100543 réponses à ce sujet

[WildOrchid]

I prefer as few companions as possible, but I'm radical like that.

 

Agreed, less companions, more content (friendship, romance, etc). I was fine with ME1 squadmates....

But as i said, i'm hoping ME:Next will have enough romances for us gay ppl.

 

I personally think that the Sera romance is the most well-done romance in DAI. It starts very slowly and if you ask too soon she will tell you to wait, get to know each other better. She will actually consider who you are and if she can get along with it. If she notices (with a Dalish at least) that her belief system does not match yours she will bring it up as an issue and even break up if she feels she cannot handle your opinions. She is one character who can comment on others and even acknowledges other romances the character might have. If you try to date her even though you are in a relationship, you will net disapproval. etc. etc. Just these little things make it all much more realistic and fleshed out. 

I know that the Solas and Cullen romance (for example) suffered game external reasons like budget and time. And Bull obviously is not meant to have as much emotional depth as Sera. But still, her romance just seems designed, developed, and implemented much better than others.

 

Wow, great post... I'm going to romance Cass with my male elf rn (damn doe I made him gooooood looking)

I thought Cullen had enough romance content... but i also heard from some Solasmancers that Solas romance feels kind of... short? Like not enough romance scenes?

[The Loyal Nub]

Agreed, less companions, more content (friendship, romance, etc). I was fine with ME1 squadmates....

But as i said, i'm hoping ME:Next will have enough romances for us gay ppl.

 

 

 

I disagree on the number of companions but agree on the content for each. I think more companions will be necessary to adequately represent all groups. There need to be several straight li's and several gay options. I think where they run into trouble is when there are few romance options and then someone somewhere feels left out because they hate the sole gay or straight option. So I think there need to be at least 3 or 4 for each so then if someone does just hate all of them then they are just too hard to please.

[God is Tigger]

Heh.  I'm trying to read alllll the pages but I'm only up to 1900, and that's only halfway (for now).  Do I continue on my trek or do I just say screw it and start from current?

[Serza]

Heh.  I'm trying to read alllll the pages but I'm only up to 1900, and that's only halfway (for now).  Do I continue on my trek or do I just say screw it and start from current?

 

We went OT in the later pages. A LOT. I suggest you find my OP for v2.0 and start reading from there. It should be maybe thirty pages back. I'll try to find it.

 

Edit: 3765, there's a post from me that might resemble an initial post of a thread. That's the merging point between the old, and the new. Should be on-topic from then on.

[AresKeith]

I disagree on the number of companions but agree on the content for each. I think more companions will be necessary to adequately represent all groups. There need to be several straight li's and several gay options. I think where they run into trouble is when there are few romance options and then someone somewhere feels left out because they hate the sole gay or straight option. So I think there need to be at least 3 or 4 for each so then if someone does just hate all of them then they are just too hard to please.

 

I think the original setup of 2/2/2 is fine

[jlb524]

I personally think that the Sera romance is the most well-done romance in DAI. It starts very slowly and if you ask too soon she will tell you to wait, get to know each other better. She will actually consider who you are and if she can get along with it. If she notices (with a Dalish at least) that her belief system does not match yours she will bring it up as an issue and even break up if she feels she cannot handle your opinions. She is one character who can comment on others and even acknowledges other romances the character might have. If you try to date her even though you are in a relationship, you will net disapproval. etc. etc. Just these little things make it all much more realistic and fleshed out. 

I know that the Solas and Cullen romance (for example) suffered game external reasons like budget and time. And Bull obviously is not meant to have as much emotional depth as Sera. But still, her romance just seems designed, developed, and implemented much better than others.

 

Well, I think it's the best (but I'm biased and have only seen Josephine/Cassandra's xd).

 

There are a lot of little things that make it stand out for me.  Sera's journal entries being one of them.   The whole nickname thing was a great idea.  It's a clever way to avoid the whole issue of the Quizz's romantic partner calling her "Inquisitor" or "Herald" or whatever during romance scenes.  Like, seriously, Leliana kept calling my Warden "The Hero of Ferelden" when talking about her in dialog and it just sounded strange lol.

 

Plus, Sera has the best kiss animation of all of them.   

[veeia]

Oh god, say screw it. I love this thread but it is so not worth it, lmao.

As for companions....I think 9 would have been fine, had they been able to give them all fairly equal treatment and I'm unclear whether the uneven treatment was a resource thing or just how they wanted to approach it. I think I may be on the minority in that I don't really like the optionality of most characters...I'd prefer mandatory over not if it meant their narratives were developed better and integrated into the storyline. Assuming that would be the case, that is.

[Siha]

Wow, great post... I'm going to romance Cass with my male elf rn (damn doe I made him gooooood looking)

I thought Cullen had enough romance content... but i also heard from some Solasmancers that Solas romance feels kind of... short? Like not enough romance scenes?

 

I will watch the Cass romance on YouTube (cannot make myself play a male). I did not watch it entirely yet.

 

This is actually not quite right. The Solas romance is the longest male romance (based on the length of the youtube videos). It runs about 65 mins in total. Cullen only gets around 40-45 mins. I think the problem is that the Solas romance feels incomplete and rushed. I personally have many issues with it (spoilered for off-topic).

Spoiler

First, you cannot discuss your decisions with him, thus never explain yourself. You will net disapproval but this is unrealistic to me because people usually talk about their issues and solve them on a basis of mutual respect. Like Sera.

However, and second, once you committed (balcony kiss), he will not break up with you (until the trigger point), no matter what you do. You can be awful to him, e.g. I deliberately killed his demon friend and told him so, I still got the balcony kiss (though others say this was not possible; maybe a bug?). After it, I allied with the Wardens, drank from the well, made all judgements to gain disapproval with him, etc.etc. I really tried hard to annoy him. But he stayed with me. After the well scene he started out all angry and then fell back to the "I want to show you how much you mean to me" scene in an instant. In short, they did not polish it all enough to make it believable for me. Transitions an a few more dialogues would be needed.

Third, and on the same note, the scene when he breaks up is a total disaster in my eyes. He starts to tell you how much you mean to him, removes your vallaslin (or not), tells you how beautiful you are, kisses you... and breaks up. Just like that. It all happens so quickly, it seems just alien to me. Others claim to see the moment when he changes his mind, but I fail to see both the hesitation and the eye movement.

 

In general I don't like about his romance how weak and naive Lavellan is depicted. To get Solas to like you, you must ask questions but never question him. He hardly really accepts your opinion or even reconsiders (still speaks of your wisdom on the balcony). If you start out a proud Dalish who dislikes blood magic and tells Solas to help instead of just judge, he will even refuse to speak about his personal background with you. That is realistic, but closed-minded. It just... well, being me, I did not like being the little girl who adores the wise man.  

[veeia]

The Solasmance definitely has the least content. There are 3 cutscenes and only 1 is romance exclusive (the others just have a bit of romance but are mostly the same) and it is where he dumps you. There is no repeating kiss or anything. Besides the ball (so I guess 4 cutscene), there is no content from the start of the relationship to the end so it's just a huge middle stretch of blah. I mean you can make it long if you include every Solas scene since he's in so much, but for romance exclusive content, it's bare bones.

[WildOrchid]

I will watch the Cass romance on YouTube (cannot make myself play a male). I did not watch it entirely yet.

 

This is actually not quite right. The Solas romance is the longest male romance (based on the length of the youtube videos). It runs about 65 mins in total. Cullen only gets around 40-45 mins. I think the problem is that the Solas romance feels incomplete and rushed. I personally have many issues with it (spoilered for off-topic).

Spoiler

First, you cannot discuss your decisions with him, thus never explain yourself. You will net disapproval but this is unrealistic to me because people usually talk about their issues and solve them on a basis of mutual respect. Like Sera.

However, and second, once you committed (balcony kiss), he will not break up with you (until the trigger point), no matter what you do. You can be awful to him, e.g. I deliberately killed his demon friend and told him so, I still got the balcony kiss (though others say this was not possible; maybe a bug?). After it, I allied with the Wardens, drank from the well, made all judgements to gain disapproval with him, etc.etc. I really tried hard to annoy him. But he stayed with me. After the well scene he started out all angry and then fell back to the "I want to show you how much you mean to me" scene in an instant. In short, they did not polish it all enough to make it believable for me. Transitions an a few more dialogues would be needed.

Third, and on the same note, the scene when he breaks up is a total disaster in my eyes. He starts to tell you how much you mean to him, removes your vallaslin (or not), tells you how beautiful you are, kisses you... and breaks up. Just like that. It all happens so quickly, it seems just alien to me. Others claim to see the moment when he changes his mind, but I fail to see both the hesitation and the eye movement.

 

In general I don't like about his romance how weak and naive Lavellan is depicted. To get Solas to like you, you must ask questions but never question him. He hardly really accepts your opinion or even reconsiders (still speaks of your wisdom on the balcony). If you start out a proud Dalish who dislikes blood magic and tells Solas to help instead of just judge, he will even refuse to speak about his personal background with you. That is realistic, but closed-minded. It just... well, being me, I did not like being the little girl who adores the wise man.

 

Jaysus.... yet Sera gets a lot of flack for her break up scene.... Smfh. 

[Siha]

I disagree on the number of companions but agree on the content for each. I think more companions will be necessary to adequately represent all groups. There need to be several straight li's and several gay options.

 

I personally never had a problem with the player-sexual characters of DA2. In the end, I play for me alone and not with millions of other users in mind. I'd prefer a few very well made, fleshed-out characters with an actual personality, who are available to everybody, over a house full of companions who are on one personality level with a cucumber. I do see how it is more realistic to have straight-only/gay-only/bi LIs but I fear this will only lead to more shallow companions and simpler romance content in the future. Just when I think of how interlaced Alistair's romance was with the environment and story, and how it would play out differently based on your actions, decisions, and chosen background, and then compare this to the straight-lined Cullen... that's just sad.

 

Heh.  I'm trying to read alllll the pages but I'm only up to 1900, and that's only halfway (for now).  Do I continue on my trek or do I just say screw it and start from current?

 

It is obligatory in this thread to read all previous posts and comment at least on one every 5 pages before being allowed to contribute to more recent topics or even raise own questions. 

[veeia]

Also I agree with your assessment of the relationship. It took me a long time to figure out how to play it because I was so put off by the passive/admiring Lavellan to Solas's mentor/ego stroke dynamic. I don't think it has to be read that way by everyone who plays it and I know a lot of people adore it, but it was really hard for me not to see that.

(I ended up playing an ******* character who punched him and then romanced him...felt like they were on more equal footing if she was an ass too. and it just let her be more active and call him out wtc)

[Serza]

 

It is obligatory in this thread to read all previous posts and comment at least on one every 5 pages before being allowed to contribute to more recent topics or even raise own questions. 

 

Huh...? Never heard of that one. Unless you're joking, in which case, woo, nice one.

[Basement Cat]

Jaysus.... yet Sera gets a lot of flack for her break up scene.... Smfh. 

That's because Solas is a God while Sera is a mere mortal. Or is she? *dramatic music*

 

Seriously though. I think the above point is part of it, but Solas demonstrates from the get go that he knows better than everyone else how to handle the Breach and the Mark, while Sera is very candid about her lack of general culture and education.

 

Also, Solas is less in-your-face when he disagrees. He just frowns and shuts up. Sera gets loud.

 

That probably explains some of the outraged reactions to Sera.

[Siha]

The Solasmance definitely has the least content. There are 3 cutscenes and only 1 is romance exclusive (the others just have a bit of romance but are mostly the same) and it is where he dumps you. There is no repeating kiss or anything. Besides the ball (so I guess 4 cutscene), there is no content from the start of the relationship to the end so it's just a huge middle stretch of blah. I mean you can make it long if you include every Solas scene since he's in so much, but for romance exclusive content, it's bare bones.

 

But his last cutscene is twice as long as a normal one, thus accounting for two. And he has all his Fade stories, comments more often in quests (if you take him along), and has a few more static dialogue options. I don't distinguish between content though, for me all character-related content is okay.

I personally assume that the last scene was meant to be two, which also would have allowed for a better transition and more realistic flow. But that's just a gut feeling.

There is no repeating kiss, yes, but that's just like half a minute (and I think it was a deliberate decision, like the lack of a sex scene, so players would not feel too used after the breakup.)

And I don't think Cullen has more than one romance-exclusive scene (apart from the kiss)? I am not sure regarding the others.

[Siha]

(I ended up playing an ******* character who punched him and then romanced him...felt like they were on more equal footing if she was an ass too. and it just let her be more active and call him out wtc)

 

This is possible? You can get him to minimum approval and actually raise it again, enough to start a romance? And so late in? Wow, I have to do that. Any tips?

 

Huh...? Never heard of that one. Unless you're joking, in which case, woo, nice one.

 

Hahaha... of course I'm joking.

 

Also, Solas is less in-your-face when he disagrees. He just frowns and shuts up. Sera gets loud.

 

That probably explains some of the outraged reactions to Sera.

 

That probably also explains why I like her so much. I'm more for the honest and straightforward type where I know exactly that I can trust her instead of always having to wonder what she actually thinks of me.

[AresKeith]

I personally never had a problem with the player-sexual characters of DA2. In the end, I play for me alone and not with millions of other users in mind. I'd prefer a few very well made, fleshed-out characters with an actual personality, who are available to everybody, over a house full of companions who are on one personality level with a cucumber. I do see how it is more realistic to have straight-only/gay-only/bi LIs but I fear this will only lead to more shallow companions and simpler romance content in the future. Just when I think of how interlaced Alistair's romance was with the environment and story, and how it would play out differently based on your actions, decisions, and chosen background, and then compare this to the straight-lined Cullen... that's just sad.

 

That isn't really tied with characters having a sexuality though

[The Loyal Nub]

I personally never had a problem with the player-sexual characters of DA2. In the end, I play for me alone and not with millions of other users in mind. I'd prefer a few very well made, fleshed-out characters with an actual personality, who are available to everybody, over a house full of companions who are on one personality level with a cucumber. I do see how it is more realistic to have straight-only/gay-only/bi LIs but I fear this will only lead to more shallow companions and simpler romance content in the future. Just when I think of how interlaced Alistair's romance was with the environment and story, and how it would play out differently based on your actions, decisions, and chosen background, and then compare this to the straight-lined Cullen... that's just sad.

 

 

 

I was speaking more to that fact that some were unhappy with Sera as the only purely gay female option in the game (note the word purely so you do not bring up Josie) and how she was handled for example. You offer 2 or three for each option you might please more players. You're bringing up a separate but linked issue of how deftly the content for each option would then be? I can't speak to that except to say I would hope they'd be able to make each option more viable than a "cucumber" in terms of content and personality. 

[veeia]

Cullen has a lot of content besides the first kiss: the sex scene and the scene where he takes you to see his family home are both romance exclusive. He also hugs you before and after you defeat Corypheus. The thing that makes Sera's so good is not just the big cutscenes, but the little bits because they add up to form a meaningful relationship. Solas doesn't have a lot of those IMO. Like pretty much every companion LI has special content at Mythal or after the Fade, he doesn't. He has a ton of content as a character in the story, but not a lot about the relationship between the two, which makes his final scene seem, to me, very clunky.

[Siha]

That isn't really tied with characters having a sexuality though

 

No. It is tied to my next sentence there. I fear that more characters = more development time = more expensive, thus leading to less content per character in order to keep to the usual budget. 1 straight + 1 gay + 1 bi = 3 characters (= 3 romances) for only one "type" of romance (e.g., a smooth-and-easy romance like Cullen's). If the same character was gender-neutral, that romance could get more cutscenes and dialogue instead. Or either one or even two more romances could be developed for the same money.

[The Loyal Nub]

No. It is tied to my next sentence there. I fear that more characters = more development time = more expensive, thus leading to less content per character in order to keep to the usual budget. 1 straight + 1 gay + 1 bi = 3 characters (= 3 romances) for only one "type" of romance (e.g., a smooth-and-easy romance like Cullen's). If the same character was gender-neutral, that romance could get more cutscenes and dialogue instead. Or either one or even two more romances could be developed for the same money.

 

I would hope we're at a point were they could offer more than that and I am willing to wait just a bit more to give them time to do it. The old formula just doesn't feel like enough anymore and I would think I am not alone in feeling that way?

[veeia]

Oh yes! My tips really quickly, then I'll shush about Solas unless anyone wants to talk about him wrt to Sera:

Spoiler

Get his disapproval scene when you hit Skyhold. To do this, either side Templars or conscript Mages. Don't ask him a lot of questions, think his spirit stuff is dangerous, and don't do any of the quests that he gives approval for. I selected "for my own power" at Skyhold because he also greatly disapproves of that, but it might have been overkill, just don't get any big approvals. . Then when I went to recruit Cole I said I wouldn't, then I did, which cancelled out the approval gain.

Then I did the quests that gave him approval and banished the Wardens. As soon as I triggered his romance I went back to not choosing options he liked, lmao, if they fit the character. Essentially what I ended up with was a rivalmance where they disliked eachother too much at first to get to know eachother, bonded and realized they were being unfair, but then it unravelled anyway. I do recommend it, as it colors the relationship completely differently. Like when Solas says he's surprised by you and that maybe he's judged the Dalish too harshly, it comes across as less special snowflake validation and more earned, IMO, since he had previously judged you and used that to dismiss the Dalish.

I meta gamed it a TON because approval is tricky and also because I wanted Solas's respect coming back to feel tied to in character actions from my character. Worth it though.

[Siha]

Cullen has a lot of content besides the first kiss: the sex scene and the scene where he takes you to see his family home are both romance exclusive. He also hugs you before and after you defeat Corypheus. The thing that makes Sera's so good is not just the big cutscenes, but the little bits because they add up to form a meaningful relationship. Solas doesn't have a lot of those IMO. Like pretty much every companion LI has special content at Mythal or after the Fade, he doesn't. He has a ton of content as a character in the story, but not a lot about the relationship between the two, which makes his final scene seem, to me, very clunky.

 

Yes, if you address the issue of more "wide-spread" romance content, that is true. I simply judged based on overall screen time and personal contribution of Solas.

And it does lead to his final scene being clunky, I agree with that too. But to be really realistic, the breakup would need to happen more slowly, maybe after some hesitation and change in his behavior? Maybe the players would not be too happy about that either, because they would have to experience even more heartbreak? I'm not so sure actually.

[AresKeith]

No. It is tied to my next sentence there. I fear that more characters = more development time = more expensive, thus leading to less content per character in order to keep to the usual budget. 1 straight + 1 gay + 1 bi = 3 characters (= 3 romances) for only one "type" of romance (e.g., a smooth-and-easy romance like Cullen's). If the same character was gender-neutral, that romance could get more cutscenes and dialogue instead. Or either one or even two more romances could be developed for the same money.

 

I can see Bioware doing 3 romances ( 1 straight, 1 gay, 1 bi)

 

I was speaking more to that fact that some were unhappy with Sera as the only purely gay female option in the game (note the word purely so you do not bring up Josie) and how she was handled for example. You offer 2 or three for each option you might please more players. You're bringing up a separate but linked issue of how deftly the content for each option would then be? I can't speak to that except to say I would hope they'd be able to make each option more viable than a "cucumber" in terms of content and personality. 

 

I'd argue it's Bioware trying to please every is what leading them to having somewhat shallow content

[Heidirs]

I disagree on the number of companions but agree on the content for each. 

 

I loved all the companions in this game. I'd be really heartbroken to lose any of them. That said, more content is always good... and think Vivienne is one of those characters who could do with more fleshing out.