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Its simple it will just render them non LI status. Since given the reaction to Anders I doubt Bioware are going to have anyone actively flirting anyway.
If it's likely that the LIs won't be actively flirting with the PC anyway, what would the point of the toggle even be? I'm very, very confused.
I know you love to argue things to death, but... can't you just accept that a sexuality toggle makes people uncomfortable without interrogating them to find flaws in that reasoning?
Giving players the option to remove any same-sex content (or opposite-sex content) is fulfilling a very specific request that is not done for any other content that people might find offensive. The intention behind that request is as important as its perception; are the people who request it homophobic, and would that request be seen as homophobic by other people? If so, why would Bioware want to feed those two narratives?
I'll quote David Gaider, since he explains this better than I can:
Why not ? People expect and get difficulty toggles , they have divorced the Friendly Fire option from the difficulty in DA:I. I don't think that's a rule as much as an opinion. I don't see why what someone else does matters.
See below about LI off switch.
Because the developers don't want to do this?
Difficulty and friendly-fire sliders affect gameplay mechanics, not the story. If the developers want a story told a certain way, why should fans get to toggle parts of that on and off?
And why - of all the controversial things in Bioware's games - does that need to be sexuality? Isn't giving players that option a terrible precedent?
And why - of all the controversial things in Bioware's games - does that need to be sexuality? Isn't giving players that option a terrible precedent?
I don't see how. Everyone get's the experience they want. I mean we live our lives doing that anyway.Something you don't like on TV, you change the channel.
I don't see it as any different to someone changing the channel.
I don't see how. Everyone get's the experience they want. I mean we live our lives doing that anyway.Something you don't like on TV, you change the channel.
I don't see it as any different to someone changing the channel.
I don't see how. Everyone get's the experience they want. I mean we live our lives doing that anyway.Something you don't like on TV, you change the channel.
I don't see it as any different to someone changing the channel.
If you aren't comfortable with what is in Bioware's games, don't buy the game. Take the experience as a whole, or don't take it at all.
Asking to filter a specific kind of content (and nothing else - not the violence, gore, slavery, racism or horror) clearly implies people have a problem with same-sex relationships.
This is not an attitude that I expect Bioware to cater towards, and I don't believe they ever will.
If it's likely that the LIs won't be actively flirting with the PC anyway, what would the point of the toggle even be? I'm very, very confused.
It's to prevent the player from even having to even consider the possibility, obviously. Even seeing that heart icon when talking to someone of the same sex as the PC is apparently very disturbing to some of us.
If you aren't comfortable with what is in Bioware's games, don't buy the game. Take the experience as a whole, or don't take it at all.
As Jimmy pointed out. That's a terrible thing for a company.
You can already toggle gore.
As Jimmy pointed out. That's a terrible thing for a company.
You can already toggle gore.
I see it as very different.
Changing the channel means watching something else. You can do that with games, too... play something else.
A toggle that changes the experience does just that - it changes the experience. You can't select an option to watch The Big Bang Theory without nerds. Or Game of Thrones without incest. You can watch another comedy, or fantasy drama ... but you can't experience the content in question differently by pressing a button.
This would be a unique aspect to the video game medium. It is one that few developers have really considered or utilized, mostly due to design and budget constraints... but it would still be markedly different than changing the channel.
Accepted but not quite how I was looking at it. I was looking at it as in we all have access to the same potential entertainment channels but we choose what option (program) we select from that. What someone elses watches does not change what I watch in any way.
If you removed the political and social context of sexuality
Wait, what?
The entire reason that people are asking for a toggle is because of the political and social context of sexuality, and that's why it's offensive. We wouldn't be having this discussion if sexuality wasn't a controversial issue! People wouldn't be asking for a toggle if sexuality had no meaning.
You can create hypotheticals all afternoon in which a toggle is boiled down to a means to customise the story, but it will never just be that when so many of its proponents are people who feel that content shouldn't be in "their game". Not just any content, but a specific subset of content that has historically been absent from media representation in Western culture for, say, the last millennium or so. The motivation of a toggle is - largely - nothing to do with customising the story, it's about filtering it.
I am not interested in arguing about the merits of a toggle only as something that changes the experience. You can't separate the toggle from the intentions of the people who are arguing for it, and the perception that would be generated from doing it. It is people asking to remove content they don't like, and the developer would be caving to their demands by doing it. It's offensive because no other parts of the game are subject to the same demands for filtering, and because a filter would mean the developers had acquiesced to the demands of homophobes.
As Jimmy pointed out. That's a terrible thing for a company.
You can already toggle gore.
How many people are seriously not going to buy Inquisition because it includes gay characters and same-sex relationships that you cannot skip? How many people base their purchasing decisions on a game's sexuality content?
Refusing to include a toggle hardly counts as aggressively diminishing their audience - that proposition is absurd.
Wait, what?
The entire reason that people are asking for a toggle is because of the political and social context of sexuality, and that's why it's offensive. We wouldn't be having this discussion if sexuality wasn't a controversial issue! People wouldn't be asking for a toggle if sexuality had no meaning.
You can create hypotheticals all afternoon in which a toggle is boiled down to a means to customise the story, but it will never just be that when so many of its proponents are people who feel that content shouldn't be in "their game". Not just any content, but a specific subset of content that has historically been absent from media representation in Western culture for, say, the last millennium or so. The motivation of a toggle is - largely - nothing to do with customising the story, it's about filtering it.
I am not interested in arguing about the merits of a toggle only as something that changes the experience. You can't separate the toggle from the intentions of the people who are arguing for it, and the perception that would be generated from doing it. It is people asking to remove content they don't like, and the developer would be caving to their demands by doing it. It's offensive because no other parts of the game are subject to the same demands for filtering, and because a filter would mean the developers had acquiesced to the demands of homophobes.
Thats not the case though. Difficulty is already changed because people wanted to play the hardest level of the game without firendly fire or lower levels with friendly fire.
No one is outraged that friendly fire has been removed from the hardest level as far as I'm aware. Now it means that people can tailor the game even more to their liking.
Since the option i choose is entirely upto me, the toggle makes no difference to my game.
How many people are seriously not going to buy Inquisition because it includes gay characters and same-sex relationships that you cannot skip? How many people base their purchasing decisions on a game's sexuality content?
Refusing to include a toggle hardly counts as aggressively diminishing their audience - that proposition is absurd.
That we can't know. I mean you could say that playersexual characters are the reason DA2 sold half of what DA:O did, but you would have no way to prove it.
Again thats something we don't know because no one has statatics. We do know if it came to a head on fight its not even a question of whch way Bioware would go.Or at least EA would make them go.
Adjusting gameplay mechanics and adjusting parts of the story are not the same thing.
It is entirely misleading to compare them.
Nobody is outraged about friendly fire being removed because nobody in Bioware's audience identifies with friendly fire, and friendly fire also does not have a history of being marginalised in Western media. Friendly fire does not have its own interest groups and publications that will get absolutely enraged about any threat to remove it. Friendly fire does not start passionate debates on the forum between people who find it icky and irrationally hate it, and people who support its inclusion. Friendly fire is not involved in social and political debates in most countries on the planet.
That we can't know. I mean you could say that playersexual characters are the reason DA2 sold half of what DA:O did, but you would have no way to prove it.
Again thats something we don't know because no one has statatics. We do know if it came to a head on fight its not even a question of whch way Bioware would go.Or at least EA would make them go.
In what universe is ANYONE suggesting it will come to a head on fight?
That's a ridiculous false dichotomy. The game does not and will never have to choose between pandering to homophobes and pandering to LGBT players.
Adjusting gameplay mechanics and adjusting parts of the story are not the same thing.
It is entirely misleading to compare them.
Nobody is outraged about friendly fire being removed because nobody in Bioware's audience identifies with friendly fire, and friendly fire also does not have a history of being marginalised in Western media. Friendly fire does not have its own interest groups and publications that will get absolutely enraged about any threat to remove it. Friendly fire does not start passionate debates on the forum between people who find it icky and irrationally hate it, and people who support its inclusion. Friendly fire is not involved in social and political debates in most countries on the planet.
Thats because you feel strongly about one and not the other. A toggle is a toggle, it allows a player to change the game more to their liking. I couldn't care less what is toggled as long it has no impact on my game.
not to muddy the waters too much, but i wouldnt hate a toggle to shut off all romances regardess of gender. i mean, i feel obligated to do one or two on my initial playthroughs...but after that its not really content i care much for. and i kinda feel obligated to do so when the option is presented due to the work thats gone into them...but unless theyve revamped them a fair bit for DAI its not something that ill be looking forward to. so an off toggle for romances would be A-ok in my books
Thats because you feel strongly about one and not the other. A toggle is a toggle, it allows a player to change the game more to their liking. I couldn't care less what is toggled as long it has no impact on my game.
And some people find toggling away the gay to be offensive. You do get that, right? You think they're wrong, but you get it?
Edit: "offensive" isn't really the right word for me. I just think it's in really bad taste, like a fart joke or something.
not to muddy the waters too much, but i wouldnt hate a toggle to shut off all romances regardess of gender. i mean, i feel obligated to do one or two on my initial playthroughs...but after that its not really content i care much for. and i kinda feel obligated to do so when the option is presented due to the work thats gone into them...
Gamer OCD is a terrible thing.
Gamer OCD is a terrible thing.
its not like im an achievement wh**e or anything, im not compelled to get every cheevo. but i feel the same way about romances as i do about hidden areas and secrets...gotta see it all at least once. effort went into it, it should be seen and appreciated. but hidden areas/ semi-locked content are one thing.....attempting to suck it up and romance a set of pixels im not particularily fond of (anders) is another
I know some of you would genuinely prefer to pretend like gay people don't exist. It probably confusing for you to live in a world where LGBT folks aren't staying in the closet as much and you have to be confronted with them in real life. Maybe you're even afraid one of them might hit on you! I understand that when you're playing games, you generally get to escape into a world where you don't have to face a changing social landscape that might not automatically, unquestioningly assume your heterosexuality. You want things to stay the same. You want to be able to ignore the LGBT people because it makes you uncomfortable. I mean, you don't mind that they exist, you just don't want to see it. You don't want to have to be in the awkward situation of having to tell someone that you're fine with them being gay, but personally you're straight. In a perfect world, the gays would just keep to themselves and never mention their gayness to you so you wouldn't get put in an uncomfortable situation.
Am I wrong?
When you ask for a toggle to switch off gay/bi interactions, it makes you sound like the hypothetical person I described above. I'm not blaming you for it-- I understand it's uncomfortable to have your status quo messed with.
But, the point is really moot, as Bioware will never institute a toggle like this.
So I guess, yeah, all I can say is "suck it up".
But this is not at all what I suggested.
The toggle proposed would strictly affect how the NPCs interact with the character, not their very existence. The toggle proposed would just prevent any same sex (or, conversely, opposite sex if the player is so inclined ) romances from being initiated. It does not delete any such characters from the game entirely, like your race toggle implies. So the two ideas are apples and oranges in comparison.
RIght, because in real life we have these toggles. Tell you what, do what you should do in real life: Don't flirt, and move on.
I know some of you would genuinely prefer to pretend like gay people don't exist. It probably confusing for you to live in a world where LGBT folks aren't staying in the closet as much and you have to be confronted with them in real life. Maybe you're even afraid one of them might hit on you! I understand that when you're playing games, you generally get to escape into a world where you don't have to face a changing social landscape that might not automatically, unquestioningly assume your heterosexuality. You want things to stay the same. You want to be able to ignore the LGBT people because it makes you uncomfortable. I mean, you don't mind that they exist, you just don't want to see it. You don't want to have to be in the awkward situation of having to tell someone that you're fine with them being gay, but personally you're straight. In a perfect world, the gays would just keep to themselves and never mention their gayness to you so you wouldn't get put in an uncomfortable situation.
Am I wrong?
When you ask for a toggle to switch off gay/bi interactions, it makes you sound like the hypothetical person I described above. I'm not blaming you for it-- I understand it's uncomfortable to have your status quo messed with.
But, the point is really moot, as Bioware will never institute a toggle like this.
So I guess, yeah, all I can say is "suck it up".
wat? your telling me that if you had an option to not be subjected to the romance plots you dont like you wouldnt take it? im not in support of anything, but the option to skip romances is something that doesnt really bother me at all. regardless of which one gets skipped
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