58 réponses à ce sujet

[DeinonSlayer]

Re-doing my canon FemShep and MaleShep, I realized it actually made more sense to switch who saved the Collector base and who destroyed it (thank you, Gibbed). I was surprised to see the dialogue on Mars changed.

Previously, MShep was the one who destroyed the base. He yelled at TIM that "the base was an abomination" where hundreds of thousands were murdered to justify the choice. When my FemShep was reassigned to have destroyed the base, though, instead of taking a moralistic stance, she said she destroyed the base because she didn't trust TIM with the contents. Instead of calling her idealistic, TIM simply called her shortsighted.

I'm not sure what changed, what influenced which autodialogue sequence was shown, but it was far more character-appropriate for both of them.

Has anyone else found autodialogue which significantly changes based on decisions made elsewhere?

[CronoDragoon]

Was your Femshep a Renegade?

 

Edit: For that matter was your Mshep a Paragon? I recall you saying you usually end up Paragade.

 

Also, I know autodialogue changes depending what you pick earlier in a given scene in ME3. Is that a possible variable?

[themikefest]

Its the conversation you have with TIM after the collectors were defeated.

[Farangbaa]

Destroying the collector base is stupid. I cannot wrap my hear around it. 

 

Which is probably why I never noticed this difference 

[DeinonSlayer]

Was your Femshep a Renegade?
 
Edit: For that matter was your Mshep a Paragon? I recall you saying you usually end up Paragade.
 
Also, I know autodialogue changes depending what you pick earlier in a given scene in ME3. Is that a possible variable?

No, they were actually both paragades (around 55/45). FShep was a bit more brusque in telling off Kaidan, though. Not sure if that would have changed anything.

It's interesting the little differences you can find...

[cap and gown]

You really need to be careful in talking with TIM after blowing up the Collector base. If you take the paragon options, then in ME3 Shepard will talk about the abomination. If you take the renegade/neutral stuff, you get the "I don't trust you" stuff.

 

Other variations I have noticed deal with your renegade vs paragon score. If your renegade is higher, then when EDI asks for moral advise, Shepard says she is not really the right person to ask about that sort of thing. Then when you talk to her later, she says even though you demurred about giving moral advise, she would still like your opinion on what her purpose should be. There are some other renegade vs paragon checks in ME3 that I noticed at the time but can't recall now. (Not just the Javik thing, or Liara's description of Shepard.)

[Farangbaa]

No, they were actually both paragades (around 55/45). FShep was a bit more brusque in telling off Kaidan, though. Not sure if that would have changed anything.

It's interesting the little differences you can find...

 

And then people said our choices didn't matter.

[Fixers0]

And then people said our choices didn't matter.

 

 

Well, because they don't. A change in a line here or there doesn't strike to me as realistic simulation of choices.  

[DeinonSlayer]

And then people said our choices didn't matter.

In some rather glaring areas, they don't. Things like the Council and the Collector base have little substantial impact on the plot. That said, there is more nuance to some of the autodialogue than it appears on the surface. That's what this thread is about.

[CronoDragoon]

Well, because they don't. A change in a line here or there doesn't strike to me as realistic simulation of choices.  

 

What is a realistic simulation of choices? In a "realistic" simulation of choices some of what you choose won't matter.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Its the conversation you have with TIM after the collectors were defeated.

 

Is "I'm getting a lot of bull**** on this line" sufficient, or do you also have to pick the "you can get in line or step aside, but don't get in my way" bit after that? I found the latter a little over the top, which is why I didn't usually pick it even with Shepards who did blow up the base.

 

My canon Shepard is about as idealist-Paragon as they come, and I still thought the line about how "that base was an abomination" was a little overdone. I mean, yes, it was, but I don't see why it would be wrong to use it to research possible defenses against the Reapers, as long as we're not using it to turn people into Reapers or otherwise exploit or enslave people.

 

On the other hand, she had zero intention of letting the Illusive Man anywhere near it. I did pick the "neutral" choice - "You get the help you deserve" - for her initial response to TIM but still got stuck with the "abomination" autodialogue in ME3.

[FlyingSquirrel]

 

Other variations I have noticed deal with your renegade vs paragon score. If your renegade is higher, then when EDI asks for moral advise, Shepard says she is not really the right person to ask about that sort of thing. Then when you talk to her later, she says even though you demurred about giving moral advise, she would still like your opinion on what her purpose should be. There are some other renegade vs paragon checks in ME3 that I noticed at the time but can't recall now. (Not just the Javik thing, or Liara's description of Shepard.)

 

I think the Shepard VI is different. I don't recall exactly what the lines are, but I think it's generally more polite-sounding if Shepard is a Paragon and more gruff if Shepard is a Renegade.

 

I also imagine - though I don't know - that there are variations in Brooks's response to the comment about the Normandy crew being legends, where somebody (I think either Shepard or the VS) says there are different kinds of legends and asks what kind they are. I've only done Citadel with a few of my Shepards, all of whom were Paragons or at least Paragades at the time, and I always got the response that people look up to them and owe them their lives. I wouldn't be surprised if she says something different to a Renegade.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 Hm. I always got the "I didn't trust you" line, myself, even though my ME2 carryover reputation is more Paragon. Only my girl-scout Paragon said the "abomination" line. It may be because I went Renegade in the ME2 post-mission TIM debrief.

 

Or because I went almost fully Renegade up to that point in ME3.

 

Or maybe it's just glitchy. Ya never know.

 

 

Speaking of which, anyone else notice that they got the James/VS dialogue about the Mars sandstorm backwards?

 

James: "Damn, that's a huge storm. Looks a lot bigger in person."

--

Kaidan: "Pretty average for Mars, actually."

Ashley: "Come on, Lieutenant, it's not that bad."

--

James: (re: Kaidan) "glad you're so optimistic."

James: (re: Ashley) "doesn't mean it can't kill us."

 

... yeah, I'm pretty sure they got James's response backwards.

[themikefest]

Is "I'm getting a lot of bull**** on this line" sufficient, or do you also have to pick the "you can get in line or step aside, but don't get in my way" bit after that? I found the latter a little over the top, which is why I didn't usually pick it even with Shepards who did blow up the base.

 

My canon Shepard is about as idealist-Paragon as they come, and I still thought the line about how "that base was an abomination" was a little overdone. I mean, yes, it was, but I don't see why it would be wrong to use it to research possible defenses against the Reapers, as long as we're not using it to turn people into Reapers or otherwise exploit or enslave people.

 

On the other hand, she had zero intention of letting the Illusive Man anywhere near it. I did pick the "neutral" choice - "You get the help you deserve" - for her initial response to TIM but still got stuck with the "abomination" autodialogue in ME3.

I believe if you go renegade with TIM you get the " I didn't trust you" line

 

If you go paragon with TIM you say "that base was an abomination"

 

I'm not sure what dialogue you get if you mix it up.

[Fixers0]

What is a realistic simulation of choices? In a "realistic" simulation of choices some of what you choose won't matter.

 

It means a choice should simulate the reaction of the fictional world in the most realistic manner possible.

[CronoDragoon]

It means a choice should simulate the reaction of the fictional world in the most realistic manner possible.

 

I see. So dialogue reflecting your earlier dialogue choices isn't a realistic simulation?

[DeinonSlayer]

I think the Shepard VI is different. I don't recall exactly what the lines are, but I think it's generally more polite-sounding if Shepard is a Paragon and more gruff if Shepard is a Renegade.

I also imagine - though I don't know - that there are variations in Brooks's response to the comment about the Normandy crew being legends, where somebody (I think either Shepard or the VS) says there are different kinds of legends and asks what kind they are. I've only done Citadel with a few of my Shepards, all of whom were Paragons or at least Paragades at the time, and I always got the response that people look up to them and owe them their lives. I wouldn't be surprised if she says something different to a Renegade.

I'd be curious if Anderson's view of Shepard as expressed in the datapads you find throughout the apartment changes much based on origin, alignment, actions etc.

[TheTurtle]

Speaking of which, anyone else notice that they got the James/VS dialogue about the Mars sandstorm backwards?

James: "Damn, that's a huge storm. Looks a lot bigger in person."
--
Kaidan: "Pretty average for Mars, actually."
Ashley: "Come on, Lieutenant, it's not that bad."
--
James: (re: Kaidan) "glad you're so optimistic."
James: (re: Ashley) "doesn't mean it can't kill us."

... yeah, I'm pretty sure they got James's response backwards.

It works either way really. When Kaidan says it's average for Mars that's like saying "Hey it could be worse"

When Ash says it's not that bad James could be thinking along the lines of "Just cause it's not kill us in a second bad it's still dangerous."

That's how I see it anyway

[teh DRUMPf!!]

It works either way really. When Kaidan says it's average for Mars that's like saying "Hey it could be worse"

When Ash says it's not that bad James could be thinking along the lines of "Just cause it's not kill us in a second bad it's still dangerous."

That's how I see it anyway

 

Perhaps, but that part always seemed a little bit "off" to me until I figured this out.

[KaiserShep]

I remember making a thread about this some time ago, about how much I disliked the abomination auto-remark in ME3, because not trusting them was a much more sensible reason than lamenting over what actually happened at the base. I found that it didn't make a difference what response I chose for TIM at the end of ME2. I did, however, get this line again after selecting nothing but renegade dialogue throughout most of the game's prologue, with only one exception in one of Liara's conversations.

[CrutchCricket]

You can get through the whole destroying the base sequences without going all bleeding heart "it's an abomination" "lolsoulofourspecies" or causing Miranda to do the same, if she's in your squad. It involves some renegade responses but mostly that unsung but everfaithful middle option, which got shot behind the shed between ME2 and 3.

[von uber]

Ive never got the abomination line,probably because I play renegon (about 70/30) up to me3, then more 60/40 in 3.

[Mcfly616]

Yeah, the whole autodialogue backlash is a bit excessive. That's not saying that I prefer it over ME1s approach. But the autodialogue changes based on your P/R score, past choices and based on what previous dialogue options you chose in that particular conversation.

It was Biowares attempt to make things more cinematic and flow more naturally instead of stopping the conversation after every single sentence so we can choose a new response. Instead the game makes the convo flow (with autodialogue) based on what type of character your Shepard has come to be. It's hit or miss. But I get what they were going for.

I've played the game 25 times and I'll still hear some new lines here and there.

[DeinonSlayer]

I've played the game 25 times and I'll still hear some new lines here and there.

[CronoDragoon]

I've played the game 25 times and I'll still hear some new lines here and there.

 

I'd wager there's a good portion of lines many players will never hear, between running past eavesdropping convos (some of the best writing in the game) never getting Mordin or Wrex or Thane killed pre-ME3, etc.