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[Morry]

I tend to always have cole and dorian in the same party because i like their banter and the few times ive had dorian with other people beside cassandra or varric i notice a lot less banter going on, which is quite annoying because i love their banter... i didnt realize that they are more chatty with cassandra in the party, but now that i think about it i think youre right. ill keep that in mind because i can recall it making a difference, and i like thear as much banter as i can when i play.

[nightscrawl]

Just FYI, Danaduchy on tumblr seems to have updated the Dorian conversation transcripts, including all options. I do suggest going to check those out. I only play human, so the conversations related to other races were quite interesting.

 

Link.

 

[edit]

Man, his stuff about Felix if you take the templar path is quite depressing. On the mage path you can see that he's sad and everything, but you don't get stuff like, "He should be alive, not I."

 

Hm... the varying options and results for The Last Resort of Good Men are quite interesting. If you take him out there without first telling him about the letter, he asks, "Why didn't you let me decide?" And if you say, "I wasn't trying to deceive you, just to help," one of his responses -- I think if you did NOT reconcile them -- is, "As was my father, or so he claimed." That's just... damn. It certainly is an indication of how Dorian values honesty.

[Melbella]

Since I was awake at 4am this morning thanks to a sick kitty and couldn't go back to sleep before having to get up for work, I had a few thoughts.....

 

Does Dorian get his amulet back if you don't romance him? It seems like it would be pretty important to him, especially since he ends up a magister either way. It wouldn't do at all to have that birthright floating around somewhere, just waiting to be used against him. Does it seem odd that getting the amulet back is a romance only quest and "Last Resort" is for everyone?

[Arlee]

Since I was awake at 4am this morning thanks to a sick kitty and couldn't go back to sleep before having to get up for work, I had a few thoughts.....

 

Does Dorian get his amulet back if you don't romance him? It seems like it would be pretty important to him, especially since he ends up a magister either way. It wouldn't do at all to have that birthright floating around somewhere, just waiting to be used against him. Does it seem odd that getting the amulet back is a romance only quest and "Last Resort" is for everyone?

 

Well, it's never addressed either way if you don't romance him, so I just always assumed he found some way of getting it back on his own. It's not weird to me the amulet quest is only for romanced IQs because the whole reason the merchant thinks he can get something from it is because of the romantic relationship.

[nightscrawl]

Since I was awake at 4am this morning thanks to a sick kitty and couldn't go back to sleep before having to get up for work, I had a few thoughts.....
 
Does Dorian get his amulet back if you don't romance him? It seems like it would be pretty important to him, especially since he ends up a magister either way. It wouldn't do at all to have that birthright floating around somewhere, just waiting to be used against him. Does it seem odd that getting the amulet back is a romance only quest and "Last Resort" is for everyone?

Well, it's never addressed either way if you don't romance him, so I just always assumed he found some way of getting it back on his own. It's not weird to me the amulet quest is only for romanced IQs because the whole reason the merchant thinks he can get something from it is because of the romantic relationship.

 
I don't think he does. If you refuse Ponchard's demand the scene plays out thus...
 

[Forget it.] I'm not going to help you.
Merchant: As you wish. Should you change your mind, you know the price.
Dorian: So you'll still cling to my amulet even if you can't wring anything out of the Inquisitor?
Merchant: As I told you before, monsieur: it is not for sale. Perhaps you should not have let it go.
Dorian: Yes. Perhaps.
Merchant: Good day, Your Worship.
Dorian: (Sighs.) So much for that. Thank you for trying.

 
So I am assuming that the ONLY way for Dorian to get it back -- aside from killing the man, which Dorian does not approve of -- is through the Inquisitor's intervention. And of course it IS important, but as Dorian says himself, "It's not the only thing that's important."
 
I'm going to assume that you can't continue the romance if you don't complete this quest? I can see why that would be the case. To me, the whole point of the quest is showing Dorian that you are doing something for him because you care, and not because you want something from him. And then of course is the further explanation from him about why he refused your help in the first place, which is the first indication that Dorian has been really thinking about this... whatever "this" is... in a serious way. Certainly more serious than he lets on most of the time, which of course is the greatness of the character.

[Arlee]

 
I don't think he does. If you refuse Ponchard's demand the scene plays out thus...
 
 
So I am assuming that the ONLY way for Dorian to get it back -- aside from killing the man, which Dorian does not approve of -- is through the Inquisitor's intervention. And of course it IS important, but as Dorian says himself, "It's not the only thing that's important."
 
I'm going to assume that you can't continue the romance if you don't complete this quest? I can see why that would be the case. To me, the whole point of the quest is showing Dorian that you are doing something for him because you care, and not because you want something from him. And then of course is the further explanation from him about why he refused your help in the first place, which is the first indication that Dorian has been really thinking about this... whatever "this" is... in a serious way. Certainly more serious than he lets on most of the time, which of course is the greatness of the character.

 

Hmm, that certainly is a possibility but I think the reason it plays out that way is because Ponchard still hopes due to the Inquisitor's relationship with Dorian he might change his mind and do as Ponchard requests at a later date. I mean I know he doesn't say that specifically but it seems a likely possibility since Ponchard (at least to me) seems rather unscrupulous.

 

You bring up an interesting point regarding what happens in the romance if you fail to get the amulet back from him, I hadn't really thought about that. You make a good point about why it would make sense if the romance didn't continue but it also makes me feel a bit smarmy if that is the case. Like you did this thing for him and now you're owed something, which is sort of the opposite of what the quest is supposed to be about. I sort of hope if you can't get the amulet back (and you don't kill the merchant) Dorian would at least care the you tried and the relationship could progress as normal.

[Arlee]

Have I gone totally crazy or does it look like Dorian is using a Knight Enchanter's blade in this?

 

http://www.biowarest...lithograph.html

 

[HurraFTP]

You're not crazy...and the Iron Bull is a dual wielder here...and Varric has a dagger instead of Bianca

[Arlee]

You're not crazy...and the Iron Bull is a dual wielder here...and Varric has a dagger instead of Bianca

 

Lol, I didn't even notice those things >< Particualrly funny because I did notice the way IB is posed and thought it was interesting, but totally didn't realize he was holding a weapon in each hand. Well despite the creative license it is really pretty looking

[nightscrawl]

And Dorian's armor is flipped.

 

I dunno... while the art is REALLY gorgeous, those weird inconsistencies would annoy me every time I looked at the piece. Why did the artist make those choices? I just don't "get" creative people, I suppose. =/

[nightscrawl]

Hmm, that certainly is a possibility but I think the reason it plays out that way is because Ponchard still hopes due to the Inquisitor's relationship with Dorian he might change his mind and do as Ponchard requests at a later date. I mean I know he doesn't say that specifically but it seems a likely possibility since Ponchard (at least to me) seems rather unscrupulous.

 

You bring up an interesting point regarding what happens in the romance if you fail to get the amulet back from him, I hadn't really thought about that. You make a good point about why it would make sense if the romance didn't continue but it also makes me feel a bit smarmy if that is the case. Like you did this thing for him and now you're owed something, which is sort of the opposite of what the quest is supposed to be about. I sort of hope if you can't get the amulet back (and you don't kill the merchant) Dorian would at least care the you tried and the relationship could progress as normal.

 

Well if this were real life I think it would progress, but it's a quest in a game. You do have to keep that in mind when discussing certain things.

[Arlee]

And Dorian's armor is flipped.

 

I dunno... while the art is REALLY gorgeous, those weird inconsistencies would annoy me every time I looked at the piece. Why did the artist make those choices? I just don't "get" creative people, I suppose. =/

 

Yea... when I first looked at it I was like "omg that's so pretty!" but then I started noticing all these things and I feel like every time I look I notice something else. Like why is Vivianne holding what looks like a shard of her face? And Blackwall's hand looks hugely out of proportion to the rest of his body, like it's bigger than IB's hands. So either Blackwall randomly is wearing cooking gloves or his hand is freakishly huge >< Solas' necklace is wrong too.

 

Well if this were real life I think it would progress, but it's a quest in a game. You do have to keep that in mind when discussing certain things.

 

True... I am curious about this now though. I do admit though part of me wants it to be a possibility because I dislike Ponchard and I like the thought you can tell him no and still continue with the romance.

[Gervaise]

I'd been thinking about what happened with the amulet if you didn't get it for him too.   Mind you, if you are romancing him I find it hard to see why you would refuse Ponchard, even if you don't like him.  It's not as though he stole it from Dorian.   Dorian needed the money and didn't want it any more; Ponchard realised the value it might represent to him once Dorian wanted it back.   He was just being an astute businessman.   What you can do if you want to get back at him is to choose Leliana's path to obtain it, where she suggests that you only seem to go through the motions and once you have the amulet his plans fail (something like that anyway).    I just go with Josephine because if I'm going to get Dorian his amulet back I want to do it the honourable way.    However, I did take advice given here and did the whole thing without Dorian knowing on my latest run.   It was interesting how he tells you a lot more about why he let it go in the first place and why he wants it back if you do this.  I'm still scratching my head over why this is.

 

Still it does beg the question as to what happens if you don't romance Dorian?    I opted for the idea that after Corypheus' defeat, when everyone is feeling a lot more friendly towards Dorian, Leliana helps him get it back.   After all, it was she who puts us on to the fact that something is up with Ponchard in the first place.     He obtains his sending crystals through his connection with the Inquisition, so why not his amulet as well?    I get the feeling it is something that he would need to get back before taking up his seat in the Magisterium; it's a bit like a family seal or some such.

[nightscrawl]

Mind you, if you are romancing him I find it hard to see why you would refuse Ponchard, even if you don't like him.

There are any number of RP reasons for this. If you take Dorian with you, and especially if you ask for his opinion after which he again reiterates that he doesn't want your help, you can acquiesce to his wishes and refuse Ponchard. Another path is to be of the mind to not wish to reward [Ponchard's] bad behavior. It's my understanding that, pre- Wicked Eyes and Wicked Hearts (after which you get a "Do you want to p*ss off the Orlesian court?" type of option), only some Inquisitors have the option to retrieve the amulet without giving in or resorting to violence.

 

What you can do if you want to get back at him is to choose Leliana's path to obtain it, where she suggests that you only seem to go through the motions and once you have the amulet his plans fail (something like that anyway).    I just go with Josephine because if I'm going to get Dorian his amulet back I want to do it the honourable way.

Wait... this is a thing?! I had no idea there was another option if you initially refuse. O_O Never mind... I misunderstood what you were saying with this. I never take this path (aside from my first Dorian romance play) because I don't want to reward bad behavior.

 

However, I did take advice given here and did the whole thing without Dorian knowing on my latest run.   It was interesting how he tells you a lot more about why he let it go in the first place and why he wants it back if you do this.  I'm still scratching my head over why this is.

I can think of a some reasons. If you approach him before hand he's really tight-lipped about the whole thing because, in typical Dorian fashion, he doesn't want to talk about it and is being evasive, so he gives as little information as possible to get you to drop the subject. If you talk to him and then do NOT take him to VR and still surprise him with it, you can still get the full explanation afterward by asking...

[Tell me why you wanted it.] Why were you even trying to get it back?
Dorian: You already asked me that.
Inquisitor: And you didn't give me a straight answer.

 

If you go the other path then the conversation is solely about why he didn't want help because now he's even more upset about it, bypassing the other content. So while I too wish that we got the whole story regardless of the path, I think the way it plays out actually makes sense for the circumstances.

 

(I think I may look at this option the next time I do a run through. I'm interested to see his expression and hear his tone.)
 
 

He obtains his sending crystals through his connection with the Inquisition, so why not his amulet as well?

 

Does it actually say this in the game? I was under the impression that he brought them back from Tevinter because he knew he would be leaving again.

Modifié par nightscrawl, 21 octobre 2015 - 08:19 .

[Gervaise]

That was the odd thing; I would have assumed it would be something he could just pick up in Tevinter but he definitely said how being with the Inquisition had its advantages, which implied that is how he obtained them.     I would have to load up again to check on the precise dialogue.

Here it is: "Amazing what friendship with the Inquisition gives you access to."    So he definitely got the crystals through the Inquisition, which is funny when you think about it; if the Inquisition could get sending crystals, what the hell is Leliana using ravens for?    The old Circles definitely had them so may be it was Fiona (if alive) or even Vivienne who let him have them.   They were definitely getting along well in Trespasser.

 

I'd tried getting the full explanation after talking to him initially about his amulet on previous runs but I never did.   I'm pretty sure I tried all the options given to me without success.     The only time I have been told that his father noticed it was missing was on the latest run when I didn't involve him at all until after I had obtained it.    I specifically went with this option to see what he would say but it really went against character to do something behind Dorian's back.    I had to convinced myself that I wanted to do something as a surprise for him and also, being an elf, it was my equivalent to going out into the woods to search for a deer to present to my lover.   I went entirely alone to Val Royeaux on the basis that it was my quest and didn't want any help with it.   Mind you that fell a bit flat when it turned out I did need to involve other people since I'm really not good at the intimidation thing.

[Arlee]

Does it actually say this in the game? I was under the impression that he brought them back from Tevinter because he knew he would be leaving again.

 

I could be misremembering but I thought when Dorian gives you the sending crystal he says something along the lines of "it's amazing what connections with the Inquisition can get you".

[Dr. Doctor]

I could be misremembering but I thought when Dorian gives you the sending crystal he says something along the lines of "it's amazing what connections with the Inquisition can get you".

"Normally the roaming charges outside of the Imperium are obscene but luckily I got the unlimited plan."

[nightscrawl]

That was the odd thing; I would have assumed it would be something he could just pick up in Tevinter but he definitely said how being with the Inquisition had its advantages, which implied that is how he obtained them.     I would have to load up again to check on the precise dialogue.

Here it is: "Amazing what friendship with the Inquisition gives you access to."    So he definitely got the crystals through the Inquisition, which is funny when you think about it; if the Inquisition could get sending crystals, what the hell is Leliana using ravens for?    The old Circles definitely had them so may be it was Fiona (if alive) or even Vivienne who let him have them.   They were definitely getting along well in Trespasser.

 

I'd tried getting the full explanation after talking to him initially about his amulet on previous runs but I never did.   I'm pretty sure I tried all the options given to me without success.     The only time I have been told that his father noticed it was missing was on the latest run when I didn't involve him at all until after I had obtained it.    I specifically went with this option to see what he would say but it really went against character to do something behind Dorian's back.    I had to convinced myself that I wanted to do something as a surprise for him and also, being an elf, it was my equivalent to going out into the woods to search for a deer to present to my lover.   I went entirely alone to Val Royeaux on the basis that it was my quest and didn't want any help with it.   Mind you that fell a bit flat when it turned out I did need to involve other people since I'm really not good at the intimidation thing.

 

I disagree with your perception of what he said. To me, "Amazing what friendship with the Inquisition gives you access to," sounds like he used his connection with the Inquisition to obtain them in Tevinter (or wherever). But your statement seems like the Inquisition got them for him. It's a subtle difference, sure, but that's how I read it.

 

I'm actually not entirely sure that that path is possible, but I kind of assumed from the way that it is worded in the transcript that Danaduchy posted.

 

And... I gotta say, you've mentioned going out of character before for dialogue options. Do you not like to save, watch a thing, and reload? I'm pretty sure that I've seen all of Dorian's various dialogue options. The only exception -- and I think I would have to be high or something to pick this -- is the breakup scene (as in, after you lock-in the romance). I... don't think that I will ever pick that. To this day I've never looked at the option to give Fenris back to Danarius either.

 

Mind that I don't think Dorian will have a very significant reaction because that's how he is, but I still don't want to watch it. Watching the alternate quarters options was bad enough.

[Hazegurl]

  What you can do if you want to get back at him is to choose Leliana's path to obtain it, where she suggests that you only seem to go through the motions and once you have the amulet his plans fail (something like that anyway).    I just go with Josephine because if I'm going to get Dorian his amulet back I want to do it the honourable way.  

 

I always pick Leliana to make sure the Ponchard guy fails.  He totally deserves it for trying to use Dorian's relationship with the IQ to get ahead.  Although I don't get why threatening Ponchard works for a rogue but not a mage. I would think that he would be far more afraid of someone who could summon demons than a guy with some arrows.

 

I ended up saving and picking the break up options after the sex scene, those were just brutal to watch.

[nightscrawl]

^ The "let's keep this fun" option is really the worst one... I actually apologized profusely to the screen after watching that.

 

 

 

Ooo, new page. Dorian art!

Spoiler

 

Slugette on tumblr.

 

 

Also, in case anyone wants this for some reason, I made a resource thing for the pattern on Dorian's shirt. Get it on the Nexus.

 

[Melbella]

The only exception -- and I think I would have to be high or something to pick this -- is the breakup scene (as in, after you lock-in the romance). I... don't think that I will ever pick that. To this day I've never looked at the option to give Fenris back to Danarius either.
 
Mind that I don't think Dorian will have a very significant reaction because that's how he is, but I still don't want to watch it. Watching the alternate quarters options was bad enough.

I accidentally broke up with him in my last game.  I tend to use the number keys to pick dialogue options and I hit 1 instead of 4 since the 4, at a glance, looked like a 1. And you're right, he pretty much took it in stride, as if it was no big deal. I was way more upset than he was!

 
 

I always pick Leliana to make sure the Ponchard guy fails.  He totally deserves it for trying to use Dorian's relationship with the IQ to get ahead.  Although I don't get why threatening Ponchard works for a rogue but not a mage. I would think that he would be far more afraid of someone who could summon demons than a guy with some arrows.
 

 

I wonder if the intimidation thing is class based or race based? My elf mage went the Leliana route since his intimidation attempt was a big flop. I didn't know that you could actually talk about it first with Dorian so Olinar did it as a surprise. Marcus, human warrior, talked about it with Dorian and then brought him along. He was able to intimidate Ponchard just fine.

 

I'm with you though...why is a guy with a sword more intimidating than one who can set you on fire with a thought?  

[Arlee]

I always pick Leliana to make sure the Ponchard guy fails.  He totally deserves it for trying to use Dorian's relationship with the IQ to get ahead.  Although I don't get why threatening Ponchard works for a rogue but not a mage. I would think that he would be far more afraid of someone who could summon demons than a guy with some arrows.

 

Ditto, I mean yea he is within his rights to do as he pleases but it's still a dick thing to do in my book so I have no desire to actually help him ><

 

 

 I wonder if the intimidation thing is class based or race based? My elf mage went the Leliana route since his intimidation attempt was a big flop. I didn't know that you could actually talk about it first with Dorian so Olinar did it as a surprise. Marcus, human warrior, talked about it with Dorian and then brought him along. He was able to intimidate Ponchard just fine.

 

I'm with you though...why is a guy with a sword more intimidating than one who can set you on fire with a thought?

 

I'm pretty sure only a human can do it, and it's because the human is also a noble. My Elf warrior couldn't do it but it worked just fine for my human rogue.

[SentinelMacDeath]

Only male human nobles and male Qunari can intimidate him. Just did it a couple of days ago 

[nightscrawl]

I accidentally broke up with him in my last game.  I tend to use the number keys to pick dialogue options and I hit 1 instead of 4 since the 4, at a glance, looked like a 1. And you're right, he pretty much took it in stride, as if it was no big deal.

Sigh... oh Dorian.

I accidentally kicked Sera out of the Inquisition the same way! I had to alt+f4 during the conversation, lol...

[Arlee]

I accidentally kicked Sera out of the Inquisition the same way! I had to alt+f4 during the conversation, lol...

 

How does she react when you kick her out?