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In the 2013 Tomb Raider game, you play as a lesbian woman trying to rescue her damsel in distress.
Wait, really? I just thought Lara Croft got a new look. I didn't know she was also a lesbian. Or is she not Lara?
I'll definitely buy that now. Wow. Very cool.
TLDR; I hope the LGB characters in DA:I aren't so easily skippable. I don't believe in giving homophobic players an easy out to avoid the things they think are icky.
I think things have already changed and I'm talking about DA2. I think all the characters where bisexual in it and I think DAI will also have different sexualities so I don't think you can avoid them.
I think things have already changed and I'm talking about DA2. I think all the characters where bisexual in it and I think DAI will also have different sexualities so I don't think you can avoid them.
That made it so you could avoid them , well except Anders which caused a major backlash. Funnily enough from both straight and gay people.
I think boundries. Don't tell me about your sex life unless I ask is a good rule for NPCs.
And this is part of why I think it's a good idea: because it outs IRL bigots. If it every game had a romance, and the end result was that such people avoid videogames as a whole, everyone would be better off for it.
The same if having different ethnicities in a medieval setting got rid of the IRL racists, or having women in position of power got rid of IRL sexists.
These are groups whose interest should not only not be taken into account, but actively undermined so far as possible without actually causing too much financial damage to the company to the extent that they're still part of the market.
That made it so you could avoid them , well except Anders which caused a major backlash. Funnily enough from both straight and gay people.
I think boundries. Don't tell me about your sex life unless I ask is a good rule for NPCs.
I don't quite understand. Could you elaborate?
Someone who says "I'd support you if only you were nicer!" is LYING. It wouldn't matter HOW you approached them. That's the kind of person who's mind is made up already.
If a black person or a gay person has to always talk with sweetness and niceties to be able to receive basic human rights or respect, then that's a problem. And if I'm talking to a homophobe-- especially someone who is outspoken about how gross they find my relationship-- then no amount of sweettalking is going to change their mind.
Shouting/anger might not change their mind either, but it does get stuff done on a larger scale (protests, demonstrations, etc). Also, in my experience, good people who are just genuinely ignorant or who don't get it, are more likely to get (and not forget) it if I'm ACTUALLY UPSET and they can really see that, than if I pussyfoot around and say things like "nono, it's okay, i'm not angry, but I wish maybe you wouldn't say things like that, please, thank you."
Well no, i'm not talking about people who use your tone as an excuse to disagree with you. I am talking about the expression "you catch more flies with honey than with vineger", there is actually allot of truth to this. People are usually more open to you if you are respectful towards them. Not everyone against lgbt rights is a set in their ways homophobe, sometimes people were just taught the wrong thing and never really questioned it.
I'm not saying you have to be sweet to bigots, I am saying empathy should apply to you too. You don't have to be sweet to people to be respectful and to not act like some petulant child. Try and see why other people might have opinions like that, try to understand that they are not all inherently bad people rather than just attacking them.
Protests and demonstrations are not the same as shouting and anger and they are not the same as attacking someone who does not agree with you. In my experience being really hard on people who are just uneducated or mistaken can easily turn them away from you. Why would they want to think the way you do when it causes you to behave so nastily towards others?
Wait, really? I just thought Lara Croft got a new look. I didn't know she was also a lesbian. Or is she not Lara?
I'll definitely buy that now. Wow. Very cool.
That made it so you could avoid them , well except Anders which caused a major backlash. Funnily enough from both straight and gay people.
I think boundries. Don't tell me about your sex life unless I ask is a good rule for NPCs.
If a player mentions their sexuality, it's not a big deal. Mentioning your significant other is a common thing in conversation. I'm not aware of any NPCs outside of the LI's and the prostitutes who outwardly put their "sex lives" (i.e. what they do in the bedroom) out there for you. Although I might be forgetting someone.
Your last sentence proves the folly of your statement - money. These are video games, not social engineering projects. The goal is to make entertainment. If you happen to have some social commentary and even result in some good discussion, that is a bonus, not a driving force.
Saying "let's offend as many people as possible so that they will stay out of our sandbox" is not an ideal a company who invests hundreds of millions of dollars into a product meant for mass consumption can afford. If this was an indie studio or a non-profit company, sure. But a company that needs to sell millions of copies of a game cannot afford to alienate or ostracize large groups of potential customers, regardless of if you disagree with them or not.
After all... Bioware could obfuscate the gender choice in character creation, since society's expectations about gender norms are rapidly coming under question. You simply make a character, with any appearance you like, with the same content, the same non-gender pronouns and the same reactions (or lack thereof) to anything related to the outward visual of your character.
That would be the penultimate in fairness and equality. And it would also offend those uppity players who are so crass as to be gender myopic and actually want to play as a female or male. But how dare they! Get them out of our sandbox!
There's also a difference between making a game that you want to make and catering to people who have bigoted views. I think In Exile's point (and certainly one that I agree with) is that they should make their games with inclusion in mind since that's what they want to do. And if that drives people who don't like inclusion away, well, that's on the person who's holding the bigoted views. The times have changed and companies do better financially when they are inclusive and not exclusive. In other words, the money (and popular opinion) is not on the side of the bigoted, so Bioware doesn't seem concerned about catering to that particular clientele. That being said, I also don't think they are interested in actively rejecting them either. If people don't like the product, in 2014, there will be enough people who do that it's not a big deal if those bigoted people take their money elsewhere. At least, that's how I see it.
She is. It was hinted at in the game - kind of danced around - but made explicit in the recent comics (written as a bridge to the next game).
You don't even need Yuri Goggles to see it, either. Take a look at this gif from the end of the game (spoilers, I guess):
Spoiler
Then again,
Spoiler
Very cool. And yes, that last spoiler is frustrating. Stupid tropes!
I don't quite understand. Could you elaborate?
"herosexual" rather than bisexual. Different gendered PC's would get different responses. Or as I like to to call them "Schrodinger's sexdolls". You don't know what they are until you open the box 
Anders was the only one that would outright flirt with a male PC and that caused all kinds of problems. Partly because of that and partly because of the rival points you got when you shot him down.
If people don't like the product, in 2014, there will be enough people who do that it's not a big deal if those bigoted people take their money elsewhere. At least, that's how I see it.
And if those people don't materialise ? It's easy to take risks with other peoples money.
It's better to just let the tiger sleep.
"herosexual" rather than bisexual. Different gendered PC's would get different responses. Or as I like to to call them "Schrodinger's sexdolls". You don't know what they are until you open the box
Anders was the only one that would outright flirt with a male PC and that caused all kinds of problems. Partly because of that and partly because of the rival points you got when you shot him down.
Why was it so bad that Anders flirted with you? If you wouldn't get rivalry points would it have been better?
There's also a difference between making a game that you want to make and catering to people who have bigoted views. I think In Exile's point (and certainly one that I agree with) is that they should make their games with inclusion in mind since that's what they want to do. And if that drives people who don't like inclusion away, well, that's on the person who's holding the bigoted views.
The times have changed and companies do better financially when they are inclusive and not exclusive. In other words, the money (and popular opinion) is not on the side of the bigoted, so Bioware doesn't seem concerned about catering to that particular clientele.
That being said, I also don't think they are interested in actively rejecting them either. If people don't like the product, in 2014, there will be enough people who do that it's not a big deal if those bigoted people take their money elsewhere. At least, that's how I see it.
Why was it so bad that Anders flirted with you? If you wouldn't get rivalry points would it have been better?
Varied from person to person.
I barely dragged myself through the game once and chose Merrill (I know her VA so awkward). Dragon Age 2, not an enjoyable game for me.
Wait, really? I just thought Lara Croft got a new look. I didn't know she was also a lesbian. Or is she not Lara?
I'll definitely buy that now. Wow. Very cool.
I think things have already changed and I'm talking about DA2. I think all the characters where bisexual in it and I think DAI will also have different sexualities so I don't think you can avoid them.
Yeah, that's part of why I liked the all-bisexual LI in DA2. But since they're going back to set sexualities for DAI, there's the potential for them to write it so that the gay/bi LIs are skippable again. I HOPE it doesn't happen, and I'm crossing my fingers!
Lara is not confirmed as gay during the game, is just hinted slightly that her & Sam are more then friends.
http://gaygamer.net/...ara-to-be-gay/
This is an interview with the woman who wrote Lara in which she specifically says:
There’s part of me that would’ve loved to make Lara gay. I’m not sure Crystal would be ready for it! But we’ve not spoken about it directly, either. Who knows what the future might hold? It is a bit of a minefield.
So, hinted or not, it wasn't explicitly canon, or intended. And players could go through the whole game without ever suspecting they were playing anything but a straight character. Sadly, I can't really count that as representation.
On the plus side, the fact that the main writer WANTS to do it, makes me hopeful for the future, at least!
I know Gaider threw a diapershitting tantrum over the idea on his dumblr, but I actually liked the proposal of giving your character a chosen sexuality during character creation
No more of my gay warden stumbling into a relationship with Leliana and no more gay Hawke giving Isabela his biggest, smarmiest smirk when she flirts with him
Spoiler
I really hope that doesn't happen, want a happy lesbian relationship for once without anything tragic happening 
Inclusion to the point of exclusion is inclusion. Got it.
No one is being excluded. The people you are talking about are choosing to exclude themselves because they would prefer to continue to see groups of people not represented. It's their right to do so, but I won't feel sorry for them.
I'm not sure of the market of being bigoted, but I can name you the top 10 movies, games and TV shows that all deal with white, hetero-normal leads. So I'm not sure where you get that inclusivity is more profitable. It's not actively HARMFUL... until, again, you reach the level of inclusivity to the point of exclusivity.
Just because a game, movie, or TV show has a white hetero lead, doesn't mean it's not inclusive. That's not at all what I mean by it. I mean that, if you are actively exclusive (i.e., this product is not for racial minorities, LGBT individuals, women, etc.), then you will do worse financially than people who are inclusive. Look at all of the boycotts that have been happening because of this. That's what I'm talking about.
What is "enough people?" This isn't an orphanage that needs to raise enough money to keep the bank from buying them out... it is a for-profit business. EA can't put on a quarterly statement to its shareholders "we invested $100 million in a game and only made $75 million in gross revenue... but the amount of people outside the statistically ignored demographics who got to engage in some digital hanky panky with our characters is at an all time high!" If they did, the board would call for people's heads.
It is an entertainment company. Entertainment has often been a source, and indeed, leader, of socially progressive ideas and concepts. But it always has to walk the line of entertainment vs. preaching. Having a goal where you alienate anyone by being an extreme is not good, but is (as depressing as this is to say) only acceptable when the group you are alienating is much smaller than the group you are bringing in.
Of course it has to bring in money. See my earlier point. I guarantee you that the number of people who are willing to boycott a product for being inclusive is far less than the number of people willing to boycott a product for being actively exclusive. It's 2014. Times have changed and money is flowing in the direction of inclusivity.
Yeah, that's part of why I liked the all-bisexual LI in DA2. But since they're going back to set sexualities for DAI, there's the potential for them to write it so that the gay/bi LIs are skippable again. I HOPE it doesn't happen, and I'm crossing my fingers!
or that straight women get romances which will end badly 
If something has happened before it doesn't mean that it will happen again.
So, hinted or not, it wasn't explicitly canon, or intended. And players could go through the whole game without ever suspecting they were playing anything but a straight character. Sadly, I can't really count that as representation.
On the plus side, the fact that the main writer WANTS to do it, makes me hopeful for the future, at least!
I really hope that doesn't happen, want a happy lesbian relationship for once without anything tragic happening
In the 2013 Tomb Raider game, you play as a lesbian woman trying to rescue her damsel in distress.
Errr, as much as i'd LOVE to, Lara is not a lesbian. Neither straight of course, she's just ambiguous at best (as always was) so people can headcanon her sexuality, which imo is a good idea because if the devs were to give her a sexuality, they'd use the 'easy' way and make her straight as usual.
I really hope that doesn't happen, want a happy lesbian relationship for once without anything tragic happening
Lesbian stories ar always tragic and end up with death or break ups. Didn't you know? 
And the 'agenda' word is starting to annoy me.
I know, right? But Square Enix needs more games, so. Ugh.
Apparently if you want fiction with lesbian romances that are both vanilla and not tragic, you have to write it yourself!
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