334 réponses à ce sujet

[Eguintir Eligard]

Ok this should be the last question on this stage. I want to make sure it's right before I try the next step as your building is only as good as your base.

 

 

No matter if I choose best align or manually set it, the UV stretcher always starts out with either the "threads" crooked and the object angled correctly, or the object itself is turned at some weird angle, say 45 degrees to the clockwise etc. The result is what you see here... I tried to manually rotate them all back to zero degrees, but as you can see there is some non-straight pelt pulls, very evident on the two corner pieces (see their center line, top to bottom? Not even close to straight). So the entire texture is not straight.

 

Is there a remedy for this other than manually moving every single thread of the pelt window to straightened position?

 

Is this a concern for what I am texturing here, or in general? I am more or less going to paint light pink on a projected high poly version of this.

 

Thanks again!

[4760]

the object itself is turned at some weird angle, say 45 degrees to the clockwise etc.

Maybe you should untick the boxes "fill holes", "rotate clusters" (and probably "normalize clusters" too), assuming you're using the "flatten mapping" option.

[Eguintir Eligard]

its pelt mapping

[-Semper-]

Is there a remedy for this other than manually moving every single thread of the pelt window to straightened position?Is this a concern for what I am texturing here, or in general? I am more or less going to paint light pink on a projected high poly version of this.

 

before going any further you should simplify the eyes. they have way too many polys! just import a vanilla mesh and copy those eyes to be used with your head.

next thing is that you're wasting too much uv space, and that your uv islands are sized subpar. the main part of your model (face and back of the head) has a very low pixel density compared to all the other tiny parts. shrink the other parts and enlarge the 2 main uv islands of the head - also compress everything together (with a spacing of a few pixels) and re-size all the parts till it fits right into the uv space.

 

regarding the straightness: depends on your texturing process. if you create your textures with an external app (like photoshop) then straight edges are preferred. in this case seams are avoided as much as possible. it's a chore to clean them manually.

if you're using texture projection, or an app where you paint your textures directly on the model then you don't need a perfect unwrap. almost everything should work.

 

it's ages since i unwrapped with max so i can't really help you with your other question, but there should be enough tutorials floating around in the internet. i saw that 4760 already posted two.

[Eguintir Eligard]

I know there are no optimizations on my template. This was an early rough draft just to illustrate my point. If an absolute straight pelt is not essential, I can continue on and just go ahead with optimizing the template and adjusting the ratios. The template will be done properly before I move on.

 

I just didn't know if there was some reason pelt mapping refuses to stay straight (as in some check box or process I am not using). If it's just a general issue that's unavoidable then I'll leave it be. Thanks!

[-Semper-]

how you gonna texture the head?

[Eguintir Eligard]

Projecting a higher poly version of it with some embellishments and wrinkles for a normal map?

[-Semper-]

that's baking a high poly on a low poly mesh. but how will you do the actual texturing process? dunno if max is capable of painting directly on the uv map or the surface of the mesh. or are you using a different application for the process like 3dcoat, bodypaint, zbrush or mudbox? you could also use a 2d application like photoshop or gimp to create the textures.

[Eguintir Eligard]

GIMP. That's the part I have zero skill at and tutorials seem hard to put into words.

 

So I am hoping normal maps take care of the need to do much more than spray colour over them. From what I can see, they definitely do.

[Eguintir Eligard]

So I am ready to embark on doing high poly mesh to add some features (indents on the ears, nostrils, minor facial flaws like wrinkles)

and I realize I have no information on techniques to do this.

 

I believe I will check out this zbrush for this step since it is free, is it not?

 

One question I do have, I am not sure anyone would know though, is for normal map projecting is it better to leave things like nostrils and ear canals a completely

empty whole (delete the face) or to cap the holes at the end of the tunnels? Perhaps both would work but I dont see it mentioned. I am assuming all holes should be capped so it knows how deep to project the bump map.

 

I'm also assuming there is a limit to how much a normal map can show... it can show a shallow divot or recess, but not a plunging hole.

 

Does this all sound reasonable?

[-Semper-]

So I am hoping normal maps take care of the need to do much more than spray colour over them. From what I can see, they definitely do.

 

unfortunately not. a simple diffuse map without any color variation won't do the trick. a normal map helps to create the illusion of details, but without an at least halfway decent texture map your model will look quite boring. it also helps if you bake an ambient occlusion- and a cavity map too.

 

So I am ready to embark on doing high poly mesh to add some features (indents on the ears, nostrils, minor facial flaws like wrinkles)

and I realize I have no information on techniques to do this. I believe I will check out this zbrush for this step since it is free, is it not?

 

a new license of zbrush costs around 800$, mudbox around 500$. blender and sculptris are free and almost as powerful. i would strongly suggest to create your details with a scultping application (touch sensitive tablet preferred), because modeling such details manually ain't fun in any way.

 

 

is it better to leave things like nostrils and ear canals a completely empty whole (delete the face) or to cap the holes at the end of the tunnels? Perhaps both would work but I dont see it mentioned. I am assuming all holes should be capped so it knows how deep to project the bump map.

I'm also assuming there is a limit to how much a normal map can show... it can show a shallow divot or recess, but not a plunging hole.

 

either way works. without going into details in 3dsmax the depth is calculated through a baking cage. that's basically a shell around your low poly mesh. every vertex of your low poly mesh shoots an "arrow" outwards along its normal until it hits the shell - if there's nothing to hit the vertex shoots again in the opposite direction. if the arrow hits the surface of your high poly mesh this info is baked to the normal map. the amount of detail a normal map can store correlates with its resolution.

[Eguintir Eligard]

Ya blender is what I meant not zb.
Looks like there aren't many guides to creating wrinkles and such but on the other hand it seems blender is pretty straight forward doing little adjustments like that and is suited to do it. So I may go the intuitive route here.

Thanks for the q and a!

[-Semper-]

https://www.youtube....h?v=mTOBCp2k1R8

 

this should get you started. while you're at it you should also search for texturing tutorials, as blender is able to paint directly in 3d which should reduce the amount of work significantly.

 

https://www.youtube....rG6OnjeA/videos

this is also a nice channel where you'll learn about dynamic scultping, retopo, uv unwrap and texturing - all inside blender and basically the whole process to create a model.

[Eguintir Eligard]

I have a tutorial to greyscale a normal map and give depth to colour that way as well. I'll come back to this once I've established a normal map.

[Eguintir Eligard]

Been watching these videos at work and trying them out at home. A lot of gaps in the learning between tutorials but the crease brush alone will greatly prepare my head in short order, then we can try it out in game.

I like the lizard scale brush. Would go a long way to making feathers for owl bear

[Dann-J]

I had a go at pimping the normal map for I am Death Come for Thee's owlbear:

 

http://forum.bioware...2#entry13748649

 

It was very much a manual process though.

 

I've been giving SSBump Generator a workout recently, reskinning the faithless golem as a flesh golem. I really emphasised the details in the normal map, so every wrinkle, hole and gash in the saggy flesh pops out. It's amazing how deep you can make holes and gashes look just with the normal map. Now I'm thinking the model might also make a good web golem.

[Eguintir Eligard]

You may want to skip the owl bear at least for now, as it is one thing I kind of wanted to take on as a 3d model from scratch. Not a guarantee by any means,

but the lack of them in all infinity and bioware games was really bugging me.

[Dann-J]

I Am Death Come for Thee's owlbear model is already pretty good. Unlike a lot of owlbear artwork over the years, It doesn't commit the sin of looking more like an eagle-bear.

 

And for those interested; here's fleshy! His skin care regime leaves a lot to be desired.

[Eguintir Eligard]

UPDATE

 

I completed my high poly head model. The ears are driving me friggin crazy and I am not sure I am such a big fan of the blender after all.

I did what I could to get the model ready for the bump texture projection method.

Well my very heplful tutorial hit a snag. The map it produced looked all purple rather than blue and pink like a normal map does.

 

I've contact the author but he's been out of the blog world almost a year... completion hangs in the balance.

[Eguintir Eligard]

Ok figured it out myself. Here are some shots of the result of projecting a higher detailed 3d model of the head (Via blender) unto the lower details 3d model.

That's where my normal (bump) map comes from.

 

Without normal map:

 

 

 

And with normal map...

 

 

 

As you can see some detail has been added. He actually has nostrils now, and some eye wrinkles.

 

Unfortunately the details are not very pronounced. I have not yet figured out how to deepen the effect, particularly the nostrils

and ears, since they rely entirely on the normal map for their depth (without it, they are flat and smooth, and hole-less).

[4760]

I don't use Gimp, but there should be an option to increase the "height" difference. At least that's how I do it when I find the details are not pronounced enough (I'm using xNormal by the way).

Modifié par 4760, 09 juillet 2014 - 07:23 .

[Eguintir Eligard]

What is xNormals?

I know GIMP has a plugin that I've used to turn a 2d texture to normals, but this is quite a different process. If there is a way GIMP can artificially deepen the already existing 3d "embossment" I'll hear it.

[4760]

Oops... Sorry, I didn't give the link. Done in my previous post (direct to the download section, the one here goes to the FAQ).

[Lance Botelle]

Hi E.E.

Looking good!

Lance.

[Eguintir Eligard]

Ok I am seeking council on the normal map weakness, so I will let you know when I know.

 

I got the fat body in game at least, also awaiting normal map and texture, but I can think we can agree the proportions are spot on. I was just doing it in 3ds max without any size reference and somehow it turned out perfect (he'll be taller with his head on). What are the odds??