82 réponses à ce sujet

[Cainhurst Crow]

Isn't it likely that the first wardens figured out what they needed to do in order to properly kill the archdemon through trail and error, and the only recorded event is when they actually succeeded? Riodan is the one who tells you that if you don't have the taint in you the archdemon doesn't die and migrates to a new host instead. How would they possess this knowledge if they hadn't figured it out already with dumat? And why wouldn't dumat continue the blight if he was slain by incompetent wardens, and simply kill them? If his plan was to trick them into thinking they killed him, I doubt it actually worked considering the wardens know you need to take in the archdemons soul and die in order to kill it.

 

And really, I doubt the wardens only figured this out in the second blight, with the second archdemon, and were just like "Well when we fought the first archdemon we didn't need the ritual so I guess we got lucky with him herp derp" and assume the first blight was all hunky dorey and that dumat is dead.

[Divine Justinia V]

Dumat is an Archdemon however hence she can't be him.

 

I'm not saying she is Dumat lmao. I said I highly doubted it, I didn't say once that I thought she was Dumat. Come on, now.

 

Yes Demons often possess hosts, the lore has already given a viable line of logic of the reasoning of this, Bodies still decay and age and thus need replacing.

 

To me that doesn't confirm anything beyond Flemeth just you know, being an abomination that has lingered long enough to actually need a new corpse to posses.

 

It doesn't confirm she's an abomination, not in the slightest bit. Unless you can source that, don't confirm it.

[Master Warder Z_]

It doesn't confirm she's an abomination, not in the slightest bit. Unless you can source that, don't confirm it.

 

She just acts like one?

 

And i said and i quote: "To me that doesn't confirm anything beyond Flemeth just you know, being an abomination that has lingered long enough to actually need a new corpse to posses" Notice i said "to me"

 

Serious Justinia you speak for me, you figure i'd know best.

 

[Shadow Fox]

I'm not saying she is Dumat lmao. I said I highly doubted it, I didn't say once that I thought she was Dumat. Come on, now.

 

 

It doesn't confirm she's an abomination, not in the slightest bit. Unless you can source that, don't confirm it.

The topic asked if she was, I pointed out the crucial reason she isn't.

[Divine Justinia V]

She just acts like one?

 

And i said and i quote: "To me that doesn't confirm anything beyond Flemeth just you know, being an abomination that has lingered long enough to actually need a new corpse to posses" Notice i said "to me"

 

Serious Justinia you speak for me, you figure i'd know best.

 

 

Lmfao shut up

I have your work to do anyway, your followers are beating down my door wanting a reason for the abrupt change in weather.

[Spiredash]

For All we know Flemeth could b the 1st Old God baby and further more the Daughter of Dumat.......but that's just my theory

[Lulupab]

For All we know Flemeth could b the 1st Old God baby and further more the Daughter of Dumat.......but that's just my theory

 

Mine too

 

I share all theories leading her to old gods.

[Divine Justinia V]

For All we know Flemeth could b the 1st Old God baby and further more the Daughter of Dumat.......but that's just my theory

 

That sounds even better.

 

hehehehe I bet Z would love that

[Master Warder Z_]

That sounds even better.

 

hehehehe I bet Z would love that

 

I'm of the mind that her involvement with the Old Gods begins and ends with the creation of the Dark Ritual.

 

I'd be interested in WHO taught her that, over whomever she was or used to be.

 

Now that, would be you're connection to the Old Gods, the being behind Flemeth, not Flemeth.

[pallascedar]

._. You don't think someone you know...checked once they were slain but before they went kablooy?

Its just odd the lore would have this notion of them being male you know, with out some one checking and finding out.

Just saying...

I don't know, I always figured the Archdemons were corrupted beyond recognition at that point. I also don't think finding its intermittent organ would be anyone's first thought aftet s blight ended... Maybe I gave a bit to much faith in humanity there though.

[Ispan]

For All we know Flemeth could b the 1st Old God baby and further more the Daughter of Dumat.......but that's just my theory

 

I ran out of likes so... "like"... there you go!  That's a very interesting idea

[Spiredash]

Well again these r all specualtions and ideas we all want......we'll find out everything eventually as the world of dragon age continues =)

[Lulupab]

The only scenario where she can be an abomination is being possessed by a spirit of hope. Spirits of hope are the strongest entities of the fade, stronger than all the other demons and spirits. There is no recorded contact with them and it is said that when a mage is dreaming and on the fade with zero interruption from the demons it most likely means the mage is dwelling on the spirit of hope's domain where no demon dares to enter. The spirit however is ignoring the mage. They are like Arch Angels from biblical lore.

[Divine Justinia V]

I'm of the mind that her involvement with the Old Gods begins and ends with the creation of the Dark Ritual.

 

I'd be interested in WHO taught her that, over whomever she was or used to be.

 

Now that, would be you're connection to the Old Gods, the being behind Flemeth, not Flemeth.

 

We'll see

[Cainhurst Crow]

For All we know Flemeth could b the 1st Old God baby and further more the Daughter of Dumat.......but that's just my theory

 

*shrugs* it could work.

[katerinafm]

If she is Dumat, then has she regretted what she's done? If she wanted the darkspawn and everything to happen, then why help the Grey Wardens in the first game? Remember that they would have died without her, all she had to do was not save the Warden and Alistair at the Tower of Ishal (sp?)

[Master Warder Z_]

I don't know, I always figured the Archdemons were corrupted beyond recognition at that point. I also don't think finding its intermittent organ would be anyone's first thought aftet s blight ended... Maybe I gave a bit to much faith in humanity there though.

 

*Shrug* Its just odd that they would be the only High Dragons considered Male out of the entire species with out some justification or credence to that thought.

[Bond]

I think bioware(or anyone honestly) decide these things on the fly. This is why i am not that excited. They might decide that Flemeth is Dumat if it fits perfecly and it might not. Their games shape the future of the characters and stories. 

The only way for me to be trully excited about this kind of stuff, is when it all happens in one game, book, movie, because you know that was the plan from the beginning. I just dont see bioware in 2008-2009 pondering on whether Flemeth is Dumat or not. They make her intriguing and secretive so that they can do whatever they decide with her in the future. 

Just think about it 10 secs and if you are smart you will know the correct answer. Half of the people who made the original game, probably are not working in BW anymore. This is only some reasons among the countless more and i think it is pointless to discuss these things in details.

Of course most of the time creators of original products imagine their story (whether it is game movie or book) and know from the beginning of the series how certain character will end up , but these are only very smart part of the cast. And even in these cases, the journey is shaped by the momentum of the writer. So basically i dont think Flemeth is the key part of the game and bioware thought of her from the beginning. They always stated DA is about Thedas. What they do with flemeth is playing with your minds and hook you  up with her mysteries and secrets. Then at some point and time if they wish, they will decide where are they going with her. Whether this is in Inquisition, doesnt matter. They already had plenty of time to build the expectation, maybe now they will link all together and decide what is she, where she comes from etc...



If TLDR, i will just give some examples Lost, Heroes, GOT(uncle Ben anyone ? and many more), True Detective recently (go watch it, pure quality). These are only on top of my head. Many question are raised to provoke interest and investigation. In the end many are unanswered like Lost and other like Heroes just decided in the last moment. So there is more than 90% chance in my book that Flemeth's story was decided recently, or if she is not in DAI ( or is in there but without providing answers) - in this case they are still wondering what to make of her.

[DrBlingzle]

For All we know Flemeth could b the 1st Old God baby and further more the Daughter of Dumat.......but that's just my theory

Ooh I hadnt thought of that. Nice idea.

[Spiredash]

Ooh I hadnt thought of that. Nice idea.

Lol thanks but in way it can make sense to everything since anything is possible and Flemeth is a powerful being and from what we've seen thru out it all shes got a mystery bout her we will eventually find out

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 It's possible, but my gut says Flemeth is not anything or anyone we've heard of before. Or if she is, it's something very rarely talked about, and linked with some unassuming details of the lore like Codex entries or sidequests like Unbound (DAO) or Pride Unbound (DA2).

 

Again, just my gut feeling on her.

[Anvos]

I'm more likely to believe she's either fused with one of the original ancient fade creatures and/or Fen'Harel. 

 

Also in the spectrum of what happened to Dumat theories I'd rank the date theory for Andraste being his Old God Baby more likely.

 

I think there is also the problem that I believe that the story involving Flemmeth and the predecessor to the Couslands is supposed to have occured before the imperium conquered Ferelden.

[ShadowLordXII]

Well there is this journal line if you complete the Alter of Dumat quest in DA2: Legacy-

 

"Sacrifices made at the altar of Dumat appear to have pleased the old god. The altar now appears dormant."

 

Suggesting that Dumat is still somehow present in Thedas. Maybe the first Archdemon wasn't Dumat at all?

[MrMrPendragon]

I think bioware(or anyone honestly) decide these things on the fly. This is why i am not that excited. They might decide that Flemeth is Dumat if it fits perfecly and it might not. Their games shape the future of the characters and stories. 

The only way for me to be trully excited about this kind of stuff, is when it all happens in one game, book, movie, because you know that was the plan from the beginning. I just dont see bioware in 2008-2009 pondering on whether Flemeth is Dumat or not. They make her intriguing and secretive so that they can do whatever they decide with her in the future. 

Pretty much what this guy said. I doubt the whole lore and all of its mysteries have been planned from the start.

Now, I'm not certain if what this guy said is right, but considering that this might be true makes me wonder if the writers themselves get some ideas from here? Lol

[Brass_Buckles]

I once had a thread theorizing that Flemeth might be an Old God; it made perfect sense in the context of DA:O (and in the fact that seemingly no one else can learn to shapeshift into a dragon, canonically speaking).

 

I do not really believe she could be Dumat, but perhaps she is another Old God who managed to avoid being sealed away, or escaped.  Or, she might be, as others suggested, Fen'Harel.  As powerful as she is, the blight concerned her in DA:O, though, really, faced with an overwhelming swarm of darkspawn, who wouldn't be concerned?

 

Of interest is that she seemingly doesn't leave the Wilds often, if at all.  She does have that legend behind her, and she has her own story about it.  Her story suggests she's an abomination (of vengeance, maybe), but it might indeed be that she's more than that.  So we can guess that she might be somehow tied to the Korcari Wilds, and it could even be that she didn't go to a demon for help, but to an Old God or even an elven god, or some other entity we know nothing about.

 

For all we know, Flemeth is the reason the Black City became corrupted and Dumat felt the need to send in mages to investigate, only to have the corruption then travel to him and also corrupt him.

 

It might be interesting, though, if the entity that was bound to Flemeth was actually some form of god or old god, which would mean that no, she's not human and also not an abomination.  But I am like others; I think we'd know if Dumat hadn't been really slain.  I guess it's possible, if someone had guessed or known about the Dark Ritual.  But if they did know about it, then we have to ask how they knew.  Did someone tell them?  Or did someone who had something to do with the origin of the darkspawn in the first place know enough to say so?  In either case, how did Flemeth find out?  Or is she just well-learned enough by this point that she can crank out all kinds of theories on magic and its application that no one else could, due to their lack of time and experience that Flemeth has in spades?  That's equally likely.

 

Personally, I think that one quest with the underground magical city in DA:2 gives some suspicion that the corruption and the darkspawn began with something those apparently magic-using dwarves did (if they were dwarves).  Where and how Flemeth ties into this, I don't know.  But while I suspect she does have at least minor ties with the Old Gods, if she isn't one herself, I still can't quite bring myself to agree with the theory that she is Dumat.  If she is an Old God, she's one of the undiscovered, and unslain ones, and clearly she intends to remain that way.  And yet, if she is?  Then as long as she lives, there will be darkspawn trying to rise up and corrupt her.  She'd fit quite well as the Old God of Mystery, Razikale, more so than as Dumat, the Old God of Silence.  Or as Urthemiel, the Old God of Beauty, but we know she can't be him, since he was the archdemon we defeated in DA:O.  Of course, we know of seven Old Gods that the Tevinters worshiped.  There may have been others that were not known about, or simply not worshiped.  Many larger pantheons have some minor deities who aren't given as much importance.