121 réponses à ce sujet

[Bob from Accounting]

I haven't, actually. But I tend not to believe Wreav or anybody could be that hopelessly stupid. And even if he is, I don't think other krogan would follow him long.

[Steelcan]

I haven't, actually. But I tend not to believe Wreav or anybody could be that hopelessly stupid. And even if he is, I don't think other krogan would follow him long.

The other krogan are the problem, Wreav has no control over them at all.

 

Victus mentions that if Wreav is in charge that Palaven never got the reinforcements they needed because the krogan wouldn't cooperate

 

 

I am hesitant to say the whole species is moronic without Wrex beating them into line, but it seems like the only viable option, without him they just can't be trusted

[DeinonSlayer]

I haven't, actually. But I tend not to believe Wreav or anybody could be that hopelessly stupid. And even if he is, I don't think other krogan would follow him long.

Did you miss the entire Genophage arc? They did it before. Wreav says he'll do it again.

With Wrex in charge, Eve says other Krogan clan leaders will want revenge, and is uncertain as to whether Wrex will be able to keep them in check.

[Bob from Accounting]

Do they?

[Bob from Accounting]

Did you miss the entire Genophage arc? They did it before. Wreav says he'll do it again.

 

No. They didn't. Entirely different things.

 

The krogan attacking a peaceful galaxy as a strong race is entirely different from the krogan attacking a galaxy under attack (including themselves) as a weak race.

 

The krogan are far weaker than both the Reapers and the rest of the galaxy individually, much less combined. If they caused any trouble, made any attacks, they'd immediately be made an enemy of the entire galaxy to kill on sight. The only way things could possibly go well for them is if they outlasted both the rest of the galaxy and the Reapers. It ain't happening.

[DeinonSlayer]

Do you not see the EC slide I posted? The concern voiced in-game is that the galaxy would be too weakened by the conclusion of the Reaper war to stand against a resurgent Krogan, not that the Krogan would attack during the war itself.

Personally, I wish ME3's genophage argument focused less on that and more on the internal implications of a Krogan population explosion - as was discussed in Mordin's loyalty mission. They were only truly going extinct because of their own cynicism; fighting amongst themselves, throwing their lives away in merc groups. They could overcome it without a cure if they followed the course ME2 Wrex charted. ME3, of course, ignored all of that and recast the Genophage as the driving force for the Krogan going extinct.

[Steelcan]

No. They didn't. Entirely different things.

 

The krogan attacking a peaceful galaxy as a strong race is entirely different from the krogan attacking a galaxy under attack (including themselves) as a weak race.

 

The krogan are far weaker than both the Reapers and the rest of the galaxy individually, much less combined. If they caused any trouble, made any attacks, they'd immediately be made an enemy of the entire galaxy to kill on sight. The only way things could possibly go well for them is if they outlasted both the rest of the galaxy and the Reapers. It ain't happening.

 

Wreav says that after the reapers are dealt with he will forge a new krogan empire, after the war there will be no power in the galaxy left to challenge them.

[Steelcan]

I now find myself wondering if David has ever seen a non-paragon palythrough at all

[Bob from Accounting]

If he wants to try that, let him. Despite what he thinks, whatever trouble the krogan might cause after the war is less of a concern than what the Reapers are doing right now.

 

In any case, it hardly matters, since Javik says all this whether Wreav is present or not.

[Steelcan]

If he wants to try that, let him. Despite what he thinks, whatever trouble the krogan might cause after the war is less of a concern than what the Reapers are doing right now.

 

In any case, it hardly matters, since Javik says all this whether Wreav is present or not.

 

The point is that his concern is entirely justified for anyone who has three brain cells, a cursory understanding of history, and enough common sense to put the two together

[DeinonSlayer]

The point is that his concern is entirely justified for anyone who has three brain cells, a cursory understanding of history, and enough common sense to put the two together

The Paragon Mantle dictates otherwise. Idealism can never be punished. If I am Blu, I am Just.

[Bob from Accounting]

Concern for what might happen in the future? Sure. Concern enough to demand the krogan should be moronically thrown away right now in exchange for something of far lesser worth that may or may not even occur? No, that's just foolish.

[Bob from Accounting]

I notice how often people whine that Wrex is just one krogan and won't really have any influence if the genophage is cured. It's interesting to see how very quick the same people are to forget that same notion when Wreav is in charge.

[Steelcan]

Concern for what might happen in the future? Sure. Concern enough to demand the krogan should be moronically thrown away right now in exchange for something of far lesser worth that may or may not even occur? No, that's just foolish.

 

As far as you know Salarian support might turn out greater, you can't go by the arbitrary numbers assigned

[Steelcan]

I notice how often people whine that Wrex is just one krogan and won't really have any influence if the genophage is cured. It's interesting to see how very quick the same people are to forget that same notion when Wreav is in charge.

 

Wreav isn't in charge, he may be "the top krogan" but his word is not law to the other clans

[Bob from Accounting]

And yet you apparently feel comfortable using his words as the gospel of what all krogan will do in the future.

[Steelcan]

And yet you apparently feel comfortable using his words as the gospel of what all krogan will do in the future.

 

Because thats what they did in the past, they have shown no inclination towards change, the other clans we have seen Werloc(sp?) Gatagog, the chieftain Wreav argues with if you ahve him in ME3 forget his name, are just as bad as him.

 

But there's totally nice clans out there that won't be the same, despite not a single one of them ever being mentioned, ever?

[Bob from Accounting]

Hmm. There's the fact that the krogan are now crippled as a population, even more so after the war. The fact they have no ships. No infrastructure. Little technology.

 

There's the simple fact they tried it once and lost almost everything. The fact that the entire galaxy is going to be keep a close eye on them. The simple fact that ideals and morals can change through history. The fact that working together to defeat a great enemy would give them respect for the rest of the galaxy.

 

Consider any of those things at all?

[Steelcan]

Hmm. There's the fact that the krogan are now crippled as a population, even more so after the war. The fact they have no ships. No infrastructure. Little technology.

 

There's the simple fact they tried it once and lost almost everything. The fact that the entire galaxy is going to be keep a close eye on them. The simple fact that ideals and morals can change through history. The fact that working together to defeat a great enemy would give them respect for the rest of the galaxy.

 

Consider any of those things at all?

 

They won't be crippled for long, your beloved EDI mentioned how if 10% of krogan females become fertile there will be 10 billion krogan, now imagine 100% become fertile, that 1 FREAKIN TRILLION KROGAN IN ONE YEAR, they have ships and infrastructure designed for war, they have ships, they just don't have weapons on them, and you think they will abide by that restriction when they outnumber all the other races?

 

If you think curing the genophage under Wreav will work out in the end, despite absolutely no one else in game thinking it is a good idea, and the epilogue showing you that he goes to war, if after all that you still think he and the krogan following him are going to have a magical change of heart after fighting with the galaxy.

 

 

watch this, this is as Earth

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=-T_MKK3N42s

[Steelcan]

So unless the next two hours change his mind, and every other krogan's on earth he's still going to be out for blood, and the other clans will also be in favor of attacking the galaxy..

 

 

But go ahead cure the genophage under him, let your conscience be at ease as he slaughters his way across the galaxy

[Bob from Accounting]

No. They don't have ships. EDI specifically says so. They don't have infrastructure. The krogan on Urdnot, which is pretty much the capital city, says they're living in luxury if they have electricity and clean water. There's no indication they have much of anything other than small weapons.

 

Get your facts straight.

 

In any case, krogan children do not grow up instantaneously. If they reproduce out of control they'd be damning themselves by simple starvation long before they could become any sort of threat. 

[BurningBlood]

It seemed to me, especially after the echo shard conversation, that Javik was essentially the Shepard of his cycle.  Except that his ship was lost and his crew indoctrinated, and after they betrayed him he had to hunt down his Joker, his Liara, his Garrus, his Tali (etc.), slit their throats and watch them bleed out to make sure they were dead.  After doing that to his closest friends Shep would come away from that severely scarred, I would think, so I get why Javik is so merciless to anyone he sees as a threat.  Not to mention that a fully renegade Shep will already kill pretty much anyone who looks at him the wrong way, potential ally notwithstanding.

[Steelcan]

No. They don't have ships. EDI specifically says so. They don't have infrastructure. The krogan on Urdnot, which is pretty much the capital city, says they're living in luxury if they have electricity and clean water. There's no indication they have much of anything other than small weapons.

 

Get your facts straight.

 

In any case, krogan children do not grow up instantaneously. If they reproduce out of control they'd be damning themselves by simple starvation long before they could become any sort of threat. 

"They have been demilitarized, they have no warships" There is not a gorram thing stopping them from having non armed ships

 

So?  They still have orbit capable transport, massive stockpiles of WMDs, and a thirst for blood, and you want to rely on their goodwill to not attack the galaxy, when they will have motive, means, and opportunity.  And how much better off do you think the other races will be?  You think Earth is going to be too terribly different than Urdnot after the war?

 

Grunt was grown in less than two years, reptiles don't age like mammals, they could be ready to go after only a few years, maybe less given the krogan way of life.

[Bob from Accounting]

Point me to where it says anything about a 'massive stockpile of WMDs'?

 

I'm pretty damn sure EDI says the krogan have no ships, period. Hence needing the turians to transport them. In any case, how long you think those ships will last in an armed conflict? The krogan clearly don't have the materials or infrastructure to equip them with weapons. And even if they did, jury-rigged shipping vessels would be torn apart by an actual fleet.

 

Grunt was grown in a thank, and can't be taken as representative of the race any more than the Shepard clone grown in two years can.

[Steelcan]

Point me to where it says anything about a 'massive stockpile of WMDs'?

 

I'm pretty damn sure EDI says the krogan have no ships, period. Hence needing the turians to transport them. In any case, how long you think those ships will last in an armed conflict? The krogan clearly don't have the materials or infrastructure to equip them with weapons. And even if they did, jury-rigged shipping vessels would be torn apart by an actual fleet.

 

Grunt was grown in a thank, and can't be taken as representative of the race any more than the Shepard clone grown in two years can.

War Asset description on the Krogan clans

 

"The krogan have been hoarding WMD's for generations, now these stockpiles can be turned on the reapers instead of Tuchunka"

 

 

She doesn't, I quoted her word for word.  They don't have any warships because they are prohibited from making them not because they lack the resources or know-how, a powerful clan like Urdnot could probably do it they had the numbers and power.

 

Grunt was a pure korgan, he may have been grown in a tank and given supplmements to boost his growth like vitamins and such, but I doubt it affected his growth THAT much.