If that's the case, why wouldn't Alistair and his Warden Queen simply turn to magic for help concieving if having an heir is really that important?
I imagine it's one of those things Gaider will fall back on if he decides there will be a royal heir later on. It's not something that's in the canon, just something Gaider said in response to a question about royal children.
As to Alistair and his queen-first they would have to find someone who would tell them it's not impossible for two Wardens to have a child, because that's something that's probably a widespread belief. Then having figured out that magic can help them, they'd have to track down an apostate because it's not something a Circle mage would likely know. Finally, they'd have to track down said apostate between the time of Origins and DAI, because it might be a bit harder to find apostates once the Mage-Templar war heats up. It might be something we see in DAI, but I imagine it'd take a bit of work for Alistair and his queen to find a apostate and work the proper ritual in time for them to have the child. I think there's a time limit on how long Wardens can have a decent chance of having any children because of the Taint.
I think what Gaider actually said is that it is possible for Wardens to conceive, but that with 2 Grey Wardens it's impossible unless magic is involved.
Ovum: "Hi Spermie, nice to meet you! I hope you won't mind too much if I say that you are looking a bit, uhhhm, tainted! Your donor wouldn't happen to be a Warden, would he? What, he is?! No, that really won't do! With both parents Grey Wardens, the poor child would be utterly doomed from the outset, what with their working hours and the nasty clientele and all that. Sorry, no can do."
As to Alistair and his queen-first they would have to find someone who would tell them it's not impossible for two Wardens to have a child, because that's something that's probably a widespread belief. Then having figured out that magic can help them, they'd have to track down an apostate because it's not something a Circle mage would likely know.
Why not? It seems to me that fertility treatments would be the sort of thing the Circle would want to be able to offer those with political power (and the Wardens only say they don't have this), and since the Chantry can claim a good deal of credit for anything the Circle does it seems to me they'd want this to happen too.
Why not? It seems to me that fertility treatments would be the sort of thing the Circle would want to be able to offer those with political power (and the Wardens only say they don't have this), and since the Chantry can claim a good deal of credit for anything the Circle does it seems to me they'd want this to happen too.
Exactly. There are so many ways to work around this. I mean he was a warden so he could by virtue of being a warden actually conscript mages to find something to help with this matter. There is no reason why not to actually find something to help with the taint. Frankly, given they say it's high time that more research was done, I would think conscripting mages for this specific purpose of finding a way to live a better life with the taint or be able to have children or not die through some kind of magic would be an excellent use of mages. I wouldn't even have them do the ritual. They are there for research and conscript them into the wardens but don't use them as warriors. Use them for research, this one being the primary thing. Also, if he is married to a warden she still is pretty much commander of the grey and she could do all this herself. Actually, I can see that being something my noble would do so they could have an heir but also because it would be nice if they found something that would make it so the wardens didn't have this death sentence over their heads. It would actually make a huge difference for the wardens if they found some way to undo it at some point whereby then perhaps the warden could have served their time and then go off to live their lives. Heck, it's a story. You can make up whatever you want. And this would resolve a lot of problems if the mages came up with something. It would give the mages more respect as well. And if they could find a way to help the wardens then that could probably be put to good use during a blight - think about all the people who die from taint. We've seen it in the series. Bethany/Carver in game two face this. It's not really mentioned in DAO that I recall or not much, but there are people who die from that and that would be an excellent reason to devote resources to that, particularly mages since the ground work for this exists already within the dark ritual. And the chantry really couldn't argue with it because the end goal would be to have a way to save people from the taint.
@ghostbuster: Perhaps your Alistair was still locked in from the Landsmeet? It might be possible to check that if earlier saves - post-Landsmeet but pre-Redcliffe - are still available.
I checked the plot script but it just pops up the party picker UI without further ado. The number of factors that might be related to locking in Alistair is staggering, though. Warden male, Warden female. Alistair king, not king. High approval, low approval. Alistair in love, not in love. Alistair ruling with Anora, without Anora. Alistair hardened, unhardened... etc. pp.
P.S.: I poked around in the toolset for a bit but couldn't find an efficient way of searching scripts without opening them all first. The magic function seems to be SetFollowerLocked().
The flag is romanced Alistair with 100% approval and Loghain is dead.
Why not? It seems to me that fertility treatments would be the sort of thing the Circle would want to be able to offer those with political power (and the Wardens only say they don't have this), and since the Chantry can claim a good deal of credit for anything the Circle does it seems to me they'd want this to happen too.
iDK-I tried to find Gaider's post earlier this morning but it looks like it's a very tedious process to find the older threads as your unable to search them on this forum and you'd need to go page by page on the old forum.
From what I remember, Gaider implied you'd need to work some pretty powerful magic to make it work. I'd think that rule out creation magic, it'd seem like it'd be something only a spirit healer could do. I think this would be something all the nobles would be interested in, so if the Circle could do it we might have heard about it already.
iDK-I tried to find Gaider's post earlier this morning but it looks like it's a very tedious process to find the older threads as your unable to search them on this forum and you'd need to go page by page on the old forum.
From what I remember, Gaider implied you'd need to work some pretty powerful magic to make it work. I'd think that rule out creation magic, it'd seem like it'd be something only a spirit healer could do. I think this would be something all the nobles would be interested in, so if the Circle could do it we might have heard about it already.
Good information.
I always took the stance that the baby was a don't care. I have made Anora queen alone and she doesn't ever marry. If the Warden wants to marry Alistair I strongly support it. This game does try to mess with the female wardens.
I always took the stance that the baby was a don't care. I have made Anora queen alone and she doesn't ever marry. If the Warden wants to marry Alistair I strongly support it. This game does try to mess with the female wardens.
Truly.... who cares about this baby. It's only brought up as a justification to screw the female players some more. All this nonsense at the end of the game is exactly why I never make him king anymore. Mages are way more fun for me and we just waltz off into the horizon when it's done.
You pointed out that the baby thing only exists to screw the female players, i don't understand what you mean by that.
Ah, sorry. My thoughts on that is that the baby thing becomes a reason to dump you under the right circumstances. I think if Alistair fights and kills Loghain he will dump you even at love status if you are a noble. I was broadsided by that one. Reloaded and killed loghain myself. They rig the game around the baby thing. He will become obsessed with having an heir and dump you because of the taint in your blood if the choices aren't made correctly. Sort of like dumping you for not being fertile. Gotta love that one especially since he's been tainted longer than you. This is the point in the game where he magically becomes a total douche where before, he's mr. compassionate who seems like he would never dump his first love and sex partner over this issue especially when they are both wardens - given that lifestyle. Just stupid game mechanics again around the landsmeet where women players get screwed over. Men marrying Anora never face this issue for a several reasons but mostly it's just a lame thing they throw in there and Gaider no matter how he justifies it always comes off looking sexist.
Akrabra, tartan-princess et ahellbornlady aiment ceci
You pointed out that the baby thing only exists to screw the female players, i don't understand what you mean by that.
They want the female story to sound as if you were selfish by romancing AL. The male warden marries Anora and they have a period called the golden age. I think Mike posted this.
The female warden if you romanced AL and the romance flag is still up you are going to be force to take AL to the final battle. If he didn't do the creepy DR with Morrigan then the big AL is going to die for you. Not a very happy ending.
Ah, sorry. My thoughts on that is that the baby thing becomes a reason to dump you under the right circumstances. I think if Alistair fights and kills Loghain he will dump you even at love status if you are a noble. I was broadsided by that one. Reloaded and killed loghain myself. They rig the game around the baby thing. He will become obsessed with having an heir and dump you because of the taint in your blood if the choices aren't made correctly. Sort of like dumping you for not being fertile. Gotta love that one especially since he's been tainted longer than you. This is the point in the game where he magically becomes a total douche where before, he's mr. compassionate who seems like he would never dump his first love and sex partner over this issue especially when they are both wardens - given that lifestyle. Just stupid game mechanics again around the landsmeet where women players get screwed over. Men marrying Anora never face this issue for a several reasons but mostly it's just a lame thing they throw in there and Gaider no matter how he justifies it always comes off looking sexist.
One added note. If Anora was Queen alone she doesn't marry and therefore she is not producing a child. This was totally unnecessary for them to add this.
They want the female story to sound as if you were selfish by romancing AL. The male warden marries Anora and they have a period called the golden age. I think Mike posted this.
The female warden if you romanced AL and the romance flag is still up you are going to be force to take AL to the final battle. If he didn't do the creepy DR with Morrigan then the big AL is going to die for you. Not a very happy ending.
Yes, it's so annoying how Gaider seems to have gone out of his ways to stick it to women in nearly all the scenarios.
Also, I know I've mentioned it before, but the default for this game, if you run it with code will marry Alistair to Anora. It always defaults to that if you get to a point in the game where you debug to the epilogue because you are getting crashes in glitchy areas (mainly most of the final battle is big for this for me) and if I use the debug to go to the epilogue rather than keep crashing just so I can complete my game it ALWAYS will marry the two of them. So every choice that is not marrying Alistair and Anora has all these things put in there to screw it up. Most especially for the female player as the male has no loss because he doesn't romance Alistair. Even when I had completed everything so that if I had to jump to the epilogue I should have been walking off with Alistair into the sunset, happily in love, both of us grey wardens still - it changed it so that he was king and she was queen.
One added note. If Anora was Queen alone she doesn't marry and therefore she is not producing a child. This was totally unnecessary for them to add this.
" Alistair is not the super macho dude, but the type of male character who is awkward and sweet. He wishes to find love in a familial as well as romantic sense. He’s definitely a character who doesn’t take love or relationships lightly. Alistair is also the kind of romance option that sweeps a girl off her feet. He gives your Warden a rose once his likeness gauge towards you is high enough. He expresses how much you mean to him. He even initiates the first kiss between the two of you. The entire romance truly plays out like the ultimate epic love story. But given the high notes of his romance, there are parts that do fall flat.
Now I’ve only ever played the story as the human noble. It is also the only story where you can marry Alistair––him being the only surviving heir for the throne in Ferelden. There is a point in the game where you need to convince Alistair to accept his role as king. Despite his refusal to take the crown, he has no real say in the matter if you want him as king. Alistair grudgingly accepts his new role, and you also need to select who rules beside him. As a human female noble, you also get to nominate yourself as Alistair’s queen which also forces a marriage proposal. Alistair comes to talk to you about it afterwards, and here’s where the romance gets a little less than ideal.
Alistair is a bit mad at your Warden for nominating him as king when the two of you talk in private. Other than the king issue, when Alistair addresses the marriage between him and your Warden, he acts like it’s the worse thing that could happen. This part irked me a bit. Yes, the Warden puts Alistair on the spot by making him king and forcing a marriage proposal all within a short time span, but you would think if Alistair is in love with your playable character, he would act more excited about being with the love of his life. Instead, his reaction isn’t quite so warm and fuzzy. This is the part of the romance that bothered me most. Despite that, the romance manages to play out better toward the end, but only if you take certain actions in the game to ensure a happily ever after."
I was able with a hardened Alistair 100% approval and making all the correct dialogue choices to get a much more favorable response from him when I made him King and the warden Queen. First you have to talk him into being King before the landsmeet and during the landsmeet. When he greets you after the landsmeet you have to be careful what you select. In the end you tell him that if they have to produce a child then good thing we have been practicing. I did this one a long time ago on xbox. I found a video on this. I didn't produce the video but the same person did an Alistair mistress as well.
" Alistair is not the super macho dude, but the type of male character who is awkward and sweet. He wishes to find love in a familial as well as romantic sense. He’s definitely a character who doesn’t take love or relationships lightly. Alistair is also the kind of romance option that sweeps a girl off her feet. He gives your Warden a rose once his likeness gauge towards you is high enough. He expresses how much you mean to him. He even initiates the first kiss between the two of you. The entire romance truly plays out like the ultimate epic love story. But given the high notes of his romance, there are parts that do fall flat.
Now I’ve only ever played the story as the human noble. It is also the only story where you can marry Alistair––him being the only surviving heir for the throne in Ferelden. There is a point in the game where you need to convince Alistair to accept his role as king. Despite his refusal to take the crown, he has no real say in the matter if you want him as king. Alistair grudgingly accepts his new role, and you also need to select who rules beside him. As a human female noble, you also get to nominate yourself as Alistair’s queen which also forces a marriage proposal. Alistair comes to talk to you about it afterwards, and here’s where the romance gets a little less than ideal.
Alistair is a bit mad at your Warden for nominating him as king when the two of you talk in private. Other than the king issue, when Alistair addresses the marriage between him and your Warden, he acts like it’s the worse thing that could happen. This part irked me a bit. Yes, the Warden puts Alistair on the spot by making him king and forcing a marriage proposal all within a short time span, but you would think if Alistair is in love with your playable character, he would act more excited about being with the love of his life. Instead, his reaction isn’t quite so warm and fuzzy. This is the part of the romance that bothered me most. Despite that, the romance manages to play out better toward the end, but only if you take certain actions in the game to ensure a happily ever after."
I was able with a hardened Alistair 100% approval and making all the correct dialogue choices to get a much more favorable response from him when I made him King and the warden Queen. First you have to talk him into being King before the landsmeet and during the landsmeet. When he greets you after the landsmeet you have to be careful what you select. In the end you tell him that if they have to produce a child then good thing we have been practicing. I did this one a long time ago on xbox.
In justification for some of that, if you don't tell him he would be a good king or encourage it in some way or even speak to him where he gets a chance to admit he has come to terms with it (if hardened) I can see how he would be pissed. That is totally logical. And also why he would not be Mr. Loving toward you. This doesn't surprise me because if the person you love and trust just blindsided you into being something you never wanted to be - King, no less - would you not feel angry or betrayed rather than grateful? Love is all well and good and I don't think this represents that he doesn't want to be married, but that he was blindsided by someone he implicitly trusted into a position he made clear in many conversations that he didn't want. I'd be pissed too. Sure, I'd still love them and want to marry them, I suppose though frankly I'd wonder about ulterior motives but Alistair might not given he's romantic at heart when I'm more of one who examines things. But I think his response in this specific case, if you hadn't hardened him or at least warned him, is more than justified.
However, if you do harden him he is okay with it. If you do tell him before hand and even encourage him, he is really happy about it in the landsmeet and makes a comment that this is the part in the dream where he usually wakes up (meaning it's when it's getting good). So to me, all of this is kind of expected. But a lot of other things are stuck in there as a blindside. However, first time players might not think to talk to him because had they tried more than once at eamon's they would have noted the repeating dialogue about the dining room and thought there were to be no more dialogue options, but after you talk to anora you get a new one. It's tricky because you could miss that and not realize there is a trigger embedded in there that must take place. They should have set up the dialogue so that you would always think to talk to him rather than having him repeat the same comment about the dining room because otherwise you could miss all of this.
They want the female story to sound as if you were selfish by romancing AL. The male warden marries Anora and they have a period called the golden age. I think Mike posted this.
Well it works, I always felt sorta selfish. The fandom picks right up on that btw, I guess that's why the Cousland Origin has such a bad reputation. I wonder if the same people think it's selfish when the male Cousland puts himself on the throne marries Anora...propably not.
I have a doubt. If you don't harden Alistair and marry him to Anora, does he refuse to have you as his consort?
He refused my Warden when hardened...
Well this goes back to how hardening can make him an idiot. I'm not sure about the specifics around how to continue an affair if he marries anora because that to me is never an option I choose. The arranged marriage doesn't fly for me because it feels so not special and you get tossed to the side. There are probably conditions for that as well as there are for everything else when playing a female romancing Alistair. I do know that when he is hardened he can become a jerk if you don't take the right steps.
It apparently is a complex dialogue branch and the fact that you are his love and you pair him with anora doesn't sit well with him at all. That's why this is just another way to trick you up as a female player romancing alistair, but I would say that as a female player in romance with Alistair, why would you want him to marry anora? I would never approve of that. Never. He's either king alone or not king but never marrying. So this is where it does get complex.
Here's an old thread in the old forum that I found:
I have a doubt. If you don't harden Alistair and marry him to Anora, does he refuse to have you as his consort?
He refused my Warden when hardened...
True. You have to harden AL if you want to be consort. There is a video hardened consort. I also this this a long time ago. I'll put the person's video and I'll try to find my notes for you. I haven't done that one in years.
Well it works, I always felt sorta selfish. The fandom picks right up on that btw, I guess that's why the Cousland Origin has such a bad reputation. I wonder if the same people think it's selfish when the male Cousland puts himself on the throne marries Anora...propably not.
No none of the guys feel selfish. Many have killed Alistair and kept Loghain as their father-in-law. I don't think you should feel selfish. You did the hard work and if you want to enjoy your relationship you should be able to without the stupid backlash for no real reason. Just remember I can put Anora on the throne alone and she never has a kid.
Please forgive me but I think they were counting on making you feel that way. The game has so many double standards it is not funny. Should you feel guilty about a relationship when you saved the country? Where are your perks? Guys have no problem in this area. They won't put up with it.
How about that silly Arl? If he was so worried about the bloodline why did he send Al to be a drug addicted Templar while he married a brain dead woman half his age? He did whatever that woman wanted. Poor kid took the heat.
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