So a master in gymnastics equals kunfu master right? Muscles check, know how to use muscles check, great stamina check - ready to fight right? Learning martial arts is just a waste of time. Don't tell me you are really this thick..
Facepalm omg and what have common with mastery of magic? if you are master of magic you mastered using magic simple and don't need to think much hm?
So master in gymnastic knows gymnastics and master of kunfu knows kung fu (fight) when master of magic ...
Facepalm omg and what have common with mastery of magic? if you are master of magic you mastered using magic simple and don't need to think much hm?
So master in gymnastic knows gymnastics and master of kunfu knows kung fu (fight) when master of magic ...
Or could be the theory of magic, after all there is a world of difference between theory and practice.
Or could be the theory of magic, after all there is a world of difference between theory and practice.
Not disagreeing with you but adding on to what you said.
Knowing how to cast a firespell to light a campfire is significantly different from setting someone's face alight. There's an entirely different mindset.
Facepalm omg and what have common with mastery of magic? if you are master of magic you mastered using magic simple and don't need to think much hm?
So master in gymnastic knows gymnastics and master of kunfu knows kung fu (fight) when master of magic ...
You my friend dont seem to realise that for war you need to be properly trained. and that goes for the mages as well. By our standards a circle mage would be the same as a man that been shooting all his life as a sport. but that doesnt make him a good soldier. you still need to mentally and physically condition someone before he is fit for combat. Mages have neither. they are kept deliberately weak by the chantry to make them controllable.
mental stability, if mages had this then many would not have resulted to blood magic in times of desperation
mental stability, if mages had this then many would not have resulted to blood magic in times of desperation
Even the most hardcore soldier can crack in times of desperation.
But at end of DA2 I was really confused and you can see it was rushed, as the bad side of groups completely overshadowed the good side they both had.
mental stability, if mages had this then many would not have resulted to blood magic in times of desperation
You mean the mages in Kirkwall who were in a Tevinter Hellmouth, as per the Band of Three codex entries?
Or could be the theory of magic, after all there is a world of difference between theory and practice.
Yeas because he would be FE if he know only theory... so i guess non-mage can be master of magic if understand theory that have sense...
You my friend dont seem to realise that for war you need to be properly trained. and that goes for the mages as well. By our standards a circle mage would be the same as a man that been shooting all his life as a sport. but that doesnt make him a good soldier. you still need to mentally and physically condition someone before he is fit for combat. Mages have neither. they are kept deliberately weak by the chantry to make them controllable.
And still it doesn't mean that you can't mastery magic combat and magic are 2 different things but affect each other so physical god thanks to raw poer wouldn't need any traning to put master of the sword without effort. And no that mages are very obedient to the chantry considering numbers of blood mages...
Now you're inventing spells on the spot and diminishing some of the most powerful mages in the setting such as Corypheus and Orsino because they can't do the spells you just invented.
Ok, listen, I'm going to take my time to explain, take the time to carefully read and understand. Komandor this goes for you as well.
Everything so far for me indicates that using magic works exactly like using ones muscles, so spiritual muscles if you will.
We have spellpower which is the indication of ones pure magical might, so a mage that has very high spellpower is an equivalent of a person with big muscle mass that can lift very heavy objects, a guy who can fight with a big sledgehammer.
We have willpower which is an indication of mages mana reserve, which is mages stamina, having high willpower for a mage is an equivalent of person that can jog for a very long time, or a person who can swing their light rapier for a very long time.
Both of these together in unison make a very good ''physical'' condition and foundation for casting powerful spells and casting them a lot and often.
But that's not all. There is such thing as martial arts, an art of using your physical condition to the fullest potential. Often martial arts makes use of a weaker physical condition to such an extent that it can be more effective than greater physical condition, and to be a professional warrior it's not enough to just have great physical condition, one must also know how to fight properly and effectively and have right experience that is sharpened through years of training. Same goes for magic. Circle or non-combat oriented mages to me are an equivalent of people that go to a fitness gym. To be a real battle mage you must have not just the knowledge of magic, but also the knowledge of how to use it effectively, and years of training and perfection of these arts.
Imagine a mage that doesn't just learn how to conjure fire and how to cast a fireball, but goes to the shooting range every day and casts set fireball over and over again until they can't cast anymore, and does it for years until it becomes an instinct, until they can cast that fireball by any day any second without even thinking about it, when casting becomes as natural as using any other muscle in your body, like walking.
Then imagine said mage striving to make said fireball fly faster, so that it would be very hard to dodge even for fast moving targets, and working to understand fireball physics, direction and learning to improve accuracy, then adding some extra juice to the fireball so that if it is for example blocked by a shield it explodes and engulfs the whole enemy in fire anyway. Then imagine said mage training against actual opponents for a few more years and learning how to deal with everything that might happen on the battlefield, and finally said mage is going to go to war and put all these skills to serious practical use. THEN and only then, you have a real Mage ''warrior'', that knows how to fight with magic and knows warfare.
Where can you find these mages? Most definetely not in the circle, they don't train killing machines. You won't find them among the dalish, and not even among Tevinter mage nobility, it's not the mages like Corypheus that sit in their glittered chair spitting orders at slaves and enjoy their luxury. One of the places I can think of where such mages could be found are Tevinter battle front lines.
You say Corypheus is strong, and I agree, he is strong no doubt, but I also think that you can find quite a few scarred, battle hardened Tevinter mage war veterans that will wipe the floor with Corypheus. The kind of mages that live war everyday and kill Qunari by the hundreds.
Even if they wouldn't have the natural talent of Corypheus, or his shear power level, they would defeat him through through their experience and hard training. They would blast him fast, they would blast him hard and they would blast him just right, and they would stay calm and focused while doing so, and have appropriate defense that would work like on an instinct level like an eyelid protects an eye when it is in danger.
Corypheus to me is like a big jog bully that could no doubt kick the butt of a regular person through shear physical strength, but that doesn't mean that said jog could easily defeat a great martial artist, even if that martial artist has less raw physical strength. Circle mages are also akin to big muscular barbarians that are very effective on the battlefield just because of their overwhelming might compared to a regular person, but they are far from trained warriors.
Edit: Are these mages Gods? No.
Can they still be taken by surprise or be exhausted due to being overwhelmed by great numbers or other stress? Of course.
But a might of a battle mage is far greater than any mundane warrior can achieve.
Think about this, and tell me where my logic is flawed.
Ok, listen, I'm going to take my time to explain, take the time to carefully read and understand. Komandor this goes for you as well.
Everything so far for me indicates that using magic works exactly like using ones muscles, so spiritual muscles if you will.
We have spellpower which is the indication of ones pure magical might, so a mage that has very high spellpower is an equivalent of a person with big muscle mass that can lift very heavy objects, a guy who can fight with a big sledgehammer.
We have willpower which is an indication of mages mana reserve, which is mages stamina, having high willpower for a mage is an equivalent of person that can jog for a very long time, or a person who can swing their light rapier for a very long time.
Both of these together in unison make a very good ''physical'' condition and foundation for casting powerful spells and casting them a lot and often.
But that's not all. There is such thing as martial arts, an art of using your physical condition to the fullest potential. Often martial arts makes use of a weaker physical condition to such an extent that it can be more effective than greater physical condition, and to be a professional warrior it's not enough to just have great physical condition, one must also know how to fight properly and effectively and have right experience that is sharpened through years of training. Same goes for magic. Circle or non-combat oriented mages to me are an equivalent of people that go to a fitness gym. To be a real battle mage you must have not just the knowledge of magic, but also the knowledge of how to use it effectively, and years of training and perfection of these arts.
Imagine a mage that doesn't just learn how to conjure fire and how to cast a fireball, but goes to the shooting range every day and casts set fireball over and over again until they can't cast anymore, and does it for years until it becomes an instinct, until they can cast that fireball by any day any second without even thinking about it, when casting becomes as natural as using any other muscle in your body, like walking.
Then imagine said mage striving to make said fireball fly faster, so that it would be very hard to dodge even for fast moving targets, and working to understand fireball physics, direction and learning to improve accuracy, then adding some extra juice to the fireball so that if it is for example blocked by a shield it explodes and engulfs the whole enemy in fire anyway. Then imagine said mage training against actual opponents for a few more years and learning how to deal with everything that might happen on the battlefield, and finally said mage is going to go to war and put all these skills to serious practical use. THEN and only then, you have a real Mage ''warrior'', that knows how to fight with magic and knows warfare.
Where can you find these mages? Most definetely not in the circle, they don't train killing machines. You won't find them among the dalish, and not even among Tevinter mage nobility, it's not the mages like Corypheus that sit in their glittered chair spitting orders at slaves and enjoy their luxury. One of the places I can think of where such mages could be found are Tevinter battle front lines.
You say Corypheus is strong, and I agree, he is strong no doubt, but I also think that you can find quite a few scarred, battle hardened Tevinter mage war veterans that will wipe the floor with Corypheus. The kind of mages that live war everyday and kill Qunari by the hundreds.
Even if they wouldn't have the natural talent of Corypheus, or his shear power level, they would defeat him through through their experience and hard training. They would blast him fast, they would blast him hard and they would blast him just right, and they would stay calm and focused while doing so, and have appropriate defense that would work like on an instinct level like an eyelid protects an eye when it is in danger.
Corypheus to me is like a big jog bully that could no doubt kick the butt of a regular person through shear physical strength, but that doesn't mean that said jog could easily defeat a great martial artist, even if that martial artist has less raw physical strength. Circle mages are also akin to big muscular barbarians that are very effective on the battlefield just because of their overwhelming might compared to a regular person, but they are far from trained warriors.
Edit: Are these mages Gods? No.
Can they still be taken by surprise or be exhausted due to being overwhelmed by great numbers or other stress? Of course.
But a might of a battle mage is far greater than any mundane warrior can achieve.
Think about this, and tell me where my logic is flawed.
First at all it is not truth that martial arts don't require physical condition because to preform it you need great condition...
Second thing nages are traning pretty it are basics we can see in mage origin where mage train to counter enemy spells or control fire same with accuracy of spells is trained as we know from jowan dialogue they are trained to point that irving wanted train them even in using swords another prove is that harrowing is mostly about fighring with demons so i doubt that they weren't trained to do that so well...
Third you practically don't know nothing about Corypheus and tell us that he was lazy noble who was doing nothing and didn't had any battle experience and you know that how? Because i doubt that he gained power because he was watching old spice commercials 
First at all it is not truth that martial arts don't require physical condition because to preform it you need great condition...
Second thing nages are traning pretty it are basics we can see in mage origin where mage train to counter enemy spells or control fire same with accuracy of spells is trained as we know from jowan dialogue they are trained to point that irving wanted train them even in using swords another prove is that harrowing is mostly about fighring with demons so i doubt that they weren't trained to do that so well...
Third you practically don't know nothing about Corypheus and tell us that he was lazy noble who was doing nothing and didn't had any battle experience and you know that how? Because i doubt that he gained power because he was watching old spice commercials
Logic, logic and logic is all I can say. If you believe that mages at the circle are drilled to become killing machines fair enough. If you think that Tevinter nobility has more battle experience than political experience just like the lower class mages that are fighting for them on the battlefield, fair enough. I don't think it is so.
Logic, logic and logic is all I can say. If you believe that mages at the circle are drilled to become killing machines fair enough. If you think that Tevinter nobility has more battle experience than political experience just like the lower class mages that are fighting for them on the battlefield, fair enough. I don't think it is so.
Well when i see one i will be glad.Killed machines who said that neither soldiers are trained to be killing machines but both are trained and prepared well. Well because nobility in tevinter unlike in other countries like orlais where you need to pretend and frame others like in orlais for example tevinter nobility follows rule might makes right so you need be strong to keep position.
Well when i see one i will be glad.Killed machines who said that neither soldiers are trained to be killing machines but both are trained and prepared well. Well because nobility in tevinter unlike in other countries like orlais where you need to pretend and frame others like in orlais for example tevinter nobility follows rule might makes right so you need be strong to keep position.
Like I said, if that's your opinion fair enough. I don't see circle mages as being well trained and prepared for battle. I also don't think that merely a powerful gifted mage could just barge in Tevinter declaring himself the new Archon just because he can cast the biggest fireball or something.
Like I said, if that's your opinion fair enough. I don't see circle mages as being well trained and prepared for battle. I also don't think that merely a powerful gifted mage could just barge in Tevinter declaring himself the new Archon just because he can cast the biggest fireball or something.
It is not opinion it is truth at least with mages being trained it was proved they are so well...
As i said might makes right in teviner feynriel mentions that one magister (his master) killed another no one cared pretty much i can see such system working there... and no that wasn't what i said what i said it is rule might makes right so if another mage kills archon i guess he takes power if he is toughest... same with other nobles so you need to know how protect yourself in tevinter if you are mage.
No, it's an opinion. But hey like I said for the third time, you can disagree with me, I said everything I had to say.
Well proved fact isn't opinion opinion is when you ask someone if he s/he likes potatoes and fact is when we know that person eats potatoes...
oh my god, Kain this is pointless.
Being trained to defend themselves =/= being trained for battle.
oh my god, Kain this is pointless.
Sigh. 
What do you think about what I have written though? 
Being trained to defend themselves =/= being trained for battle.
And what you are doing during battle singing?
oh my god, Kain this is pointless.
When someone can see diffrence between opinion and fact well it is indeed pointless...
And what you are doing during battle singing?
Since my Rogues in Origins had the Bard specialization, yes.
Sigh.
What do you think about what I have written though?
I liked it, especially the way it began lol and I loved your glittered chair example 
but seriously, I agree wholeheartedly with you, but I'm sure you already knew that
I'm not sure why he doesn't understand that the Circle doesn't train warrior mages, it never has. That's kind of the point of it.
Since my Rogues in Origins had the Bard specialization, yes.
Yeah right... because song and screams can knock you down
And what you are doing during battle singing?
You heard it here first folks. If you've taken self-defense classes, you are ready for deployment on the front lines.
I liked it, especially the way it began lol and I loved your glittered chair example
but seriously, I agree wholeheartedly with you, but I'm sure you already knew that
I'm not sure why he doesn't understand that the Circle doesn't train warrior mages, it never has. That's kind of the point of it.
depends by what do you mean warrior if you mean swing sword then not (but here may depend on circle as irving wanted teach them that) if you mean they are trained to fight they are it is proved even harrowing is mostly fight test so well it they didn't know how to fight they would be dead/possessed at least that who went through harrowing.
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