2138 réponses à ce sujet

[drummerchick]

I have pointed at Garrus as an example, and the same goes with Thane. I would never imagine them as bi. None of them even gives a hint that they could be into different orientation. It is a problem of characters that writers create, like in a book or a film, and not developers' of the game.

 

But I will probably just shut my mouth about this topic, because whatever I say I am attacked T_T

Just because you can't imagine it, doesn't mean it isn't possible.  

But I do agree, there is no evidence of Garrus or Thane being attracted to men. But that's not the point. Sexuality is personal, and we can never know a person's sexuality unless they make us aware.

[phantomrachie]

I have pointed at Garrus as an example, and the same goes with Thane. I would never imagine them as bi. None of them even gives a hint that they could be into different orientation. It is a problem of characters that writers create, like in a book or a film, and not developers' of the game.

 

But I will probably just shut my mouth about this topic, because whatever I say I am attacked T_T

 

I'm not attacking, I'm genuinely curious.

 

Garrus and Thane never hinted that they were bi & I've never thought of them as such. Though unless the topic comes up in conversation, we generally infer people's sexuality by the people they date/have sex with/fall in love with, this is why bisexual people sometimes have to 'come out' multiple times.

 

So I was curious as to what behaviour a person might exhibit to allow you to see them as possible bi 

[Fisva]

Just because you can't imagine it, doesn't mean it isn't possible.  

But I do agree, there is no evidence of Garrus or Thane being attracted to men. But that's not the point. Sexuality is personal, and we can never know a person's sexuality unless they make us aware.

Yes, I know it doesn't mean it is impossible. I am just trying to show you my understanding of this problem from a writer's point of view, as well as a "straight person" who is overwhelmed by bi and homosexual characters in almost every game. That's why I am saying that if game is supposed to be for everyone, there should be a variety of choices, and I think this is what writers provide. Bioware will do what they think is best anyway.

Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to offend anyone.

[Fisva]

 

So I was curious as to what behaviour a person might exhibit to allow you to see them as possible bi 

I'm sorry, I used wrong words. I meant that they never say anything about their preferences.

(English is my foreign language XD)

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Yes, I know it doesn't mean it is impossible. I am just trying to show you my understanding of this problem from a writer's point of view, as well as a "straight person" who is overwhelmed by bi and homosexual characters in almost every game. That's why I am saying that if game is supposed to be for everyone, there should be a variety of choices, and I think this is what writers provide. Bioware will do what they think is best anyway.
Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to offend anyone.

"overwhelmed by bi and homosexual characters in almost every game"

Are you just talking about BW games when you say that?

[Puppy Love]

Yeah I'm a bit confused by the overwhelmed comment myself.  What games are they playing?

[WildOrchid]

"overwhelmed by bi and homosexual characters in almost every game"

Are you just talking about BW games when you say that?

 

Lol ikr. I laughed.

 

Please show me games that are "overwhelmed" by bi and gay characters. Because i see none.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Yeah I'm a bit confused by the overwhelmed comment myself.  What games are they playing?

Yeah, considering that the majority of games make you play as a straight male character

[Basement Cat]

I'm sorry, I used wrong words. I meant that they never say anything about their preferences.

(English is my foreign language XD)

Most people don't just blurt out their sexual preferences out of the blue. You don't go from discussing baseball to saying 'by the way, I'm gay/bi/straight'. Straight people don't feel the need to announce they are straight, why would someone of a different sexuality?

[phantomrachie]

I'm sorry, I used wrong words. I meant that they never say anything about their preferences.

(English is my foreign language XD)

 

that is true, but I wonder does someone have to say something?

 

Straight is seen as the default sexuality, most people tend to assume people they meet are straight until they say otherwise.

 

It is that assumption that makes it difficult to see someone as bi, not the actions of the person themselves.

[Ianamus]

I find the debate about bisexual characters needed to "prove" their sexuality to be an interesting one, as I can easily see it from both sides.

 

On the one hand, obviously a bisexual person does not need to indicate an attraction to both sexes to be bisexual. Any character who never specifically declares themselves straight or gay could be bisexual. 

 

But when it comes to media and character representation... It's a different matter. I can't see a character that never expresses any interest in both genders or states that they are bisexual to be a "bisexual character", even if the creators say that they are. It's like saying that your character is a great fighter even though they never win a single battle, or that they are moral and just even though we see the character throwing kittens into rivers and burning down orphanages. 

 

Yes people in real life can be bisexual without indicating it, but if a creator is going to make a character in their piece of work be bisexual then they need to actually write a bisexual character, one who the audience can tell is bisexual. If it's just a throwaway comment by the creator that means nothing and is never indicated in-universe in any way then what is the point of giving them any defined sexuality at all? 

[karushna5]

Yes, I know it doesn't mean it is impossible. I am just trying to show you my understanding of this problem from a writer's point of view, as well as a "straight person" who is overwhelmed by bi and homosexual characters in almost every game. That's why I am saying that if game is supposed to be for everyone, there should be a variety of choices, and I think this is what writers provide. Bioware will do what they think is best anyway.
Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to offend anyone.

Straight people are not "overwhelmed" They are dealing with the fact Gay people exist and wont disappear. That they are being shown as people and are given that humanization. Saying you are overwhelmed is admitting that you find the number currently uncomfortable, that somehow any number of respectful showing of a person who happens to have particular sexuality can be uncomfortable when there is much much more of whatever you are.

[Not a Cat Doll]

Yes, I know it doesn't mean it is impossible. I am just trying to show you my understanding of this problem from a writer's point of view, as well as a "straight person" who is overwhelmed by bi and homosexual characters in almost every game. That's why I am saying that if game is supposed to be for everyone, there should be a variety of choices, and I think this is what writers provide. Bioware will do what they think is best anyway.

Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to offend anyone.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

"Snip"

Im fine with bisexual characters showing that their bi in the media, the only problem is that it's usually the "depraved bisexual who f**ks anyone" stereotype that gets shown. This causes people to believe that if someone bi like myself doesn't constantly sleep around then im not "truly" bisexual & that im really a sexually confused straight/lesbian person just cos im not extremely sexually active with both genders

[Ianamus]

Im fine with bisexual characters showing that their bi in the media, the only problem is that it's usually the "depraved bisexual who f**ks anyone" stereotype that gets shown. This causes people to believe that if someone bi like myself doesn't constantly sleep around then im not "truly" bisexual & that im really a sexually confused straight/lesbian person just cos im not extremely sexually active with both genders

 

Don't get me wrong, I really don't like that stereotype. But if the audience doesn't know that the "normal" bisexual characters are actually bisexual then they do nothing to solve the problem. 

[CrimsonN7]

Please show me games that are "overwhelmed" by bi and gay characters. Because i see none.

 

You just can't handle the gay truth WO, it's errywhere, rainbows galore babby.

[dekarserverbot]

Lol ikr. I laughed.

 

Please show me games that are "overwhelmed" by bi and gay characters. Because i see none.

 

Dragon Age 2 for example...

Now this tread trait us like if we were villians just because Mario is straight. I pointed that I felt alienated in this topic just because i'm interested in women and not in any men. What makes worse is that every straight person that comes here without planning to attack or be attacked is either bashed or provoked like if this place was bikini bottom instead of BSN.

I was furious about "anders" in dragon age 2, specially since they just turned him bi and used a non existent character to plot hole his prefferences, i feel that the character was not only bastardized but also raped to please a bunch of cruel short sighted fangirls who don't give a dime about any character and just want yaoi.

[Puppy Love]

Dragon Age 2 for example...

Now this tread trait us like if we were villians just because Mario is straight. I pointed that I felt alienated in this topic just because i'm interested in women and not in any men. What makes worse is that every straight person that comes here without planning to attack or be attacked is either bashed or provoked like if this place was bikini bottom instead of BSN.

I was furious about "anders" in dragon age 2, specially since they just turned him bi and used a non existent character to plot hole his prefferences, i feel that the character was not only bastardized but also raped to please a bunch of cruel short sighted fangirls who don't give a dime about any character and just want yaoi.

 

I must admit I'm having trouble not just snapping at you for the language you've used, but I'll try anyway.

 

In Dragon age 2 the romance-able characters were for the most part player sexual, as in they liked whatever the player was.  Which I agree wasn't the best done method.  It was another route they took in the attempt to try and address these issues.  They also had a trans prostitute that bother me quite a bit as it was a negative stereo type.  However, at least they are trying to address a concern that affects a lot of people that deserve the same abilities to enjoy their games as you do.  Are there going to be a lot of mistakes and potential failures?  Of course their is, it's trial by error.  It's not an exact science, and they're going to stumble a few times before they figure it out.  We all will.  At least they're trying. 

[BabyFratelli]

Dragon Age 2 for example...

Now this tread trait us like if we were villians just because Mario is straight. I pointed that I felt alienated in this topic just because i'm interested in women and not in any men. What makes worse is that every straight person that comes here without planning to attack or be attacked is either bashed or provoked like if this place was bikini bottom instead of BSN.

I was furious about "anders" in dragon age 2, specially since they just turned him bi and used a non existent character to plot hole his prefferences, i feel that the character was not only bastardized but also raped to please a bunch of cruel short sighted fangirls who don't give a dime about any character and just want yaoi.

 

This kind of approach is always going to make gamers who are not straight or male roll their eyes, purely because BioWare games are one of the only places (... the only, in cases of sexuality? I can't think of another game as well known as ME/DA/SWTOR) where they actually have options and get to see people like themselves represented. It feels 'whiny' to some us (I fall into the straight female category) because it's something that we're used to, in the gaming world, and often when we complain about it we get shut down and insulted ("fangirls!" "sjw!" "reverse-homophobia/sexism!") so we just deal with it as it comes. 

 

Ice cream analogy:

 

Think of it like there are two people, and one of them has gotten two scoops of ice cream their whole life and the other has only gotten one scoop. It doesn't matter, right? Because ice cream is a good thing anyway. The second person should be happy they got an ice cream at all. Then the first person is forced to split a scoop with the second person and complains about it. They want two scoops. They've always had two scoops. Why can't they have two scoops now? Why is no one talking about their original two scoops anymore? They're complaining because they believe they're entitled to the two scoops when really, things have just being brought up to a more equal level and because of that they're not getting the treatment they're used to. To the second person, who for the first time in their life finally gets an extra half a scoop, this obviously comes off as ridiculous and selfish. Even if, as often is the case, it is not the first person's intent to seem or be so.

[phantomrachie]

Dragon Age 2 for example...

Now this tread trait us like if we were villians just because Mario is straight. I pointed that I felt alienated in this topic just because i'm interested in women and not in any men. What makes worse is that every straight person that comes here without planning to attack or be attacked is either bashed or provoked like if this place was bikini bottom instead of BSN.

I was furious about "anders" in dragon age 2, specially since they just turned him bi and used a non existent character to plot hole his prefferences, i feel that the character was not only bastardized but also raped to please a bunch of cruel short sighted fangirls who don't give a dime about any character and just want yaoi.

 

wow, just wow. No one has a problem with Mario being straight. This topic has turned into a conversation about equality, you feel alienated about that?

 

Who is attacking or bashing anyone? I mean, if someone says somthing homophoic or sexiest then they'll be called out on it but that is not bashing it's calling someone out on their crap.

 

As for Anders, all we knew about his sexuality was that he wasn't gay. A man being attracted to women means that you are either straight or bisexual. BioWare deciding to give Anders a male lover doesn't destroy his character.

 

Oh and to make a rape comment like that, is pretty crappy. 

[Artemis Leonhart]

Dragon Age 2 for example...

Now this tread trait us like if we were villians just because Mario is straight. I pointed that I felt alienated in this topic just because i'm interested in women and not in any men. What makes worse is that every straight person that comes here without planning to attack or be attacked is either bashed or provoked like if this place was bikini bottom instead of BSN.

I was furious about "anders" in dragon age 2, specially since they just turned him bi and used a non existent character to plot hole his prefferences, i feel that the character was not only bastardized but also raped to please a bunch of cruel short sighted fangirls who don't give a dime about any character and just want yaoi.

I beg your pardon? Anders was always meant to be bisexual, I believe one of the devs confirmed this. Just because he didn't tell the warden that he liked both men and women doesn't mean that he wasn't bisexual. I'm positively sure they didn't "turn" him bi because some "yaoi fangirls" asked them to. He was bisexual all along.

Also, could you please avoid using the word "rape" in such a light way? There might be rape survivors reading this thread and it might be a trigger for them.

Edit: even if there are no rape survivors reading this thread, making rape comments like that is distasteful and disrespectful of people who had the misfortune of being assaulted.
 

[Puppy Love]

Ice cream analogy:

 

Think of it like there are two people, and one of them has gotten two scoops of ice cream their whole life and the other has only gotten one scoop. It doesn't matter, right? Because ice cream is a good thing anyway. The second person should be happy they got an ice cream at all. Then the first person is forced to split a scoop with the second person and complains about it. They want two scoops. They've always had two scoops. Why can't they have two scoops now? Why is no one talking about their original two scoops anymore? They're complaining because they believe they're entitled to the two scoops when really, things have just being brought up to a more equal level and because of that they're not getting the treatment they're used to. To the second person, who for the first time in their life finally gets an extra half a scoop, this obviously comes off as ridiculous and selfish. Even if, as often is the case, it is not the first person's intent to seem or be so.

 

 

That's a really awesome analogy, I love it!!!!

[BabyFratelli]

That's a really awesome analogy, I love it!!!!

 

Borrow it, butcher it, do what you like with it. No citation needed. I'll be here all week.

[CrimsonN7]

@BabyFratelli, welp jokes on two scoop lifer, they'll get the diabetes before I will!

[dekarserverbot]

wow, just wow. No one has a problem with Mario being straight. This topic has turned into a conversation about equality, you feel alienated about that?

 

Who is attacking or bashing anyone? I mean, if someone says somthing homophoic or sexiest then they'll be called out on it but that is not bashing it's calling someone out on their crap.

 

As for Anders, all we knew about his sexuality was that he wasn't gay. A man being attracted to women means that you are either straight or bisexual. BioWare deciding to give Anders a male lover doesn't destroy his character.

 

Oh and to make a rape comment like that, is pretty crappy. 

 

How could be talking about equality if every heterosexual that  gives his two cents is inmediattly attacked just for being what he is? I'm not asking anyone to became attached in marriage with a person of the opossite sex just because some narrow minded individuals thought it should be that way, I just came to point that if they are doing it right this time, how could not do it right before?

So... now everybody is a potential bisexual then? this makes even less sense. I have no idea how a bisexual mind is because i have no one. But now you are saying that every person in the world is bisexual in some degree, or at least that's what i feel you are trying to say me. There are homosexual and heterosexual people, a lesbian will never have any interest in men as neither  do I. Same for gays and straight women with other women.