34724 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

Yup and it's kinda insulting to say if she was gay somehow she'd be far more interesting, this is silly.

Which is something that I never even remotely said. All it determines is romantic availability, and that was the point.

[Ailith Tycane]

 

It's going to be dictated by the whim of writers either way; popularity is just one form of artistic stimulus. One that matters to many people, conveniently enough.

 

Bioware has said before that they don't make romance decision based on who is popular and who is not, but then again, Garrus and Tali were both (straight) romance options in ME2 based on player feedback, so...

[90s Luke]

Which is something that I never even remotely said. All it determines is romantic availability, and that was the point.

 

Perhaps if the protagonist had been human-only, Cassandra could have been bisexual.

[Xilizhra]

Perhaps if the protagonist had been human-only, Cassandra could have been bisexual.

Bullsh!t. Bioware should never have made their most plot-important romances purely heteronormative at all.

[TheJediSaint]

Perhaps if the protagonist had been human-only, Cassandra could have been bisexual.

 

I'm pretty sure she would still be straight regardless.  They had most of the story stuff nailed down before they delayed the game for a year to add other races.

[Maria Caliban]

Also I would like to point out that her character traits are traditionally masculine. I'm not condoning heteronormative character stereotypes about whats male and whats female behavior, but generally being seen as a headstrong, opinionated, aggressive leader are all "male" traits, and these are all traits Cassandra seems to have an overabundance of.

 
Also true.
 

Interestingly, we do know that in DA:I characters are getting unique models. So at least Cassandra's build - obscured though it may be by her armour - may well be indicative of her physique. In the same way that Anders in DA2 was actually much slimmer than the beefcake baseline body for everyone else.

And Isabela was curvy in a way other women weren't.

I hadn't read this, but perhaps I missed that it was true for DA:I. That said, there are still limits, I believe. Could they make Cassandra as tall as Cullen without adding a ton of extra work?

[In Exile]

Bioware has said before that they don't make romance decision based on who is popular and who is not, but then again, Garrus and Tali were both (straight) romance options in ME2 based on player feedback, so...

 

I'm not a writer, so I obviously can't understand the relationship between writers and their characters. But I just don't fundamentally see why it would be difficult, aside from possibly the technical difficulties, to allow player preference to influence where assets are allocated design wise (to make up for the cinematic cost) and then to open up an LI as available for everyone. 

[Maria Caliban]

It was a poor choice that Bioware made, to be sure.

I'd like to point out here that I don't think making Cassandra straight is a bad choice.

I would like the character who appears to be very important to the plot be available for both men and women to romance, but disagree that popularity or notoriety or butchness should determine a character's sexual orientation.

It sucks, but I don't think BioWare has done something wrong.

[TheJediSaint]

I'm not a writer, so I obviously can't understand the relationship between writers and their characters. But I just don't fundamentally see why it would be difficult, aside from possibly the technical difficulties, to allow player preference to influence where assets are allocated design wise (to make up for the cinematic cost) and then to open up an LI as available for everyone. 

 

Players don't generally learn about characters until they're pretty much done writing them.  And they cant really tell what character is going to be really popular ahead of time.

[Xilizhra]

I'd like to point out here that I don't think making Cassandra straight is a bad choice.

Then we disagree, which isn't so new.

I wasn't going to romance her to begin with, but my girlfriend has grown increasingly angry about certain decisions this game has made, and this one might make her swear it off completely; I'm seriously displeased.

[In Exile]

I hadn't read this, but perhaps I missed that it was true for DA:I. That said, there are still limits, I believe. Could they make Cassandra as tall as Cullen without adding a ton of extra work?

 

In theory there's no reason why not because I believe the Iron Bull will be taller and larger than the male Qunari Inquisitor. So in theory I think they could have made Cassandra taller. My guess is you see Cass being like Anissa from the comic Invincible (see picture below), except for maybe the comically large breasts: 

 

 

(I made the horrible mistake of searching for an image for her without enabling safe-search. The horrors I saw cannot be described. Damn you, Rule 34!!!) 

[Ailith Tycane]

I'd like to point out here that I don't think making Cassandra straight is a bad choice.

I would like the character who appears to be very important to the plot be available for both men and women to romance, but disagree that popularity or notoriety or butchness should determine a character's sexual orientation.

It sucks, but I don't think BioWare has done something wrong.

 

I also don't think it would kill Bioware to make one of their more butchy female LI's actually gay for once, switch it up a little bit, haha

[Allan Schumacher]

Just because she's recognizable as female doesn't mean she's not androgynous/butch also. 

 

Evidently I misunderstood as I though androgynous meant (simplified) a sort of inability to determine if someone was a man or a woman via physical features.  Not so much a function of masculine and feminine features.

 

I'm still not sure I would consider her androgynous because I think I classify a lot of things as gender neutral that many don't, but at the same time if I'm going to use my definition for myself then I must concede that what you consider masculine and feminine is just as valid for yourself.  So in that sense I apologize if I came across unnecessarily dismissive with my statement.

[Ailith Tycane]

Evidently I misunderstood as I though androgynous meant (simplified) a sort of inability to determine if someone was a man or a woman via physical features.  Not so much a function of masculine and feminine features.

 

I'm still not sure I would consider her androgynous because I think I classify a lot of things as gender neutral that many don't, but at the same time if I'm going to use my definition for myself then I must concede that what you consider masculine and feminine is just as valid for yourself.  So in that sense I apologize if I came across unnecessarily dismissive with my statement.

 

You weren't dismissive, it's just semantics and not especially important. I think we can agree she's not as traditionally feminine as someone like Isabella for example and that's more what I meant.

[90s Luke]

Bullsh!t. Bioware should never have made their most plot-important romances purely heteronormative at all.

 

Romances are optional content, though.

 

None of them are important to the main plot (or at least don't affect it significantly).

[Maria Caliban]

Players don't generally learn about characters until they're pretty much done writing them.  And they cant really tell what character is going to be really popular ahead of time.

Are you suggesting that they didn't know Cassandra, Varric, and Cullen would be wildly popular?

If so, I disagree. It's one thing to say that about new character, but these were all characters with established fan bases.

I can imagine the developers not expecting Cassandra to be popular among gay women. We're maybe 2% of their fanbase, and I suspect that if you asked someone to imagine a character gay women would be attracted to, they wouldn't know where to start.

[In Exile]

Are you suggesting that they didn't know Cassandra, Varric, and Cullen would be wildly popular?

If so, I disagree. It's one thing to say that about new character, but these were all characters with established fan bases.

I can imagine the developers not expecting Cassandra to be popular among gay women. We're maybe 2% of their fanbase, and I suspect that if you asked someone to imagine a character gay women would be attracted to, they wouldn't know where to start.

One of the many reasons why representation in the creative groups is so very important. 

[Ailith Tycane]

I can imagine the developers not expecting Cassandra to be popular among gay women. We're maybe 2% of their fanbase, and I suspect that if you asked someone to imagine a character gay women would be attracted to, they wouldn't know where to start.

 

This is why you should hire gay women Bioware, haha. 

[Sherbet Lemon]

Players don't generally learn about characters until they're pretty much done writing them.  And they cant really tell what character is going to be really popular ahead of time.

 

I think normally this would ring true, but people have been fans of Cassandra since DA2 (not that that's a reason WHY someone should be romanceable period).  That's a really look time to really take to a character which I think is also why for some this one hurts different from a Miranda or a Morrigan or Ashley.

 

Whether or not her actual appearance in this game will showcase her as plotcentric or not is kind of a moot point.  She was featured in DA2, we knew back then she would most likely be in this game (some were betting on her status as LI even then when the "ambiguous sexuality system" had been implemented), and she had an entire anime that sort of functions like an origin story.  She could be no more important than Sera or Josephine, but people have had a long time to be a fan.  That sort exposure lends to that sort of thinking that is or will be the lead.

 

It really isn't much of a winnable situation for all parties.  Um, yeah...

[Xilizhra]

Romances are optional content, though.

 

None of them are important to the main plot (or at least don't affect it significantly).

In this case, what matters is how important the person is, not the romance.

[Allan Schumacher]

You weren't dismissive, it's just semantics and not especially important. I think we can agree she's not as traditionally feminine as someone like Isabella for example and that's more what I meant.

 

I find most of Isabela's femininity comes from her appearance and less so from her personality.  Looks aside, how do you think Cassandra and Isabela differ?

[90s Luke]

Romances are not based on what fans want, but what each writer wants to give us.

 

They would need to create dozens and dozens of love interests to accommodate EVERYONE 

[Allan Schumacher]

This is why you should hire gay women Bioware, haha. 

 

I'm reasonably confident we have some that work here.  But I mean, I didn't realize David was gay until very recently myself, so I suspect they fit the "look like a human being" to me so....

[Xilizhra]

Romances are not based on what fans want, but what each writer wants to give us.

 

They would need to create dozens and dozens of love interests to accommodate EVERYONE 

In this case, a better balance could have been struck.