937 réponses à ce sujet

[SwobyJ]

If a speech by a President said it, I don't believe it.

[DeathScepter]

Yes, that's war. But the "We did what we must to end the war " is totally wrong : the japanese wanted to surrender (once again read Howard Zinn or the pentagon papers if you want real official paper to prove facts and understand USA in the XXth century), America did nothing to end the war, it wasn't to help the troops and it wasn't to be great, it was just to have more power.

 

 

Bullshit, Japanese government didn't want to end the war regardless of the will of their people.  Lets Face it, War is hell. 

[N7Gold]

I don't believe it was all an illusion anymore, but the theory gave me new theories of my own.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Bullshit, Japanese government didn't want to end the war regardless of the will of their people.  Lets Face it, War is hell. 

More specifically, the Japanese military didn't want to. They even held their Emperor in house arrest so he couldn't declare surrender. 

 

But what does WWII have to do with IT?

[DeathScepter]

i do think it has to do with the Destroy Ending and how We ended W.W.2 with the Atomic bomb on Japan. In war, there will be sacrifice. Also War is nasty mess. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

i do think it has to do with the Destroy Ending and how We ended W.W.2 with the Atomic bomb on Japan. In war, there will be sacrifice. Also War is nasty mess. 

Ah, okay. I was just wondering. 

[Mordokai]

i do think it has to do with the Destroy Ending and how We ended W.W.2 with the Atomic bomb on Japan. In war, there will be sacrifice. Also War is nasty mess. 

 

Obligatory link: https://www.youtube....h?v=bX7V6FAoTLc

[MSandt]

Bullshit, Japanese government didn't want to end the war regardless of the will of their people.  Lets Face it, War is hell. 

 

Correct. There were of course some Japanese politicians who were willing to surrender unconditionally, but they were completely powerless. Then there were those who were willing to surrender, but not unconditionally. Of course, the Allies were willing to accept nothing but an unconditional surrender, which was of course the right thing to do considering the fact that the Japanese had been just as brutal as the Nazis had been.

[Farangbaa]

Well, this has escalated

[Iakus]

i do think it has to do with the Destroy Ending and how We ended W.W.2 with the Atomic bomb on Japan. In war, there will be sacrifice. Also War is nasty mess. 

 

Didn't nuke Korea to stop Japan though

[SirBob3]

 

My main problem with IT is the protean beacon on Thessia.  The Prothean VI has the ability to recognize indoctrinated individuals, as demonstrated with its immediate shutdown when Kai Leng shows up, but it still talks to Shepard, indicating that he/she is not indoctrinated.  The same VI also asks Shepard if he/she is attempting to rescue it from "indoctrinated forces" when in the Illusive Man's chair, indicating once again that Shepard is not indoctrinated, and this time, extremely close in time to the ending.  This suggests that, if IT was correct, then Shepard would have to be indoctrinated within the amount of time that he/she heads back to earth, and I feel like that would be such a big shift in mental state that there would be no way for the subtleties that IT requires.  Thus, I really don't think that IT is real.  

 

Plus, as a writer myself, I can't imagine it being that fulfilling to end such a grand story as the one the ME trilogy tells in such a way.  It would feel too half-hearted and, for lack of a better term, lame.   It's a not-a-real-ending ending.

[DarkestDeceit]

I can't help that IT was the way the ending was going then for whatever reason it was cut out at last minute, the game ending is just out of sync with the rest of the game imo.

[ZerebusPrime]

I hear this one a lot so I want to point it out while it's being mentioned.

 

The Prothean VI seemingly throws a wrench into things, but it doesn't kill the IT.  I think of Indoctrination as a degenerative brain disease.  Shepard is able to resist becoming "indoctrinated" right up until the decision chamber sequence and possibly beyond.  Simply undergoing the process does not automatically make one "indoctrinated"; that's an end result of the process that has to be arrived at.  So the Prothean VI probably has a threshold to its detection algorithm and Shepard didn't qualify as having passed that threshold during the times he was scanned.  

 

Shepard is an anomaly.  He's resistant.  He can even kick Leviathan out of his own head for brief moments.  But Priority: Earth takes us to Indoctrination Ground Zero.  The Reapers are crawling all over the place down there.  Even then, it ultimately takes Harbinger's close proximity and concerted effort to push Shepard over the edge as I see it.  

[DeathScepter]

 

 

My main problem with IT is the protean beacon on Thessia.  The Prothean VI has the ability to recognize indoctrinated individuals, as demonstrated with its immediate shutdown when Kai Leng shows up, but it still talks to Shepard, indicating that he/she is not indoctrinated.  The same VI also asks Shepard if he/she is attempting to rescue it from "indoctrinated forces" when in the Illusive Man's chair, indicating once again that Shepard is not indoctrinated, and this time, extremely close in time to the ending.  This suggests that, if IT was correct, then Shepard would have to be indoctrinated within the amount of time that he/she heads back to earth, and I feel like that would be such a big shift in mental state that there would be no way for the subtleties that IT requires.  Thus, I really don't think that IT is real.  

 

Plus, as a writer myself, I can't imagine it being that fulfilling to end such a grand story as the one the ME trilogy tells in such a way.  It would feel too half-hearted and, for lack of a better term, lame.   It's a not-a-real-ending ending.

 

 

 

Well It is not perfect in tell whom is indoctrinated. For many indoctrinated agents did sabotage the Project in the last cycle.

[ForceXev]

I still think IT is interesting and worth considering, but I have to admit logically it's probably not what was intended with the ending.  Still, I can't shake that there is something about the ending that should not just be taken at face value.  Of all the weird and crazy things in the ending, it's something so simple and insignificant that makes me most suspicious of the ending: the elevator.  After Anderson dies and Shepard passes out in front of the console, this weird platform elevator lifts him up through an eerie beam of light.  Why would there be an elevator right there?  Why have we not seen these floaty platform elevators anywhere on the Citadel before?  And what's with the strange beam of light?  It's all too ethereal and strange.  I can accept everything else about the ending, from the Catalyst and the infuriating final decision to the destruction or damage to the relays and wiping out the Geth with space magic and all of that stuff.  But that elevator... I don't trust that elevator.

 

It makes me think that everything after Shepard passes out at the console is in Shepard's mind in one way or another.  I don't know if he's just having a little sleepy time, or if it's Reaper indoctrination invading his mind, or maybe something else entirely.  But I can't accept that that elevator is actually a real thing.

[Lyria]

I will always subscribe to the Indoctrination theory.  There was just something off about the ending, even the expanded ending.  But that is my opinion and I cannot go into the mind of the writers and find out what was intended and if something else was intended.  I'm not a Reaper. 

[shepskisaac]

I can't help that IT was the way the ending was going then for whatever reason it was cut out at last minute, the game ending is just out of sync with the rest of the game imo.

Except that Microsoft accidentaly leaked the beta of the demo on Xbox Live which had internal dev files form the production, old abandoned plots and all and IT was never planned, the  general idea for the ending was always the same

[XXIceColdXX]

I still feel if IT or a derivative of it, is not part of the grand plan, Bioware will have missed the opportunity for one of the greatest plot twists in gaming history.

[AlanC9]

I still feel if IT or a derivative of it, is not part of the grand plan, Bioware will have missed the opportunity for one of the greatest plot twists in gaming history.

By " greatest" do you mean "least popular"?

[CronoDragoon]

I still feel if IT or a derivative of it, is not part of the grand plan, Bioware will have missed the opportunity for one of the greatest plot twists in gaming history.

 

That ship sailed when the game was released. Even if IT were true, releasing the true ending as DLC later would have been extremely bad PR, and pissed off more people than it amazed.

 

Had IT been incorporated into the base game upon release, such that there's an Indoctrination section at the end of the game like BW had planned before they scrapped it, that would have been interesting.

 

I especially like one of the fan ideas to have dialogue wheel options that, upon being picked, said something completely different. Since you know, Indoctrination and all. We know from Grayson that with the ASSUMING CONTROL type of indoctrination, the original person is trapped inside, experiencing the Reapers speaking for them and probing their thoughts.

[Iakus]

 

I especially like one of the fan ideas to have dialogue wheel options that, upon being picked, said something completely different. Since you know, Indoctrination and all. We know from Grayson that with the ASSUMING CONTROL type of indoctrination, the original person is trapped inside, experiencing the Reapers speaking for them and probing their thoughts.

Well, that would explain some of the bad paraphrasing.

 

Not to mention the looong stretches of autodialogue

 

But I must say i'm still curious how, if MENext really is a sequel, how they'll handle the hopes and dreams of staunch IT-ers

[ZerebusPrime]

I'm curious to see how they handle the hopes and dreams of staunch anything-ers.

[Iakus]

I'm curious to see how they handle the hopes and dreams of staunch anything-ers.

 

Ah, the joys of a broken base

[AlanC9]

I'm curious to see how they handle the hopes and dreams of staunch anything-ers.

 

Simple They'll do what they want. Some folks will be OK, others will ragequit.

[masster blaster]

By " greatest" do you mean "least popular"?

That is opinion not fact. IT is what people think it is. Some say it's popular, others say it's not. People still talk about aside from here on the new BSN, and IT site, so it is not the least popular, yet nor the greatest. Just simple it is popular, yet to whom ever views it as such.