impossible to remove, despite the art book statement, "Companion costumes are built in layers, with an eye for customization and functionality. We strive to make sure that every belt, clasp, and fastener has a purpose. These should be costumes you could build in real life," (p.63). I literally LoLd when I read this.
Of course, this doesn't change the fact that his armor looks impossible to remove, despite the art book statement, "Companion costumes are built in layers, with an eye for customization and functionality. We strive to make sure that every belt, clasp, and fastener has a purpose. These should be costumes you could build in real life," (p.63). I literally LoLd when I read this.
You misunderstand. If the single digit years (1-9) are represented as 01-09, then he could not have been born in the first year of the Dragon Age, as that would be shown as 9:01. So, with the date partially shown as "9:1_" his birth year can only be from 9:10-9:19. At the very most, this puts him at 31 when DAI takes place, as the Concave was held in 9:41.
I did understand what you meant, that's why I mentioned "9:1 I" could be a typo for 9:11. But that's not important 
I agree about getting the art book, it's well worth it. The concept art for Dorian's outfit kind of makes me wish it had that darker color for the leather as I think it looks good (and also more Tevinterish). It's a shame they didn't add all of those rings and tattoos in the end. I think piercings were mentioned somewhere too but it's not present in the art.
There's an album on imgur with lots of close-ups of different parts of Dorian's body (in-game). It covers every little detail of his outfit, with and without robes. I recommend taking a look, it's fun to compare it to the concept art. The album is here
I'm an engineer and I'm baffled at how that clasp/buckle/chain mechanism would work. He's got what looks to be a hip holster for his grimoire/potion storage that ties into another pair of belts which hook into the harness assembly that holds the under layers of the armor on. Then the cloak hooks in with yet another set of belts.
Because I've had to describe it in writing, I've put a great deal of thought into it. His main belt, and everything on it, is only attached via the single chain connected to the assembly across his chest (pic 1) -- the strap on his waist (pic 2) is not attached to the belt, but does seem to be, improbably, angling downward into his pants. If you assume that there is a hook or clasp of some sort on the chain, once this is undone you can just remove the belt as normal; the grimoires are all attached to the single Batman utility belt (pic 3).
Also, I have no idea what this belt closure thing is supposed to be; there seems to be a lever locking mechanism here, but I'm not sure how it would work. It also seems that Dorian keeps the cover (the egg-shaped part) open all the time, rather having it closed and hiding the lock.
The knee and shin guards are buckled on and over standard boots with spurs (pic 4), and he seems to be wearing leather pants (with ornaments), so that's fine.
I could accept it if he had the large straps over a collared shirt (pic 5). BUT the large leather panels on the right side of his body are the most confounding (pic 6, pic 7). Are they attached to something? Are they tucked into his pants? It really gives the impression that, even if all of the leather straps were removed, he would be left wearing a leather and cloth unitard with no discernible way to remove it.
And randomly, much love for the butt flap.
I did understand what you meant, that's why I mentioned "9:1 I" could be a typo for 9:11. But that's not important
I agree about getting the art book, it's well worth it. The concept art for Dorian's outfit kind of makes me wish it had that darker color for the leather as I think it looks good (and also more Tevinterish). It's a shame they didn't add all of those rings and tattoos in the end. I think piercings were mentioned somewhere too but it's not present in the art.
There's an album on imgur with lots of close-ups of different parts of Dorian's body (in-game). It covers every little detail of his outfit, with and without robes. I recommend taking a look, it's fun to compare it to the concept art. The album is here
OMG thank you for that album link. Those photos are great! 
I think that they should give us "undress Dorian" tutorial.
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