34723 réponses à ce sujet

[Shadow Quickpaw]

Does anyone else get a bit miffed with Giselle after you save Haven, when she completely disregards everything you just learned from Corypheous by saying: "He must be lying to himself."

 

Um, I'm sorry. I'm going to believe the first-hand account of someone who was actually there over hundreds of years of misremembered and manipulated dogma. And by the way, worship and general knowledge/awareness of the "Maker" doesn't predate Andraste. She's the first person in Thedas's history to even mention "him."

[Dr. Doctor]

It's his special gif for sensitive moments like these. Dean doesn't have it in him.

Shadow Realms is kind of what I'm thinking of, but I would play a Supernatural-esque RPG. Think an urban fantasy version of The Witcher.

[RobRam10]

Does anyone else get a bit miffed with Giselle after you save Haven, when she completely disregards everything you just learned from Corypheous by saying: "He must be lying to himself."

 

Um, I'm sorry. I'm going to believe the first-hand account of someone who was actually there over hundreds of years of misremembered and manipulated dogma. And by the way, worship and general knowledge/awareness of the "Maker" doesn't predate Andraste. She's the first person in Thedas's history to even mention "him."

Giselle is a worthless snake what wisdom did you expect from her?

[Al Foley]

Why do I suspect if Giselle voiced support for mage independence, most of you would stop supporting her.

I wouldn't.  

 

Honestly I am a bit surprised at the anti mage sentiment in this thread...or excuse me the 'mage's need to be locked up in Circle's' sentiment coming from a lot of people given this is the Cassandra thread.  Given that her opinion and solution of the 'mage problem' is give them a little freedom and self management but also create organizations and safe guards which will check them should evil and corruption begin to take root within the new Circles of Magi.  A perfect solution to me.  Exactly what Anders wanted.  Exactly what Solas seems to want.  And I think Dorian would probably be on board too.  

 

(Disgusted noise)

[Br3admax]

Does anyone else get a bit miffed with Giselle after you save Haven, when she completely disregards everything you just learned from Corypheous by saying: "He must be lying to himself."

 

Um, I'm sorry. I'm going to believe the first-hand account of someone who was actually there over hundreds of years of misremembered and manipulated dogma. And by the way, worship and general knowledge/awareness of the "Maker" doesn't predate Andraste. She's the first person in Thedas's history to even mention "him."

"It's all one world, Herald. All that changes is our place in it...."

 

I wouldn't.  

 

Honestly I am a bit surprised at the anti mage sentiment in this thread...or excuse me the 'mage's need to be locked up in Circle's' sentiment coming from a lot of people given this is the Cassandra thread.  Given that her opinion and solution of the 'mage problem' is give them a little freedom and self management but also create organizations and safe guards which will check them should evil and corruption begin to take root within the new Circles of Magi.  A perfect solution to me.  Exactly what Anders wanted.  Exactly what Solas seems to want.  And I think Dorian would probably be on board too.  

 

(Disgusted noise)

 

She still wants them to be in Towers and watched by the Chantry. You know, basically what it was like before Anders, but with all Circles. 

[Al Foley]

Does anyone else get a bit miffed with Giselle after you save Haven, when she completely disregards everything you just learned from Corypheous by saying: "He must be lying to himself."

 

Um, I'm sorry. I'm going to believe the first-hand account of someone who was actually there over hundreds of years of misremembered and manipulated dogma. And by the way, worship and general knowledge/awareness of the "Maker" doesn't predate Andraste. She's the first person in Thedas's history to even mention "him."

I am curious.  I have seen lots of videos in school.  Tons of tv shows about cops and evens science fiction and crime dramas which indicate that first hand accounts are not to be trusted.  Usually at all.  And, most people want more solid evidence to get a conviction.  Especially in this case.  He could be lying to himself.  He could not understand what he saw.  Or he could be lying to us.  

 

Personally though for sake of lore I do wonder if he is not in fact right.  With some of the other revelations on unrelated topics.  

[Al Foley]

"It's all one world, Herald. All that changes is our place in it...."

 

 

She still wants them to be in Towers and watched by the Chantry. You know, basically what it was like before Anders, but with all Circles. 

But yet a lot more freedom then they did.  Freedom under law.  A perfect solution.  

[Al Foley]

It's not necessary to completely agree with her. I do on most points, but I think she's also lost some of the previous convictions she's had. This was DG's description of her pre-release.. that she's in a more reflective mode. It's up to us to interpret it as positive or negative. Even she doesn't know if it is.. she wonders if she's heretical or crazy sometimes.

I know and I don't always agree with her but her solution seems to have a certain elegance to it combined with the 'status quo with me in charge' of Viv and the Leilianna 'hey lets change all the things'.  

[Master Warder Z_]

But yet a lot more freedom then they did. Freedom under law. A perfect solution.

No.

Reconstution of the circles and Templars is the perfect solution.

Oh and then throw rocks at mages every feastday.

[Al Foley]

No.

Reconstution of the circles and Templars is the perfect solution.

Oh and then throw rocks at mages every feastday.

I wouldn't mind this.  Just as long as their were appropriate checks and balances and you had the Templars open to mage membership.  

[Master Warder Z_]

I wouldn't mind this. Just as long as their were appropriate checks and balances and you had the Templars open to mage membership.

Hell no.

Magi should be nowhere near the Templar order.

That's the first step with Tevinter.

[RobRam10]

Hell no.

Magi should be nowhere near the Templar order.

That's the first step with Tevinter.

One step to the True Path.

[Al Foley]

Hell no.

Magi should be nowhere near the Templar order.

That's the first step with Tevinter.

 

I think the Circles of Magi would lead to another Tevinter...

I strongly feel good about the status quo though..I'd like to take a giant dump on Anders. I'd like to tell Cass and Leli that they shouldn't be bullied by him. That it was never that bad.. Anders' has basically shaken even the diehard Chantry types to the core, making them question everything. Choosing the status quo is me saying "Nah, f*ck that."

 

At the same time, having mages in the Chantry and Viv in power also provides the symbolism that good mages can be rewarded. It's not totally status quo. It's bringing mages into the fold more. Rather than being outsiders. I always felt this was a theme in other games too.. about my mage warden or mage Hawke.

...I see.  

[thesuperdarkone2]

When has Bioware ever made it so that ambigous choices backfire? Everyone thought doing the dark ritual would backfire but so far nothing bad happens. Everyone thought letting Varric keep the red lyrium shard and that didn't backfire. I doubt Bioware is going to make the free mages ending backfire, and I'll laugh at all the paranoid fear-mongers when that happens. I also doubt letting the architect live is going to backfire 

[Al Foley]

When has Bioware ever made it so that ambigous choices backfire? Everyone thought doing the dark ritual would backfire but so far nothing bad happens. Everyone thought letting Varric keep the red lyrium shard and that didn't backfire. I doubt Bioware is going to make the free mages ending backfire, and I'll laugh at all the paranoid fear-mongers when that happens. I also doubt letting the architect live is going to backfire 

To be fair:

 

The Varric decision was relatively minor.  

 

And we do not know how the Dark Ritual choice will play out.  It has not back fired yet but....well if oyu saw the ending to DA I you know it could still happen.  

 

As for the Architect, I doubt it too.  I think Corypheus became his stand in.  

[thesuperdarkone2]

Just to add.. I just don't buy the argument that the system was broken. It worked well for a thousand years..

 

And then some spirit came in, who doesn't even know jack **** about this world (Justice), decided to blow everything up. Secondly, Kirkwall was a mess.. but the world was not Kirkwall. Yet suddenly everyone now treats it like it always was.

 

So I call bullsh*t.

Well considering that all endings give mages more freedom and weaken the Templars, that should tell you something.

[Br3admax]

But yet a lot more freedom then they did.  Freedom under law.  A perfect solution.  

Again, that was the Circle before. First Enchanters leading Circles. A society for mages by mages. There are codices for a reason. 

[Master Warder Z_]

Again, that was the Circle before. First Enchanters leading Circles. A society for mages by mages. There are codices for a reason.

A lot of the old pro mage movements prefer headcannon.

[Shadow Quickpaw]

@Al Foley (sorry I can't quote) Why would Corypheous lie to us? He has no real reason to (being described as arrogance personified), as his success doesn't hinge on anything the Inquisitor believes. He has even less reason to lie when he first wakes up and is all confused by millennia asleep. He's not even talking to anyone when he states "But it was black. Corrupt. The City! It was supposed to be golden!"

 

And the fact that his statements and "memories" are consistent between both his original awakening (confused, lost, and generally discombobulated) and now... And besides: He had likely never heard of the "Maker" and so had no real reason to fear the scorn of that deity. Again: belief in the Maker and that particular faith system was started by Andraste AFTER the first blight.

 

Giselle says Corypheous is lying to himself to avoid believing he was punished by a particular God whom know one would even worship until a couple of centuries later.

 

That is not to say he COULDN'T have been lying. We'll have to wait and see.

[MisterJB]

Does anyone else get a bit miffed with Giselle after you save Haven, when she completely disregards everything you just learned from Corypheous by saying: "He must be lying to himself."

 

Um, I'm sorry. I'm going to believe the first-hand account of someone who was actually there over hundreds of years of misremembered and manipulated dogma. And by the way, worship and general knowledge/awareness of the "Maker" doesn't predate Andraste. She's the first person in Thedas's history to even mention "him."

 

Actually, it does. The Tevinters acknowledged the existence of the a creator god, they simply has no incentives to worship him when the Old Gods actually answered to prayers.