For all the horrors of religious dogma, authoritarian monarchy, and tyrianical history, no one was burned at the stake or executed for such disrespect to Empress and Chantry? You make a very compelling case that the Chantry and Orlais are more tolerant than many would give them credit for.
Oh, yes, people were executed. The elves. With the Divine's suggestion, by the way.
Really enjoyed the novel and absolutely sped through it.The characters are various shades of grey and i certainly felt the player is given less forced prodding(than say Asunder) as to who they should be sympathetic towards. Gaspard wasn't the moustache twirling villain and Celene certainly wasn't the wonderful ruler. Thestage has been set wonderfully for DAI and the inquisitor's turn to step onto the stage.
I've always been in love with the Eluvians(reminded me a bit of Tolkien's Palantir in a way) and to read about them coming to life, the pocket kingdom and the tombs got me super excited to the notion we might get to use the network in DAI.
Fen'harel has been the diety that most interested me. I loved the story about tricking both sets of gods so the fact that this novel was littered with more info about him was fantastic too.
Finnished it last night. Really good!
I loved how everyone in the book had a moment where I kind of disliked them, but also had alot of likeable moments. I especially loved Gaspard near the end.
I kinda curious how Morrigan and possibly the warden and there baby stay in there so long with without getting massive migranes.
Oh, yes, people were executed. The elves. With the Divine's suggestion, by the way.
The elves of Halamshiral were in rebellion aganst the Empress. That's a tad more than disrespect. What would you expect to happen?
The elves of Halamshiral were in rebellion aganst the Empress. That's a tad more than disrespect. What would you expect to happen?
Ah, but Celene didn't march against them because they rebelled. Celene marched against the elves because of the play mocking her and her pro-elven disposition. Don't forget that Briala's solution was set into motion beforehand, and that was the answer to the rebellion.
Dean suggested that maybe the Chantry and Orlais are more tolerant than people give them credit for because no one was punished because of the play. I said that people were punished, not just the people we expected. Also, that the Divine herself suggested that solution, so the Chantry isn't blameless either.
Ah, but Celene didn't march against them because they rebelled. Celene marched against the elves because of the play mocking her and her pro-elven disposition. Don't forget that Briala's solution was set into motion beforehand, and that was the answer to the rebellion.
Dean suggested that maybe the Chantry and Orlais are more tolerant than people give them credit for because no one was punished because of the play. I said that people were punished, not just the people we expected. Also, that the Divine herself suggested that solution, so the Chantry isn't blameless either.
Look at the big picture. Her pro-elven disposition was bleeding her support. The more support she lost, the easier it would be for Gaspard to succeed in his attempts to usurp her. Briala's solution (Actually I think it was Celene's idea) was intended to quiet that one revolution. Burning Halamshiral was intended to stop Gaspard from launching one: a show of force to quiet the rumors and strengthen her authority, to stop a destructive war and protect all she's done to drag Orlais kicking and screaming into a new more egalitarian era. It wasn't because of the play.
The play was sponsored by Remache. Seeing it just showed Celene Gaspard's newest tactic in destabilizing her rule. And that it was working. What Leliana told her about what University scholars were doing to defame elves only confirmed it. The Divine told Celene the situation needed to be dealt with if stability was to be maintained. The play was nothing but a sympton, to call it the cause of the attack is to oversimplify a very complicated situation.
Jedi Master of Orion, on 13 Apr 2014 - 6:31 PM, said:As an elf fan, Briala and Felassan left me cold. I imagined my hypothetical Dalish Inquisitor saying "You idiots have doomed us all!"LobselVith8: I'm curious, why is that?
I'm thinking because they were trained to withhold information and control their feeling at all time. I remember the book said that Briala was trained to listen and read other people thoughts but to show no emotion and blend into the scenery.
I think it'll all be an interesting aspect to the game (the computer game) that we'll each have to deal with ourselves.
I pretty much assume that somewhere along the line there will be factions we need to aline with to get their help with the overall big picture of closing the veil tears. Unless one of you happen to be David Cameron or Barack Obama (if you are then erm Syria, Ukraine, Recession...get back to work), non of us has ever been in a position where we have had to make these type of decisions outside of other computer games.
We will no doubt be forced to choose between the lesser of evils, pick a side, or bash enough heads to force a consensus in order to achieve the ultimate goal. Would you burn an alienage if it meant you can close a veil tear and save a million lives? Will you betray your LI if it meant gaining a greater power?
It's actually quite interesting if you consider the Gaspard, Celene and Briala 'war for orlais' like the Turian, Krogan, Salarian part of the game. The Mages and Templars then become your Geth and Quarian old enemies aspect. SO who will be the Asari? The wardens? Ferelden? Just hope there's no red, green , blue ending coming 
I think it'll all be an interesting aspect to the game (the computer game) that we'll each have to deal with ourselves.
I pretty much assume that somewhere along the line there will be factions we need to aline with to get their help with the overall big picture of closing the veil tears. Unless one of you happen to be David Cameron or Barack Obama (if you are then erm Syria, Ukraine, Recession...get back to work), non of us has ever been in a position where we have had to make these type of decisions outside of other computer games.
We will no doubt be forced to choose between the lesser of evils, pick a side, or bash enough heads to force a consensus in order to achieve the ultimate goal. Would you burn an alienage if it meant you can close a veil tear and save a million lives? Will you betray your LI if it meant gaining a greater power?
It's actually quite interesting if you consider the Gaspard, Celene and Briala 'war for orlais' like the Turian, Krogan, Salarian part of the game. The Mages and Templars then become your Geth and Quarian old enemies aspect. SO who will be the Asari? The wardens? Ferelden? Just hope there's no red, green , blue ending coming
I agree. There is another thread that ask players to pick the factions they want to support. I'm planning on playing an Elf. I want the opportunity to help Briala. I'm sure some players want to side with one of the other two and they should be allowed.
Your comment: "Just hope there's no red, green , blue ending coming"
I agree that was terrible.
I agree. There is another thread that ask players to pick the factions they want to support. I'm planning on playing an Elf. I want the opportunity to help Briala. I'm sure some players want to side with one of the other two and they should be allowed.
Your comment: "Just hope there's no red, green , blue ending coming"
I agree that was terrible.
Ahh but what Briala is using the eluvians to attack supply lines? Send assassins into meeting? You've convinced Gaspard to force march his men to the defence of an Inquisition fortress about to be over run by demons and Briala choose this moment to attack Verchiel?
Briala's stated intention is to prolong the war and weaken the humans. For the inquisitor who's goal is to unite, defend and eventually close a veil tear, her goals as we know to this point sound to be against ours.
I agree it will be interesting to play out, siding with the various factions which I fully intend to explore. But in the hypothetical, gun to your head, pick one of your wardens, one of your hawkes and this is your world state (not sure about you, but I do have a 'main' warden and hawke I plan to recreate in the keep), I'm not sure I would be playing an Inquisitor that actively supported the elves.
Ahh but what Briala is using the eluvians to attack supply lines? Send assassins into meeting? You've convinced Gaspard to force march his men to the defence of an Inquisition fortress about to be over run by demons and Briala choose this moment to attack Verchiel?
Briala's stated intention is to prolong the war and weaken the humans. For the inquisitor who's goal is to unite, defend and eventually close a veil tear, her goals as we know to this point sound to be against ours.
I agree it will be interesting to play out, siding with the various factions which I fully intend to explore. But in the hypothetical, gun to your head, pick one of your wardens, one of your hawkes and this is your world state (not sure about you, but I do have a 'main' warden and hawke I plan to recreate in the keep), I'm not sure I would be playing an Inquisitor that actively supported the elves.
your comment: " Briala's stated intention is to prolong the war and weaken the humans."
Could this be just a short term goal? Could she be building an army of CE and Dalish? I don't know the book ends at the beginning. It teases me.
If Briala is playing the role of the Elven Great Leader, I'm in. It would be fun. I don't see a real reason to make this just option a Celene or option b Gaspard. We will see i guess.
your comment: " Briala's stated intention is to prolong the war and weaken the humans."
Could this be just a short term goal? Could she be building an army of CE and Dalish? I don't know the book ends at the beginning. It teases me.
If Briala is playing the role of the Elven Great Leader, I'm in. It would be fun. I don't see a real reason to make this just option a Celene or option b Gaspard. We will see i guess.
To answer the need question: Simple, continuity issues. It'll be easier to write future games if Orlais doesn't change much and the main thing different is just a different ruler.
I'm all in for an option to side with Briala - because that means we can also completely ruin her plans.
Look at the big picture. Her pro-elven disposition was bleeding her support. The more support she lost, the easier it would be for Gaspard to succeed in his attempts to usurp her. Briala's solution (Actually I think it was Celene's idea) was intended to quiet that one revolution. Burning Halamshiral was intended to stop Gaspard from launching one: a show of force to quiet the rumors and strengthen her authority, to stop a destructive war and protect all she's done to drag Orlais kicking and screaming into a new more egalitarian era. It wasn't because of the play.
The play was sponsored by Remache. Seeing it just showed Celene Gaspard's newest tactic in destabilizing her rule. And that it was working. What Leliana told her about what University scholars were doing to defame elves only confirmed it. The Divine told Celene the situation needed to be dealt with if stability was to be maintained. The play was nothing but a sympton, to call it the cause of the attack is to oversimplify a very complicated situation.
The big picture is that Celene had two paths to choose from: taking direct action against the elves or take indirect action. At the beginning she chose the second, then, after the play, she chose the first. Of course, both had advantages and disadvantages. No one has the benefit of claiming "this is the pragmatic option". Especially for one big reason: because we do know that the correct option was to wait, since it was a trap set by Gaspard. And Celene hasn't even the option to say "no one could have seen that coming", because Briala saw it coming (ch7).
That any other similar event could have sparked it is both true and inconsequential, since Celene wasn't forced into action by things that didn't happen, but by a play that did happen. In the end, the only people who were punished because of the play were the elves. Remache met his end because of another reason. And that's the sadness of it.
Ahh but what Briala is using the eluvians to attack supply lines? Send assassins into meeting? You've convinced Gaspard to force march his men to the defence of an Inquisition fortress about to be over run by demons and Briala choose this moment to attack Verchiel?
Briala's stated intention is to prolong the war and weaken the humans. For the inquisitor who's goal is to unite, defend and eventually close a veil tear, her goals as we know to this point sound to be against ours.
I agree it will be interesting to play out, siding with the various factions which I fully intend to explore. But in the hypothetical, gun to your head, pick one of your wardens, one of your hawkes and this is your world state (not sure about you, but I do have a 'main' warden and hawke I plan to recreate in the keep), I'm not sure I would be playing an Inquisitor that actively supported the elves.
If Briala becomes an obstacle, she will end up badly. Frankly, I didn't expect any elven side to put anything of value on the table for the Inquisition.
BUT control of the Eluvians is a major thing. For an organization such as the Inquisition, taking control of a vast network of fast travel in Thedas would be as good as having one of the contender's armies. Briala can negotiate since it isn't as easy as "you killed it, you bought it"; without the password, the Eluvians are almost useless.
That is of course if Briala is the only way to achieve this. Celene has a new court mage who might have a different option. If playing a Qunari Inquisitor would they even trust a network of Ancient Elven mirrors?
Would be cool to have to fight elves in the 'pocket world', the world shifting in colour and not quite right (unless you an elf yourself of course).
That is of course if Briala is the only way to achieve this. Celene has a new court mage who might have a different option. If playing a Qunari Inquisitor would they even trust a network of Ancient Elven mirrors?
Would be cool to have to fight elves in the 'pocket world', the world shifting in colour and not quite right (unless you an elf yourself of course).
Why wouldn't they? You're a Vashoth Qunari, not a Qunari Qunari.
You still would of been born and raised in a Magical suspicious society. The fact that you've chosen to leave the Qun isn't likely to totally erase an upbringing of mage fear. I would assume the natural response for a Qunari of any stripe given a choice of fight 100 guys or step through a magical mirror would be the fight.
To answer the need question: Simple, continuity issues. It'll be easier to write future games if Orlais doesn't change much and the main thing different is just a different ruler.
I see what you mean.
Huh so my friend corrected me.
Ishmael wont be the big bad for DAI.
It is told that "something worse" is coming and leaves.
So what can be worse then an ancient demon?
I kinda hope that we get another freaking awesome boss fight like we had with the two main demons in DAO and DA2 though.
Huh so my friend corrected me.
Ishmael wont be the big bad for DAI.
It is told that "something worse" is coming and leaves.
So what can be worse then an ancient demon?
I kinda hope that we get another freaking awesome boss fight like we had with the two main demons in DAO and DA2 though.
Greater Pride Demon, perhaps? Those things are believed to be capable of destroying the world if they cross the Veil.
Ishmael wont be the big bad for DAI.
I do hope we can deal with him though. I dislike the Dalish as much as the next person, but what he did to the clan was just horrible. Except the Keeper. Had no mercy at all for him. Idiot.
The elves of Halamshiral were not burned because of the play. At best you can say the play was partially and Indirectly responsible. They rebelled against the Empress, and Celene was accused of being too soft on the elves. The play was just a manifestation of that. If she hadn't forcefully put down the rebellion she would have looked weaker. You could argue whether that was a price she should have paid or not but politically speaking, not responding with an army would have played into Gaspard's hands as well.
I'm thinking because they were trained to withhold information and control their feeling at all time. I remember the book said that Briala was trained to listen and read other people thoughts but to show no emotion and blend into the scenery.
I uh... wasn't talking about their demeanor. I was talking about how appealing they were as major elf characters.
The elves of Halamshiral were not burned because of the play. At best you can say the play was partially and Indirectly responsible. They rebelled against the Empress, and Celene was accused of being too soft on the elves. The play was just a manifestation of that. If she hadn't forcefully put down the rebellion she would have looked weaker. You could argue whether that was a price she should have paid or not but politically speaking, not responding with an army would have played into Gaspard's hands as well.
I uh... wasn't talking about their demeanor. I was talking about how appealing they were as major elf characters.
Sorry.
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