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Sera "The Artful Dodger" discussion thread - V2 (now with more V1)


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#5501
The Night Haunter

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Right, so you walk into the fade and there's a greater wisp there that can talk. What are you going to refer to the wisp as? He? She? You see, spirits don't have a gender. 

A polite Inquisitor would Inquisite: "Fair spirit, how shall I address thee?"

 

Lol.

 

But there is a difference between a spirit who appears to all intents and purposes human and a wisp. I am not going condemn Sera's character for this (minor) flaw however, as has been said it is entirely possible that Sera warms up to Cole in the end, or she ends up vindicated when Cole turns all demony, we don't know.



#5502
LobselVith8

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The interview specificially states that Sera dislikes Cole and refuses to speak to 'it'. That is hardly zero information.

 

Reposting:

[DA]: You mentioned that the player can choose not to have Cole join the Inquisition. Are the other followers going to have an opinion?

[PW]: Oh, Maker, yes. Vivienne thinks Cole should be safely banished, and Sera refuses to talk to "it" entirely.

 

That clearly demonstrates that, at least initially, Sera doesn't like Cole. Don't be so defensive, Sera isn't meant to be (or should be) an angel. She has flaws, she distrusts Cole (which may or may not be a flaw..... my opinion lean towards not trusting), but that is just a facet of her character. Lets accept it and move on.

 

Painting Vivienne and Sera's hesitancy to trust Cole as a character flaw is the issue of contention, especially given the recent 'bullying' label that's been given to the character. I don't think anyone here assumes that Sera is meant to be perfect.



#5503
Divine Justinia V

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Hell, Shale calls the Warden "it" and she never bullied the Warden

 

LOL exactly. Everyone looooves Shale though, so it's not bullying. FOH.


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#5504
AresKeith

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The interview specificially states that Sera dislikes Cole and refuses to speak to 'it'. That is hardly zero information.

 

Reposting:

[DA]: You mentioned that the player can choose not to have Cole join the Inquisition. Are the other followers going to have an opinion?

[PW]: Oh, Maker, yes. Vivienne thinks Cole should be safely banished, and Sera refuses to talk to "it" entirely.

 

That clearly demonstrates that, at least initially, Sera doesn't like Cole. Don't be so defensive, Sera isn't meant to be (or should be) an angel. She has flaws, she distrusts Cole (which may or may not be a flaw..... my opinion lean towards not trusting), but that is just a facet of her character. Lets accept it and move on.

 

She isn't being defensive, she's stating that no one can really pin Sera as being a bully since we only know one thing regarding her and Cole. And looking from Sera's POV, you can't really blame her for it


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#5505
The Night Haunter

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LOL exactly. Everyone looooves Shale though, so it's not bullying. FOH.

Shale means it offensively at first too, but she isn't that terribly invested in demeaning others, she just does it offhand. It is only a term of endearment later. Context is important, and judging by the interview Sera does indeed mean it to be an offensive remark. I have little doubt that Sera would warm up to Cole as the game progresses, Sera is supposedly concerned about 'people' (the poor, lower classes) and Cole, apparently, now likes helping people (instead of stabbing them) so in the long term I'd say their motives would be quite compatible.


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#5506
Divine Justinia V

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Shale means it offensively at first too, but she isn't that terribly invested in demeaning others

 

So we know Sera is invested in demeaning others? When did we learn this? When was it said that it was intentional to hurt him?

 

wait, Shale is purposely being offensive but she's still not a bully? Hm..


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#5507
The Night Haunter

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She isn't being defensive, she's stating that no one can really pin Sera as being a bully since we only know one thing regarding her and Cole. And looking from Sera's POV, you can't really blame her for it

Ahh, well I'm not saying Sera is a bully, I'm saying she is acting like a bully. The difference is semantics, but quite important. Sera no doubt also acts like a bully to her marks (the rich people she targets anyway), especially if she is a half-way robinhood type character. That doesn't make her a bully, it just means she occasionally acts like a bully, and maybe defaults to off-hand offensive remarks when uncomfortable or off-guard.



#5508
Eveangaline

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I just figure Sera is scared of him, and thinks talking to him or acknowledging him much might make it easier for his 'demonry' to possess her.



#5509
KainD

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So we know Sera is invested in demeaning others? When did we learn this? 

 

Omg, come on she said that word.. you know ''it'' *hisss*.


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#5510
jlb524

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I have little doubt that Sera would warm up to Cole as the game progresses, Sera is supposedly concerned about 'people' (the poor, lower classes) and Cole, apparently, now likes helping people (instead of stabbing them) so in the long term I'd say their motives would be quite compatible.

 

Their motives do match up pretty well.  It's interesting that there's some antagonism there.

 

Cole is a demon-y guy that has murdered people in the past.  People who were innocent and in a very vulnerable situation.  I'm not sure if Sera will know this, but then there's still the demon thing.  I think it would be naive of Sera to trust him outright.

 

I can't see a sane Inquisitor trusting Cole at first either.



#5511
The Night Haunter

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So we know Sera is invested in demeaning others? When did we learn this? When was it said that it was intentional to hurt him?

 

wait, Shale is purposely being offensive but she's still not a bully? Hm..

You're taking my words out of context... just like a democrat.... (j/k I'm liberal). I did indeed say Shale is a bully, but her motives are different from what I percieve Sera's motives to be. The difference is that we know the end of Shale's friendship plot line, we don't know the end(s) of Sera/Cole plot line, so it may start off with antagonism, and end with happy happies for all we know.



#5512
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I don't like bullies. If I see something that seems like it, such as referring to someone as 'it', I'll call it out. 

So am I bullying a cat if I say, "Aww, it's so cute."? Cuz you know, "it" is a horrible way to address someone or something apparently.


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#5513
Divine Justinia V

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we don't know the end(s) of Sera/Cole plot line

 

we don't know the beginning, either


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#5514
KainD

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we don't know the beginning, either

 

Sure we do. The party meets Cole, and Cole is like: ''Hello!'' And Sera is like: *humpf* ''I'm not talking to it..''


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#5515
jlb524

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You're taking my words out of context... just like a democrat.... (j/k I'm liberal). I did indeed say Shale is a bully, but her motives are different from what I percieve Sera's motives to be. The difference is that we know the end of Shale's friendship plot line, we don't know the end(s) of Sera/Cole plot line, so it may start off with antagonism, and end with happy happies for all we know.

 

Shale also looked down on the Warden (at first) as being a 'lesser' being.  An easily squished flesh bag.

 

Sera doesn't trust Cole...doesn't know what he is and is probably frightened by the whole idea of having a sneaky demon (who has killed in the past) around the camp late at night.    I don't see her thinking she's 'better' than him b/c of some reason.



#5516
WildOrchid

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So am I bullying a cat if I say, "Aww, it's so cute."? Cuz you know, "it" is a horrible way to address someone or something apparently.

 

'Cats aren't humans so it doesn't matter!'


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#5517
KainD

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'Cats aren't humans so it doesn't matter!'

 

Cole isn't human so it doesn't matter either. 


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#5518
Divine Justinia V

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Sure we do. The party meets Cole, and Cole is like: ''Hello!'' And Sera is like: *humpf* ''I'm not talking to it..''

 

LOL

 

'Cats aren't humans so it doesn't matter!'

 

Fortunately neither is Cole huehuehuhue


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#5519
The Night Haunter

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we don't know the beginning, either

While true we are still allowed to draw inferences from the information given and assume (based on Cole's new goody-two-shoes [such an odd phrase] stance according to the inverview) that Sera's antagonism isn't justified beyond Cole is a spirit inhabiting a corpse (maybe?). Like I said, I don't think this demeans Sera's character, it just shows that, for some reason we don't currently know, Sera really hates spirits/demons/maybe-even-mages.



#5520
The Night Haunter

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'Cats aren't humans so it doesn't matter!'

Take that back you monster!!!!!!


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#5521
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Ahh, well I'm not saying Sera is a bully, I'm saying she is acting like a bully. The difference is semantics, but quite important. Sera no doubt also acts like a bully to her marks (the rich people she targets anyway), especially if she is a half-way robinhood type character. That doesn't make her a bully, it just means she occasionally acts like a bully, and maybe defaults to off-hand offensive remarks when uncomfortable or off-guard.



I guess that makes Leliana a bully. You could say many of the characters are bullies. What makes Sera more controversial than any other character?
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#5522
HiroVoid

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While true we are still allowed to draw inferences from the information given and assume (based on Cole's new goody-two-shoes [such an odd phrase] stance according to the inverview) that Sera's antagonism isn't justified beyond Cole is a spirit inhabiting a corpse (maybe?). Like I said, I don't think this demeans Sera's character, it just shows that, for some reason we don't currently know, Sera really hates spirits/demons/maybe-even-mages.

So aside from maybe the mages, she's like 99% of Thedas.


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#5523
Divine Justinia V

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While true we are still allowed to draw inferences from the information given and assume (based on Cole's new goody-two-shoes [such an odd phrase] stance according to the inverview) that Sera's antagonism isn't justified beyond Cole is a spirit inhabiting a corpse (maybe?). Like I said, I don't think this demeans Sera's character, it just shows that, for some reason we don't currently know, Sera really hates spirits/demons/maybe-even-mages.

 

I think it's maybe a bit extreme to assume Mages just yet, considering we haven't heard anything about her and the other Mage companions.

 

I don't see calling him "it" is bullying, no one knows what he is. It's more than likely fear/ignorance, which is pretty justifiable if you've read his actions in Asunder. As I've said, I'm a big Cole fan, but I'm not afraid to call a spade a spade. He/it (see w I did there) obviously has major issues. Anyone has good reason to be afraid of.

 

but get this 'bullying' mess up out of here, it's nonsense. (of course I mean that in a loving way and obviously everyone is welcomed to their own opinions)


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#5524
XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX

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Meh...i don't really care if Sera dislikes an unnecessary companion like Cole whose only in Inquisition thanks to him being a book character.

#5525
The Night Haunter

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I guess that makes Leliana a bully. You could say many of the characters are bullies. What makes Sera more controversial than any other character?

The confusion here lies in your assumption that I am saying she is more controversial or otherwise worse than other characters. She is not. There are meaner characters that are still 'goodish' guys. I am simply pointing out a character flaw. Character flaws are what make great characters however, so it is neither intended to be bad, nor an indication that I will not use her. I am simply drawing inferences from the knowledge we have to gain a better understanding of her character. Which I still like.