2014 réponses à ce sujet

[EmissaryofLies]

Wait, are we seriously having forum ettiquete brought up on BSN forums...when did I enter the twilight zone.

 

Shhhh only dreams now.

[Master Warder Z_]

No, Merrill built the Eluvian from lore she gathered and information she extrapolated from the shard. She spoke with Audacity about blood magic, and it was trapped in a statute for nearly a millennia and sundered from the Fade.

 

Wasn't aware a Demon needed to be in the Fade to make deals and bestow trinkets.

 

They don't by the way.

[LobselVith8]

I know. I'm telling you why before remember you first came to the forum and you were like "Why are you all so hostile towards Xili?" what you just experienced was part of the reason why.

 

That's all.

 

I don't see Xil saying anything to warrant any hostility towards her. There's nothing preventing anyone on this board from civility, even with people who we disagree with.

 

I do hope that mirror doesn't harm Merrill if you friended her. Though even if it does I rivaled her so *dances*

 

Supporting Merrill as a friend and a confidant doesn't harm her.

[EmissaryofLies]

I wonder just what Lady Harimann was getting up to with that Desire Demon...I've a feeling it was more than we know. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

No, Merrill built the Eluvian from lore she gathered and information she extrapolated from the shard. She spoke with Audacity about blood magic, and it was trapped in a statute for nearly a millennia and sundered from the Fade.

 

 

Speaking with the Profane Abomination and Torpor doesn't require you to make a bargain with either one. You can gather intel, and then attack them, which are moves that are supported by Merrill.

So despite "All spirits are dangerous", she approves you working with them. This actually helps my point that Dangerous =/= Forbidden to the Dalish.

[Master Warder Z_]

I wonder just what Lady Harimann was getting up to with that Desire Demon...I've a feeling it was more than we know. 

 

._. Its a Desire demon.

[KC_Prototype]

I hope one of the major issues we get to solve as Inquisitor is who will rule Orlais from this point on. It would be soo cool to see the scandal of Orlesian politics live.

[The Elder King]

Yes thanks to Marethari's noble sacrifice. * *

Idiotic sacrifice you mean. Because if Audacity defeated Hawke and Merril, it'd have massacrated the people Marethari had the duty to protect. Even in the case Merrill was going to be possessed (and she asked someone to kill her in that case, unlike Marethari), choosing one person over hundreds under your care is a terrible choice.

[TK514]

Bingo. Since we already have violence with Gaspard as it is, we persuade Celene to get more active, unite her forces with Briala's, and defeat Gaspard.

 

You'd still end up with two incompatible methodologies.  Celene recognizes that education and adjustment are key to long term acceptance and equal rights.  That's why she supports the University of Orlais, has them teaching pro-elf curricula (that results in young nobles graduating with a vastly better view of elves than their parents) and even accepting promising elves as students.

 

Briala is no longer content to wait.  She thinks she can brute force change, which is only going to end the same way it always has;  resentment and repeated conflict.  The same conflicts that have been going on since Arlathan and Tevinter.

[KC_Prototype]

Can somebody please tell me how to quote properly with this new forum?! It is waaaay more complicated than the other forum.

[AresKeith]

Idiotic sacrifice you mean. Because if Audacity defeated Hawke and Merril, it'd have massacrated the people Marethari had the duty to protect. Even in the case Merrill was going to be possessed (and she asked someone to kill her in that case, unlike Marethari), choosing one person over hundreds under your care is a terrible choice.

 

Iirc Marethari told them to kill her to stop the demon

[LobselVith8]

So despite "All spirits are dangerous", she approves you working with them. This actually helps my point that Dangerous =/= Forbidden to the Dalish.

 

Gaining information doesn't require working with them. You can gather information from the Profane Abomination and Torpor about the respective situations in the primeval thaig and Feynriel's plight without making a deal with either one of them.

 

Also, WoT reads, "Unlike other spellcasters, Dalish mages do not use any magic involving spirits, as they believe all spirits are dangerous." (page 104) That was my issue.

[Hellion Rex]

Can somebody please tell me how to quote properly with this new forum?! It is waaaay more complicated than the other forum.

Just hit the quote button and type your response down below.

[Ryzaki]

I don't see Xil saying anything to warrant any hostility towards her. There's nothing preventing anyone on this board from civility, even with people who we disagree with.

 

 

Supporting Merrill as a friend and a confidant doesn't harm her.

 

Lob. I'll say this as nice as I can you really haven't seen me and Xil argue seriously. Most of the time I'm going trollolol because of our previous engangements.

 

Didn't say it did. The mirror is the unknown in that scenario. she's perfectly unharmed on rivalry as well.

[The Elder King]

Iirc Marethari told them to kill her to stop the demon

Oh? I didn't recall that they knew she was about to be possessed, but i haven't played the game for a long time.

[Ryzaki]

Idiotic sacrifice you mean. Because if Audacity defeated Hawke and Merril, it'd have massacrated the people Marethari had the duty to protect. Even in the case Merrill was going to be possessed (and she asked someone to kill her in that case, unlike Marethari), choosing one person over hundreds under your care is a terrible choice.

 

But Marethari does that with Merrill constantly. She was a terrible keeper because she choose trying to look after Merrill over the safety and well being of her clan. (She really should've just let Merrill make her mistakes on her own. But I can see why she didn't. It was a absolutely terrible way of going about it no doubt but I see her as trying to protect Merrill. She shouldn't have Merrill was old enough to make her own mistakes and choices but she did). And yeah as Elu said Marethari does flat out tell you to kill her to stop it.

 

She tells you something like I have no choice then and she runs up the mountain if you tell her what Merrill's up to before you go. (I guess if you say nothing she assumes the worst and heads up anyway). And when you get there she tells you she allowed it to possess her so it wouldn't Merrill.

[Shadow Fox]

Idiotic sacrifice you mean. Because if Audacity defeated Hawke and Merril, it'd have massacrated the people Marethari had the duty to protect. Even in the case Merrill was going to be possessed (and she asked someone to kill her in that case, unlike Marethari), choosing one person over hundreds under your care is a terrible choice.

See the   I was mostly joking I agree she was an idiot for not washing her hands of Merrill.

 

Also if Merrill got possessed and killed Hawke it'd also lead to a massacre .

[LobselVith8]

Oh? I didn't recall that they knew she was about to be possessed, but i haven't played the game for a long time.

 

Marethari already let Audacity loose. Her reasoning was that Audacity would use the restored Eluvian to escape, but the Keeper never explains how she came to this conclusion when her opposition to Merrill's efforts in Act I and II was entirely different. Maerethari said she set Audacity free to protect Merrill and trapped it inside herself, then proceeded to try to kill Merrill as an abomination. There was a flaw in her logic, in my humble opinion.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Oh? I didn't recall that they knew she was about to be possessed, but i haven't played the game for a long time.

Marethari contains the demon until Merrill and Hawke arrives, at which point she tells them to kill her, and not trust a word she says after the demon has taken over.

[Hellion Rex]

Hmmm, considering what we now know of the eluvians, it might not be that far of a stretch, what Marethari was saying. If these eluvians are doorways, who is to say that it couldn't open a doorway out of the statue?

[The Elder King]

But Marethari does that with Merrill constantly. She was a terrible keeper because she choose trying to look after Merrill over the safety and well being of her clan. (She really should've just let Merrill make her mistakes on her own. But I can see why she didn't. It was a absolutely terrible way of going about it no doubt but I see her as trying to protect Merrill. She shouldn't have Merrill was old enough to make her own mistakes and choices but she did). And yeah as Elu said Marethari does flat out tell you to kill her to stop it.

She tells you something like I have no choice then and she runs up the mountain if you tell her what Merrill's up to before you go. (I guess if you say nothing she assumes the worst and heads up anyway). And when you get there she tells you she allowed it to possess her so it wouldn't Merrill.

Yes, she was definitely a terrible Keeper. I understand the reason why she acted that way, but a Keeper has certain responsibility.
Ah, I remember now the dialogue, though my point is that she should've adverted the clan.

See the I was mostly joking I agree she was an idiot for not washing her hands of Merrill.

Also if Merrill got possessed and killed Hawke it'd also lead to a massacre .

Fair enough on the first part.
On the second part, Merrill didn't have the responsibility to warn the clan, and she didn't plan to get possessed. Marethari had that responsibility and she wanted to be possessed to save Merrill.

[The Elder King]

Marethari contains the demon until Merrill and Hawke arrives, at which point she tells them to kill her, and not trust a word she says after the demon has taken over.

Yes, I remember now. I misunderstood Ares' post and though he was referring to her clan.

[Xilizhra]

You'd still end up with two incompatible methodologies.  Celene recognizes that education and adjustment are key to long term acceptance and equal rights.  That's why she supports the University of Orlais, has them teaching pro-elf curricula (that results in young nobles graduating with a vastly better view of elves than their parents) and even accepting promising elves as students.

 

Briala is no longer content to wait.  She thinks she can brute force change, which is only going to end the same way it always has;  resentment and repeated conflict.  The same conflicts that have been going on since Arlathan and Tevinter.

Then merge them. Find some elves and elevate them to the nobility, to start with, preferably with some kind of dispensation in marriage issues so that they don't have to breed with human nobles. Formally dissolve any legal barriers between humans and elves... assuming you can't give the elves their own nation.

[Ryzaki]

 
Yes, she was definitely a terrible Keeper. I understand the reason why she acted that way, but a Keeper has certain responsibility.
Ah, I remember now the dialogue, though any point is that she should've advised the clan.

 

Yeah she let her love for Merrill blind her to her duties. Understandable but she shouldn't have had the job if she didn't know how to cut people loose.

 

She might've figured the clan would've tried to stop her (and I wouldn't blame them.).

 

Edit: Heh. I wonder if elven threads turning into Merrill discussions is the DA2 version of Loghain/Alistair discussions turning into the opposite.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Gaining information doesn't require working with them. You can gather information from the Profane Abomination and Torpor about the respective situations in the primeval thaig and Feynriel's plight without making a deal with either one of them.

 

Also, WoT reads, "Unlike other spellcasters, Dalish mages do not use any magic involving spirits, as they believe all spirits are dangerous." (page 104) That was my issue.

Yeah it does, since the demons only share information if they feel it would benefit them. Thus acting on that information can be considered as cooperation.

 

Doesn't mean they didn't use spirits for other things. So far every Keeper we've met has been involved with a spirit at least once.