But for a far shorter period of time. The net number of innocents killed will be lower than if this was allowed to go on unchallenged for much longer.
I don't think it can be said that war is never worth it.
When you start to measure the outcomes of the conflict in number of bodies, you cross the line.
And hey... redemption?
An alliance with Ferelden and Orlais could prevent that, assuming the Inquisitor would help one of the warring Orlesian factions who would be willing to accept elven rule over the Dales. Celene offered honorary lordship over the Dales, so I don't think it's implausible; perhaps she would offer the same to an elven Inquisitor who could help her against Gaspard.
So you wouldn't mind the Dales as an Orlesian province with an Elven Lord? Because that is a very different thing than an independent Elven state.
I would much prefer that option.
I agree with that view about war in comparison to diplomacy, yes. That said, I'm not an idiot and know sometimes there is no other recourse. In Andraste's case, people have tried everything else so when all other options fail, you go with what's left.
Like if the slaves have ever had options to begin with. Not like they can vote in the Senate or launch peaceful demonstrations on the streets.
So you wouldn't mind the Dales as an Orlesian province with an Elven Lord? Because that is a very different thing than an independent Elven state.
I'd honestly prefer elven independence for the Dales to serving as a province of the Orlesian Empire.
Honorary lordship means that they could call themselves Lord of the Dales if they wished to, but Pierre would still be the actual Lord.
And even I am mistaken, being a lord means they would still be beholden to the orlesian throne. Celene accepted to give honors to elves, not to cut a portion of her empire and deliver it to them.
Celene accepted to give honors to elves, not to cut a portion of her empire and deliver it to them.
If she ever did that, the nobles would be busting down her door in seconds.
Hmm. Now that i think about it, the eluvians should be kept and trademarked. A crafty businessmen could create a delivery service that surpasses the efficiency of all known irl delivery companies combined.
Eluvian mail.... E-mail. 
Honorary lordship means that they could call themselves Lord of the Dales if they wished to, but Pierre would still be the actual Lord.
And even I am mistaken, being a lord means they would still be beholden to the orlesian throne. Celene accepted to give honors to elves, not to cut a portion of her empire and deliver it to them.
With the Orlesian civil war, the Mage-Templar War, and the threat of the veil tears, that may change.
If she ever did that, the nobles would be busting down her door in seconds.
They already are
They already are
Meh, what she did in pretty much burning down a piece of Halamshiral cowed many who would doubt her.
Meh, what she did in pretty much burning down a piece of Halamshiral cowed many who would doubt her.
And yet she is in the middle of a Civil War for being too moderate 
And yet she is in the middle of a Civil War for being too moderate
True, but she did win back some of her support by crushing that rebellion, otherwise she'd be in even worse shape.
Exactly, Celene killed 2000 elves to prove to the orlesian nobles she was not growing too lenient with them; and they began to turn against her because of things like admittance to universities and the High Market.
if she just gave them the Dales, she might as well give the throne to Gaspard.
They already are
Still the idea of giving some elves a semi-autonomous "province" has potential, the fact that the Dales was a historic home for them and that there seems to be a relatively low population there.
If Celene had done something like this before **** went down it could have been spun as a pragmatic action in the interests of strengthening the Empire and reducing racial tensions at the same time.
Sure it may be an Elven province but it would still answer to a human empress, be required to follow Imperial laws, and pay taxes to the Empire.
Exactly, Celene killed 2000 elves to prove to the orlesian nobles she was growing too lenient with them; and they began to turn against her because of things like admittance to universities and the High Market.
if she just gave them the Dales, she might as well give the throne to Gaspard.
Granted, doing small things like the University and High Market, is the best way to approach the situation, I believe. Change is slow, but it's still change. Handing over the Dales would completely cause Orlais to turn into an even worse battleground.
Hence why that isn't my proposed solution.
I am still of the mind DA needs a Valley of the Flowers after all.
An Elven State, That is protected and economically stable via a Human Empire.
Has Elven land holders, nobility, merchants and soldiers, but ultimately answers to a Human Nation. It's basically like the Volus Protectorate if you want to go Mass Effect rather then Witcher.
Something that benefits both sides, Orlais gets a bufferzone between it and invasion, a place for it to station troops if the need arises, Perhaps form a circle there. It would ultimately be a dictated State, but it would be a state none the less.
How old is the Valley of the Flowers? And didn't Iorveth say it was a "dead end" of sorts, due to the birthrate? Granted, I can't remember if that's due to elven biology in The Witcher.
Never made much sense to me how, if the Valley of Flowers is a dead end due to the birthrate, it was a good idea to sacrifice elven lives fighting for Saskia.
Oooh, do you think that Best Elf Warden (City Elf) Royal Boon will be mentioned if they're trying to put together a vassal state?
Oooh, do you think that Best Elf Warden (City Elf) Royal Boon will be mentioned if they're trying to put together a vassal state?
NPC: Hey didn't Ferelden try to set something like this up? What happened?
Elf NPC: It ended... poorly.
*Flashback*
Other Elf NPC: Naww I'm telling you guys summoning this Uber Demon can't possibly backfire! Then we'll show those filthy Shemlen what's what!
*Demon kills almost everyone*
*end of flashback*
Elf NPC:... mistakes were made.
NPC: Hey didn't Ferelden try to set something like this up? What happened?
Elf NPC: It ended... poorly.
*Flashback*
Other Elf NPC: Naww I'm telling you guys summoning this Uber Demon can't possibly backfire! Then we'll show those filthy Shemlen what's what!
*Demon kills almost everyone*
*end of flashback*
Elf NPC:... mistakes were made.
No, that was the Dalish boon, this is the City Elf boon. Probably poor investments; as Sten says, the city elfs excel at poverty. :/
Spoiler
i want a felessan fan page
No, that was the Dalish boon, this is the City Elf boon. Probably poor investments; as Sten says, the city elfs excel at poverty. :/
A thousand apologies I can fix it.
NPC: Hey didn't Ferelden try giving its Elves more internal autonomy in the capital?
Elf NPC: It didn't end well...
*Flashback*
Elf Leader: Guys its so obvious! We should risk everything we've gained and use it all to buy ye olde stock on margin! It can't possibly fail!
*end of flashback*
Elf NPC: Mistakes were made...
No, that was the Dalish boon, this is the City Elf boon. Probably poor investments; as Sten says, the city elfs excel at poverty. :/
Best CE boon is clearly making CE PC a Teyrn. Showing that yes CEs can be in high positions of nobility and somehow the world doesn't implode on itself.
Then again some Orlesian probably would use that as a way to say Fereldan's backwards.
Resposting from the other thread since I haven't seen mentioned here and it could be a big deal.
Retour en haut