Okay, what do you all think of a lesbian being written by a guy?
I find I'm doubtful.
I guess I can understand the thinking, but if that thought line was followed through on, doesn't it end up with lots of straight white male characters? Which admittedly wouldn't be a change.
I guess you can look at his prior work. Aveline makes me feel good about his ability to write a female character at least.
Guest_Act of Velour_*
I'm wondering why sexual orientation is still the main focus here, over a dozen pages and several "Move on" comments later...
There's nothing wrong with her being a lesbian.
I guess I can understand the thinking, but if that thought line was followed through on, doesn't it end up with lots of straight white male characters?
I guess you can look at his prior work. Aveline makes me feel good about his ability to write a female character at least.
Well, race restrictions are in, so it's possible Sera is one of the race-restricted romances.
Wait, that got confirmed?
*sigh*
Really hoping Sera won't deny my Lady Qunari, otherwise just gonna have to stalk the Nexus until someone releases a small mod to allow it.
I'm wondering why sexual orientation is still the main focus here, over a dozen pages and several "Move on" comments later...
There's nothing wrong with her being a lesbian.
Guest_Act of Velour_*
Really? I guess I can rest well tonight.
I don't think you still want to discuss it. I think you're apparently concerned about a man writing a lesbian romance. Why's that?
Okay, what do you all think of a lesbian being written by a guy?
I find I'm doubtful.
While I disagree with the implication (that you cannot successfully write a character unless you are yourself their mirror), if it helps, I didn't attempt to write her to be an example of what a lesbian character should or should not be. I wrote her to be Sera, and she happens to be a lesbian. I tried to take the same approach with Aveline. I didn't write her to be a strong woman, I wrote her to be a strong character. That she was a woman was part of her character, but not what wholly defined her.
Like Aveline, Sera has her flaws. I expect some will like her, and some will hate her, and that's expected. Hopefully because of her opinions/actions and not due to an expectation of what she should or should not represent. But I can't control that, so we'll see how it goes. I've had my hits and misses before. Fun every time. 
I'm wondering why sexual orientation is still the main focus here, over a dozen pages and several "Move on" comments later...
Oh, such talk can go on for ages if you go about it right. Plus people finding out later than others.
While I disagree with the implication (that you cannot successfully write a character unless you are yourself their mirror), if it helps, I didn't attempt to write her to be an example of what a lesbian character should or should not be. I wrote her to be Sera, and she happens to be a lesbian. I tried to take the same approach with Aveline. I didn't write her to be a strong woman, I wrote her to be a strong character. That she was a woman was part of her character, but not what wholly defined her.
I whole heartedly approve of this approach. I'm all for not letting sexuality and gender define a person completely, women can write good men and men can write good women. The same goes for writing opposing sexualities.
Guest_Act of Velour_*
I whole heartedly approve of this approach. I'm all for not letting sexuality and gender define a person completely, women can write good men and men can write good women. The same goes for writing opposing sexualities.
If one goes by the logic of "Unless you're the mirror of the character, you can't properly write them", then you pretty much condemn every fantasy story ever made and every writer of them too. No one in Bioware's team was actually an N7 trooper, or a Grey Warden, or a Jedi Knight, so that'd make their writing of such characters very poor.
Going by that logic, that is.
Well most of them will leave you if they get to disliking you enough so if she truly disliked you I don't see how not joining due to dislike of humans is any different. Plus we already know she's anti "greater good". She would just fight the demons in some other way.
If past Bioware games are any indication, characters will leave you because the player actively picks confrontations and opposes basic cornerstone principles of the companion- not mere dislike, but an outright loss of faith in the PC's direction in the face of the ongoing crisis.
In DAO, you had to outright try to lose most of the companions, the most eggregious being the virtually pointless desecration of the Urn of Sacred Ashes. In DA2, it pretty much came down to picking the wrong side of a crisis issue and not having won their faith in you.
I whole heartedly approve of this approach. I'm all for not letting sexuality and gender define a person completely, women can write good men and men can write good women. The same goes for writing opposing sexualities.
Agreed.
While I disagree with the implication (that you cannot successfully write a character unless you are yourself their mirror), if it helps, I didn't attempt to write her to be an example of what a lesbian character should or should not be. I wrote her to be Sera, and she happens to be a lesbian. I tried to take the same approach with Aveline. I didn't write her to be a strong woman, I wrote her to be a strong character. That she was a woman was part of her character, but not what wholly defined her.
Like Aveline, Sera has her flaws. I expect some will like her, and some will hate her, and that's expected. Hopefully because of her opinions/actions and not due to an expectation of what she should or should not represent. But I can't control that, so we'll see how it goes. I've had my hits and misses before. Fun every time.
For me that is good to hear. I was never sold on the idea that sexuality made oh so very great a difference to characters and we absolutely had to have it defined, so if we are going to have it defined I'm happy to hear there still won't be a song and dance about it.
I was a Grey Warden once, so I should obviously be part of the writing team at Dragon Age!
If one goes by the logic of "Unless you're the mirror of the character, you can't properly write them", then you pretty much condemn every fantasy story ever made and every writer of them too. No one in Bioware's team was actually an N7 trooper, or a Grey Warden, or a Jedi Knight, so that'd make their writing of such characters very poor.
Going by that logic, that is.
Precisely. There can be so many characters created in fictional works, the writer can't possibly identify his/herself in all of them.
Okay, what do you all think of a lesbian being written by a guy?
I find I'm doubtful.
I think it probably has similarities to someone from culture A trying to write a figure of culture B. There are things that mesh, and there are things that wouldn't, and it's not necessarily because of the culture gap itself.
As a confession, I've taken a hand at character outlining and planing in the past. I've tried a variety of different viewpoints and perspectives, in the name of trying to keep myself flexible. I wouldn't say I'm great at it, but it did help me learning some things.
Like, for example, that at the time I wrote my males and females almost indistinguishably. Not that I was writing men like women, or women like men: just that they both came off as characters where gender was irrelevant. It wasn't disrespectful, but it was absent.
Which surprised me, because even the characters of the same gender and orientation as myself came this way. I was, in a sense, 'failing' to write my own gender and orientation.
That is part of why, to me, I don't worry to much on the source as opposed to the product. Writing what you know is good, but only if you're good at that. But for a lot of characters of Dragon Age, there's little about them that anyone could credibly claim 'to know.' Too many differences, too many contextual and social changes. If you're into the whole privilage check-off thing, there are so many of those that simply don't match up. And it doesn't really matter.
Gaider wrote Morrigan's romance, as I recall. There is nothing about Gaider that suggests to me 'heterosexual tsundere witch with social and mother issues.' But it was interesting, and I can appreciate Morrigan even if I don't like her. Not because Gaider wrote what he knew- just because he wrote.
I've created and written gay and lesbian characters before so I have that Bioware can make Sera a very deep character since they have more experience writing than I do.
I'm gonna be the can opener of worms and say I was very disappointed in how the Traynor romance scene in ME3 was written (DISCLAIMER: I think Traynor was a nice character outside of that scene, although I'm going to side eye her obsession with a vibrating phallic object forever...). BUT, I'm aware that I could have had just as many problems with another writer. I really enjoy Lukas Kristjanson's earlier works, so I'm pretty sure I'll like Sera as a character too.
When it comes to tv shows or movies that revolve around lesbians and their issues, that's another story, but I think one character in a larger game can be very well written by someone who isn't using their own lived experience as fodder.
Okay, what do you all think of a lesbian being written by a guy?
I find I'm doubtful.
Good question. Hopefully she's well written... actually, as long as those 'i used to date a dude - have bad memories with dudes' and anything that has to do with dudes, i'm fine. I don't want another cliche trope that usually happens with lesbians.
Good question. Hopefully she's well written... actually, as long as those 'i used to date a dude - have bad memories with dudes' and anything that has to do with dudes, i'm fine. I don't want another cliche trope that usually happens with lesbians.
This is Bioware we're talking about,they always do gays and lesbians right in regards to making them fleshed out characters.
Good question. Hopefully she's well written... actually, as long as those 'i used to date a dude - have bad memories with dudes' and anything that has to do with dudes, i'm fine. I don't want another cliche trope that usually happens with lesbians.
This is Bioware we're talking about,they always do gays and lesbians right in regards to making them fleshed out characters.
This is Bioware we're talking about,they always do gays and lesbians right in regards to making them fleshed out characters.
I'm just worried about Sera being one of those 'cliche lesbians', that's all.... But i have faith, i loved Aveline anyway. 
I'm gonna be the can opener of worms and say I was very disappointed in how the Traynor romance scene in ME3 was written (DISCLAIMER: I think Traynor was a nice character outside of that scene, although I'm going to side eye her obsession with a vibrating phallic object forever...). BUT, I'm aware that I could have had just as many problems with another writer. I really enjoy Lukas Kristjanson's earlier works, so I'm pretty sure I'll like Sera as a character too.
I never noticed that before.
Will be stuck in my head forever
I'm just worried about Sera being one of those 'cliche lesbians', that's all.... But i have faith, i loved Aveline anyway.
I agree with you there,when creating my gay characters I always made it a point to not let their sexuality define them.Given what we already know of Sera I suspect her being a lesbian won't be the focal point to the character.
I'm just worried about Sera being one of those 'cliche lesbians', that's all.... But i have faith, i loved Aveline anyway.
Well to my knowledge the last lesbian character they did was Traynor and I thought she was pretty cool and nicely done.
Aveline was hands-down my favourite DA2 companion. She was the only one I truly wanted and she wasn't available. At least I got a kiss.
(DISCLAIMER: I think Traynor was a nice character outside of that scene, although I'm going to side eye her obsession with a vibrating phallic object forever...).
Nothin' wrong with a lady loving some sweet vibrations.
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