946 réponses à ce sujet

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Yes Mr Simpleton, because as a Biotic those Husks were dead before he had a chance to say "you remember how to use a gun don't you?".

 

You slapped their asses with a singularity, right?

[TheTurtle]

So it 'really annoys' you that you're given a weapon because you can take them out with biotics? That 'really annoys' you? Just making sure I'm clear on that. You're 'really annoyed' by that? That's something that 'really annoys' you?

You're not even trying anymore are you?

[Barquiel]

I meant that you're forced to recruit Mordin and Jack (and that you can't send them to TIM, Hackett, Anderson, etc.). And Liara's farewell in London does change for example. She doesn't even offer the gift if you're not close.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

So it 'really annoys' you that you're given a weapon because you can take them out with biotics? That 'really annoys' you? Just making sure I'm clear on that. You're 'really annoyed' by that? That's something that 'really annoys' you?

 

No, Bob, it's not that you're given a gun, it's that while you're cleaning house with your biotics Anderson is constantly badgering you on "take them out. Use your pistol and take them out. You remember how to use a gun, don't you?" That's what's annoying. Not the fact you were given a gun.

[Sir DeLoria]

Ok... miranda maybe if you needed to rescue her sister every other mission, or the number of arse shots had dropped below the required minimum, but the other two?
Don't be daft.

Feron is a long time agent with extensive espionage and infiltration experience. Kal'Reegar is a selfless, tough, incredibly brave marine NCO and veteran. Liara is a young Asari archeologist turned info broker with no CQC or weapons training. Hmm, who would fit best on a warship?

[DeinonSlayer]

I always thought Mordin was required as a squadmate. Isn't he needed to come up with a defense against the seeker swarms?

For one of my Shepards, Mordin never stepped foot outside the lab after being recruited and then died in the Suicide Mission (I wanted to see what happened when his loyalty mission was never finished and have a Padok Wiks playthrough, two birds with one stone). Freedom's Progress is really the only ME2 level with forced squadmate participation. All loyalty missions are optional.

Mordin has that one plot point going for him (seeker countermeasure). Given a choice in the matter, some of my Shepards would not have recruited Jack.

In my first ME3 playthrough, I remember I was starting to wonder if I'd ever get control over my squad selection. It's no wonder the usage stats are as lopsided as they are, given that the VS and Tali are only available for the last 1/3rd of the vanilla game.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

No you're not getting it. This particular Shepard was pro-Alliance. She never would have worked for Cerberus. She knew where her loyalties were. Why did she have to work for them in ME2. Why couldn't she just do that in ME2. It was no different a railroad than what you're talking about. In fact it was worse. You may disagree with me about Cerberus being a terrorist organization. I'm going by how this particular Shepard views them. You're bringing personal politics into this. I'm role playing this Shepard. This Shepard was plot railroaded.

 

So we've seen the limitations of this media, and no matter if you mentioned that I may have given a David argument, there are limitations to this media that are not present in a pen and paper type RPG or in an open world sandbox type RPG. There are going to be things that we don't like, and there aren't going to be any way of fixing them. We are at the mercy of the writers, and they're not going to try to please everyone because we know what happens when they do that. They end up pleasing no one. Writing by committee is a pain in the ass and you've got compromises all over the place especially with the size of writing team they had on this game. It's a mess.

 

This was a story we wanted to like. The characters made the story and caused us to overlook all of the flaws. Then someone decided that Liara was the canon LI for Shepard. Someone up high on the totem pole. You can do that in a book, but not in a RPG. Then the ending ruined the whole thing.

 

Wth are you even talking about now?

 

Yeah, I get exactly what you're saying. You didn't see what I was saying. What I'm saying is that despite the narrative railroading in ME2 and ME3, we still should have been able to define how our Shepard felt about such circumstances. In a counter to what you said, in an ideal universe, I'd have had my Shepard make it clear in ME3 that he wasn't going to take a jack from the alliance or Council and that he was in charge, and that the war was going to be fought his way. He'd have told Ashley to unfuck herself or meet his bullet, and make it clear to Liara that she wasn't welcome on the ship. He'd offer every alliance crewmember a choice of following his orders to the letter or being left on Mars. He'd order any non-essential war industries shut down, and all non-critical or unnecessary civilian assets (including the civilians themselves) to be liquidated to prevent their use by the Reapers.

 

And as you said, I can't do that, just as you can't take the Normandy over to the alliance in ME2. 

 

What I'm saying is that in ME2, you can be pro-alliance and anti-Cerberus, despite the narrative railroading of having to work with them. I can't do the same in ME3 with the alliance. I can't be pro-Cerberus and anti-alliance, despite the narrative railroading. I'm fine with the limitation in the story, but I'm not fine with the limitation of my agency over Shepard. And you're arguing against that. I think. I'm honestly not getting where or why you're arguing against me on this. Or why anyone would (except David).

[Animositisomina]

Technically Mordin is never in your squad. If we're talking ME3.

True, I guess he's not really a squadie. He's just sort of in the background doing his own thing.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Really? You can skip curing the genophage and still beat the game, eh?

 

Is Mordin a squadmate?

 

That said, technically, yes, I can skip curing the genophage and still beat the game.

 

It's called sabotaging the genophage! ***** brix!*

[von uber]

You slapped their asses with a singularity, right?

 

Yep, and shockwave, and warp. Starting at level 30 gives you so many options to kill them.

Endlessly.

Until you have to use a pistol.

 

Goes a little like this:

 

[themikefest]

I meant that you're forced to recruit Mordin and Jack (and that you can't send them to TIM, Hackett, Anderson, etc.). And Liara's farewell in London does change for example. She doesn't even offer the gift if you're not close.

The only way she doesn't offer the gift is if you don't talk to her at all in the game aside from cutscenes.

[von uber]

Feron is a long time agent with extensive espionage and infiltration experience. Kal'Reegar is a selfless, tough, incredibly brave marine NCO and veteran. Liara is a young Asari archeologist turned info broker with no CQC or weapons training. Hmm, who would fit best on a warship?

 

So feron doesn't have CQC or weapons training, whereas by ME3 Liara has been through all the mission Shep has and survived.

Righto.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

So it 'really annoys' you that you're given a weapon because you can take them out with biotics? That 'really annoys' you? Just making sure I'm clear on that. You're 'really annoyed' by that? That's something that 'really annoys' you?

 

It's redundant and it takes up space. It's the same reason why, say a sniper doesn't bring a 240 Bravo with him. Or why an One-Five-Five or MLRS battery has a call for fire option with an Apache.

[Bob from Accounting]

Does it 'really annoy' you Massively? Does it 'really annoy' you that biotics are given a pistol at the start of the game? Are you 'really annoyed' that BioWare didn't decide it would be a grand idea to not give biotics a weapon?

[DeinonSlayer]

@Massive
Still don't see how a Scorched Earth policy achieves anything except speeding the Reapers' invasion timetable and breaking down morale and trust in leadership. Unnecessary self-inflicted civilian casualties and destruction of infrastructure will only make post-war recovery more difficult. Saying "I'm The Shepard, deal with it or crawl off and die" doesn't change these realities.

[themikefest]

So feron doesn't have CQC or weapons training, whereas by ME3 Liara has been through all the mission Shep has and survived.

Righto.

Not really. You can do a playthrough where she never sees combat. You pick her up after Virmare and go to Ilos without using her and if you choose not to do the broker dlc she doesn't see combat with Shepard.

[congokong]

Liara was reluctant and TIM explains it: "Nothing beats having someone with a personal motive driving them. You were very close with Commander Shepard. When I heard you were here, I knew I wanted you on my team."

 

And a Liara comic obviously sells better than "random cerberus goon saves Shepards body".

I know why the writers did it. But TIM's reason seems weak to me.

 

1. Liara wasn't loyal to Cerberus

2. Liara was very loyal to Shepard

3. Liara isn't a true field agent despite her potential endeavors in ME1

 

The implication from 1 and 2 is that she may decide to burn the body or bring it to the Alliance instead of handing it over to an organization that's considered terrorists by many. To me the risks would far outweigh the benefits.

[TheTurtle]

Does it 'really annoy' you Massively? Does it 'really annoy' you that biotics are given a pistol at the start of the game? Are you 'really annoyed' that BioWare didn't decide it would be a grand idea to not give biotics a weapon?

Yeah you're not trying.

[von uber]

Does it 'really annoy' you Massively? Does it 'really annoy' you that biotics are given a pistol at the start of the game? Are you 'really annoyed' that BioWare didn't decide it would be a grand idea to not give biotics a weapon?

 

Are you really that bored? Maybe this will cheer you up:

 

[Animositisomina]

Is Mordin a squadmate?

 

That said, technically, yes, I can skip curing the genophage and still beat the game.

 

It's called sabotaging the genophage! ***** brix!*

I'm pretty sure you knew I simply meant the genophage mission in general, not whether you cure or sabotage it.

[Bob from Accounting]

I have to admit, I'm curious how a person would function in everyday life if they're 'really annoyed' by being given a weapon in a video game. If that's 'really annoying' to them. If they're 'really annoyed' by such a thing. If being given a weapon is 'really annoying.'

[Sir DeLoria]

So feron doesn't have CQC or weapons training, whereas by ME3 Liara has been through all the mission Shep has and survived.
Righto.

We don't know that about Feron, but given his position, he should've had both. From my experience all Liara ever did during missions was getting constantly severely injured, doing some biotic stuff and shooting her gun the same way everybody else did(thanks to the game's AI, so it should be ignored).

Seriously, her position on the ship is hardly justifiable, but puting her(a civilian) in an active combat zone is just ludicrous. She's the only civilian squadmate in ME3 and although there's a huge war going, the military should still have something called 'rules' and civilians deffinitely aren't allowed as squadmates in a marine squad

[MassivelyEffective0730]

I always thought Mordin was required as a squadmate. Isn't he needed to come up with a defense against the seeker swarms?

 

He's not required to be on a mission.