138922 réponses à ce sujet

[Asperath]

Are there supposed to be random dead people in Val Rouyeaux or did they all faint when I wasn't looking?

 

I know of at least one random that faints, I think on one of the upper tiers

[Zarro-Morningstar]

I just witnessed one today. It was a guy who apparently had a crush on my IQ/a big hero worshiper and fainted when I passed him.

[Zarro-Morningstar]

You know what I just realized? When the IQ asks Cullen about the men and women around him at the ball, she says something like this: "It seems you have attracted quite the following. Who are all these people?" That could be taken the way it may had been meant to at that moment but do you think that is a poke from Bioware to you know this forum and everyone who frequents it, lol? If so it seems Cullen does not appreciate all of us XD

[alwayshungry]

I know of at least one random that faints, I think on one of the upper tiers

I saw one faint after Blackwall's quest on the main level. Actually, I didn't see him faint, I just saw him on the floor and I thought he died.

[Jean]

You know what I just realized? When the IQ asks Cullen about the men and women around him at the ball, she says something like this: "It seems you have attracted quite the following. Who are all these people?" That could be taken the way it may had been meant to at that moment but do you think that is a poke from Bioware to you know this forum and everyone who frequents it, lol? If so it seems Cullen does not appreciate all of us XD

Oh, definitely. First thing I thought when I saw his crowd. 

[SpiritMuse]

As requested, the prayer scene with an unromanced Cullen who still takes lyrium.  Even the prayer sounds more bitter to me...
 
SPOILERS!!!

Hey that's my vid!

On a slightly more serious note, it always bugs me a little when people start making judgments on the moral fiber of the player based on what their characters do. It's a hazy issue sometimes because we do all have our own real life opinions on everything and there are many people who play what are essentially "What would I do in this situation"-selfquisitors, but there are also many who do not. Whose Inquisitors do things they might not ever choose themselves. I'm not saying anyone here is guilty of being judgmental, I think most of us know better than that, but I have sensed some implied judgments in some of the comments on the lyrium issue, intended or not. Just wanted to say be careful with that.

[Zarro-Morningstar]

I saw one faint after Blackwall's quest on the main level. Actually, I didn't see him faint, I just saw him on the floor and I thought he died.

Lol, I would had died if I saw that happen at that tense moment! They are Orlaisians so you never know...someone may had put a little tainted sugar in their honeyed wine.

 

Oh, definitely. First thing I thought when I saw his crowd. 

SO I'm not insane! Or at least not alone that is X3. I wonder if anyone else put that together...or still think that Cullen appreciates our clamoring.

[Jean]

Well... Then I apologize if my comment on the lyrium issue came off as being judgmental, as that was not my intention.

[riverbanks]

I agree that these slides show a lot about Cullen's character. And I actually agree with almost everything he had to say, and

Spoiler

most of my IQs will spare Blackwall. But there are only two moments in Blackwall's entire character development that I feel you can be certain are genuinely him and not potentially meant to protect his cover as Blackwall/playing a role: when you first find him and he's organizing those farm boys to fight back against the bandits, and when he confesses to save his former soldier from execution. Those are why I would believe he actually was trying to atone and change, and why my IQs will spare him to give him the chance. But because his romance doesn't have any development past the point of "starting over," you are left with only the lie. To me, it cuts off at the moment the real romance should start. And doesn't. There's a difference between leaving some specifics to headcannon and leaving the entire person to headcannon. Hopefully people aren't being too rude about it; for all we know, his writer had written content past that and someone made the decision to cut it. He is a fascinating and well-written character, and she did an outstanding job creating a character that was going to genuinely make people feel betrayed, which is remarkable writing (which I think I've said before, but I also don't think my criticism of his romance is unreasonable.)

 

Sort of briefly because this is not the place and we've had this conversation before anyway.

Spoiler

Having carried him in my party all game and got through all of his party banter, and actually having done his romance from beginning to end, I absolutely disagree with all of that, and I do think that discreting all of his character prior to the judgement as completely dishonest is unreasonable. There are parts of his arc where he is maintaining a facet, obviously, but there are many more where he shows his true character (romanced or not). Between his conversations and banter, you do know the real man behind both Blackwall and Rainier - you can even tell him that in judgement, that you free him to atone as the man he is, not the man he was or the one he was pretending to be.

 

In his romance, which is your specific criticism, in the very scene that activates the romance you can tell him against his own protests that you see good in him that even he doesn't see. That's not about the title he's carrying, but the deeds that show who he is. There's no headcanon involved in this - by the time of the judgement, you are not starting over from zero, you are choosing to work through this with the person you fell in love with, and not his title. If you can't see past that, you have the option to break up, but I don't think it's fair to essentially say that people who romance him and don't give up on him are romancing only his Grey Warden persona, instead of the real person he shows himself to be, regardless of name.

 

I don't blame you for being resentful of the character, but I do think it's quite unreasonable to be stuck on the notion that everything he says is a lie and not see past the lie to acknowlege all the things he does and says that are true and do reveal a true character beyond what name he calls himself. That's partly what Cullen's dialogue in that jail scene is there to say. If we are to live by that notion, then everything Morrigan, Anders and Solas say to you during their stories is a lie too, and we never saw a single moment of genuine character from any of them. Since their reveals only come at the end of their games and nothing else was done in terms of character development beyond that, did everyone who romance them romanced only their lies too? That's what I mean when I usually refer to double standards - if we are willing to admit that there were moments of those characters that were genuine, that were honest, that were themselves before their reveals, then disregarding all of Blackwall's character prior to his confession just comes accross as disingenuous. His character arc had the same premise as theirs, and I don't think you'll find a single Morrigan, Anders or Solas willing to say they never truly knew the character they were romancing before their lies came out to light. We acknowlege fault in certain characters but completely handwave others, so what gives? What is the standard?

 

In any case, we've agreed to disagree about this before, so... we carry on disagreeing.

[SpiritMuse]

Well... Then I apologize if my comment on the lyrium issue came off as being judgmental, as that was not my intention.

I actually was not intending to single anyone out, it was more a general "hey be mindful of this cause some posts may be drifting in that direction", and anyway, there was nothing judgmental about what you posted (unless I missed something).

[R2s Muse]

I was so confused when the lyrium thing came up. Everything we've ever been told thus far had always left me with the impression that lyrium was impossible to get off of - not unless you liked dying. Slowly. Painfully. I remember even talking to the tv like "How are you not dead???" 

 

After he said it'd been months since his last draught, I... Figured it was a slight retcon in how severe lyrium withdrawals were said to be, so I encouraged him to kick it. 

 

And not to be sappy, but I suppose I'll be a bit: His addiction plotline hit incredibly close to home for me as well. I come from a family with a very... colorful history of addiction problems. Drugs (any and all), alcohol, tobacco, prescription meds, a myriad of all the above, take your pick. 

 

So to watch a person, if only a fictional one, make the decision on their own to beat their addiction was a pretty ****** exhilarating thing for me to watch... Even if we really only got a very small taste of everything he was more than likely going through. 

 

Now I'm just going to *hides face*

Aw, not sappy! Thanks for sharing. Others with more firsthand knowledge than I have also said that the addiction storyline rang true, so that's nice to hear and a nice tribute to Brianne, I think.

 

On lyrium, I was thinking the same thing. All indicators up until now have suggested it was very hard to quit, with death a real possibility. Particularly given Evangeline's comments on suffering withdrawal after a week and madness after a month. Of course... I will also cut this storyline some slack since it does what I usually do, and kinda sweeps that fact under the rug... and inserts an offcamera "he soldiered through and broke his addiction" idea. 

 

One thing I also thought was interesting was that they seem to identify different degrees of addiction here as well. Every templar is addicted to lyrium, by definition, but apparently Samson's addiction was worse somehow. According to the start of Cullen's nemesis quest... 

 

Spoiler

"He had a chronic lyrium addiction. He spent every last coin buying it from local smugglers."

 

So, it's almost like there's addiction, and then there's addiction. Implying perhaps that Cullen's was the easier addiction to kick. I dunno. The distinction I just find curious.

[Basement Cat]

Aw, not sappy! Thanks for sharing. Others with more firsthand knowledge than I have also said that the addiction storyline rang true, so that's nice to hear and a nice tribute to Brianne, I think.

 

On lyrium, I was thinking the same thing. All indicators up until now have suggested it was very hard to quit, with death a real possibility. Particularly given Evangeline's comments on suffering withdrawal after a week and madness after a month. Of course... I will also cut this storyline some slack since it does what I usually do, and kinda sweeps that fact under the rug... and inserts an offcamera "he soldiered through and broke his addiction" idea. 

 

One thing I also thought was interesting was that they seem to identify different degrees of addiction here as well. Every templar is addicted to lyrium, by definition, but apparently Samson's addiction was worse somehow. According to the start of Cullen's nemesis quest... 

 

Spoiler

"He had a chronic lyrium addiction. He spent every last coin buying it from local smugglers."

 

So, it's almost like there's addiction, and then there's addiction. Implying perhaps that Cullen's was the easier addiction to kick. I dunno. The distinction I just find curious.

About your spoiler.

 

Spoiler

There are different types of addiction. Physical and psychological. It could be that Cullen's addiction is merely physical while Samson's is both.

[R2s Muse]

 

SO I'm not insane! Or at least not alone that is X3. I wonder if anyone else put that together...or still think that Cullen appreciates our clamoring.

LOL Um, I'm not sure if that comment could have been *more* obvious, to be honest.

[Asperath]

LOL Um, I'm not sure if that comment could have been *more* obvious, to be honest.

When I saw this in game for the first time, I thought it was hilarious! I love it & how obvious it was

[Jean]

Aw, not sappy! Thanks for sharing. Others with more firsthand knowledge than I have also said that the addiction storyline rang true, so that's nice to hear and a nice tribute to Brianne, I think.

 

On lyrium, I was thinking the same thing. All indicators up until now have suggested it was very hard to quit, with death a real possibility. Particularly given Evangeline's comments on suffering withdrawal after a week and madness after a month. Of course... I will also cut this storyline some slack since it does what I usually do, and kinda sweeps that fact under the rug... and inserts an offcamera "he soldiered through and broke his addiction" idea. 

 

One thing I also thought was interesting was that they seem to identify different degrees of addiction here as well. Every templar is addicted to lyrium, by definition, but apparently Samson's addiction was worse somehow. According to the start of Cullen's nemesis quest... 

 

Spoiler

"He had a chronic lyrium addiction. He spent every last coin buying it from local smugglers."

 

So, it's almost like there's addiction, and then there's addiction. Implying perhaps that Cullen's was the easier addiction to kick. I dunno. The distinction I just find curious.

Spoiler

I'd really like for that to be elaborated on as well. It's likely what Basement Cat said, with it being both a physical and psychological addiction, but I'd still love to know more.

 

Like... What about Alistair? We know via the comics that he does in fact take lyrium to use his abilities. So is he addicted? Am I fucked if even a small dose touches my tongue? Or does it take more than gradual sip for that to happen? Does it vary person to person, as people in real life??

 

I DON'T KNOW. BUT I WOULD LIKE TO.

[QweenBeen]

Cassandra's comment during his Perserverence quest got me thinking: why is it that templars "silently endure" and mages are the ones who get all vocal about lyrium? I didn't even thing mages got addicted to lyrium since it basically leaves their bodies when they use magic?

And agree with whoever posted that to seems weird cullen can even kick it. I just remember it being super emphasized that there's no way off it. I bit the bullet and asked he stay on it because he's hurting. My 3rt pt I'll be romancing him and blackwall so I can play nice later I guess :/

[Jean]

Cassandra's comment during his Perserverence quest got me thinking: why is it that templars "silently endure" and mages are the ones who get all vocal about lyrium? I didn't even thing mages got addicted to lyrium since it basically leaves their bodies when they use magic?

And agree with whoever posted that to seems weird cullen can even kick it. I just remember it being super emphasized that there's no way off it. I bit the bullet and asked he stay on it because he's hurting. My 3rt pt I'll be romancing him and blackwall so I can play nice later I guess :/

She didn't mean lyrium is what the mages get vocal about, it's other abuses they suffer. The templars are the ones who stay silent about their lyrium addiction issues and the fact that they are leashed to the chantry to feed it to them unless they somehow find a reliable source outside. 

[R2s Muse]

Cassandra's comment during his Perserverence quest got me thinking: why is it that templars "silently endure" and mages are the ones who get all vocal about lyrium? I didn't even thing mages got addicted to lyrium since it basically leaves their bodies when they use magic?

And agree with whoever posted that to seems weird cullen can even kick it. I just remember it being super emphasized that there's no way off it. I bit the bullet and asked he stay on it because he's hurting. My 3rt pt I'll be romancing him and blackwall so I can play nice later I guess :/

Agree with Jean on the "vocal" part. 

 

On lyrium and mages... I think that's a part of the lore that's muddied by gameplay difficulties. In DA:O they were going to have lyrium have diminishing returns the more you used as a way to show addiction. But mages had to slam pots, meaning everyone would end up addicted. So they took that aspect out. 

 

http://forum.bioware...page-2?p=372049

[R2s Muse]

Oh! Quick question. Does anyone know what it takes exactly to the get the solasan temple achievement? I opened all three doors, but didn't get it. Or do you have to finish before the story finale for it to count?

[Dishycrazychick]

I think there is a fourth door you can open after the cold fire and spirit one. Pretty much straight ahead when you first enter if I remember right.

[Jean]

Technically we're not supposed to be slamming back health poultices either, but gameplay. Stopping to rub goop on a wound would be weird, although according to Bull, drinking them still works.

 

I don't see why a mage couldn't become addicted to lyrium though, especially if they sip on it like some sort of casual drink.

[TheLastArchivist]

Yeah, in my opinion he becomes much colder. Spoilers for the romance in case anyone hasn't gotten to it:

 

Spoiler

As a mage in a romance with him, if you ask him what he would do if you're possessed he acts very conflicted. Your Quizzy then assumes he would go through with putting her down, but he tells her it's not that simple and he'd rather not think about it. In the past he probably would have, but it's much less clear in this case and it feels like it could go both ways.

 

However, if he breaks it off with you after you force him back on lyrium (without promising to help him find another way later) and you ask him the same thing, he basically says something like "What do you expect? That I would jeopardize the safety of the Inquisition instead of doing what had to be done?" in a really cold and firm tone of voice. He goes back to being all business, because basically you've told him that his duties come before any personal desires or emotional needs. It was actually a bit shocking when I watched the video of it because I've been so used to him being softspoken towards my Quizzy, hah.

 

I really like how you highlighted this important change in the Commander's behaviour.This is why he's my favourite romance, along with Dorian's. 

 

There's a lot of 'choice and consequences' going on here. Some people take relationships very lightly, having a boy/girlfriend "just for having one". Or because hey, why not?

In Dragon Age, I felt players were indulged in this inconsequential behaviour a lot. All you had to do was go on personal quests and unlock key dialog options to kiss and bed them. To many people, this must've been wonderful, because love in real life is not so black-and-white and good romance options don't just fall on our lap, as it is with games. Not to mention you can't just make people fall in love with you forever after doing one single thing for them or give them gifts and then it's 'they lived happily ever after'.

 

In other words, the player can manipulate their love interest at will.

 

 

Inquisition seems to have changed that a little bit. That system is still there, but Cullen's personal quest sure took people by surprise. Some people certainly thought that the whole lyrium ordeal would be solved in a binary way. Choose dialog option #1, he stays with me. Choose option #2, he quits me. Some fans must've been thinking along the lines of: Oh, to engage in romance with him, it's obvious which one I have to choose, tee hee!

 

And then they're faced with a REALLY HARD CHOICE, where there's no right or wrong. Just your conscience for another human being who desperately needs your help. 

And if the player hasn't been paying attention to one bit of what he said or just didn't plain care...well, that shows how much they actually deserve that romance.

 

It might be a game, but it simulated perfectly the complexity of a real life relationship; Cullen's not just a boy toy. He feels like a real man. Either you have enough experience to understand hs pains and nuances as a human being or you don't. It's simple. The man has serious issues that cannot be ignored in the name of casual flirting because they permeate his entire life. 

 

We're not getting involved with a 2nd Alistair. He's not a girlish woman's fantasy. Which is why his romance is so tasteful and mature, like Bioware promised it would be.

[Oxana124]

It really doesn't. Nothing that is posted is breaking any rules. So I'd say it is some ass filing a false complaint. 

I have always wondered whether it was ok to post gameplay videos on youtube, I know as long as they are not monetized it is fine, and some companies like Blizzard give permission. But for other companies I think the caveat is it has to have commentary. That's the information I've found by searching online anyways. I'm sure there is more to it.

[Annarl]

She didn't mean lyrium is what the mages get vocal about, it's other abuses they suffer. The templars are the ones who stay silent about their lyrium addiction issues and the fact that they are leashed to the chantry to feed it to them unless they somehow find a reliable source outside. 

 

Agree with Jean on the "vocal" part. 

 

On lyrium and mages... I think that's a part of the lore that's muddied by gameplay difficulties. In DA:O they were going to have lyrium have diminishing returns the more you used as a way to show addiction. But mages had to slam pots, meaning everyone would end up addicted. So they took that aspect out. 

 

http://forum.bioware...page-2?p=372049

I think that was also part of the Alistair retcon about lyrium. How he could use the powers without taking lyrium.

 

Though I think it would add an interesting spin in the future to find out the Chantry was lying about lyrium period.  Lying about Templars not being able to stop using it and that it is even needed once the abilities are learned by a Templar, it would show the Chantry was using it as a way of controlling Templars, a military force they want to do their biding. 

[kalasaurus]

So, does Cullen not care that there's a hole in his ceiling over his bed and a tree branch swinging in his room?  I mean, it'll snow and rain in his bedroom, right?  Is there a way to fix that?  I wouldn't want him catching a cold.  I haven't fully upgraded Skyhold yet.

 

Spoiler