859 réponses à ce sujet

[eyezonlyii]

This is one of those arguments based on perceptions and philosophy.

[KaiserShep]

If Cerberus snags the students, that seems more like negligence on Shepard's part than success on theirs. After all, Traynor and EDI saw through their subterfuge in the fake turian signal, and if Shepard ignores it, that's his/her responsibility. Success would be more like Shepard went there immediately and they got away.

[ImaginaryMatter]

This is one of those arguments based on perceptions and philosophy.

 

That's never stopped us before!

[MassivelyEffective0730]

It wasn't a success. If the only way to control the Geth is to torture the man who would control them to the point where he wants you dead, then it's not possible. 

They didn't intend that. That wasn't part of the project. 

Well, most people did. 

The Krogan clans came with 300 war assets. They hindered the war effort. 

Remember this, no matter what Cerberus did, the Salarians won the Reaper War. Earth is still more or lessed destroyed after being occupied for a couple months, the human colonies are practically all burned, and Humanity no longer has any infrastructure to rebuild. If Cerberus' end goal was to help humanity above the other races, they failed. If they hadn't taken away the catalyst's location both times, the Alliance would still have a fleet and Earth would've been saved a lot sooner. 

 

Hmm, I thought my Shepard (who fully believed in and endorsed Cerberus ideals) took control of the Reapers and made the galaxy into a place where the strong wouldn't have to worry about the limitations by the weak. If you're delving into headcanon there, I'll do it too. My Shepard used the Reapers to ensure human dominance in the galaxy for all time, making sure that those similar to TIM were always in power. The universe is going to be a beautiful place.

 

Also, quote what you're talking about, I have no clue which of the points you're talking about: 

 

That said, sure it is. Just keep the man controlled.

 

And it might have been a problem for Teltin, but it seemed like a boon for Lazarus. Jack served her purpose on that Cerberus mission just fine to me.

 

I don't care what most people did. I left them because their lives were tertiary to my goals.

 

Hmm, I thought I made them useful by deceiving Wreav and gaining the Salarian fleet. I got a strong fleet with strong Krogan. Works for me.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

This is one of those arguments based on perceptions and philosophy.

 

That's never stopped us before!

 

That's what I'm trying to demonstrate here. I'm playing Devil's advocate here. It's all about perspective and philosophy, and I'm describing how his horror can be seen as a utopia to someone else, as well as making a not so subtle statement against moral objectivity.

[von uber]

My Shepard used the Reapers to ensure human dominance in the galaxy for all time, making sure that those similar to TIM were always in power. The universe is going to be a beautiful place.

 

Sounds horrendous.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Sounds horrendous.

 

Paradise for all time.

[AlexMBrennan]

And Kahoku shouldn't have been poking his nose were it didn't belong.

Kahoku's crime was "not looking the other way when his guys got murdered" - I sure wouldn't want to live in this ideal world you and your terrorist buddies at Cerberus are trying to create. 

[von uber]

Paradise for all time.

 

Galatic apartheid eh. I'll stick with the big red button and

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Galatic apartheid eh. I'll stick with the big red button and

 

Who said anything about apartheid for the galaxy?

[von uber]

Who said anything about apartheid for the galaxy?

 

Dominance of humans enforced by a all-powerful police force to make sure the Aliens don't get uppity? Sounds like it to me.

[Barquiel]

Kahoku's crime was "not looking the other way when his guys got murdered" - I sure wouldn't want to live in this ideal world you and your terrorist buddies at Cerberus are trying to create. 

 

...and neither does Shepard

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Kahoku's crime was "not looking the other way when his guys got murdered" - I sure wouldn't want to live in this ideal world you and your terrorist buddies at Cerberus are trying to create. 

 

I thought his crime was not keeping his head down like the good little drone he is.

 

That said, I don't think anyone here is getting what I've said. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

...and neither does Shepard

 

Depending on the final choice, your Shepard can be the one who makes the galaxy into this.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Hmm, I thought my Shepard (who fully believed in and endorsed Cerberus ideals) took control of the Reapers and made the galaxy into a place where the strong wouldn't have to worry about the limitations by the weak. If you're delving into headcanon there, I'll do it too. My Shepard used the Reapers to ensure human dominance in the galaxy for all time, making sure that those similar to TIM were always in power. The universe is going to be a beautiful place.

 

Also, quote what you're talking about, I have no clue which of the points you're talking about: 

 

That said, sure it is. Just keep the man controlled.

 

And it might have been a problem for Teltin, but it seemed like a boon for Lazarus. Jack served her purpose on that Cerberus mission just fine to me.

 

I don't care what most people did. I left them because their lives were tertiary to my goals.

 

Hmm, I thought I made them useful by deceiving Wreav and gaining the Salarian fleet. I got a strong fleet with strong Krogan. Works for me.

To the first thing, it's common sense, at least in the destroy ending. Sur'Kesh never got hit. There were around 8 human ships left after the battle. Only 1-2 Salarian fleets ever commited to the war effort. It's no headcannon, it's common sense.

 

To the 2nd, I'm fairly new here, don't know how. 

To the 3rd, they didn't though. It was a failure, that produced no results. Even if you let the ******* scientist continues to torture his brother, they still can't control them. 

To the 4th, well, the actual thing they tried to do failed. 

To the 5th, aren't you a special little snowflake. 

To the 6th, no matter what, letting the bomb be detonated loses 300 points in war assets, no matter what happened with the Genophage, unless Wrex withdraws all Krogan support. But since "your" Shepard had Wreav, that doesn't matter. 

[ImaginaryMatter]

Is it too early for the popcorn gifs?

 

Ah, hell:

 

[rekn2]

I know this. However, I think her intent with her statement was directed at me personally. 

i see your point, she could have left out the "****** brilliant" part

[eyezonlyii]

Though I don't hold the same views I honestly am intrigued by Massively's version of Shepard and Cerberus. It's in all honestly a refreshing take on the events of the game instead of typical PARAGON! route most (including myself the first time) take. It's honestly the kind of decisions I would hope I would be strong enough to make, and in my head, I could make them if need be. I just thought I should say this, because I know I pester you about your views on Cerberus at times, even though in theory I can agree with some of their goals, if not their methods. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Dominance of humans enforced by a all-powerful police force to make sure the Aliens don't get uppity? Sounds like it to me.

 

No, they aren't a police force. The aliens won't be uppity.

 

They're an extermination force. To rid the galaxy of the filth of alien scum on the beauty of human purity.

[themikefest]

Is there any way to prove that is Shepard's kid since all Asari look the same? And why would Shepard want a Asari kid? What if Shepard wants to have a human kid? Is LIara prepared for that?

[rekn2]

Paradise for all time.

said every dictator ever. well, you have spoke of your political leanings before so this stance doesnt surprise me.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

To the 5th, aren't you a special little snowflake. 

To the 6th, no matter what, letting the bomb be detonated loses 300 points in war assets, no matter what happened with the Genophage, unless Wrex withdraws all Krogan support. But since "your" Shepard had Wreav, that doesn't matter. 

 

I take it you're not one who's familiar with playing Devil's Advocate. The premise is to show how there's always two sides to a coin, to any argument, and that one person's perspective isn't the same as another's.

 

And yeah, I am a special little snowflake. It's my game, the decision to not do anything for Grissom is there, and I do it. Or I can make an argument for why there is no objective truth to doing it.

 

That's fine. I'm fine with losing 300 assets from the Krogan. I'm going to finish them off post-war anyway. They just made my job easier.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

said every dictator ever. well, you have spoke of your political leanings before so this stance doesnt surprise me.

 

I've never understood why everyone hates dictators. 

 

I'm morally outraged by the moral outrage against them.

 

That said, I'll be blunt. I'm pulling a mind screw here.

[eyezonlyii]

I've never understood why everyone hates dictators. 

 

I'm morally outraged by the moral outrage against them.

 

That said, I'll be blunt. I'm pulling a mind screw here.

Probably because people are blending democracy, freedom and equality into one quasi ideal. That and the fact that even if a dictator was perfect, and under his or her rule there was a utopia, eventually that person will die, and then after that, there is no system of check in place to continue the previous person's agenda. 

 

Actually if one wanted a perpetual "perfect" dictatorship, one would place a synthetic in charge...but then we're back to square one.

[von uber]

Is there any way to prove that is Shepard's kid since all Asari look the same? And why would Shepard want a Asari kid? What if Shepard wants to have a human kid? Is LIara prepared for that?

 

Yes, Shep will have no choice.. first:

 

 

... and a few lessons from a certain Asari friend, leads to..