2014 réponses à ce sujet

[Master Warder Z_]

That's a meaningless criteria for victory, then, since survival isn't actually in question. Even in a Templar victory, the mages would survive.

 

Not that they deserve it but they would.

[Wolfen09]

There will be civilian casualties, not all mages are like ryhs and all those who gathered at andoral's reach.   Some mages would probably try to use the civilians as hostages in the conflict, wouldnt surprise me one bit. 

 

I do however, agree with a lesser number of civilian casualties than a normal war, cause like xill said, its a war of extermination, not for land

 

at most i see minor skirmishes throughout the country with a major one being at andorals reach

[EmperorSahlertz]

 

No more than we should assume the American Revolution or most other wars were fought in towns with explosives being flung about willy-nilly. Which they weren't.

 

If you don't understand how wars cause casualties, perhaps you should avoid arguing that lives will be saved by means you don't understand.

What are you talking about? Most wars were fought in or the vicinity of towns and cities. The only times armies would fight on open fields, were if they were caught/trapped and had to fight. Of course areas of tactical importance (such as bridges, passes, valleys and hills) have been fought over too, but one of the surest ways to make sure your enemy stood and fought, even if it was disadvantagous, was to attack where he lived, which means towns and cities.

 

There is a reason that the safest place to be in a warzone is in the army after all.

[Master Warder Z_]

I do however, agree with a lesser number of civilian casualties than a normal war, cause like xill said, its a war of extermination

 

Then both of you missed thing where the Templars preferred to have the circle and living mages within it.

 

A Field filled with dead mages is no use against Qunari after all.

 

That said, Both of you are wrong.

 

The Potential for civilian casualties is far greater if it ever moved to more populated area's, Demons being summoned, Abominations, Fireballs...Need i go on?

 

It would be like a normal war, men killing each other but worse.

[Cainhurst Crow]

So we just assuming that mages will never, ever go to a city or try and use a town as a base of operations? Through the whole campaign they'll just be hiding out in some forest or whatever?

Thats a mighty big assumption to base an entire sentiment like civilian casualties won't be high.

[Master Warder Z_]

So we just assuming that mages will never, ever go to a city or try and use a town as a base of operations? Through the whole campaign they'll just be hiding out in some forest or whatever?

Thats a mighty big assumption to base an entire sentiment like civilian casualties won't be high.

 

Pretty much.

 

Whose to say they won't shell random cities? for kicks?

 

Their mages.

 

And mages are evil!

 

[Steelcan]

this thread isn't for mage-scum, its for elf-scum

[Divine Justinia V]

this thread isn't for mage-scum, its for elf-scum

 

lmfao i want to be mad at this but i can't

[Xilizhra]

So we just assuming that mages will never, ever go to a city or try and use a town as a base of operations? Through the whole campaign they'll just be hiding out in some forest or whatever?

Thats a mighty big assumption to base an entire sentiment like civilian casualties won't be high.

They could be, but they don't have to be. It's not a guarantee.

[Steelcan]

They could be, but they don't have to be. It's not a guarantee.

Mages are truly the ones with a mind for avoiding civilian casualties at all costs

 

[Master Warder Z_]

lmfao i want to be mad at this but i can't

 

You know its true!

[EmissaryofLies]

Warder, I believe Steel's post above yours is the 'hyperbole' that you're looking for. 

 

Or 'gross inaccuracy' if you're feeling articulate. 

[Master Warder Z_]

Warder, I believe Steel's post above yours is the 'hyperbole' that you're looking for. 

 

Or 'gross inaccuracy' if you're feeling articulate. 

 

._.

 

Uh how the heck is it hyperbole?

 

It happened.

 

[LobselVith8]

Exactly, Celene killed 2000 elves to prove to the orlesian nobles she was not growing too lenient with them; and they began to turn against her because of things like admittance to universities and the High Market.

if she just gave them the Dales, she might as well give the throne to Gaspard.

 

You mean in Inquisition, where Orlais is in the middle of a civil war, the Circles are lost to the Chantry because the majority of the fraternities voted in unison with Grand Enchanter Fiona, Lambert had a defection of Seekers and templars to hunt down the mages, and veil tears have creatures from the Beyond pouring out? I think things are a bit different now than they were when Fiona murdered thousands of elves to appease the nobility. Then again, I'm simply reminded why I have no incentive to assist either Celene or Gaspard in my first run.

[Xilizhra]

._.

 

Uh how the heck is it hyperbole?

 

It happened.

 

By and large, mages aren't being piloted by taint-maddened spirits.

[Master Warder Z_]

By and large, mages aren't being piloted by taint-maddened spirits.

 

No, But they are led by a taint maddened wench.

 

I see no hyperbole in assuming the worst from her.

[TK514]

You mean in Inquisition, where Orlais is in the middle of a civil war, the Circles are lost to the Chantry because the majority of the fraternities voted in unison with Grand Enchanter Fiona, Lambert had a defection of Seekers and templars to hunt down the mages, and veil tears have creatures from the Beyond pouring out? I think things are a bit different now than they were when Fiona murdered thousands of elves to appease the nobility. Then again, I'm simply reminded why I have no incentive to assist either Celene or Gaspard in my first run.

 

Except that's not what Celene did.  She put down a rebellion.  She'd have been forced to do the same if it had been human peasants.  It's an unpleasant responsibility of being a monarch.  And she wouldn't have had to do anything if the Lord who was supposed to be in charge of the situation had done his job in the first place, and if Gaspard hadn't outmaneuvered her.  You also conveniently neglect to mention that Celene's directed and acted on choice in dealing with the situation was to leave the rebelling peasants alone and assassinate a member of the nobility to give them some justice.  Unfortunately, that option for ending the situation was taken out of her hands.

[LobselVith8]

Random question:  Did Merrill's eluvian come from the Dalish origin or did she find it at Sundermount?  I can't remember...

 

Merrill built her own Eluvian based on lore she gathered and information she extrapolated from a shard she took in Ferelden. She incorporated the shard into the construction of the elven mirror she built.

 

She found it in a ruin back in Ferelden.

 

iirc It could be Dalish but Duncan assumed it was Tevinter.

 

The Eluvian in the Elven Ruins was shattered, and pieces of it remain in "Witch Hunt", having infected a number of elves, and Finn utilizes one for the blood magic ritual in locating the Eluvian in the Dragonbone Wastes. Tevinter utilized the Eluvians after enslaving the Arlathan elves, so it's understandable why Duncan would make that mistake (as Potato Cat pointed out).

[TheKomandorShepard]

Im reading comments about book and events in it (i don't have book) but it seems that both gaspard and celene skull will be perfect on my throne hmm i hope it won't be another enforced when i have to chose 1 of them instead go against both. 

[TK514]

Is there any guarantee that Merrill's mirror is even connected to the overall network?  Maybe that's why it didn't work.  It might be a perfectly functional eluvian that simply isn't connected to anything, so it didn't turn on.  Nowhere to go.

[Xilizhra]

No, But they are led by a taint maddened wench.

 

I see no hyperbole in assuming the worst from her.

Taint-cured, apparently. In any case, the taint doesn't affect you until the Calling; it's spirits who are strangely vulnerable to it, as Avernus discovered.

[LobselVith8]

Is there any guarantee that Merrill's mirror is even connected to the overall network?  Maybe that's why it didn't work.  It might be a perfectly functional eluvian that simply isn't connected to anything, so it didn't turn on.  Nowhere to go.

 

That's certainly possible. Merrill did say she felt a hum of power from it, but it remained inert.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Is there any guarantee that Merrill's mirror is even connected to the overall network?  Maybe that's why it didn't work.  It might be a perfectly functional eluvian that simply isn't connected to anything, so it didn't turn on.  Nowhere to go.

My guess is that Merrill's Eluvian worked perfectly well, Merrill just didn't know the activation phrase.

[LobselVith8]

My guess is that Merrill's Eluvian worked perfectly well, Merrill just didn't know the activation phrase.

 

Merrill built her own Eluvian, so I don't see why she would necessarily need an activation phrase. It's not as though this was one of the original Eluvians of Arlathan; she literally constructed her own.

[MisterJB]

You mean in Inquisition, where Orlais is in the middle of a civil war, the Circles are lost to the Chantry because the majority of the fraternities voted in unison with Grand Enchanter Fiona, Lambert had a defection of Seekers and templars to hunt down the mages, and veil tears have creatures from the Beyond pouring out? I think things are a bit different now than they were when Fiona murdered thousands of elves to appease the nobility. Then again, I'm simply reminded why I have no incentive to assist either Celene or Gaspard in my first run.

I was only referring to the situation at the time Celene offered honorary lordship but, you are correct; the situation is different.

However, how exactly do you propose creating this new elven state?
The eluvians have boosted the power of the City Elves but only to an extent. Unlike what we previously thought, they are not rebelling and even if they were, there is little point in being able to set up ambushes in places where are Eluvians; which are limited; if you don't have the manpower to actually make your ambushes suceed and the City Elves simply don't have the power to create an independent elven state in the Dales and making it stick. The Eluvians provided them with escape routes and supply routes, not silverite armors and years of training.

 

As for the Dalish, they seem to be more of a military power than the CE; altough that is debatable. They have better equipment and training; altough they are still leagues below the Chevaliers as evidenced by Ser Michel; but their numbers are very reduced. One clan appears to be composed of 50 or so Dalish while there are 10000 CE in Val-Royeaux alone (honestly, this alone should really put into question who truly are the last hope of the elven race. Clearly, the CEs are the one who have a sustainable birth rate). But the Dalish are not united and they have no stake in this conflict unlike with DAO where the treaties compelled the to fight. They have shown an unwillingness to cooperate either with orlesians or CEs making the possibility of the Dalish alone being able to take the Dales and keeping it a remote one.

Of course, you will claim that not every clan is like the one in this book and that there is a gathering happening in the Dales which would eliminate the problem of the clans not having much contact with each other and they might even look past their animosity towards CE and unite for a brigther future for all elves... but that goes against everything shown in this book. Briala will, most likely, rise as the leader of the CEs and she does not think of the Dalish as her people.

 

And even if, somehow, the elves managed to actually win some victories against human armies, that would either result in:

a) Celene and Gaspard uniting. Nothing unites a country better than a common enemy.

b ) Celene or Gaspard turning her/his attention towards the elves so as to prove that s/he can protect the empire, unlike her/his opponent

 

If one side begins using the elves; which is doubtful, Briala won't trust either of them and neither will the Dalish; the other side will just claim this is evidence they intend to steal human lands and give it to elves which might sway some nobles away from the pretender to the throne who used the elves. This, of course, means that they both will be reluctant to ally with the elves and, even if they did, their forces would diminish because of it which would bring their victory into question and, simultaneously, elven victory.