2014 réponses à ce sujet

[LobselVith8]

Yeah it's not like teaching her blood magic wasn't part of some long term plan he had to get himself released. And Profane and Torpor wanted Hawke to get rid of something for them, thus gave information on their foe.

 

Marethari certainly set Audacity free - I don't dispute that.

 

Hey, we are currently 3 for 3 of Keepers dealing with spirits, so you can't blame me for seeing it as a possibly more common occurrence than you think it is. 

 

I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm saying it's not supposed to be done by tradition.

[TK514]

One cannot assume that such a plan would work, especially not now that so much blood is being shed. Any of hope of the long game's reliability, which was faint as hell to begin with, has evaporated.

 

And even faint, it still has a better chance of success than trying to force the issue, which has no chance of success at all.

[Shadow Fox]

good grief ya'll are like dogs with a chew toy.  Can we not have one friggin thread that doesn't get bogged down in senseless trivial debate about Merril!?!?!?!?!?

 

I actually dislike her more because of all the meaningless debates she has caused on this forum then I actually dislike her from playing the game.

 

If we are going to talk about making deals with demons in game context, I hope we actually get a manipulative demon who can fool the PC like Ishmael does to Michel.

 

Basically "Here, give me let me go free in the deep roads and I will give you this great artifact/weapon and will never trouble you again" Then when you get back out of the deep roads you find that he has possessed your entire fortress and killed off some important NPCs that could have helped you.

 

Yeah that would be nice.

It's either this or debating on whether the Dalish should get the Dales,whether Orlais should be purged for crimes against the Elves or the Mage/Templar conflict again.  

 

Yup it would.

[wcholcombe]

I say AGAIN:

 

good grief ya'll are like dogs with a chew toy.  Can we not have one friggin thread that doesn't get bogged down in senseless trivial debate about Merril!?!?!?!?!?

 

I actually dislike her more because of all the meaningless debates she has caused on this forum then I actually dislike her from playing the game.

 

If we are going to talk about making deals with demons in game context, I hope we actually get a manipulative demon who can fool the PC like Ishmael does to Michel.

 

Basically "Here, give me let me go free in the deep roads and I will give you this great artifact/weapon and will never trouble you again" Then when you get back out of the deep roads you find that he has possessed your entire fortress and killed off some important NPCs that could have helped you.

 

Yeah that would be nice.

[AresKeith]

[wcholcombe]

It's either this or debating on whether the Dalish should get the Dales,whether Orlais should be purged for crimes against the Elves or the Mage/Templar conflict again.  

 

Yup it would.

Yes but those are actual debates. These are the grown up version of shouting "I know you are but what am I" at each other....

[Xilizhra]

And event faint, it still has a better chance of success than trying to force the issue, which has no chance of success at all.

I seriously doubt that harmony between Celene and Briala will be futile. If Gaspard's forces can be destroyed and, perhaps, enough elves prove themselves in the coming conflict, it'll be a foot in the door for a swifter ascension.

[LobselVith8]

You can talk to her before heading up the mountain, at which point Marethari deduces the reason you and Merrill has arrived, and she runs ahead. If you do not talk to her, we can only assume she took a shortcut, despite what the Merrill lovers wants to believe.

 

Merrill asks for Hawke's help in the first place (in Kirkwall) because it seems as though Audacity may have escaped (since she tried to remotely communicate with it and failed when she ran into problems with her inert Eluvian), so it seems Marethari set Audacity free long before Hawke and Merrill journeyed to Sundermount.

[Shadow Fox]

I say AGAIN:

 

good grief ya'll are like dogs with a chew toy.  Can we not have one friggin thread that doesn't get bogged down in senseless trivial debate about Merril!?!?!?!?!?

 

I actually dislike her more because of all the meaningless debates she has caused on this forum then I actually dislike her from playing the game.

 

If we are going to talk about making deals with demons in game context, I hope we actually get a manipulative demon who can fool the PC like Ishmael does to Michel.

 

Basically "Here, give me let me go free in the deep roads and I will give you this great artifact/weapon and will never trouble you again" Then when you get back out of the deep roads you find that he has possessed your entire fortress and killed off some important NPCs that could have helped you.

 

Yeah that would be nice.

See my post above yours.

[Ryzaki]

 

Merrill's skill is short-ranged. And the maps do change; in fact, if you go up to the top of Sundermount in Act 2, you'll see that the blue barrier is gone and replaced by an overturned wagon (which, by the way, strongly implies that someone had been there three years before she was allegedly possessed...), so if Bioware had wanted to show that the landslide had been removed, they'd have shown it.

 

Short ranged yes nothing's saying it can't be spammed with enough magic. She wouldn't have to bound up the mountain in one go. Getting far enough of Hawke and Co would be quite enough. She's rushing they're walking. It's not like Hawke & Co got up the mountain quickly. Had to fight those mobs.

 

You do realize there's a quest with a rogue mage over there if you side with the templars previously right?  You kill him up there. Cart could've been him it's not like there's much difference besides. You're giving BW's maps more credit than I do though. And if BW wanted to show that Marethari had been possessed before you even get up there they would've made it obvious as well if you want to use that arguement. It's not like any other possession isn't made abundantly clear.

[EmissaryofLies]

I'm just gonna stop, cause I have lost all track of what the hell we are trying to debate.

 

 Besides the Dalish hate brigade, business as usual. Just make some sweeping statement about spirits and demons and you'll fit right in. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I say AGAIN:

 

good grief ya'll are like dogs with a chew toy.  Can we not have one friggin thread that doesn't get bogged down in senseless trivial debate about Merril!?!?!?!?!?

 

I actually dislike her more because of all the meaningless debates she has caused on this forum then I actually dislike her from playing the game.

I'm not talking about Merrill at all. Lob and I are talking about Dalish Keepers in general. 

[Steelcan]

Then merge them. Find some elves and elevate them to the nobility, to start with, preferably with some kind of dispensation in marriage issues so that they don't have to breed with human nobles. Formally dissolve any legal barriers between humans and elves... assuming you can't give the elves their own nation.

 

I can totally see the nobility of Orlais passing off on this

[Hellion Rex]

WILL SOMEONE TELL ME WHAT THE ORIGINAL POINT OF THIS ARGUMENT WAS?

[Xilizhra]

Short ranged yes nothing's saying it can't be spammed with enough magic. She wouldn't have to bound up the mountain in one go. Getting far enough of Hawke and Co would be quite enough.

 

You do realize there's a quest with a rogue mage over there if you side with the templars previously right?  You kill him up there. Cart could've been him it's not like there's much difference besides. You're giving BW's maps more credit than I do though. And if BW wanted to show that Marethari had been possessed before you even get up there they would've made it obvious as well if you want to use that arguement. It's not like any other possession isn't made abundantly clear.

Spammed after being ejected into solid rock, or perhaps right off the mountain if the spell is kinder? You're reaching to the point of tendons snapping with a spell that's never been shown to have any such capabilities.

 

And why would they have made it obvious? After all, hidden possession is supposed to be dangerous because it's hard to discern, right? In any case, that mage isn't there if you side with the mages.

[Shadow Fox]

Yes but those are actual debates. These are the grown up version of shouting "I know you are but what am I" at each other....

This is what they all ultimately devolve into unfortunately my friend. 

[LobselVith8]

I seriously doubt that harmony between Celene and Briala will be futile. If Gaspard's forces can be destroyed and, perhaps, enough elves prove themselves in the coming conflict, it'll be a foot in the door for a swifter ascension.

 

Given how the Hero of Ferelden from different backgrounds could ask for something specific from the ruler of Ferelden, perhaps something similar will be possible with the conflict in Orlais. Perhaps an elven Inquisitor can ask for something more than "honorary lordship", with the civil war raging on.

[Ryzaki]

Spammed after being ejected into solid rock, or perhaps right off the mountain if the spell is kinder? You're reaching to the point of tendons snapping with a spell that's never been shown to have any such capabilities.

 

And why would they have made it obvious? After all, hidden possession is supposed to be dangerous because it's hard to discern, right? In any case, that mage isn't there if you side with the mages.

 

And you're insisting that she needs to use it like a projectile instead of getting just a bit further and insisting she's somehow possessed please don't act like I'm the only one reaching here.

 

Why wouldn't they have? Also the mage not being there has to do with the maps being recycled for constant content. You have no reason to be up there if you sided with the mages I believe. Only the templar quest takes you up there why would they bother remaking a map for such a slight variation?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Given how the Hero of Ferelden from different backgrounds could ask for something specific from the ruler of Ferelden, perhaps something similar will be possible with the conflict in Orlais. Perhaps an elven Inquisitor can ask for something more than "honorary lordship", with the civil war raging on.

Let's hope not considering how pretty much every single one of those boons ends up failing. 

[EmperorSahlertz]

Merrill asks for Hawke's help in the first place (in Kirkwall) because it seems as though Audacity may have escaped (since she tried to remotely communicate with it and failed when she ran into problems with her inert Eluvian), so it seems Marethari set Audacity free long before Hawke and Merrill journeyed to Sundermount.

Nope. It really doesn't.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Marethari certainly set Audacity free - I don't dispute that.

 

 

I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm saying it's not supposed to be done by tradition.

Well, maybe they discovered the ancient elves used spirits. Since they are all about being like them, they followed suit. 

[Hellion Rex]

Yup, I'm quitting. This is giving me a headache.

[Xilizhra]

And you're insisting that she needs to use it like a projectile instead of getting just a bit further and insisting she's somehow possessed please don't act like I'm the only one reaching here.

 

Why wouldn't they have? Also the mage not being there has squat to do with the maps being recycled for constant content. You have no reason to be up there if you sided with the mages I believe. Only the templar quest takes you up there.

You're still giving a spell range and power that it was never shown to have. You can look down on the mountain from a fair height and see Marethari still just standing there. And then there's the assumption that releasing Audacity would have been a swift matter... and then there's the fact that a possessed Marethari could have just jumped off the mountain and ended the whole problem instead of preparing an ambush for Hawke and Merrill in the demon's own den. Even if the fall wouldn't instantly kill the demon, she could leave the clan a warning about where she'd be jumping towards, more or less, and telling them to kill any injured demons that happened to be there.

 

And you don't explore? Also, there's no reason in-universe for the barrier to be down at all on the mage side if you're thinking that that one rogue mage was responsible.

[Shadow Fox]

WILL SOMEONE TELL ME WHAT THE ORIGINAL POINT OF THIS ARGUMENT WAS?

Well...

 

First it was whether the Dalish could be oppressive,then the merits of co-existence vs isolation for Elves,,then who started the war between Elves and Man,then whether Orlais should suffer for offenses against Elves and Mages,then whether Celene is progressive enough now it's whether Merrill's a hypocrite or not.

 

[The Hierophant]

This is what they all ultimately devolve into unfortunately my friend.

Just be glad a poster named Gimli doesn't pop up in here then shout "I will be dead before i see the ring in the hands of an elf!" during the peak of tension.