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[LobselVith8]

I was wondering if anyone thought that the Magi Boon might be addressed in the upcoming story of Inquisition. With the Mage-Templar War looming, I thought that it might play a factor in Ferelden, especially since the story of the Inquisitor will take place, for some undisclosed amount of time, in the nation of Ferelden.

 

If The Warden survives the killing blow against the Archdemon Urthemiel and asks for the Circle of Ferelden to be given it's independence, the new ruler will agree. The new ruler asks: "Is there any boon that you might request of Ferelden's king/queen? If it is within my power, I will grant it." After the Hero of Ferelden requests for the Circle to be given it's independence from the Chantry and the templars, Queen Anora will declare: "I doubt the Chantry will agree, but you have an excellent point. Let it be known that Ferelden's mages have earned the right to watch over themselves. The tower shall be restored and returned to the Circle."

 

In conversation with First Enchanter Irving, he will acknowledge the choice made by the Hero of Ferelden, saying to the protagonist:  "I must thank you, however, for freeing the Circle from our shackles. That was most unexpected, indeed! You could have asked for anything." If the Hero of Ferelden says: "I did what I thought was right," Irving will comment: "Most would have asked for wealth, or power. Thank you. This is a gift we will not abuse."

 

After the Hero of Ferelden commits the ultimate sacrifice, the new ruler will proclaim that the Circle will be free. King Alistair says, "That being the case, I wish a new tower built - with the Chantry's aid. And it will bear the Hero's name." Followed by, "And once the tower is built, Knight-Commander, I am granting the new Circle autonomy." While Greagoir initially protests, King Alistair retorts, "It proves what a substantial contribution a mage can make. They have earned the chance to prove they can watch themselves, don't you agree?" With Greagoir responding: "I... yes, your majesty. As you say."

 

As a result of this choice, an independent Circle of Magi never forms in Orzammar as a result of Dagna's research.

 

However, the impact of this royal boon is pretty much ignored in Awakening and Witch Hunt. It's mentioned in Dragon Age II by the bartender, and during the Act III quest "King Alistair", but only briefly, to address that the Chantry said no. Xil addressed this tonal shift in her thread. However, the reason why the independent Circle of Orzammar didn't form isn't explained, especially since there's no reason it wouldn't form if the Circle of Ferelden wasn't freed.

 

Honestly, I'd like to think that a mage being a national hero who ended the Blight and saved the City of Amaranthine from darkspawn as a political and military leader, and asking for the emancipation of his people with the full support of the Crown, would have some ramifications among the Circles of Magi, as well as from other groups, like the Mages Collective, the mage underground, and splinter factions like the Resolutionists.

[Knight of Dane]

I bloody well hope it at least makes a bit of a difference. Even if it's just in banter and such.

[Master Warder Z_]

It may or may not matter, that's about my opinion on it.

 

Considering for the most Part boons exist entirely within individual world states, i'd not be surprised if it was relegated to either non existence or a minor imported notion. In fact this wouldn't be the first time a boon was entirely overlooked and not given relevancy, After all if Your Warden was a Dwarven Noble who requested aid for his people in battling the darkspawn, it wasn't mentioned in Dragon Age 2 at all, Same goes for being given the rank of Chancellor, Ultimately there were many boons possible at the end of DAO.

 

Several will likely be relegated to only occurring in a set world state, and given we are relying entirely upon the Keep for the importing for information to create this world state, ultimately the boon if mentioned at all would be an applicable spot to place into the Keep.

 

Ultimately it doesn't bother me much, its just another thing that was cast off for the sake of vastly diverging plotlines.

[TK514]

It might make it easier to recruit one side or the other. Maybe some side comment during any time we spend in Ferelden. I doubt you'll see any detail or wide ranging effect of this or any other choice with several possible end states.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Well last warden who killed archdemon was elf it didn't make their life any better.

 

Hero of ferelden is gone anders said that no one cares that hero was mage s/he is seen as hero until s/he screws something up like in daa where if you burn city there will be rumors that you are possessed blood mage who want burn world.

 

Even mage hawke is seen more as hero than mage only times that makes difference someone insults you for being mage hell even champion statue is shown as warrior not mage.

 

And still it is far from fixing all crap that mages caused and are causing.

[Grieving Natashina]

It may or may not matter, that's about my opinion on it.

 

Considering for the most Part boons exist entirely within individual world states, i'd not be surprised if it was relegated to either non existence or a minor imported notion. In fact this wouldn't be the first time a boon was entirely overlooked and not given relevancy, After all if Your Warden was a Dwarven Noble who requested aid for his people in battling the darkspawn, it wasn't mentioned in Dragon Age 2 at all, Same goes for being given the rank of Chancellor, Ultimately there were many boons possible at the end of DAO.

 

Several will likely be relegated to only occurring in a set world state, and given we are relying entirely upon the Keep for the importing for information to create this world state, ultimately the boon if mentioned at all would be an applicable spot to place into the Keep.

 

Ultimately it doesn't bother me much, its just another thing that was cast off for the same of vastly diverging plotlines.

Pretty much this.

[Mirrman70]

I thought that they said the chantry didn't allow it to happen.

[Inprea]

I'd like to see it have a note worthy effect but that depends on how much resources are put into the decision. I believe that it would significantly lower any violence in Fereldan. It seems to me if the PC was a mage and a well behaved one it'd make it much easier for the people to accept free mages and thus weaken the templars. Depending on how badly weakened the chantry was they wouldn't be able to send them much support either.

 

A mage Warden that saved Amarthine is already a huge violation of chantry laws anyway. A mage outside the circle, a high noble who sets in judgment of others and freely practicing magic the chantry doesn't support in some cases. They're breaking every chantry law about mages and the people they rule are benefiting from it.

 

It'd be nice if due to have no support from the thrown, support from the chantry reduced and support from the people reduced the templars gathered up their things and just left. They may not have any choice really depending on how much money the chantry can send them. Can you imagine what it'd look like if a circle was cut off from its lyrium supply for a few months? We've seen how bad off a templar is when they don't have their fix.

[LobselVith8]

I thought that they said the chantry didn't allow it to happen.

They said that, but King Alistair is arguing about it several years later (in Act III's "King Alistair"), and now that all the Circles have broken free from Chantry and templar control, I think it would make sense to address it in the respective timelines where the Hero of Ferelden from the Circle asked for the Circle to be granted autonomy, or committed the ultimate sacrifice to save the world from the Blight.

[Grieving Natashina]

They said that, but King Alistair is arguing about it several years later (in Act III's "King Alistair"), and now that all the Circles have broken free from Chantry and templar control, I think it would make sense to address it in the respective timelines where the Hero of Ferelden from the Circle asked for the Circle to be granted autonomy, or committed the ultimate sacrifice to save the world from the Blight.

Tricky though.   The Mage boon cannot have any real impact on the story since it is so optional.  Not everyone played a mage, and not every mage Warden asked for the boon.  If you want to include that in the story, then there must be another story for those that didn't choose that option.

 

My mage Warden was pro-Circle and instead choose the riches/title for herself.  She didn't think that the mages should be free from the Circles.  Note: my views aren't my mage Warden's views on the subject.  You gotta love RP'ing.   

[Iron Fist]

Kinloch Hold could have been made into a safe haven for mages between gaining its independence and the fall of the Circle of Magi.

 

I expect it would now be incredibly isolationist, since it would have gained its independence differently from the other Circles.

[MisterJB]

I am unsure what difference this could make.

The Magi Warden asked for the Templars to retreat as a boon; the Ferelden monarch asked the Chantry for permission to do this and the Chantry said "No."

Thus, unless Bioware says otherwise, the Templars never left the Circle. Any animosity or goodwill that may exist among Ferelden Templars and mages will not have been affected by this boon that resulted in nothing.

 

Rather, I think it'd be far more relevant whether mages were recruited or not since this might have an affect on how they are perceived.

 

Now that I think about it, if Irving died and the Magi Warden asks for the boon, who is there to congratulate him/her?

[LobselVith8]

I am unsure what difference this could make.
The Magi Warden asked for the Templars to retreat as a boon; the Ferelden monarch asked the Chantry for permission to do this and the Chantry said "No."
Thus, unless Bioware says otherwise, the Templars never left the Circle. Any animosity or goodwill that may exist among Ferelden Templars and mages will not have been affected by this boon that resulted in nothing.

I'm thinking along the lines of the ramifications this caused with the Circles, with the Hero of Ferelden and the new ruler both publicly supporting autonomy for the mages, since Meredith makes an allusion to news having spread to other Circles when she berates King Alistair.

With the Circles no longer under Chantry governance, I think the mages could see Ferelden as a safe haven. It's the only nation under the Andrastian Chantry (that we know) to support independence for the Circle (post Magi Boon).

Rather, I think it'd be far more relevant whether mages were recruited or not since this might have an affect on how they are perceived.

Now that I think about it, if Irving died and the Magi Warden asks for the boon, who is there to congratulate him/her?

I don't believe anyone replaces Irving.

[MisterJB]

I'm thinking along the lines of the ramifications this caused with the Circles, with the Hero of Ferelden and the new ruler both publicly supporting autonomy for the mages, since Meredith makes an allusion to news having spread to other Circles when she berates King Alistair.

With the Circles no longer under Chantry governance, I think the mages could see Ferelden as a safe haven. It's the only nation under the Andrastian Chantry (that we know) to support independence for the Circle (post Magi Boon).

Fair enough.

However, I don't see mages trying to escape to Ferelden being given a warm welcome. There are Templars there and, regardless of the ruler's personal feelings, s/he is not likely to turn Ferelden's recovering army against sons and daugthers of Ferelden in defence of a mass exodus of mages from every nation in Thedas.

[KC_Prototype]

That be a fun consequence to see play out. The Ferelden mages would be ahead of the game and already have independence so they get an influx of mages coming through to be free.

[Big I]

If memory serves, the boon doesn't happen if the Mage Warden lives (the monarch promises to try, but the Chantry digs in their heels and the monarch doesn't push it), only happens if the Mage Warden sacrificed his or herself (so they do so out of respect for his or her memory), but it's all undone by the end of DA2 anyway.

 

The boon can be granted with the Warden alive. Anora must either be ruling by herself or married to Alistair with Loghain alive. In this instance it's Anora who grants the boon, not Alistair. If Alistair grants the boon it's not carried through on import due to a bug, I don't know if that problem is with all boons or solely the Mage one.

 

According to Witch Hunt it seems that the boon grants mages more freedom (Finn doesn't have to ask permission to leave the Circle). The King Alsitair scene in DA2 has Alistair saying that mages outside the circle (e.g. the Mages Collective, apostates) are now outside Chantry control.

[Vit246]

Oh for frak's sake the Magi Boon won't have a significant role. You, lobselvith8, have been obsessed with the Magi Boon for years. You put WAY TOO MUCH importance into ONE OPTION out of MULTIPLE OPTIONS that was put in 4 YEARS AGO into the FIRST game. And at this point in the DA storyline and setting with everything plot-relevant thats happened so far, is it REALLY still relevant?

 

vvv He says this better than me.

It may or may not matter, that's about my opinion on it.

 

Considering for the most Part boons exist entirely within individual world states, i'd not be surprised if it was relegated to either non existence or a minor imported notion. In fact this wouldn't be the first time a boon was entirely overlooked and not given relevancy, After all if Your Warden was a Dwarven Noble who requested aid for his people in battling the darkspawn, it wasn't mentioned in Dragon Age 2 at all, Same goes for being given the rank of Chancellor, Ultimately there were many boons possible at the end of DAO.

 

Several will likely be relegated to only occurring in a set world state, and given we are relying entirely upon the Keep for the importing for information to create this world state, ultimately the boon if mentioned at all would be an applicable spot to place into the Keep.

 

Ultimately it doesn't bother me much, its just another thing that was cast off for the sake of vastly diverging plotlines.

[thetinyevil]

I really hope it does.

[Sir JK]

I don't think we'll see an in-depth analysis of the magi boon.

 

For one, it's not contained within DAI but a DAO decision which means that only longtime fans will truly benefit. The Keep might make this easier but it's still a choice made 2 games previously and there's no real way to interact with it. Unless it has significant impact on a plot, then it'd be little more than a showcase of a decision made by only the most loyal fans. Nice, but hardly high priority.

 

Secondly, it's not even one of the choices everyone will encounter. It's only mages that will and really only one of many choices. It'd be to give one choice more attention than any other, which carries a risk of backfiring. Why would it be given it's own specific plot significance when no other choice is? What if I chose to travel to Par Vollen with Sten? Shouldn't that have equally far reaching consequences? What if I wanted Gwaren? What if I appointed Shianni or myself to be the Bann of the Alienage? And so forth.

The fate of Dagna, Zathrian and the Ashes could reasonably be made somewhat impactful since they're choices encountered by all wardens. Magi boon? Only one small subset of them.

Naturally... if they make all boons relevant this point would be moot. It'd be nice if they did, but let's not pretend it wouldn't require massive resources.

 

Thirdly, and perhaps the most important, as touched upon above this is content only a small subset of DAI players will experience (let alone be in a position to compare). This is not cause to do nothing, but they cannot make a unique game/plot for people who happened to play mages and choose this in the first game. No matter what you chose in previous games, no matter what you play... all playthroughs will interact with the same things.

I could see them, if they wish, make the magi boon a topic of dicsussion beyond a single mention. Perhaps mention by a libertarian mage that they don't trust the Chantry to hold their best interest in mind given how they vetoed the independent Kinloch hold? Perhaps as background for why Ferelden isn't supporting the mages (The king/queen wants to but the Bannorn says no)?

I could even see it be the source of a single side quest. Much like Zevran and Nathaniel is. But no more than that.

 

But I don't think anything more than that can be expected (unless they really want to and have time to spare).

 

You might be able to choose which spices to flavour the soup with, but everyone will get the same base soup. No matter what we've chosen.

 

 

I'd like to see it have a note worthy effect but that depends on how much resources are put into the decision. I believe that it would significantly lower any violence in Fereldan.

 

Mind... that's not how it ended up in Rivain.

[Dean_the_Young]

Minor dialogue difference, not a major impact or change of the storyline. Perhaps an investigation dialogue wheel option or two about 'Didn't the Warden ask for Mage Boon' with a subsequent explanation/resentment that it didn't occur.

 

Given that the dominant narrative aspect of Ferelden post-DAO is 'busy trying to recover,' and the 'demonic veil tears across the lands' providing a new distraction for secular powers, I don't see them making much of a difference even if they wanted to- and I don't see them particularly wanting to, mage boon or no. Sympathy is not the same as commitment, and Alistari/Anora have shown no signs of wanting a head-on-head fight with the Templars over mage freedoms: sheltering three Kirkwall apostates from returning to Kirkwall is one thing (and we don't even know where they were in the meantime: the Ferelden Circle is as good a guess as any), radically changing political calculus is another. People who view the Ferelden state as behind the Mages and supporting mage independence are taking inches to make miles.

 

So I don't expect it to matter. I don't even expect the Ferelden state to matter: the Inquisition's efforts will be focused in Western Ferelden and the frostbank mountains, ie the western limits of Ferelden influence. I expect the lyrium trade and Dwarves to matter significantly more in the Ferelden campaign than I do a minor epilogue option nearly a decade before that most people never even got the chance for.

[Inprea]

Mind... that's not how it ended up in Rivain.

 

True but how much combat experience did the Rivain mages have? I'm sure some will disagree but one reason I believe the templars don't want the mages going to war, even to fight the darkspawn despite ignoring the king's request, Is because they don't want the mages getting too much combat experience. Jowan knocked a group of templars on their tail and he's not even considered a very good caster. How many templars could a mage that's actually practiced killing warrior types take down?

 

Now to anyone who says they only fought in one battle. No. We encounter the mages on the road fighting darkspawn as a group learning to watch one another's back. We may have only seen two battles but that is no reason to assume they only fought in one. I may be wrong but I believe the notion of a circle filled with mages that are seasoned killers scares the day lights out of the templars.

[Mistic]

Minor dialogue difference, not a major impact or change of the storyline. Perhaps an investigation dialogue wheel option or two about 'Didn't the Warden ask for Mage Boon' with a subsequent explanation/resentment that it didn't occur.

 

This. Or maybe a different codex entry depending on your choices. But nothing else.

 

Given that the dominant narrative aspect of Ferelden post-DAO is 'busy trying to recover,' and the 'demonic veil tears across the lands' providing a new distraction for secular powers, I don't see them making much of a difference even if they wanted to- and I don't see them particularly wanting to, mage boon or no. Sympathy is not the same as commitment, and Alistari/Anora have shown no signs of wanting a head-on-head fight with the Templars over mage freedoms: sheltering three Kirkwall apostates from returning to Kirkwall is one thing (and we don't even know where they were in the meantime: the Ferelden Circle is as good a guess as any), radically changing political calculus is another. People who view the Ferelden state as behind the Mages and supporting mage independence are taking inches to make miles.

 

My thoughts exactly. There's also the possibility that the Circle tower in Ferelden has been already purged by the Templars or that all the mages fleed. In fact, given that the Ferelden templars were in general relatively nice (so nice that Cullen, who became an extremist at the end of DA:O by his Fereldan peers' standards, was one of the sanest templars in DA2), I can see Greagoir turning a blind eye to the later case. In either case, the Ferelden Circle stops being an issue in Inquisition. In Asunder Irving is already with the rest of the mages, so maybe other Fereldan mages followed him.

[The Elder King]

I recall that in old discussion people mentioned the fact that Leliana in DA2 had a line when talking about the risk of Kirkwall falling to mages if you picked the Magi boon: expecially after what happened in Ferelden. People thought she was referring to the freedom of the Circle, but Gaider stated that there's something we don't know. I guess we might find it in DAI.

[TheKomandorShepard]

I recall that in old discussion people mentioned the fact that Leliana in DA2 had a line when talking about the risk of Kirkwall falling to mages if you picked the Magi boon: expecially after what happened in Ferelden. People thought she was referring to the freedom of the Circle, but Gaider stated that there's something we don't know. I guess we might find it in DAI.

Well if i recall she always have that line but to get it you can't take anders who replace her line with "none of you"