100542 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

Perhaps there is another option. Perhaps there is an option that takes Elves forward and not backwards. Perhaps a way out of what Solas and the Dalish represent.

 

I could almost see Solas as Lenin. He's freed the slaves/peasants/workers and smashed the state only his genius lay solely in doing only that. Perhaps it is up to another to show the Elves their proper way forward?

 

Just tossing that out there for you to chew on. Nibble a bit. Savor it. Digest it possibly.

No, the Dalish are an important part of the way forward. It's not in the interests of the elves to just subsume their culture under Andrastianism.

[The Loyal Nub]

No, the Dalish are an important part of the way forward. It's not in the interests of the elves to just subsume their culture under Andrastianism.

 

You're assuming that. I am not. I see the Dalish as Sera does: cultural hicks living in a cultural dead-end.

[Xilizhra]

You're assuming that. I am not. I see the Dalish as Sera does: cultural hicks living in a cultural dead-end.

So, you support the elimination of Dalish culture?

[FemHawke FTW]

Four more pages until the big 4K everybody!

[Iakus]

You're assuming that. I am not. I see the Dalish as Sera does: cultural hicks living in a cultural dead-end.

I don't think Sera seems them as hicks.  She sees them as, well, "elfy"

 

She neither understands nor cares about Dalish culture, and doesn't want to.  And Dalish look down on her for that, for being a "flat-ear"  lilke she isn't a real person for living her own life.  And she doesn't respond well to that.  It makes them too much like the human nobles she likes punishing.

[YourFunnyUncle]

I don't think Sera seems them as hicks.  She sees them as, well, "elfy"

 

She neither understands nor cares about Dalish culture, and doesn't want to.  And Dalish look down on her for that, for being a "flat-ear"  lilke she isn't a real person for living her own life.  And she doesn't respond well to that.  It makes them too much like the human nobles she likes punishing.

She makes a show of not caring about Dalish culture, and yet...

 

 

(Yes I asked her when playing as an Elf. I wanted to see what she said. Reloaded afterwards.)

[Xilizhra]

Mother of ****, why is Sera's background so obscured?

[Rel Fexive]

So how much genocide is acceptable in the name of elvish - sorry, Dalish only - freedom? Mostly genocide? Just slightly? Only a bit genocide-y? How many have to die just so the Dalish can get their wonderful past back - even though they are utterly clueless about the truth of that past. How much death is enough to buy "freedom" at everyone else's expense?

Better if everyone just finds a way to get along and be better to each other than just go blindly with the crazy death plan, yeah?

[Xilizhra]

So how much genocide is acceptable in the name of elvish - sorry, Dalish only - freedom? Mostly genocide? Just slightly? Only a bit genocide-y? How many have to die just so the Dalish can get their wonderful past back - even though they are utterly clueless about the truth of that past. How much death is enough to buy "freedom" at everyone else's expense?

Better if everyone just finds a way to get along and be better to each other than just go blindly with the crazy death plan, yeah?

The number of acceptable deaths is the number of those who would continue to oppress the elves.

 

Of course, I'm all for plans that aren't crazy or deathy, and if the Inquisitor's ability to say they'll find a better way means anything at all, I believe we'll find some.

[FemHawke FTW]

Scrolling through some of the earlier pages and found this delightful fanart, so cute and funny how could I not repost right?

[The Loyal Nub]

So, you support the elimination of Dalish culture?

 

That's your word. I'd probably choose "evolution."

 

So you support the stagnation of Elvish culture? See? We can play it that way if you want.

[Xilizhra]

That's your word. I'd probably choose "evolution."

 

So you support the stagnation of Elvish culture? See? We can play it that way if you want.

Happily, I support the evolution of elven culture as well. Which necessitates that it not be utterly devoured by human culture.

 

Anyway, regarding Sera, this is my headcanon for her, because it's the only way she makes sense to me: Sera briefly joined a Dalish clan at some point in the past, and things went very badly wrong. Like, they were all psycho fundamentalists, or they slaughtered a human village for no real reason, or she was raped by the Keeper, or something. And she had a Dalish girlfriend from said clan, who dumped her for not going along with everything because it made her insufficiently elfy.

[Rel Fexive]

Pretty sure no one here is suggesting any culture gets eliminated by any other culture, whether by devouring or by pesky, pesky genocide.  "Getting along" means finding ways to coexist peacefully - oppressing any culture in any way is contrary to this goal, whoever is doing the oppressing.

 

Sadly, though, I fear the Dalish need a bit of a kick in the arse and hefty dose of reality to wake them up to the, well, fantastical bollocks they've made up about their past and thus developed into their current culture.  Most of it has turned out to be built on badly remembered tatters of a bygone age that was actually very different to how they now imagine it was.  Just bad luck, really.  They need to find their own truth rather than clinging to something they never had, not as they think it was anyway.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

There are non Dalish Elves that are familiar with the Creators, such as those in the Hinterlands. She could have learned about the elven gods from them.

[Xilizhra]

Pretty sure no one here is suggesting any culture gets eliminated by any other culture, whether by devouring or by pesky, pesky genocide.  "Getting along" means finding ways to coexist peacefully - oppressing any culture in any way is contrary to this goal, whoever is doing the oppressing.

 

Sadly, though, I fear the Dalish need a bit of a kick in the arse and hefty dose of reality to wake them up to the, well, fantastical bollocks they've made up about their past and thus developed into their current culture.  Most of it has turned out to be built on badly remembered tatters of a bygone age that was actually very different to how they now imagine it was.  Just bad luck, really.  They need to find their own truth rather than clinging to something they never had, not as they think it was anyway.

Everyone needs kicking, but the Dalish need it rather less than, say, the Orlesians. Historical misconceptions matter much less than modern atrocities.

 

 

There are non Dalish Elves that are familiar with the Creators, such as those in the Hinterlands. She could have learned about the elven gods from them.

Nah. It doesn't explain the fact that Sera is more neurotic about "elfiness" than Fenris is about mages.

[YourFunnyUncle]

There are non Dalish Elves that are familiar with the Creators, such as those in the Hinterlands. She could have learned about the elven gods from them.

My point wasn't about where she learned the names, but that she bothered at all. I think her loud disdain is in large part a defence mechanism. She was clearly hurt by Dalish Elves (and maybe even some from the city) before so to stop it happening again she pushes anyone who is too "Elfy" away by any means necessary. To show anything other than contempt would undermine that strategy, but perhaps it's less about hating the culture and more about hating rejection.

[Xilizhra]

My point wasn't about where she learned the names, but that she bothered at all. I think her loud disdain is in large part a defence mechanism. She was clearly hurt by Dalish Elves (and maybe even some from the city) before so to stop it happening again she pushes anyone who is too "Elfy" away by any means necessary. To show anything other than contempt would undermine that strategy, but perhaps it's less about hating the culture and more about hating rejection.

And it truly maddens me to have these very pivotal parts of her backstory and character go completely undiscussed. It reaches the point where the only way I can make narratively satisfying sense out of her at all is to headcanon entirely new conversations with her... or just decide that she's a purely racist ******, and I'd prefer not to do that.

[Rel Fexive]

Is it just me or are (some clans of) the Dalish at times xenophobic and murderous towards outsiders in the present day?  I'm not imagining that, am I?  It's not like they are all sweetness and light and never hurt anyone ever, as far as I can remember.  Pretty sure the endemic racism is on both sides... which suggests that everyone needs to have serious words with themselves about that.

[Xilizhra]

Is it just me or are (some clans of) the Dalish at times xenophobic and murderous towards outsiders in the present day?  I'm not imagining that, am I?  It's not like they are all sweetness and light and never hurt anyone ever, as far as I can remember.  Pretty sure the endemic racism is on both sides... which suggests that everyone needs to have serious words with themselves about that.

Of the ones we've seen, one is mildly xenophobic, one is slightly xenophobic, and one just isn't xenophobic at all. I guess the clan from TME was moreso?

[YourFunnyUncle]

Is it just me or are (some clans of) the Dalish at times xenophobic and murderous towards outsiders in the present day?  I'm not imagining that, am I?  It's not like they are all sweetness and light and never hurt anyone ever, as far as I can remember.  Pretty sure the endemic racism is on both sides... which suggests that everyone needs to have serious words with themselves about that.

There are clearly better and worse clans and individuals among the Dalish, just as there are more and less tolerant people among the humans, and despite efforts from the more enlightened on either side,  lingering resentments abide for decades and even centuries. It's just like certain conflicts in the real world that I could mention...

[Cyberstrike nTo]

 

Video I make of Sera just well saying things 

 

Honestly, in my 1st play-through I though she was crazy and weird. Then in my 2nd play-through I was evil and we did not get along at all. Then in my 3rd play-through I had her as a regular in my party and really got to know her and my opinion complete changed of her. She is awesome. Sera + Solas + Iron Bull is a great party combo for banter.  

 

Her banter with Dorian is really funny. Her comment about Dorian and Iron Bull becoming a couple is really funny. 

[FemHawke FTW]

Her banter with Dorian is really funny. Her comment about Dorian and Iron Bull becoming a couple is really funny.

I love her banter so much! She's always such a fun breath of fresh air to have around isn't she?

[Iakus]

My point wasn't about where she learned the names, but that she bothered at all. I think her loud disdain is in large part a defence mechanism. She was clearly hurt by Dalish Elves (and maybe even some from the city) before so to stop it happening again she pushes anyone who is too "Elfy" away by any means necessary. To show anything other than contempt would undermine that strategy, but perhaps it's less about hating the culture and more about hating rejection.

I think it's an extension of her anarchic temperament and disdain for nobles, or anyone else who puts on airs.  She wants people to just be people.  TO her, being human or elf doesn't matter.  Nor does being poor or wealthy, titled, or mage-born.  It's why she reacts with disgust towards anyone who puts themselves above others (like Vivienne).  Even the Jennies aren't an organization, really.  They're just a bunch of "friends" who do each other favors.

 

The Dalish are all about putting on airs, though.  They are "the last of the elvhen" and she isn't a "real elf" to them.  And being a "real elf" is all-important to them.  They think they're better than she is because they worship different gods and wear vallalsin.  And that, to Sera's mind, makes them no better than human nobles.

[Xilizhra]

I think it's an extension of her anarchic temperament and disdain for nobles, or anyone else who puts on airs.  She wants people to just be people.  TO her, being human or elf doesn't matter.  Nor does being poor or wealthy, titled, or mage-born.  It's why she reacts with disgust towards anyone who puts themselves above others (like Vivienne).  Even the Jennies aren't an organization, really.  They're just a bunch of "friends" who do each other favors.

 

The Dalish are all about putting on airs, though.  They are "the last of the elvhen" and she isn't a "real elf" to them.  And being a "real elf" is all-important to them.  They think they're better than she is because they worship different gods and wear vallalsin.  And that, to Sera's mind, makes them no better than human nobles.

With Sera, a two-steps-removed extension doesn't seem plausible at all. Her grudge simply doesn't make sense to me unless it's personal, especially since one isn't even likely to meet any Dalish in alleyways.

[Witch Cocktor]

I love Sera, but few small details ****** me offfffff

 

1) when in Haven you talk to her about not being like other elves, you have no options to agree with her that elven history, traditions is whatever. You only get options to defend it. It's meh.

2) when you get back from her mission where she destroys that noble ****, she is confused why I'm approving of her actions. And my options to that are either flirt, say I need allies or... '' I WANNA BE YOUR FRIEND! '' ??? NOBODY EVER past the age of 9 asks if we could be friends?! That dialogue really annoys me because it's so frikken cheesy, you'd think Sera would disapprove of such sappiness. Why couldn't the option be like '' I enjoy your company and I like to think of you as my friend, that's why I approve of your actions. '' or something. BUT NOT '' can we b frendz???? '' like damn, I'm the goddamn inquisitor, this is just stupid.

 

Learn from this BW.