946 réponses à ce sujet

[DeinonSlayer]

Not 100% sure. Maybe I picked that up on an another thread somewhere.
Anyway, of course, it's not like she's the most nonsensical squadmate to have in the series. There's Jack, a mass-murdering psychopath who is kept on a frigate, Kasumi, explanation unneeded, Morinth, who Shepard has no reason to think wouldn't go ahead and give a death by snu-snu verdict to another squadmate, and the VS in ME3, who moments before proved how they can't trust their future CO and pulled a gun on her.

Ah, Jack and her bulletproof tattoos... the only thing worse than Miranda's catsuit IMO. I could offer observations on all of the above, but I'd rather my humor not be mistaken for negativity.

I will say it'd have made more sense if you sided with Morinth automatically unless you passed the persuasion check. If you pass the check, you choose who to side with; and keep them; if you fail the check, Morinth overpowers and kills Samara while Shepard remains in a trance, and then escapes into the night, simply leaving you down a squadmate. That of course leads into the crappy ME2 persuasion mechanic forcing players to adhere to one side of the wheel or the other for the entire game to pass loyalty checks. It was interesting playing a Shepard whose personality didn't pass muster to pick up Morinth at the club.

(I'm sure David will find something besides that to scoff at in the above scenario)

[DeathScepter]

Not 100% sure. Maybe I picked that up on an another thread somewhere. 

Anyway, of course, it's not like she's the most nonsensical squadmate to have in the series. There's Jack, a mass-murdering psychopath who is kept on a frigate, Kasumi, explanation unneeded, Morinth, who Shepard has no reason to think wouldn't go ahead and give a death by snu-snu verdict to another squadmate, and the VS in ME3, who moments before proved how they can't trust their future CO and pulled a gun on her. 

 

 

Jack is violent that is true, she is not a psychopath. if you listen to her backstory, she has also suriviors guilt and she has a line if put her in charge of the fire teams, Paraphasing from memory, she said, DAMNIT Shepard, why did you made me care, I didn't know i had it in me. A True Psychopath would happily let everyone die if they know they will surivie.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Classic example was when he said that the ease with which he grasped physics (a topic people see as difficult) meant it would be no harder for a raw recruit to become an SF-tier soldier in "a couple of months" with the right instructors. That Liara should have started with zero experience or training to justify The Shepard training her to his level in a Team America-style montage.

 

It took me 2 and half months to go from a raw-recruit PFC to a slightly less raw Specialist who graduated from Basic Combat Training. And I still hadn't even been to my Advanced Individual Training, which was another two months. Followed by my transfer to intel, and 5 and half months to get dual qualifications in my Enlisted MOS'. And after all that was finished... I still wasn't even a fully trained Soldier. SF Soldiers (real ones) train for years before they ever go on their first mission. 

 

Nevermind that Liara fundamentally lacks the ruthless brutality that is a necessity for those operators. 

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

I will say it'd have made more sense if you sided with Morinth automatically unless you passed the persuasion check. If you pass the check, you choose who to side with; and keep them if you fail the check, Morinth overpowers and kills Samara while Shepard remains in a trance, and then escapes into the night, simply leaving you down a squadmate. That of course leads into the crappy ME2 persuasion mechanic forcing players to adhere to one side of the wheel or the other for the entire game to pass loyalty checks.

(I'm sure David will find something besides that to scoff at in the above scenario)

At least with Tali's trial, if Veetor and Reegar survived, you can do without the check. 

Unpopular opinion, but ME2 really kinda sucked if you think about it. The main story line really has no impact, the combat is too much of a hybrid between 1's and 3's, your railroaded for the main plot as much as you're railroaded into ME3's ending, and you can only be paragon or renegade and nothing in between. The characters are good, though. 

[DeinonSlayer]

At least with Tali's trial, if Veetor and Reegar survived, you can do without the check.
Unpopular opinion, but ME2 really kinda sucked if you think about it. The main story line really has no impact, the combat is too much of a hybrid between 1's and 3's, your railroaded for the main plot as much as you're railroaded into ME3's ending, and you can only be paragon or renegade and nothing in between. The characters are good, though.

I found my ME2 experience vastly improved when I used Gibbed to amp my P/R points to the level that all persuasions were unlocked. If a persuasion is inappropriate for my Shepard from an RP perspective, I ignore it. Simple as that. I admit that in my first playthroughs I was conditioned to take whatever persuasions happened to be unlocked, knowing it produced an optimal outcome. "Unpersuasive Shep" does a good job shaking things up.

I've never played a Sentinel or Adept; I'm trying to come up with personalities for them which would expose me to new content. If I redo my canon in ME2, I figure I'll fail Samara's loyalty mission (my Shepard had to be extremely OOC to "attract" Morinth - blunt to a fault everywhere else, but suddenly becoming an oscar-winning tool when the situation calls for it?) and end up losing someone else in the SM because of it.

[KaiserShep]

Yeah being paragade or renegon in ME2 sucked. I sure missed ME1's point system for charm and intimidate.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Jack is violent that is true, she is not a psychopath. if you listen to her backstory, she has also suriviors guilt and she has a line if put her in charge of the fire teams, Paraphasing from memory, she said, DAMNIT Shepard, why did you made me care, I didn't know i had it in me. A True Psychopath would happily let everyone die if they know they will surivie.

Her backstory doesn't make her not a psychopath. At least at the time of recruitment, she's in the prison for killing many, many people. 

She's a person with a history of violence, who is known to have murdered people in the past, and is mentally unstable. 

Why is she unstable? Because of PTSD stemming from live experimentation by, guess who, the same people whose ship she is on. And yet, she is allowed to stay beneath the ships main reactor. Makes less sense than Liara I'd say. 

[KaiserShep]

Yeah, given the option, I would not have allowed Jack anywhere near engineering.

Jack: "I destroyed a space station!"

Shepard: "Yeah, have fun sharing Samara's spot."

[MassivelyEffective0730]

At least with Tali's trial, if Veetor and Reegar survived, you can do without the check. 

Unpopular opinion, but ME2 really kinda sucked if you think about it. The main story line really has no impact, the combat is too much of a hybrid between 1's and 3's, your railroaded for the main plot as much as you're railroaded into ME3's ending, and you can only be paragon or renegade and nothing in between. The characters are good, though. 

 

I disagree. I think the departure from the main plot was refreshing. ME2 is basically what my Shepard will do post-war for a lot of the stuff. I liked the combat, though in my most recent playthrough, I'll admit to rose tinted glasses to an extent. As far as railroading? Yeah, you're forced to work with/for Cerberus, but you don't have to like them. That's an advantage for you in ME2 that I don't have in ME3. Same with the P/R in ME2. It feels a lot more balanced imo than ME3. I can make Shepard what I want him to be in ME1 and ME2, outside of a few distracting options. Whereas in ME3, I lose a lot of my agency for my Shepard on how he feels and what he feels about, etc.

[Daemul]

Unpopular opinion, but ME2 really kinda sucked if you think about it. The main story line really has no impact, the combat is too much of a hybrid between 1's and 3's, your railroaded for the main plot as much as you're railroaded into ME3's ending, and you can only be paragon or renegade and nothing in between.

This is not an unpopular opinion.

[DeinonSlayer]

I miss ME1's outdoor sniping.

[Sir DeLoria]

Her backstory doesn't make her not a psychopath. At least at the time of recruitment, she's in the prison for killing many, many people. 
She's a person with a history of violence, who is known to have murdered people in the past, and is mentally unstable. 
Why is she unstable? Because of PTSD stemming from live experimentation by, guess who, the same people whose ship she is on. And yet, she is allowed to stay beneath the ships main reactor. Makes less sense than Liara I'd say.

They both make no sense and should get the hell off my ship!

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

I found my ME2 experience vastly improved when I used Gibbed to amp my P/R points to the level that all persuasions were unlocked. If a persuasion is inappropriate for my Shepard from an RP perspective, I ignore it. Simple as that. I admit that in my first playthroughs I was conditioned to take whatever persuasions happened to be unlocked, knowing it produced an optimal outcome. "Unpersuasive Shep" does a good job shaking things up.

I've never played a Sentinel or Adept; I'm trying to come up with personalities for them which would expose me to new content. If I redo my canon in ME2, I figure I'll fail Samara's loyalty mission (my Shepard had to be extremely OOC to "attract" her) and end up losing someone else in the SM because of it.

For a Sentinel, maybe you could think of someone who has gone through both extensive biotic and technical training in order to be the very best. Someone who will do what it takes not only to get the job done, but someone who wants to get the job done in the best possible way. No stone unturned, no loose ends. 

Spacer/War Hero for someone who grew up aspiring to be the best possible, with high expectations that he/she not only wants to meet, but plans to meet by performing in the most ideal way possible. 

Or, Colonist/Ruthless, although having biotics when born on a rural farming colony makes little sense, for someone who witnessed his/her family being slaughtered and wanted revenge. Instead of developing a blind, blunt hatred, he/she decided to hone the hated and anger into a precision weapon. 

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

I disagree. I think the departure from the main plot was refreshing. ME2 is basically what my Shepard will do post-war for a lot of the stuff. I liked the combat, though in my most recent playthrough, I'll admit to rose tinted glasses to an extent. As far as railroading? Yeah, you're forced to work with/for Cerberus, but you don't have to like them. That's an advantage for you in ME2 that I don't have in ME3. Same with the P/R in ME2. It feels a lot more balanced imo than ME3. I can make Shepard what I want him to be in ME1 and ME2, outside of a few distracting options. Whereas in ME3, I lose a lot of my agency for my Shepard on how he feels and what he feels about, etc.

Rule for the next ME game: minimum 4 dialogue options in each circle. ME had it, ME2 had 3+exposition, and ME3 really seemed to only have 2, ever. 

[Han Shot First]

They both make no sense and should get the hell off my ship!

 

 

 

Both make more sense than Tali, who could die from simply getting her suit caught on a sharp corner. As a Quarian she makes the least sense by far out of all the potential squadmates in all three games as a candidate to bring on your ground combat team.

[DeinonSlayer]

For a Sentinel, maybe you could think of someone who has gone through both extensive biotic and technical training in order to be the very best. Someone who will do what it takes not only to get the job done, but someone who wants to get the job done in the best possible way. No stone unturned, no loose ends.
Spacer/War Hero for someone who grew up aspiring to be the best possible, with high expectations that he/she not only wants to meet, but plans to meet by performing in the most ideal way possible.
Or, Colonist/Ruthless, although having biotics when born on a rural farming colony makes little sense, for someone who witnessed his/her family being slaughtered and wanted revenge. Instead of developing a blind, blunt hatred, he/she decided to hone the hated and anger into a precision weapon.

I've never done a pure paragon or pure renegade Shepard, and never will. My canon was colonist/ruthless, though - I come up with a personal backstory which informs Shepard's actions. My canon, for example.

Both make more sense than Tali, who could die from simply getting her suit caught on a sharp corner. As a Quarian she makes the least sense by far out of all the potential squadmates in all three games as a candidate to bring on your ground combat team.

She, like Kasumi (infiltration) and Liara (Prothean expert), has a high-value skillset which makes her better reserved for situations where that skillset is applicable. I could see her being needed to shut down the thrusters on X57, for example, or to play more of an Anna Grimsdottir-style support role (she and Adams work together to take apart every rogue probe you find while galaxy scanning in ME1). But yeah, other people are better suited (no pun) to put a boot in the door.

I loved how they lampshaded this if you bring Tali to the Rachni mission in ME3. Something along the lines of "I'm sure we'll find advanced computer equipment down in the cave full of poison gas and monsters."

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Not 100% sure. Maybe I picked that up on an another thread somewhere. 

Anyway, of course, it's not like she's the most nonsensical squadmate to have in the series. There's Jack, a mass-murdering psychopath who is kept on a frigate, Kasumi, explanation unneeded, Morinth, who Shepard has no reason to think wouldn't go ahead and give a death by snu-snu verdict to another squadmate, and the VS in ME3, who moments before proved how they can't trust their future CO and pulled a gun on her. 

 

I looked at Liara's dossier. While Asari do receive martial arts training and biotics training as part of their basic education, there is nothing about her having trained as a commando. There is a one-shot fan fiction about her receiving commando training. That's where you may have seen it. But there is nothing official about her having done so. That training typically occupies about 30 years and this is what makes them so deadly. Having a full powered Asari Commando on the squad along with Javik would have been like having an "I win" button every battle. You'll say "why weren't they able to hold Thessia?" Anyone can be overwhelmed by sheer numbers and small arms do nothing against 2 km tall ships.

 

Liara was a powerful biotic because she's Asari. It's a species thing. Her mother was a very powerful biotic, and her father the same. So there you have it. She learned how to shoot a pistol. Anyone can do that with enough practice. And she learned how to use a machine pistol with enough practice. She's not shooting assault rifles. 

 

She's not a soldier, neither was Tali yet they made her an Admiral??? From civilian to Admiral in less than three years! Now that is quite a feat especially when every single mission she's led ended with everyone getting wiped out.

[TheTurtle]

Both make more sense than Tali, who could die from simply getting her suit caught on a sharp corner. As a Quarian she makes the least sense by far out of all the potential squadmates in all three games as a candidate to bring on your ground combat team.

I never take Tali on missions for this exact reason. It throws me out of the game extremely fast.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

I've never done a pure paragon or pure renegade Shepard, and never will. My canon was colonist/ruthless, though - I come up with a personal backstory which informs Shepard's actions. My canon, for example.

If you do use one of mine, then the colonist one would make sense. It's about being being unbeatable, not being vicious. 

[DeinonSlayer]

If you do use one of mine, then the colonist one would make sense. It's about being being unbeatable, not being vicious.

Yep. My canon, as I said, was colonist/ruthless. Not "vicious" or needlessly cruel, but untroubled by making sacrifices when the situation called for it. Sounds similar to yours, actually.

Thanks for the advice, though.

[KaiserShep]

I never take Tali on missions for this exact reason. It throws me out of the game extremely fast.

I always left her to the mandatory missions, so Tali was essentially my trusty ship engineer pretty much all of the time.

[Jorji Costava]

I have to admit that my opinion of ME2 has gotten harsher and harsher as times have past. I only ever found a rather small number of the relatively large cast of characters to be really compelling, the P/R system is a mess, and the disloyal=dead mechanic was possibly one of the biggest missteps in the series. And if I'm being completely honest, I feel that the game is kinda fascist (although that's a whole other can of worms it's probably not a good idea to open right here). Still, it has some of my most remembered moments of the series (Mordin and Legion's loyalty missions, the overall atmosphere, etc.). If ME were music, then I'd rate ME1 as the overall more consistent album, while ME2 has some songs that are way better than anything in ME1, but also has a lot of songs that just aren't very good at all.

[DeinonSlayer]

Yeah, given the option, I would not have allowed Jack anywhere near engineering.
Jack: "I destroyed a space station!"
Shepard: "Yeah, have fun sharing Samara's spot."

I can just picture Samara trying to coax Jack into meditating... I wonder if she'd succeed in calming her, or if Jack would sooner provoke her into a fight.

[TheTurtle]

The loyalty missions got old really fast; I hate trudging through them on perfectionist playthroughs.