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She talks about love and romance. It isn't just sexual attraction. And she's only been with one man. She clearly sizes up things in terms of the longterm.
That's why I think such factors should be taken into account, and not make her into such a joke for some players.
She's not?
Guest_StreetMagic_*
She's not?
Anything that can be gamed is a joke to the person gaming it.
I don't blame her character, I blame Bioware, lol.
Anything that can be gamed is a joke to the person gaming it.
Well it's game and Bioware can only do so much with the romance content
It's not just my experiences. It's other players I've observed.
My opinion really turned when I saw a vid with some Juggalo looking Qunari in facepaint, who didn't believe anything she said, having sex with her.
No actual author would write a scene like that. It's narratively implausible and stupid. Yet it's come down to this. She's become a tool in everyone's hands. The people who like her, the people don't care much, the people who think it's all for the lulz.. Anyone can achieve with Cassandra. She likes you no matter what, as long as you game it.
Err... so we agree on that regard?
I think i presented my argument as to why Cassandra fits as my Inquisitor's love interest, i am willing to say that said story was much more belivable than pretty much any other Bioware Romance (Viconia DeVir is the exception).
Sure, i completely agree that a Qunari or a Mage/Tevinter supporter extremist Inquisitor would require way more additional dialogue (that i assume isnt present in the game) to make a romance work (if at all).
But on the chantry faith alone? that isnt a role playing barrier for the romance.
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As for why would someone be a agnostic Inquisitor in role playing terms, i like to think my character has had enough history lessions to figure out that established institutional religions are just a way to manipulate people (since my character is Human Noble, he of all people, should know that).
My perspective is that Gods/Spirits/Demons are pretty much diferent beans of the same sack, Thedas should care about itself more than with the Fade or other outworldly business (as Cory seems to do). Now that demons are spawning everywhere, its the perfect time to show how innefective pure faith can be and that we should have faith in ourselves (as in, people of thedas) before everything else.
At least thats how i role play.
Guest_TheDarkKnightReturns_*
People debating religious dogma? Cassandra's just the right amount of flexible in that regard. Her attitude by the end is "**** the Chantry, I have my faith". That is unless she takes the job offer to lead it to a better place. Those are understandable perspectives to have given that there's a ****ing hole in the sky and a 1,200 year old Blighted Magister is conquering the world while the Chantry sits on it's ass in spite of the Templars and mages killing each other.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
People debating religious dogma? Cassandra's just the right amount of flexible in that regard. Her attitude by the end is "**** the Chantry, I have my faith". That is unless she takes the job offer to lead it to a better place. Those are understandable perspectives to have given that there's a ****ing hole in the sky and a 1,200 year old Blighted Magister is conquering the world while the Chantry sits on it's ass in spite of the Templars and mages killing each other.
She isn't at the point of Leliana, proclaiming her own type of faith. She believes the principles on which the Chantry was founded. Which is to say, the Chant of Light (pre-Chantry).
In a way, she's the equivalent of an early Protestant. Back to the basics approach.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Err... so we agree on that regard?
I think i presented my argument as to why Cassandra fits as my Inquisitor's love interest, i am willing to say that said story was much more belivable than pretty much any other Bioware Romance (Viconia DeVir is the exception).
Sure, i completely agree that a Qunari or a Mage/Tevinter supporter extremist Inquisitor would require way more additional dialogue (that i assume isnt present in the game) to make a romance work (if at all).
But on the chantry faith alone? that isnt a role playing barrier for the romance.
----
As for why would someone be a agnostic Inquisitor in role playing terms, i like to think my character has had enough history lessions to figure out that established institutional religions are just a way to manipulate people (since my character is Human Noble, he of all people, should know that).
My perspective is that Gods/Spirits/Demons are pretty much diferent beans of the same sack, Thedas should care about itself more than with the Fade or other outworldly business (as Cory seems to do). Now that demons are spawning everywhere, its the perfect time to show how innefective pure faith can be and that we should have faith in ourselves (as in, people of thedas) before everything else.
At least thats how i role play.
That's cool if you roleplayed and got there without being too gamey. I'm making a general complaint on how the system falls short, that's all. Not necessarily attacking you.
Well it's game and Bioware can only do so much with the romance content
True enough.
People debating religious dogma? Cassandra's just the right amount of flexible in that regard. Her attitude by the end is "**** the Chantry, I have my faith". That is unless she takes the job offer to lead it to a better place. Those are understandable perspectives to have given that there's a ****ing hole in the sky and a 1,200 year old Blighted Magister is conquering the world while the Chantry sits on it's ass in spite of the Templars and mages killing each other.
Popcorn?
That's cool if you roleplayed and got there without being too gamey. I'm making a general complaint on how the system falls short, that's all. Not necessarily attacking you.
True enough.
Well, thats a problem with pretty much every RPG games, even if you lock out a character just for a certain kind of PC, there are still people who will diverge on their motivations for liking such character.
As someone who DMed D&D (and other PnP RPGs) for years now, i can guarantee you that its rare for someone to not find a plausible way to do something.
Of course, with the videogame format we are more restricted, but i am pretty sure there are people out there with very fertile minds who will take the game's existing dialogue and make a motivational reason as to why their ultra pro Qun and chantry exterminator Inquisitor is romancing Cassy.
Of course, we both reserve judgment on saying those people are silly 
Guest_StreetMagic_*
On a sidenote, it could be that I do wish to see someone more strict in their views about this. They seem to like taking the approach when including a Chantry character to make them more "understanding" and inclusive than usual. Unlike many Chantry NPCs. Sebastian, Leliana, now even Cass. Maybe Alistair, if he counts a little.
As if the Chantry can't be likeable any other way.
Be open to the all important godlike player, else you're just a bad person.
edit: I'm talking romanceable. Not Vivienne btw.
The entire argument in this thread reminds me of a Solas/Cassandra banter I had. I don't remember the words exactly but it was Solas telling Cassandra he was impressed she was able to change her stance and view on things after being presented with new facts/problems and that some people might think of her as weak because of it. Cassandra answer was less or more that it actually made her stronger...
Guest_StreetMagic_*
The entire argument in this thread reminds me of a Solas/Cassandra banter I had. I don't remember the words exactly but it was Solas telling Cassandra he was impressed she was able to change her stance and view on things after being presented with new facts/problems and that some people might think of her as weak because of it. Cassandra answer was less or more that it actually made her stronger...
Being admired by Solas is a bad thing.
On a sidenote, it could be that I do wish to see someone more strict in their views about this. They seem to like taking the approach when including a Chantry character to make them more "understanding" and inclusive than usual. Sebastian, Leliana, now even Cass. Maybe Alistair, if he counts a little.
As if the Chantry can't be likeable any other way.
Be open to the all important godlike player, else you're just a bad person.
Weird, i actually terribly disliked Sebastian, i though of him as pretty much the "indoctrinated altar boy". I dont consider Alistair a "chantry character" at all, he barely talks about as far as i remember.
But anyway, StreetMagic, i think your missing one of the fundamentals of RPGs, its all about the Players, havent you read any DM's rulebook? (no matter what game, they pretty much tell you the same thing).
A DM shouldnt be someone that restricts and imposes indestructable barriers to his/her players, the DM should be someone that adapts to them, change what happens to the setting around the players.
That doesnt mean it shouldnt contain challenges (hell, i have been called a pretty sadistic DM more than once), but story wise, it has been and probably will always be about the player(s) first and foremost.
Being admired by Solas is a bad thing.
Lol, calm down. Solas admires her attitude and determination. If you don't, well there's a link that says, "Back to Story, Campaign & Characters" right near the bottom of the page that you can click on.
People debating religious dogma? Cassandra's just the right amount of flexible in that regard. Her attitude by the end is "**** the Chantry, I have my faith". That is unless she takes the job offer to lead it to a better place. Those are understandable perspectives to have given that there's a ****ing hole in the sky and a 1,200 year old Blighted Magister is conquering the world while the Chantry sits on it's ass in spite of the Templars and mages killing each other.
But is the Chantry sitting on it's ass? Divine Justinia is seeking to end the war at the start of the game and then the conclave is destroyed along with the Divine.
What really seems to be the Chantry's problem at the game's start is there is no Divine and apparently some internal divisions. That's where I think the Inquisition steps in and I do think Cassandra's views on Chantry reform are generally correct. I am determined on getting on her good side even if I now see that the best thing to do, in my opinion, is to push her for Divine.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Lol, calm down. Solas admires her attitude and determination. If you don't, well there's a link that says, "Back to Story, Campaign & Characters" right near the bottom of the page that you can click on.
I am calm. I'm just offering my opinion. I see her as someone in Limbo, belief wise. In a way, forming the Inquisition and eventually deferring to us is giving up her confidence in some respects. I wish her to find it again. She puts too much faith in the player.
Of course, she's strong in taking action, but I don't like seeing people like this when it comes to faith. She doesn't necessarily like it either. She asks you early on: "Did I do the right thing?"
Lol, calm down. Solas admires her attitude and determination. If you don't, well there's a link that says, "Back to Story, Campaign & Characters" right near the bottom of the page that you can click on.
Again, that was my entire point in those paragraphs.
My inquisitor loves her and admires her for that first and foremost 
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Just to add, I don't think Bioware knew how to handle the mage/templar crisis.. And so they put it in our hands.
Except I don't want it. It troubles me that I could speak for Andraste (who my character believes in). And the only "herald" I'll be is the one that gets others to believe in her, instead of me. Starting with Cass, as much as can be possible.
This means not trying to reform everything. Such hubris. And yet, Bioware allows me.
I am calm. I'm just offering my opinion. I see her as someone in Limbo, belief wise. In a way, forming the Inquisition and eventually deferring to us is giving up her confidence in some respects. I wish her to find it again. She puts too much faith in the player.
Of course, she's strong in taking action, but I don't like seeing people like this when it comes to faith. She doesn't necessarily like it either. She asks you early on: "Did I do the right thing?"
But doesnt she have reason enough to be in Limbo? isnt seeing the Templar's getting destroyed and disheartened with the Chantry enough? to see people killing themselves while there is a huge green portal in the skies spewing demons?
Her mentor died and nobody cared about it, Orlay continued with its ongoing Civil War and everything the Justinia tried to achieve failed, isnt that reason enough?
What about the big lie the seekers told her? that she was made tranquil without knowing? That the Seekers were withholding information that would help alot of Tranquil mages? What about her former colleague becoming the leader of a Doomsday cult?
She looks at the Inquisitor and sees him/her as someone who is succeding at fixing the stuff she finds it wrong, isnt that enough reason for her to start to belive in him/her?
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Btw, if your a very religious Inquisitor cant you help her restore her faith in the Chantry? although i think that would make her Divine in the end, which would be quite sad, i imagine.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
But doesnt she have reason enough to be in Limbo? isnt seeing the Templar's getting destroyed and disheartened with the Chantry enough? to see people killing themselves while there is a huge green portal in the skies spewing demons?
What about the big lie the seekers told her? that she was made tranquil without knowing? What about her former colleague becoming the leader of a Doomsday cult?
She looks at the Inquisitor and sees him/her as someone who is succeding at fixing the stuff she finds it wrong, isnt that enough reason for her to start to belive in him/her?
There are good points there. I just don't think everything needs to change. The world was fine to me, before DA2.
I am calm. I'm just offering my opinion. I see her as someone in Limbo, belief wise. In a way, forming the Inquisition and eventually deferring to us is giving up her confidence in some respects. I wish her to find it again. She puts too much faith in the player.
Of course, she's strong in taking action, but I don't like seeing people like this when it comes to faith. She doesn't necessarily like it either. She asks you early on: "Did I do the right thing?"
Too much faith in the person she believes comes from her god? But you also want her to have absolute faith in said god? Makes absolutely no sense, tbh.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Too much faith in the person she believes comes from her god? But you also want her to have absolute faith in said god? Makes absolutely no sense, tbh.
Wait what? Can you rephrase?
I just think she needs to stick the Chant of Light and all is cool. I'll keep it simple.
And if she did that, she wouldn't give a damn what Solas thought. Among others.
Just to add, I don't think Bioware knew how to handle the mage/templar crisis.. And so they put it in our hands.
I consider the mage/templar arc to be one of the worse in Bioware games
Just to add, I don't think Bioware knew how to handle the mage/templar crisis.. And so they put it in our hands.
Except I don't want it. It troubles me that I could speak for Andraste (who my character believes in). And the only "herald" I'll be is the one that gets others to believe in her, instead of me. Starting with Cass, as much as can be possible.
This means not trying to reform everything. Such hubris. And yet, Bioware allows me.
But leaving it in OUR hands is the WHOLE point of the series!!!
Its a RPG game, not a visual novel or something thats pre-determined.
StreetMagic, please aswer this:
Can you role play the character that you wanted to? If yes then the game has achieved its goal.
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