Upon reflection, I would say Flemeth. There are several characters I dislike, but for good reasons to me. But Flemeth I usually kill, and really do not feel I have a decent reason to do so, as Morrigan's testimony is a little suspect. Plus, Flemeth is a rock star in DA2....
Characters you dislike for no good reason?
Débuté par
Spectre Impersonator
, avril 06 2014 03:44
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#52
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Posté 08 avril 2014 - 11:55
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Plus, Flemeth is a rock star in DA2....
.. perfect description.
She absolutely is. She's a 700-year old something, if she really is the Flemeth of legend. That's plenty of time to learn all sorts of life lessons. Morrigan is a tool that she shaped, entirely on purpose if her conversation with Hawke on Sundermount is any indication.
She rescues the Wardens and saves Hawke for reasons other than altruism, methinks.
She's clearly not a cackling evil maniac. She's designed to be an ambiguous figure, which means they can't show her as too good-hearted or too black-hearted. She's powerful, but what she intends to do with that power isn't clear. Clearly somebody isn't going to like it, or she wouldn't need to hide. Now, am I going to agree or disagree with that somebody? I don't know, but I suspect I'll agree, eventually.
If I had to place a bet today, I expect "Flemeth's Choice" to be 1) support Flemeth in bringing some kind of cataclysmic change to the world, or 2) uphold the status quo. The results of the change will be uncertain (because if it was all guaranteed sunshine and puppies, we'd all pick it). The change will be tumultuous and people will die. The PC will have to decide if this is worth whatever outcome Flemeth expects to get from it.
If it were me, I'd toss on an extra layer of complication, making it clear that she is choosing for people, that she thinks she knows what is best for Thedas, or at least what's better. The Internet arguments that result will be epic. There would be color-coded infograms, dueling dialogue quotes, and a new contender for Most Undying Thread on the forums.
As cool as much of those type of choices sounds, I'm skeptical of seeing things with that level of impact. Unless of course you're meaning further down the line, and not necessarily DAI. Because I heard they plan to make more. Big choices like those don't seem like they'd work in the middle of a series.
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#53
Posté 08 avril 2014 - 12:36
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As cool as much of those type of choices sounds, I'm skeptical of seeing things with that level of impact. Unless of course you're meaning further down the line, and not necessarily DAI. Because I heard they plan to make more. Big choices like those don't seem like they'd work in the middle of a series.
*nods* I eagerly await to see how they handle the OGB. I just don't see how they can reveal Flemeth's plans as anything less than earth-shaking without it being a serious anti-climax. Particularly after the vague, ominous, portentious hints dropped in the comics about dragons, magic, the Witches of the Wilds and the nature of the world. Maybe that means they'll kick her can down the road for another installment, or (hidden for DAI premise spoiler)
Spoiler
There is one other dodge, although the players would hate it. Pose the question. PC makes the choice. Possibly, deal with immediate fallout (e.g., boss fight with Flemeth). Then - a third party shows up and makes the question moot. Like if Hawke had needed to decide "mages or templars?" before the Earth-Shattering Kaboom and the Right of Annulment. From a dramatic perspective, it's pretty valid - when you make the choice, you don't know how it'll play out, so you're defining your character's end arc with it. But from a narrative perspective, people are gonna feel robbed if their choice has no external impact. DA2 illustrated that really well.
#54
Guest_starlitegirlx_*
Posté 08 avril 2014 - 06:50
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Whatever Flemeth taught her, it doesn't seem anything like Flemeth herself. For one, Flemeth actually has social skills, a sense of humor, and has proven to care about more than her own survival. She rescued Wardens, Hawke's family, and even offered a little pity for Wesley. Wesley! Not to mention she hasn't done anything to ****** off Dalish. Flemeth has enough standing with them that Marathari knows her, and Ariane went to see her. She also gives fairly wise advice at times.. be it to the Warden or even the companions at Sundermount. Even the plans in DAO to use the treaties and gather allies is a completely different attitude than Morrigan - who just suggests going straight after Loghain and thinks just about every other quest and interaction is a waste of time. If Morrigan had her way, the game would be a few hours long at most.
Maybe she's one of those parents that lives one way, but teaches their children another.
Actually, the warden is alive to do her bidding. She needs that soul. Doubtful this was Morrigan's plan because Morrigan is sent with you by Flementh. So this is what flemeth wants. She saved you because she wants that old god soul in a baby and she needs a warden to do that. So she scoops up the last two that she can after seeing how things had gone awry. This is also why she gives you the treaties. Maybe she knows how the battle will go down. Maybe that is what she is referring to when she says it's worse than they know. Even when she helps hawke, it was simply to stay alive. You deliver an object out of ferelden so that a piece of her can survive. But it's not really helping Hawke so much as saving herself. Without that she doesn't live. She probably sent a few pieces of herself forward as well. Scouted the lands and picked the ones who looked strong enough. Note that she just gets you on the boat. Doesn't fly you there. Why? She has more bits of herself to send away to ensure survival.
But back to her 'goodness' - well, she needs someone to get to that archdemon and slay it. So she doesn't do much more than watch the two she just met that she will send her daughter with. She picks you likely because 1) you are there, 2) you will be naive enough to not kill her then and there at the name flemeth because I suspect other wardens might. 3) you'll take morrigan with you which she needs and being newly branded wardens she clearly figures you might not want to die. Older ones have accepted it. Also, older ones have less to lose since the taint will get them. If you were Riordan, would you take the deal? He doesn't have much time left. Also, he can't really accomplish the task because he's been tainted too long. So she picks the new wardens as they will serve her in many ways... but all of this is not done out of the goodness of her heart. It's done to get her what she wants only Morrigan doesn't abide by that. But Flemeth figures that's how it will play out. Seems like she knew once Morrigan left her side it would turn out this way based on Hawke's meeting with her and what she says when you go to fight her. But again, she's doing this because she wants that old god soul and probably knows that morrigan will still do it as her grab for power. Morrigan of her own right is not powerful enough to face Flemeth. So eventually flemeth is going to kill her and take that baby.
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#55
Posté 08 avril 2014 - 10:57
Douxdel
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WHO IS DIS MAN TEGAHN good lord I'm not looking forward to that. I love the glitch you get if you kill her with bloodmagic in Alistair's conversation. Yes Alistair everything did indeed turn out just fine.
Heh heh heh... play it as a woman... "WHO IS DIS WOMAN TEGAHN?" ... -_-'' I'm his elven ******...who do you think? And what business is it of yours? You're his sister-in-law!
The way she treats Alistair irritated me, but then, you know the story. The way she treated my PC my first play through I chalked it up to my character...I was a casteless dwarf and then a city elf...below that of commoners to a noblewoman...but even on my most recent playthrough as a HN...a teyrna, which is technically above an arlessa, and still treated with disrespect...yikes.
Anyways...I REALLY hate Isolde. I sucker-punch every play through...I used to kill her too (I was a goody-goody once and saved everyone once...jumped through all the hoops and she is still ungrateful and unhappy) until I realized she'd probably suffer more living with the guilt that she caused her son's death...so yeah...I'm a terrible person.
Second on my list is Anora. And that is even before all her short-comings. Must be something about her tone/attitude. Dunno. I get to the Arl of Denerim's Estate to save her, get that door open to save her and I just want to close it again on her after those first few words.
Speaking of politicians, I might as well add Bhelen and Harrowmont to the list too. I don't necessarily hate them...but I don't like dealing with them and I hate that the game forces you to choose one. One that wasn't so black or white...or contastingly greyish...go with the outwardly appearing nice guy that sets the society up to fail or go with the cut-throat that practically drags an unwilling society into a modern age. -sighs-
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#56
Guest_starlitegirlx_*
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 12:16
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She absolutely is. She's a 700-year old something, if she really is the Flemeth of legend. That's plenty of time to learn all sorts of life lessons. Morrigan is a tool that she shaped, entirely on purpose if her conversation with Hawke on Sundermount is any indication.
She rescues the Wardens and saves Hawke for reasons other than altruism, methinks.
She's clearly not a cackling evil maniac. She's designed to be an ambiguous figure, which means they can't show her as too good-hearted or too black-hearted. She's powerful, but what she intends to do with that power isn't clear. Clearly somebody isn't going to like it, or she wouldn't need to hide. Now, am I going to agree or disagree with that somebody? I don't know, but I suspect I'll agree, eventually.
If I had to place a bet today, I expect "Flemeth's Choice" to be 1) support Flemeth in bringing some kind of cataclysmic change to the world, or 2) uphold the status quo. The results of the change will be uncertain (because if it was all guaranteed sunshine and puppies, we'd all pick it). The change will be tumultuous and people will die. The PC will have to decide if this is worth whatever outcome Flemeth expects to get from it.
If it were me, I'd toss on an extra layer of complication, making it clear that she is choosing for people, that she thinks she knows what is best for Thedas, or at least what's better. The Internet arguments that result will be epic. There would be color-coded infograms, dueling dialogue quotes, and a new contender for Most Undying Thread on the forums.
That's pretty much why I predicted or suspected. I mean who would spend all that money on Kate Mulgrew if it was't going to end up something like this. Kate is great but I suspect she isn't cheap. Sure it might have only been one day in studio time, but they could have gotten anyone really for that role unless it was going to open up into a larger role down the line and they really wanted someone more notable than your average voice actor for it which is what they did with most of the other voices barring maybe claudia black who is known for sci fi and fantasy genre in TV and games. Tim Curry made sense because Howe really needed his brand of villain. But I suspect she's going to come up as something like Meredith did in the second game only the choice won't be so clear at all. It will probably be close to the Loghain debates.
#57
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Posté 09 avril 2014 - 05:45
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Actually, the warden is alive to do her bidding. She needs that soul
I can't see someone with all of these motivations when from my own perspective, I've witnessed nothing resembling it. But yet, I see all kinds of callous behavior, lies, and deviousness from Morrigan. Yet, I'm supposed to believe Morrigan?
To make it worse, if I go back to Flemeth at Morrigan's bidding, and confront her with different questions, she considers it all a waste of time. And says we'll believe what we want. That I don't really want the truth. This doesn't sound like someone with a big evil plan. It sounds like someone who is disgusted with false perceptions.
She's just way too enigmatic for me to make a solid judgement about.
Funnily, the one thing Morrigan might be able to convince me to kill Flemeth is that she's an abomination. Like Uldred. But after playing Witch Hunt, she can't even make up her mind on that now.. and says she's not an abomination. So I have little reason to bother Flemeth for now.
#58
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 05:49
Massa FX
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Zevran is my most disliked character. I give him the chastity belt as punishment. Then give him the key after awhile because I feel bad. lol!
In my past playthru's, I've disliked Morrigan and Sten because of their attitude. In my current playthru I've maxed out Morrigan with gifts and her companion quest. She's actually nice. Sten is also maxed out (I found his sword!!), and he's now somewhat interesting.
But Zevran is always annoying.
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#59
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 06:14
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I didn't think I'd like Sten in the beginning. He's probably my favorite character in Origins now. There's something endearing about his directness.
If I had to add another character I dislike for no good reason to the list, it would have to be Master Wade. Your armor is useful, but damn if I can't stand your bratty hipster-in-Williamsburg artsy pretentiousness.
#60
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Posté 09 avril 2014 - 06:16
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I didn't think I'd like Sten in the beginning. He's probably my favorite character in Origins now. There's something endearing about his directness.
If I had to add another character I dislike for no good reason to the list, it would have to be Master Wade. Your armor is useful, but damn if I can't stand your bratty hipster-in-Williamsburg artsy pretentiousness.
Down with you!
Wade is awesome. If there's one minor NPC I want to see again, it's Wade. Or Wade and Herren to be exact. It only works if they're both there.
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#61
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 06:19
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Wade is nothing without Herren, mainly because Wade needs someone to complain to when he's subjected to creating wares for the unwashed rabble.
Oh the indignity, Herren! Must I squander my talents for the gormless brutes in this dingy town?
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#62
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 12:32
tartan-princess
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Wade and Herren are awesome.
'Herren! The costumer is bothering me again, why is she bothering me?!' Wade says something like that when you click him in his Denerim shop and he looks at Herren like if it is his job to prevent that xD
I was so happy to see them in Awakening. 'Turnip Keep', I'm still laughing about that 
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#63
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 12:46
Rusty Sandusky
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Every single Orlesian. Damn Orlesians.
#64
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 09:34
Tommy6860
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There is one other dodge, although the players would hate it. Pose the question. PC makes the choice. Possibly, deal with immediate fallout (e.g., boss fight with Flemeth). Then - a third party shows up and makes the question moot. Like if Hawke had needed to decide "mages or templars?" before the Earth-Shattering Kaboom and the Right of Annulment. From a dramatic perspective, it's pretty valid - when you make the choice, you don't know how it'll play out, so you're defining your character's end arc with it. But from a narrative perspective, people are gonna feel robbed if their choice has no external impact. DA2 illustrated that really well.
This^ is why I am taking the arrival of DA:I with a tepid attitude and holding back any thought of excitement to come. How you noted the workings of DA2 highlights that for me. But it isn't just that highlight on DA2 that does that, it is recent Bioware/EA history. For me, the story arc of an RPG and how any (particular) game has the PC invested in the story conclusion, is a big driving force for me. Since DA is a series, I am truly hoping the devs don 't do to this game as how ME3 did to my whole investment in the ME series. That was over 4 years of vesting myself into a series where I was allowed to guide it along, only to have the choices of meaninglessness at its conclusion.
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#65
Guest_starlitegirlx_*
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 09:47
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This^ is why I am taking the arrival of DA:I with a tepid attitude and holding back any thought of excitement to come. How you noted the workings of DA2 highlights that for me. But it isn't just that highlight on DA2 that does that, it is recent Bioware/EA history. For me, the story arc of an RPG and how any (particular) game has the PC invested in the story conclusion, is a big driving force for me. Since DA is a series, I am truly hoping the devs don 't do to this game as how ME3 did to my whole investment in the ME series. That was over 4 years of vesting myself into a series where I was allowed to guide it along, only to have the choices of meaninglessness at its conclusion.
This is why I don't even care about DAI. My interest is passing at best especially considering we lost the awesomeness of relationships with companions to crappy cutscenes with little heart embellished dialogue wheel responses. That was fine for ME as it was how it was from the start. But for DA? Awful. And I am 100% certain that this level of dumbed down shall remain ever present in DAI. BW might have been great once, but I think EA has influenced them toward mainstream way too much. ME was a classic example. While the changes weren't as in your face because ME didn't start at the RPG level of immersion that DAO did, by game three it was very clear we were scrapping the bottom of the barrel in calling it an RPG as it was only just barely.
I will only buy DAI if I hear that it has moved closer to say skyrim or DAO. If I hear that it is closer to DA2, I'll consider myself lucky that I never really invested myself in anything after DAO and see DAO as a standalone (since most of these questions I might have about things like the DR and Flemeth will likely not get answered or answered very well). ME and DA seem to be taking the same exact story path. DA2 was nothing like DAO and story-wise, you can't really even tell it is a DA game based on the story itself other than the fact that it had darkspawn in the beginning, templars and mages at the end and quinari in the middle. Those things are not enough to really make it feel like a logical progression in the story. And nothing REALLY carried over from the first game except little cameos or silly things like that.
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#66
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 09:58
Ribosome
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I would hope that because of the investment/commotion about the Keep being a thing, past player choices would have a more prominent impact.
Could just be wishful thinking on my end 
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#67
Posté 09 avril 2014 - 10:01
Elhanan
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Have enjoyed most of the companions in all the DA series thus far, and look forward to see what is next. That said, do not care for the 'club players' much, such as Zevran or isabela.
#68
Posté 27 avril 2014 - 11:43
Karm
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Dislike for no good reason?
Leliana. There, I said it.
I don't know why, I can't explain why. Maybe it's her voice, maybe it's how she speaks, but ever since first meeting her I just... couldn't. Every time I go through a playthrough, she just sits in the camp in her Chantry robes, because I simply cannot have her along with me. It's a bizarre hatred that I have and I don't understand it.
#69
Posté 28 avril 2014 - 12:23
Ciaran Cousland
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Well I hated Rendon Howe the second I saw him, but it turned out that wasn't without reason.
But The Ash warrior at the Ostagar camp for some reason always pissed me off and for the life of me I can't figure out why.
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#70
Posté 28 avril 2014 - 12:30
Nethalf
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Also, her face tattoos are ugly.
Her tattoos are awesome! 
And now run for your life for I'm gonna eradicate you with no mercy 
#71
Posté 28 avril 2014 - 12:39
SwobyJ
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No one. I like em all.
Wait, no. Dog. I can't help but to have the urge to, I dunno, give him away to a NPC or something. But I can't.
#72
Posté 28 avril 2014 - 02:22
Riverdaleswhiteflash
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Well I hated Rendon Howe the second I saw him, but it turned out that wasn't without reason.
But The Ash warrior at the Ostagar camp for some reason always pissed me off and for the life of me I can't figure out why.
Because he's a ******?
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#73
Posté 28 avril 2014 - 03:09
Isaidlunch
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Lanaya, for being such a tease with that stupid treasure chest of hers. If she didn't want her stuff to be taken she shouldn't have had it conveniently lying around in a role-playing game.
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#74
Posté 28 avril 2014 - 03:13
Cobra's_back
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This^ is why I am taking the arrival of DA:I with a tepid attitude and holding back any thought of excitement to come. How you noted the workings of DA2 highlights that for me. But it isn't just that highlight on DA2 that does that, it is recent Bioware/EA history. For me, the story arc of an RPG and how any (particular) game has the PC invested in the story conclusion, is a big driving force for me. Since DA is a series, I am truly hoping the devs don 't do to this game as how ME3 did to my whole investment in the ME series. That was over 4 years of vesting myself into a series where I was allowed to guide it along, only to have the choices of meaninglessness at its conclusion.
Very true. I haven't wanted to play ME again after the first run through of ME3. Let's hope DAI is nothing like it.
#75
Posté 28 avril 2014 - 03:47
AventuroLegendary
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Does disliking characters for being whiny count? I mean even when they have valid reasons for being whiny. Sure, Velanna should be unhappy about the lot in life Elves in general get but does she have to act so... repressed about it?
