100552 réponses à ce sujet

[YourFunnyUncle]

If I am in the trans community than I have the right to say it is. I was offended and it ruined my PT where I was romancing Sera.

You on the other side can choose not be offended but the fact it is, she misgendered a person and that is tranphobic. For whatever reasons Sera did it, it is still there. I really do not get why people cannot accept this.

I am truly sorry to read that about your playthrough. I can only imagine how awful it must be to put up with that rubbish in real life all the time. and I do agree that misgendering is transphobic, especially if it's pointed out to you and you then continue to do it. 

 

I'll just say one more time that while she was certainly very clumsy, which fits her character, I think that at least the intent was to poke fun at the hypocrisy of the nobility for hiding things that they considered would lower their standing in the game. I don't think that she necessarily intended to infer that it's actually a bad thing to be a trans person. Maybe I'm just being ridiculously charitable to her.

[Fiery Phoenix]

I'll just say one more time that while she was certainly very clumsy, which fits her character, I think that at least the intent was to poke fun at the hypocrisy of the nobility for hiding things that they considered would lower their standing in the game. I don't think that she necessarily intended to infer that it's actually a bad thing to be a trans person. Maybe I'm just being ridiculously charitable to her.

This is the impression I get from the majority of her comments; a lot of what she utters doesn't strike me as serious, intentional, or literal. It just looks like some of that slipped through the cracks and went into red flag territory.

[The Loyal Nub]

I don't expect him to, considering he declined to comment on her remark on Iron Bull (which was, admittedly, less sensitive).

 

What I would be interested to know is how the line went through peer review. You'd think someone else on the writing team would have picked up on it.

 

Yes, I agree, it should have merited comment from other members of the writing team. But given how much debate is happening here on the line and whether it was offensive or not maybe they didn't see it as a red-flag.

 

Personally now that I've had a chance to get a sense of the context the line was used in I think it should have been flagged. It's given in a line with other negatives and it does come across as Sera passing judgement in a very nasty manner.

[LightningPoodle]

We are still debating this?

[SardaukarElite]

We are still debating this?

 

Debates don't actually end in this place. Arguments about the dialogue wheel have been burning for something like seven years.

[AzureAardvark]

I'd love to use the 'well, excuse me princess' line with her. 

 

Aaaaand now we even have a name for the DLC! 

[raging_monkey]

We are still debating this?

apparently tbh ive heard worse

[veeia]

Honestly with how much pushback Bioware has gotten regarding their treatment of trans characters, and how they've vowed to do better, I am pretty surprised it went through, shrug. They obviously did a great job putting in a trans dude character and Mae got a mention, at least, but in terms of treating trans ladies (in game at least) well, I can see how it would be upsetting... Maybe it doesn't seem like a huge deal to some of you, but if Bioware was doing the research they said they were, they'd know that it actually can be for a lot of trans folk. 

 

It's not an reason to dismiss or bash Sera nor is it a condemnation of Lukas or whatever to say that all that. It's just an unfortunate line. She's not the only one who has them either. So I'm actually glad discussions about it are happening here, because it's something that bothered me, but wasn't enough for me to think SHE'S THE WORST hATE HER SO AWFUL SLFKJSLKFJSL etc etc (ie the tumblr discussions i've seen about it aren't a good place for me haha)

[Mihura]

I am truly sorry to read that about your playthrough. I can only imagine how awful it must be to put up with that rubbish in real life all the time. and I do agree that misgendering is transphobic, especially if it's pointed out to you and you then continue to do it. 

 

I'll just say one more time that while she was certainly very clumsy, which fits her character, I think that at least the intent was to poke fun at the hypocrisy of the nobility for hiding things that they considered would lower their standing in the game. I don't think that she necessarily intended to infer that it's actually a bad thing to be a trans person. Maybe I'm just being ridiculously charitable to her.

 

No need to apologize but I find it strange, that  people are still debating if her remark is or isn't transphobic. I can come off as more stern in this matters but I think it is understandably when your experiences are invalidated a lot of times.

You can see different reasons for Sera doing that, that is more than fine but to me the fact remains. Even if she wanted to hurt a noble, it is still shitty. I can handle casual cissexism fine but misgendering others, especially when it is on purpose is just too much.

 

That said I still like her, Maker knows that I was royally ****** at the wasted opportunity.

[YourFunnyUncle]

I'm going to keep quiet about it now, because I'm obviously upsetting real trans people and that couldn't possibly be further from my intention.

[AresKeith]

[LightningPoodle]

 

I agree, Cassandra.

[Serza]

*screams in agony!* IF YOU'RE GONNA SHOOT ME, AT LEAST MAKE A DECENT JOB OFF IT! *tries to find missing cheek*

 

Hmm, my trigger finger isn't at it's best today, is it?

 

Oh well, looks like this just became a DIY thing for you...

[LightningPoodle]

Hmm, my trigger finger isn't at it's best today, is it?

 

Oh well, looks like this just became a DIY thing for you...

 

I'll get around to it eventually...

[Serza]

I'll get around to it eventually...

 

*shrugs*

 

Whatever rocks your boat...

[Roamingmachine]

No need to apologize but I find it strange, that  people are still debating if her remark is or isn't transphobic. I can come off as more stern in this matters but I think it is understandably when your experiences are invalidated a lot of times.

You can see different reasons for Sera doing that, that is more than fine but to me the fact remains. Even if she wanted to hurt a noble, it is still shitty. I can handle casual cissexism fine but misgendering others, especially when it is on purpose is just too much.
 
That said I still like her, Maker knows that I was royally ****** at the wasted opportunity.

And in the bolded parts lies the trouble. You've made up your mind, why debate it here? Some, like myself, will always judge words by their intent more than on their content and under that view that SINGLE LINE takes a different tone. An opinion as valid as yours. So lets not talk about facts where there are none.

[WildOrchid]

I don't expect him to, considering he declined to comment on her remark on Iron Bull (which was, admittedly, less sensitive).

 

What I would be interested to know is how the line went through peer review. You'd think someone else on the writing team would have picked up on it.

 

What remark?

 

SHE'S THE WORST hATE HER SO AWFUL SLFKJSLKFJSL etc etc (ie the tumblr discussions i've seen about it aren't a good place for me haha)

 

Another problem i have with people especially on tumblr, they think exactly like this. Which is such hyperbole. And you know what i find most funny? They get so mad about her using the b!tch word BUT call her b!tch as well. Hypocrites, the lot of them.

[Fiery Phoenix]

What remark?

IIRC it's a line in which she expresses what could be interpreted as attraction to him.

 

It was discussed in here a couple of weeks ago. I believe you only get it if you're playing as a qunari.

[AresKeith]

IIRC it's a line in which she expresses what could be interpreted as attraction to him.

 

It was discussed in here a couple of weeks ago. I believe you only get it if you're playing as a qunari.

 

You mean that line where she says Iron Bull makes her think about "stuff"?

[syllogi]

IIRC it's a line in which she expresses what could be interpreted as attraction to him.

 

It was discussed in here a couple of weeks ago. I believe you only get it if you're playing as a qunari.

 

I think I got it on my dalish elf, where she wonders about THINGS relating to Iron Bull, right?

 

I don't think it's necessarily attraction if she's curious about his package.  I mean, maybe it's disproportionately small.  That's worth wondering about too.

 

(that was a joke nobody tell Freddie Prinze Jr I said that please)

[LightningPoodle]

You mean that line where she says Iron Bull makes her think about "stuff"?

 

Stuff being Qunari sex. Two obviously powerful people having sex is going to get a mind like Sera's wondering.

[Roamingmachine]

First off I want to thank everyone for the kind words, it means a lot to me.

Do I wish those three words weren't there certainly but I think by now it is well known that it was offensive to some of us and I'm sure BioWare is aware of it by now. I know that history has not been kind to us in BioWare games and I was hurt by some of the previous content but I can't change those three words and I'm not going to dwell on it either, it happened and we need to move on. Continuing to discuss it at this point isn't going to change anything except cause division between us. I'm not minimizing the struggles of many trans people, I've been luckier than most as I had the resources to be able to find what makes me happy. Unfortunately many are not as fortunate as I was and suffer greatly, so try to understand that these kind of comments can be very hurtful especially to someone struggling just to make it through another day.

We all have struggles of some kind and not just trans issues, so please can we just move on. I am more than willing to discuss this with anyone and we also have a Trans and Non Binary Group where we discuss these issues also.

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is how you bring up your view with tact and grace without ruffling feathers that don't need ruffling I will say no more about this on this thread

[Duelist]

(that was a joke nobody tell Freddie Prinze Jr I said that please)

It does put Varric calling him Tiny into perspective.

[AresKeith]

Stuff being Qunari sex. Two obviously powerful people having sex is going to get a mind like Sera's wondering.

 

and it made her think about qunari women