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[ComedicSociopathy]

Weird question. What do you think is Dorian favorite animal or animal that best captures his personality? 

[nightscrawl]

Well, he does mention unicorns a couple of times, but I suppose that doesn't count. Even the way he mentions them isn't like, "Ooo they're so pretty," or anything like that, but rather their metaphorical use as a fantastical thing that does not exist.

 

At any rate... I really can't think of an animal that fits how I think of Dorian. I've used the red onion to describe him before in this thread: many layers with one color outside and another inside. As for an animal... I think it would be too easy, and also shallow, to simply pick something like a peacock, because that ignores a lot of what Dorian is and only focuses on the surface.

 

I like the idea of a sea anemone. A sea "flower" (but still an animal), colorful but deadly, and just needs the right fish (a clown fish) to come along and slip through its defenses, in a peaceful, happy symbiotic relationship.

[Gervaise]

Well he's not keen on dogs; probably doesn't like the fact that they shed, smell and slobber.    I can see him liking cats because they are graceful and clean with an air of superiority but can also be affectionate if you treat them right.  However, I can't get the idea of a colourful parrot out of my mind.   They are the most intelligent of birds and also flamboyantly striking.   I could see Dorian having one on his arm and teaching it to make witty remarks or alternatively swearing in Tevene when it sees people he doesn't like.

 

If we are not restricted to domestic pets then I like to think of Dorian as a lovely black panther as he has a similar way of walking to a graceful big cat.   My own personal favourite though to capture his personality would be a magnificent stallion of one of the hot blooded breeds, like the Arab or Akal Teke, the latter having a coat with a metallic sheen that glints in the sun, both breeds being renowned for their intelligence and loyalty when treated with respect but not suffering fools gladly.   Imagine him prancing along with his head high, neck arched and mane flowing in the wind, free spirited and beautiful.

[KellinC]

Hey hey, long time no see everyone.  Hope everone has been well and your holidays and new year is enjoyable.

 

I just nipped by to report to you Dorian fans who are also besotted with his voice actor or just interested in the man behind Dorian.  Ramon Tikaram's Indie film "5 Greedy Bankers" has finally released for public viewing while they prepare to take the movie around the film festival circuit.  He stars in it, so this is not the typical 3 minutes of Ramon and then he's gone.  He's up front for over an hour and 30 minutes.   =D   

You can get it affordably at this link:  "https://vimeo.com/ondemand/thisisallaboutrevenge"  without the quotations.

 

Happy holidays everyone.

[nightscrawl]

Hm... Ramon Tikaram vs the torture of watching a movie about the banking industry (and all the a-holes in it)... What a choice to make!

[myahele]

I can see Dorian liking a cat: They're quiet, relatively independent, affectionate, portable and it seems some male mages are also cat owners: Anders, the current Archon and I think there a mention of another magister that liked cats (or was that the archon?)

[KellinC]

Hm... Ramon Tikaram vs the torture of watching a movie about the banking industry (and all the a-holes in it)... What a choice to make!

 

It's a very tongue in cheek movie.  Fun enough that I watched it a second time (there will be a third time, I know it).  It was filmed on a crowd sourced budget in the town near where Ramon lives using locals and family/friends of the actors for extras.  His two sons are also in it.

[nightscrawl]

Just throwing a topic out there... Dorian and healing magic. Go!

 

I am very much of the opinion that the specific spells we have access to in the game do not dictate anything "real" in the sense of how it relates to the story. I don't believe that my Warden mage is SO much more powerful simply because that game has the most amount of spells. For example, even though we don't have healing spells in DAI, we know that mages still do heal. Aside from the devs' gaming reasons for removing it -- please don't debate this here -- I thought the lore reasons were interesting: healing was never meant to be an in-combat cure-all like the way that we used it in DAO/2, and is actually more limited in Thedas as a specialty.

 

It seems to me that, with the spells that Necromancy has available, Dorian would lean more toward the School of Entropy generally. However, I do realize that there are a couple of references in banter to him using fire spells. Entropy is the opposite of, and complimentary to Creation (where we typically have healing spells).

 

Dorian is a competent and skilled mage, and it seems to me that he would know a little something of everything. I'm thinking that he would know how to heal, but that it might not have been something he was very interested in, and so never really developed. Consequently, he may only use healing for very minor things: cuts, scrapes, bruising, headaches. It may require intense concentration. And anything more intense, such as in an emergency, might be severely draining.

 

Unfortunately, I do find it difficult to consider magic and its use outside of the gaming context, and the developers have never given much of a description of its use. I do recall that David Gaider wrote quite a bit of Fiona's magic use in The Calling, including some healing, and of course Asunder centered around mages. But it's difficult to recall the exact way he described it all.

[Hazegurl]

I've pretty much created my own in game lore reasons for Mages not healing in DAI.  I consider it more of a natural evolution type of deal.  Such as, most mages stopped focusing on healing and more on straight up combat techniques due to the long raising tensions between the Mages and Templars.  It's sort of how animals shed qualities they feel are no longer needed for other survival skills based on their environment.  I always imagine a reason why my IQ Mage doesn't heal is because, due to the environment of the Circles, healing was never majorly taught as a priority he should have.

 

With Dorian, I just don't picture him being remotely interested in healing magic because it isn't flashy enough and also due to fighting the Qunari, which goes back to my evolution "theory" of combat skills being far more valued in a high tension environment. 

 

One of the things I liked about healing spells, especially in DA2 was of how subtle they were. I always played a Force Mage/Healer Hawke because I felt sort of like a Jedi Knight or a Mage Monk or something. Like maintaining constant heals while fighting is something that requires some sort of massive Jedi like control over your magic or something that many mages just can't do.

[Gervaise]

Whilst we didn't have the ability to heal while the combatant was on their feet, we did have revival which allowed the mage to heal them once they had fallen and put them back on their feet and I always made sure all my mages trained far enough in that field to get it.     The ability to heal/revive on mass of course was only permitted to the Knight Enchanter specialism, which sort of offset the fact that we no longer had spirit healer.    On the whole I preferred to train my mage PC in this so I could drop Vivienne and keep Dorian with me.  Alternatively run 3 mages and one tank: Cassandra backed up by my PC, Dorian and either Vivienne or Solas was a pretty awesome combination.

 

So outside of gameplay mechanics I really don't see why Dorian would not know healing spells.   It seems like something basic you would learn as an apprentice before moving onto more offensive ones.  This would be for minor cuts and bruises, nothing serious as that requires a greater level of concentration, mana and expertise.  In Masked Empire it is said that the Marquis of Montsimmard first realised his daughter was a mage when she healed her horse's leg (plus hexing a few servants). Several of the narratives in the books have the mage unable to heal themselves if they are trying to maintain another spell or are so badly hurt it interferes with their powers of concentration.   So it would seem that normal healing is something that probably any mage could do if they have sufficient ability/mana and the level of healing is determined by their amount of training or expertise in the field.    Coming from Tevinter, where they are embroiled in an ongoing war with the Qun, I would imagine every young mage is given a degree of training in healing magic for practical reasons.

 

More interesting would be to consider if Dorian would be able to train as a spirit healer, which is far more powerful and requires the use of faith spirits.    Asunder introduced the idea of a spirit medium, which seems to be someone who has a greater affinity with spirits than most mages and the spirit healer would appear to be an offshoot of this.   Rhys was a spirit medium without being a spirit healer, whereas Wynne would appear to have been both.   Rhys didn't strike me as someone who had particularly strong faith, whereas we know Wynne did because of the faith spirit coming to her rescue.     So I suppose it would be all down to how much faith you consider Dorian has.   He certainly believes in the Maker, just not in either Chantry, and it may well be that his faith is actually stronger than many of those who claim allegiance with either organisation.    He has an affinity with spirits because of his use of them in Necromancy.    So I'd say that Dorian could definitely be a spirit medium if his interest took him in that direction; may be he already qualifies as one, but whether he could be a spirit healer would, I suppose, depend on the faith spirits themselves.    This in turn could depend on Dorian's own mind set.   I think Hazegurl could be right and Dorian is more attracted towards flashy offensive spells but that does not of itself preclude one from being a Spirit Healer.     His determination to combat corruption in magic use and his own basically loyal, loving, kind and compassionate nature might well be attractive to a faith spirit.

[Hazegurl]

I can't see Dorian as a Spirit healer, knowing some healing spells, yes, but a full blown Spirit Healer? Judging by Dorian and Solas's banter Dorian seems largely ignorant and even neglectful of Spirits.  He sees them as servants who can perform parlor tricks.  And judging by Cole's reactions to Dorian while practicing Necromancy, it's almost as though it's more of a forced violation of the wisps than something he has a natural affinity to.  He "breaks" what could have become a spirit. I don't see how any spirit would find Dorian's presence attractive.

[Gervaise]

That's odd because I never had Cole react to Dorian's use of Necromancy when they were in the party together and one run they were never apart because I was trying to get all their dialogue.  In that case, you're right and likely he wouldn't be able to attract a faith spirit unless he changed his whole attitude and outlook towards spirits and that would mean abandoning his necromancy specialism.     So healing spells, yes, spirit healer, no.

[Gervaise]

For those of you interested in seeing Ramon Tikaram and have access to BBC I Player, I am currently watching an episode on BBC itself of Father Brown, entitled the Wrong Shape, in which he plays one of the leading characters.    It normally would become available on I Player in around 24 hours and then is on the site for about a month.

 

Definitely you can hear the voice on Dorian in this one and in fact it occurred to me that if they wanted someone to model for a slightly older Dorian, as seen in the epilogue slides to Trespasser, then stick a moustache on Ramon and that would be it.   He even has the longer hair that we have talked about and seems to be shown for Dorian in those slides.

[Hazegurl]

That's odd because I never had Cole react to Dorian's use of Necromancy when they were in the party together and one run they were never apart because I was trying to get all their dialogue.  In that case, you're right and likely he wouldn't be able to attract a faith spirit unless he changed his whole attitude and outlook towards spirits and that would mean abandoning his necromancy specialism.     So healing spells, yes, spirit healer, no.

It's not an in party reaction. When you pick the Rift Mage specialization and ask Cole how different you are to other Mages. He remarks about Dorian's Necromancy.  He says he takes the wisps and pulls them apart, and force them to do what he wants before they can become spirits.  Then he says he likes Dorian better when he's performing other spells but not Necromancy.  He also seems upset if the IQ chooses Necromancy.

[nightscrawl]

Random aside: it's so annoying that Dorian doesn't comment on the spec that he actually has. I think that should have been standard for everyone: the companion with that spec comments on it, then add one or two extras for flavor. Grrr.

 

It's a shame that templar spec is so heavily lore involved. I can't bring myself to take it for my canon Trevelyan warrior because of the lyrium addiction aspect. Shame, since it would have been fun to be like, "Well, I was supposed to be a templar originally anyway, so now here is my chance." I know some players who actually have gone that mentality with their Trev warrior, because of the family codex information, but I just can't. So I will forever stick with Champion and miss Dorian's templar remark. However, I've gotten the impression that, despite his actual words in the statement, he's not actually too keen on the idea personally. And I really do mean just "not too keen," not that he is secretly angsting about it or anything like that.

[Gervaise]

Just been and checked on that one on You Tube.   So lyrium makes you smell odd.   Thinking about it Fenris must really reek of the stuff.

 

I don't think Dorian approves of anything which messes with people's minds.   Remember his comments about how the blood magic ritual could have left him a drooling vegetable?    Essentially that's what happens long term to a Templar on lyrium.   Well, may be not a drooling vegetable but certainly a sort of advanced dementia.   Having seen what that did to my mother, I pity anyone whose mind is slowly decaying, but to deliberate make them take the stuff that does that is awful.   I know that the real Templars we sent north really helped Maevaris when she was attacked but I do question whether the extra powers you receive from the lyrium are worth the price.   I was glad I got Cullen off the stuff and that he has devoted himself to helping others with the addiction, plus give a home to those whose minds are too far gone.  I also wonder if it does actually increase paranoia about magic, as Dorian implies.

 

Anyway, good on you for keeping your Trevelyan off the stuff.   Champion is a good spec.   If he wants the extra powers, then I'd opt for the Seeker faith route, provided you don't actually have to be made tranquil for it to work.   I've never been entirely sure what Cassandra was saying about that, whether the prolonged period in isolated contemplation focussing on the Maker effectively suppresses the emotions in a way that mimics tranquillity or if they actually do something to you.    If she wasn't aware of it, I'd opt for the former.    Besides the essentially point seems to be having genuine faith that will attract the spirit.   I actually think being a Seeker is better than being a Templar anyway because a Seeker is immune to blood magic mind control and possession, whereas a Templar is not.

[Mistic]

Random aside: it's so annoying that Dorian doesn't comment on the spec that he actually has. I think that should have been standard for everyone: the companion with that spec comments on it, then add one or two extras for flavor. Grrr.

 

I'd like to know where he got the Necromancer spec. He does talk with Cassandra about his childhood fascination with Nevarran necropolis, but frankly, most of necromancy's lore is tied to Nevarra, so him having the spec "because Tevinter" sounded a bit odd.

 

Looking forward to future specializations in DA4 (if a game set in Tevinter doesn't have blood mages, I'll be disappointed). Looking forward to Dorian in it too, of course (crossing fingers for the chance of making him the Black Divine; after his comments about that position in DA:I, him becoming the Divine would be hilarious and ironically fitting).

[nightscrawl]

I've never been entirely sure what Cassandra was saying about that, whether the prolonged period in isolated contemplation focussing on the Maker effectively suppresses the emotions in a way that mimics tranquillity or if they actually do something to you.    If she wasn't aware of it, I'd opt for the former.    Besides the essentially point seems to be having genuine faith that will attract the spirit.   I actually think being a Seeker is better than being a Templar anyway because a Seeker is immune to blood magic mind control and possession, whereas a Templar is not.

I actually assumed that they did it discreetly. I highly doubt that "the brand" given to mages as part of the rite of tranquility is actually required...
 
 

I'd like to know where he got the Necromancer spec. He does talk with Cassandra about his childhood fascination with Nevarran necropolis, but frankly, most of necromancy's lore is tied to Nevarra, so him having the spec "because Tevinter" sounded a bit odd.
 
Looking forward to future specializations in DA4 (if a game set in Tevinter doesn't have blood mages, I'll be disappointed). Looking forward to Dorian in it too, of course (crossing fingers for the chance of making him the Black Divine; after his comments about that position in DA:I, him becoming the Divine would be hilarious and ironically fitting).

As for the Necromancer spec, well Dorian has a flair for the dramatic (and actually says this), so perhaps he just learned it on his own, or came into contact with one. Dorian was a troublemaker in his youth and went to several different Circles, but he is a brilliant mage, and I'd imagine that, despite the disruption in education this caused, he was able to learn a lot on his own.

To be honest, I really don't understand people's desire to make him Archon** or the "Black" Divine. He didn't even want to be a magister. He would be totally effing miserable. Oh, I don't doubt that he would go through with it if he thought the personal sacrifice was worthwhile for his country, but I don't think it would be a good thing for him. He also might think that being raised to either role would be the death knell for his relationship, regardless of who that is with.


** Yes, I know this is supposedly not an option any longer.

[Gervaise]

In Nevarra the focus is on the whole necropolis thing and preservation of ancestors after death but when talking with Solas he talks about people using spirits back home and that is where I think the focus of the necromancer is for the Tevinter mages, plus having the ability to scare the s**t out of people.     He looks upon spirits as useful servants and comments how most mages back home treat them well, whereupon Solas makes a sarcastic comparison with slavery.    Bear in mind that in Tevinter I should imagine they have extensive knowledge about every magical school and have explored them to a far greater depth than the rest of Thedas.     Naturally Dorian would have been interested in the necropolis simply because it is not something that you find in Tevinter and for some reason his parents, or at least his mother, seemed to have a fair bit to do with people in Nevarra.   May be it was another case of distant relatives.  

[Gervaise]

I think the likelihood that Dorian would become Black Divine is very remote, particularly considering there is no way he would be interested in shooting for the post.  Unlike the position of Archon where the successor is normally nominated by the current one, so if would have been possible if he approved personally of Dorian, the Black Divine is voted in by a vote from other Grand Clerics and is only chosen from their numbers.   So he would have to first be admitted to the clergy, then work his way up to Grand Cleric and then be sufficiently popular with the other Grand Clerics to get their vote.   Since they are acknowledged to be universally corrupt, that isn't likely to happen.

 

The alternative would be to pull off the sort of coup that the current Black Divine did and by-passing the usual system.   Which is all well and good but as Lambert reveals in Asunder, even if his pal Urian was genuine in his desire for reform (which privately I doubt), once he attained the position he was using blood magic the same as everyone else in order to keep his status.  

 

Dorian and Maevaris are taking the better route of trying in win over younger Magisters so that as the old guard die off, their positions are filled by more responsible people and there will be enough of them in power to make a difference.   So I can see Dorian giving his support to one of his protégées aiming for the position of Black Divine, without trying to assume the role himself.   

[madzilla84]

Hey hey, long time no see everyone.  Hope everone has been well and your holidays and new year is enjoyable.

 

I just nipped by to report to you Dorian fans who are also besotted with his voice actor or just interested in the man behind Dorian.  Ramon Tikaram's Indie film "5 Greedy Bankers" has finally released for public viewing while they prepare to take the movie around the film festival circuit.  He stars in it, so this is not the typical 3 minutes of Ramon and then he's gone.  He's up front for over an hour and 30 minutes.   =D   

You can get it affordably at this link:  "https://vimeo.com/ondemand/thisisallaboutrevenge"  without the quotations.

 

Happy holidays everyone.

 

Thank you for the heads-up, I just bought and watched the movie! Wish I'd been in time to help crowdfund, but I'm always late to the party. I enjoyed it, thought it was a lot of fun! Will probably end up watching it again pretty soon. And Gervaise, thanks for the note about Father Brown, I'll watch that next.

 

I actually just got done watching (or ... technically rewatching, though I don't remember much from the first time around) Ramon in the series This Life, which is, to my alarm, nearly 20 years old now. (In fact, now it's 2016 it *is* 20 years old, omg.) He's in the majority of the second series, which is all on YouTube. (Most of it is NSFW, lol.)

[nightscrawl]

Oh btw, since we're talking about extraneous materials, the new season of Downton Abbey comes on tonight and the Inquisitor's UK VA (Harry Hadden-Paton) is going to return (from an ep last season) as Lady Edith's love interest. I'm going to assume that his voice in Downton is more representative to how he actually talks, which is a bit lighter than the Inquisitor, BUT he was in it so sparingly that I didn't really have a time to get a feel for his natural voice. So we'll see!

 

It will also be rather fun if he gets to be really romantic and sappy in that, because my Inquisitor is a total sap, but we don't often get to express that type of emotion in the game.

 

 

And just in case... NO SPOILERS if you are in the UK and already know how the season/series ends!

[Gervaise]

Dropped in to say, "Hi" and hope you enjoyed the various episodes.   Wasn't a Downton Abbey fan but now I am going to have to watch it for Harry H-P because I just love his voice.   Don't forget that James Norton (voice of Cole) is in War and Peace on BBC (I assume it is the same James Norton - if not then I feel rather stupid).  

 

Also having taken a few days off from the boards, I noticed Dorian had dropped to page 2, so felt obliged to give him a lift.

[nightscrawl]

Just have to use IMDb... it is the same one. I saw him in an episode of Grantchester where he plays a crime-solving priest and it was SO strange to hear Cole's voice coming out of his mouth. Ramon Tikaram rather looks like his voice, I think, so while it is a bit odd to look at him and hear Dorian, it's not quite so jarring as with James Norton. I feel the same with Alistair's VA.

[JJ Likeaprayer]

Love him to death.I said "I love you,Dorian" to him in Trespasser DLC...he's just so damn adorable! I'm mad about him,he's just...an angel!

 

Modifié par JJ Rockspirit, 09 février 2016 - 11:47 .