333 réponses à ce sujet

[TK514]

Just to be clear, you're actually asking for the opportunity to engage with flirtations with NPCs that are turned down because your PC is of the wrong gender?

 

Or just aren't interested in a relationship with the PC, like Aveline.

[Twilight_Princess]

Like gaider, if the resources are there I'd like to see a set of sexualities in the game.

[geth47]

Zyree: The problem is, that in a game like dragon age, or mass effect, the collected info you gain from npcs helps built his, her or its lore.

 

A different protagonist can be a parallel universe when it comes to the protagonist, but it´s the same when it comes to the companions.

 

For instance, if Garrus give us a piece of info from his past when you have a renegade talk with him, and another info with you use a paragon, or another info if you´re romancing him, all 3 infos are part of his lore.

 

Some lgbt people are so centered around themselves, that they don´t take this into consideration. If all characters become playersexual, it means that all of them are actually bissexual. At least potentially. As I said before, a reality in which everyone is hetero looks artificial, false. So would one where everyone is openly bi. What´s the point of having choices if they can only open and never close doors? If for every decision you will not have to deal with restrictions? 

[daveliam]

I think that a big issue is that people are conflating playersexuality and bisexuality.  To me, playersexuality is when the player will be available to romance you regardless of the decisions that you make or the characteristics of your character.  It's bigger than just sexuality in the traditional sense.  For some reason, people are only focused on the sexuality aspect of this.

 

Just being available to both genders does not mean playersexual.  If a character changes their sexuality based on the gender of the PC, then that, to me, is playersexuality.  If a character is available to both males and females without making a chance in their sexuality, that is bisexual not playersexual.  I'm not sure that we have ever seen a playersexual LI in DA based on sexuality.  Isabela is clearly bisexual.  Anders, while not as clearly demonstrated, there is enough evidence to support that he is actually bisexual.  Remember that just expressing interest in one gender doesn't mean that you are straight (or gay).  To me, they are both bisexual.

 

Fenris and Merrill are tougher because they don't really talk about their sexuality at all, regardless of gender.  However, they also don't express that their sexuality is changing.  I'm not saying that they are not playersexual, but I also don't think you can anyone can say that they definitely are either.  It's vague and that might be why people are confusing the two.

 

For me, my stance is that I like the 2/2/2 idea, because I like the idea of having more outright gay and lesbian characters in the romance content.  However, if it couldn't be an even distribution, then I would prefer all bisexual.  Note, not playersexual.

[TKavatar]

What's the point of having choices if they can only open and never close doors?

I love this quote.

Mind if I sig it?

[Rayndorn]

Having a character attracted to only one gender makes them deeper - or, at least, that's the popular argument against playersexual companions. I disagree with this, personally.

Honestly? I vastly prefer the idea of all companions being bisexual. Everybody is happy, everybody gets their favourite LI without having to play another gender. Alistair was my forbidden fruit in Origins as a gay male, and while watching my lady Dwarf romance him was adorable, I wished I could have done so on my male Mage. And yet some people are bothered by all LI's being bisexual - sure, it's not that realistic, but playersexuality is a good half-way point IMO.

Merrill, for example, was the sweetest little thing, and never exactly refered to her preferences in dialogue outside of flirting and her romance. With only the playersexual romance, she never proved or disproved being into ladies OR men. Meanwhile, Isabela happily expresses that she is very open to the idea of sex, and if she had to have a label it would probably be bisexual.

My point is this - if people are so bothered by everybody magically being bisexual, why don't you just view your playersexual companion as only interested in your currently played gender? As others have said, if it's not in your game, why worry about it so much?

[Cainhurst Crow]

Gaider should've never said comments about "playersexual" characters. All it did just confused plain, average minds on bsn, some even suddenly started to call straight characters from Origins "playersexual".

As someone who doesn't like the current playsexual mechanic and would like it either vastly retooled or done away with completely, I'm asking to not make characters horrible people depending on what gender you play, like anders brushing his relationship with karl under the rug if you choose to play a girl.

[Weltea]

Playersexual is preferable to me, I guess. I mean,2/2/2 wouldn't make me cry or anything but still...

(Also the closest we ever came to 2/2/2 was in Origins which was,frankly terrible. Playing as a female character meant the game pushed you towards romancing Alistair and it was impossible to have a friendship like the male Warden could have with him. 'Cause almost everytime you were nice to him the romance was restarted.) 

 

Considering that there is only ever one Inquisitor of one gender per playthrough I just don't think NPCs having a fixed sexuality (that's not bi or pan) isn't neccessary because they're living in entire different universes depending on which gender you pick for your character.

 

Romances are a great way to have different playthroughs (at least for me) and as such I would like to experience as many of them as possible

Also I tend to romance whoever fits best with the personality and background I picked so to find out that a character IS romanceable just not for me would be annoying. Especially since I just cannot play female characters in this series (I try and then I get pissed at Bioware for weeks. Who knows maybe the writing for and involving a female Inquisitor won't be quit so ...'ewwww').

 

Also sorry to say but in my experience the fandoms that built up around certain characters tend to be very obnoxious and single-minded if they're female dominated and the male character in question is an LI or has hints towards a romance (OP mentioned Cullen and he's a perfect example for this, especially the tumblr part of his fandom) and having them available as romance options for both genders tends to *even it out*

 

 

 

 

Romances restricted to races or classes on the other hand I would actually find kind of cool (probably because sexuality is such a real life issue and I occassionally play for the sole reason of getting away from real life....) 

[AlanC9]

Or just aren't interested in a relationship with the PC, like Aveline.

 

Well, we got that part already.

[AlanC9]

As someone who doesn't like the current playsexual mechanic and would like it either vastly retooled or done away with completely, I'm asking to not make characters horrible people depending on what gender you play, like anders brushing his relationship with karl under the rug if you choose to play a girl.

 

Hmm.. haven't played an Anders romance yet with either gender. What's the difference?

[AlanC9]

For instance, if Garrus give us a piece of info from his past when you have a renegade talk with him, and another info with you use a paragon, or another info if you´re romancing him, all 3 infos are part of his lore.

 

 

 

Is that necessarily true? Bio could certainly establish different backstories for Garrus for RenSheps and ParaSheps if they wanted to. I can't think of any good reason to do that, but there's no reason why it couldn't happen.

 

Hawke's family changes appearance depending on your chargen choices, but it doesn't mean that they're all shapeshifters.

[MrMrPendragon]

Actually, i don't like the 2/2/2 structure. Making it even, to me, feels like fan service than just writing a character. The same with everyone being bi.

If the writers can make a character better when he/she is written as bi, then make the character bi. If the writers can make a better character overall if he/she is hetero, then make the character hetero.

It doesn't matter if I pretended this guy is hetero in one playthrough, and ****** in the next, because if you do that then the lore will dictate that this person is bi. If we do this for every game, then lore will say that all the supporting characters that were involved in all major events of Thedas are bisexual. Everytime a character is added in a game, then he/she is also added into the world of Dragon Age, and it would totally look like unnecessary fan service if every major character added is bisexual.

If you chose to be female (or male), but want someone who only romances guys (or girls) well too bad. ------- That's the way it's supposed to be.

[Han Shot First]

I'm a straight woman and if it were an option, I'd prefer 2/2/2 over playersexuality. There are a couple of reasons.

 

1. It would allow for the existence of gay love interests. In fact, it's the only way we'd ever get a gay character as a love interest. (The only time BioWare has even approached that with an actual companion in its entire history of romances was Juhani in KotOR.) Not that I don't want to see bisexual love interests as well, but it's a little sad that gay characters can never be romanced in the DA series.

 

 

Traynor and Cortez in Mass Effect 3 are gay LIs. They might not be companions, but both are crew members on the Normandy.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Hmm.. haven't played an Anders romance yet with either gender. What's the difference?

When you play as a guy, anders mentions that karl and him were romantically involved, giving another layer of why this affected him so much. But if you play a girl karl is relegated to just being some mage he was helping out, no mention of even being friends let alone lovers.

It made him come across as very two faced and manipulative on my next play through, even though initially I forgave him for his stunt with the chantry last time. It helped me realize anders is a horrible person and shouldn't be allowed to live after what he does at act 3.

[sandalisthemaker]

Actually, i don't like the 2/2/2 structure. Making it even, to me, feels like fan service than just writing a character. The same with everyone being bi.

If the writers can make a character better when he/she is written as bi, then make the character bi. If the writers can make a better character overall if he/she is hetero, then make the character hetero.

It doesn't matter if I pretended this guy is hetero in one playthrough, and ****** in the next, because if you do that then the lore will dictate that this person is bi. If we do this for every game, then lore will say that all the supporting characters that were involved in all major events of Thedas are bisexual. Everytime a character is added in a game, then he/she is also added into the world of Dragon Age, and it would totally look like unnecessary fan service if every major character added is bisexual.

If you chose to be female (or male), but want someone who only romances guys (or girls) well too bad. ------- That's the way it's supposed to be.

 

If they were all hetero would you complain?

 

Maybe all companions are bi. Maybe that's just how Thedas is. 

 

BioWare determines how things "Should be." Not you or anyone else.

[Han Shot First]

There is a bit of a problem with making everyone in Thedas bisexual. Presumably this would be done with the intent of being inclusive and accounting for every player's possible sexual preference, while allowing the player character to romance any of the potential LIs regardless of gender. But if with the stroke of a pen you've eliminated both homosexual and heterosexual people from the world of Thedas, is that really being inclusive?

[Blackrising]

I prefer the 'everyone is available to either gender' route. (I refuse to use the word 'playersexual', as I don't see them that way.)

Simply because that means I won't have to resort to playing as someone I do not want to play just to enjoy the romance I want to see. Playing men is no fun for me most of the time. I also rarely enjoy straight romance the way I enjoy gay (or more specifically, lesbian) romances, it's as simple as that. So if I am forced to play a guy in order to romance the LI I enjoy most personality-wise, I will end up being disappointed, because it would have been so much more fun for me with a lady protagonist.

(see Morrigan)

(and Tali)

(and Miranda)

(and Ashley)

(and...well, you get my drift.)

 

I don't see an advantage to the 2/2/2 approach as opposed to the '4 for everyone' approach, to be honest, apart from getting some people (most of whom, as it seems to me, don't particularly care for the romances anyway) to complain less about how it breaks their immersion.

Just let everyone have a LI they're happy with. It's not that hard.

[daveliam]

Where are people getting the idea that "everyone" is bisexual and "no one" is straight or gay? 

 

Last time I checked, we are only talking about LI's, which account for about 4-5 people per game.  That's it.  That's the extent of it.  It's not doing anything to change the sexualities of anyone who isn't an LI.

 

All told, we have had 9 LI's in Dragon Age and only 6 of them are bisexual (none are gay, I'd like to point out).  Considering that we've met, literally, hundreds of characters and we're talking about 6 (yes, there are some bisexual and gay NPCs too, but that number is marginal).

 

People are blowing this out of proportion, I think. 

[Ryzaki]

OFFS

 

For the hundredth time four bi LIs doesn't mean everyone in Thedas is bisexual. I don't see why people are being so obtuse about that.

 

Edit: Lawl david beat me. XD

[sandalisthemaker]

In general, the people who claim not to care about the romances are the ones that want restrictions placed on the people who like them.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Playsexual actually doesn't have anything to do with bisexuality, homosexuality, or heterosexuality, and instead has a weirder effect.

If you play a girl, then you make every female a lesbian and every male heterosexual. If you play a male you make every male character gay and every women straight. Bisexuality is completely removed from existence, as characters must be attracted only to what gender the main character is, and that gender alone. Getting ride of player sexuality allows for actually homosexual, heterosexual, and bisexual characters to arise. Which isn't all that much of an accomplish compared to making characters have full preferences of their own independent on the players opinion on the matter. Personally, I'd like to see romances or interactions with characters depend on flags throughout the game, that determine how characters react and view you in a meaningful way, over this only mattering in a romance context. But I accept this will never happen due to how hard it'll be and that romances are just an easier thing to work with for bioware.

Still, I don't believe anyone who claims playsexual romances increase inclusiveness when it wipes out various orientations from existence rather then accept that some characters will and won't be into you.

If bioware let characters explore relationships outside of the main character a little more, like aveline in Da2 or garrus and tali if you didn't romance either in mass effect, this wouldn't be such a problem.

[Jorji Costava]

There is a bit of a problem with making everyone in Thedas bisexual. Presumably this would be done with the intent of being inclusive and accounting for every player's possible sexual preference, while allowing the player character to romance any of the potential LIs regardless of gender. But if with the stroke of a pen you've eliminated both homosexual and heterosexual people from the world of Thedas, is that really being inclusive?

 

This hardly seems like the most natural way to look at things. If there are N mages out of a total of nine companions, no one's going to look at that and think, "Well Bioware must be saying that N out of every 9 people in Thedas is a mage." I don't see how things are any different if you have four bisexual companions.

[AresKeith]

In general, the people who claim not to care about the romances are the ones that want restrictions placed on the people who like them.

Not really

[sandalisthemaker]

Not really

 

Yes really.

[Uhh.. Jonah]

If you play a girl, then you make every female a lesbian and every male heterosexual. If you play a male you make every male character gay and every women straight. Bisexuality is completely removed from existence, as characters must be attracted only to what gender the main character is, and that gender alone. 

 

Right, because when I play as a Male Hawke in DA2, Isabela totally loses her interest in females, even though many of her lines suggest that she enjoys a woman's company also.