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[Ariella]

Yeah, I always figured that even with all that he suffered in the tower that lead to Cullen being a little out of sorts for a while, that Greagoir still gave him a glowing recommedation based on his dedication to the job and how much he poured of himself into it.
 
And obviously, he never slept to the top with Greagoir either, which probably doesn't need to be said.
 
(Not that I don't enjoy the idea of Greagoir being a silver fox and/or gay knight in shining armour, I'd just prefer that to be without any unfortunate implications attached, y'know?)

Okay, the idea of Greagoir having sex with anybody strikes the same cord as the idea of my parents... well you know.

Greagoir is, well, Greagoir, he's the nice uncle who's sex life you REALLY don't want to know about.

I should mentioned I'm having trouble breathing due to laughter at the moment, Sifr, because that is the last pairing I'd ever think of.

Of course the idea of Meredith having sex in general is just weird for all different kinds of reasons that just popped into my head.

[Sifr]

I'm pretty sure I've heard someone say that, either it was Cullen or someone else. But still, I'm pretty sure I've heard it somewhere in game...

 

Yeah, one of the conversations with Cullen in his office has him mention that Meredith tried to nurture his mistrust of mages after what happened in Ferelden, hoping that she could mold him into her image as a similar authoritarian Templar. 

 

Actually gives a newfound insight to why Cullen's stance on mages swung back and forth a lot in DA2, that unbeknowst to us, he was attempting to reconcile the tough-but-fair stance he and the Ferelden Templars had, with the hardliner stance that Meredith and many in the Gallows held.

 

Maybe some will think it was due to him being badly characterised in DA2 (and many decried him about it), but I like to think that it's because he's just a hero of another story that Hawke was just casually wandering into from time to time, so s/he never got the whole picture.

 

Okay, the idea of Greagoir having sex with anybody strikes the same cord as the idea of my parents... well you know.

Greagoir is, well, Greagoir, he's the nice uncle who's sex life you REALLY don't want to know about.

I should mentioned I'm having trouble breathing due to laughter at the moment, Sifr, because that is the last pairing I'd ever think of.

Of course the idea of Meredith having sex in general is just weird for all different kinds of reasons that just popped into my head.

 

Yeah, I felt the same when Wynne mentioned that she used to be a bit of a cougar and drunkenly revealing that Rhys' father was a Templar. Between that and Loghain doing the Dark Ritual with Morrigan, those are some serious mental images I could have done without.

 

Not that I think they're unattractive or anything to do with their age, just that when your character isn't the one in that romance, it does end up being like finding out that your favourite uncle has been screwing a teacher you had a crush on in school.

 

[Rascoth]

Yeah, I always figured that even with all that he suffered in the tower that lead to Cullen being a little out of sorts for a while, that Greagoir still gave him a glowing recommedation based on his dedication to the job and how much he poured of himself into it.

 

And obviously, he never slept to the top with Greagoir either, which probably doesn't need to be said.

 

(Not that I don't enjoy the idea of Greagoir being a silver fox and/or gay knight in shining armour, I'd just prefer that to be without any unfortunate implications attached, y'know?)

 

Yeah, I felt the same when Wynne mentioned that she used to be a bit of a cougar and drunkenly revealing that Rhys' father was a Templar. Between that and Loghain doing the Dark Ritual with Morrigan, those are some serious mental images I could have done without.

 

Not that I think they're unattractive or anything to do with their age, just that when your character isn't the one in that romance, it does end up being like finding out that your favourite uncle has been screwing a teacher you had a crush on in school.

 

*cough, cough, heavy breathing* I'm sorry, I have to calm myself after that laugher attack.

 

Yeah, one of the conversations with Cullen in his office has him mention that Meredith tried to nurture his mistrust of mages after what happened in Ferelden, hoping that she could mold him into her image as a similar authoritarian Templar. 

 

Actually gives a newfound insight to why Cullen's stance on mages swung back and forth a lot in DA2, that unbeknowst to us, he was attempting to reconcile the tough-but-fair stance he and the Ferelden Templars had, with the hardliner stance that Meredith and many in the Gallows held.

 

Maybe some will think it was due to him being badly characterised in DA2 (and many decried him about it), but I like to think that it's because he's just a hero of another story that Hawke was just casually wandering into from time to time, so s/he never got the whole picture.

That's where I've heard that! Sorry, I've talked with everyone in every game so many times, that I sometimes loose track on who said what and when. It's rare since I'm known for remembering things like that, but it happens.

 

I personally agree with you on that last part. DA2 was Varric's tale about Hawke and I'm pretty sure he simply ignored what was not directly connected to Hawke.

[Tishina]

Yeah, one of the conversations with Cullen in his office has him mention that Meredith tried to nurture his mistrust of mages after what happened in Ferelden, hoping that she could mold him into her image as a similar authoritarian Templar. 

 

Actually gives a newfound insight to why Cullen's stance on mages swung back and forth a lot in DA2, that unbeknowst to us, he was attempting to reconcile the tough-but-fair stance he and the Ferelden Templars had, with the hardliner stance that Meredith and many in the Gallows held.

 

Maybe some will think it was due to him being badly characterised in DA2 (and many decried him about it), but I like to think that it's because he's just a hero of another story that Hawke was just casually wandering into from time to time, so s/he never got the whole picture.

 

 

Yeah, I felt the same when Wynne mentioned that she used to be a bit of a cougar and drunkenly revealing that Rhys' father was a Templar. Between that and Loghain doing the Dark Ritual with Morrigan, those are some serious mental images I could have done without.

 

Not that I think they're unattractive or anything to do with their age, just that when your character isn't the one in that romance, it does end up being like finding out that your favourite uncle has been screwing a teacher you had a crush on in school.

 

OK, ya'll can't go there without expecting the old farts in this thread to jump in. Pffft, you're only too old to enjoy sex when you're in the grave, and nothing says Wynne wasn't still a cougar, just not during DAO   Though I admit I didn't realize how badly off their depiction of age was in DAO until I found out Wynne's real age. She wasn't that old in DAO, at least not by my middle aged standard - I thought she was surely in her early 60s at least.

 

Oh, and Greagoir? There are hints he might have been Rhys's father. So now you have the image of a younger Greagoir and Wynne in your heads. You're welcome.

[Ariella]

Yeah, one of the conversations with Cullen in his office has him mention that Meredith tried to nurture his mistrust of mages after what happened in Ferelden, hoping that she could mold him into her image as a similar authoritarian Templar. 
 
Actually gives a newfound insight to why Cullen's stance on mages swung back and forth a lot in DA2, that unbeknowst to us, he was attempting to reconcile the tough-but-fair stance he and the Ferelden Templars had, with the hardliner stance that Meredith and many in the Gallows held.
 
Maybe some will think it was due to him being badly characterised in DA2 (and many decried him about it), but I like to think that it's because he's just a hero of another story that Hawke was just casually wandering into from time to time, so s/he never got the whole picture.

Ironically, that's pretty much what I'm working on right now, though Hawke's a little more than once in a while. I'm a sucker for the couple, but it's all Cullen's point of view so it's dealing with Meredith, trying to navigate what the letter of the law tells him, and the spirit of the law tells him.

I honestly wish they had given him more time in DA2. He's kind of like (God help me I'm about to sound like a REAL nerd here) Harley Quinn. Harley was supposed to be a one shot sidekick for Joker in Batman the Animated Series, but she became so popular, and was just beloved by the creators they kept bringing her back, and then DC dropped her into the comic universe.

Another example is Phil Coulson.

In a way, it's the same with Cullen. Went from just throwaway to well, having "ites"

Of course there's a great deal I wish they could have done more with in DA2. The thing had so much potential.
 

Yeah, I felt the same when Wynne mentioned that she used to be a bit of a cougar and drunkenly revealing that Rhys' father was a Templar. Between that and Loghain doing the Dark Ritual with Morrigan, those are some serious mental images I could have done without.
 
Not that I think they're unattractive or anything to do with their age, just that when your character isn't the one in that romance, it does end up being like finding out that your favourite uncle has been screwing a teacher you had a crush on in school.
 

Yeah, pretty much that. Something to be avoided at all cost and if needed scrubbed from memory.

I forgot about Wynne's TMI. I do remember Alistair getting all creeped out about the idea of Wynne having a sex life.

And even when Loghain was in Stolen Throne, I didn't want to think about him having sex. I really loathed his character.

Oh and how can we forget Morrigan's litany about Flemeth and the men she took for "company".

[Rascoth]

OK, ya'll can't go there without expecting the old farts in this thread to jump in. Pffft, you're only too old to enjoy sex when you're in the grave, and nothing says Wynne wasn't still a cougar, just not during DAO   Though I admit I didn't realize how badly off their depiction of age was in DAO until I found out Wynne's real age. She wasn't that old in DAO, at least not by my middle aged standard - I thought she was surely in her early 60s at least.

 

Oh, and Greagoir? There are hints he might have been Rhys's father. So now you have the image of a younger Greagoir and Wynne in your heads. You're welcome.

Wait, how old Wynne was in DAO? 

 

 

 I'm getting DA books soon, including Asunder... And I'll definitely remember that comment when reading about Rhys.

So thank you.

Really, thanks. It'll make reading it more interesting    

[Tishina]

Wait, how old Wynne was in DAO? 

 

 

 I'm getting DA books soon, including Asunder... And I'll definitely remember that comment when reading about Rhys.

So thank you.

Really, thanks. It'll make reading it more interesting    

You're welcome, enjoy!

Her birthyear was in WoT2 or something recently, and I can't remember exactly, but I believe she was 50ish? Possibly as young as 45 to no more than mid 50s, my age. All I can remember for certain was looking at that and thinking, "s**t, she looked 10 to 15 years older than me and my friends that age." Kind of like Cullen does not look 18/19ish in DAO...

[Ariella]

OK, ya'll can't go there without expecting the old farts in this thread to jump in. Pffft, you're only too old to enjoy sex when you're in the grave, and nothing says Wynne wasn't still a cougar, just not during DAO   Though I admit I didn't realize how badly off their depiction of age was in DAO until I found out Wynne's real age. She wasn't that old in DAO, at least not by my middle aged standard - I thought she was surely in her early 60s at least.
 
Oh, and Greagoir? There are hints he might have been Rhys's father. So now you have the image of a younger Greagoir and Wynne in your heads. You're welcome.

Nothing to do with old, Tishina, and everything to do with being parental. I don't think anyone wants to think about their parents in that light. And to me, Wynne and Greagoir are like my folks. That's just the vibe I get from them.

I don't get this vibe from say... Robert Redford, or Harrison Ford.

Veering back onto topic, don't have a problem with the idea of Wynne and Greagoir. In fact, I like that pairing. Again, it's like thinking of my parents going farther than a cute couple.

Strangely though I have no problem with Jed and Abby Bartlett in West Wing. Nerd Hot talk...

Maybe it's the voices. Wynne and Greagoir have these very parental voices, and not just in voice acting. You don't really see them out of those roles. And honestly they're supposed to be like that. I'm surprised no one has mentioned Irving in all this...

I'm a little slap happy from lack of sleep. Apologies

[Sifr]

OK, ya'll can't go there without expecting the old farts in this thread to jump in. Pffft, you're only too old to enjoy sex when you're in the grave, and nothing says Wynne wasn't still a cougar, just not during DAO   Though I admit I didn't realize how badly off their depiction of age was in DAO until I found out Wynne's real age. She wasn't that old in DAO, at least not by my middle aged standard - I thought she was surely in her early 60s at least.

 

Oh, and Greagoir? There are hints he might have been Rhys's father. So now you have the image of a younger Greagoir and Wynne in your heads. You're welcome.

 

Well, wasn't trying to suggesting that older people can't have an active sex life, just like as Ariella said, they are kinda parental figures.

 

I'd love to have an older love interest in the games and was a little disappointed that we weren't able to flirt with Wynne in Origins (especially when she revealed her preference for younger men) and when got rid of those streaks of grey in Blackwall's hair from his concept art.

 

(If Thedas had facebook, no doubt that the Warden and Zevran would have founded the Magical Bosom Appreciation Society, that's obvious)

 

How old was Wynne meant to be anyway? I always thought she was meant to be in her late 50's or early 60's at most, which is why the constant talk of her being old, as well as the similar comment from Bartrand about Leandra in DA2, kinda irked me since it's really not at all?

 

And I totally enjoy the idea of Greagoir being Rhys' father, I've always liked Greagoir/Wynne/Irving as a OT3.

 

[Ariella]

Well, wasn't trying to suggesting that older people can't have an active sex life, just like as Ariella said, they are kinda parental figures.
 
I'd love to have an older love interest in the games and was a little disappointed that we weren't able to flirt with Wynne in Origins (especially when she revealed her preference for younger men) and when got rid of those streaks of grey in Blackwall's hair from his concept art.
 
(If Thedas had facebook, no doubt that the Warden and Zevran would have founded the Magical Bosom Appreciation Society, that's obvious)
 
How old was Wynne meant to be anyway? I always thought she was meant to be in her late 50's or early 60's at most, which is why the constant talk of her being old, as well as the similar comment from Bartrand about Leandra in DA2, kinda irked me since it's really not at all?
 
And I totally enjoy the idea of Greagoir being Rhys' father, I've always liked Greagoir/Wynne/Irving as a OT3.
 

Alistair was supposed to be a grizzled veteran too, originally.

I can't find anything that's specific about her age, but I'd put her at about 53-55. Greagoir, I'd say, would be in his early sixties. Irving I would have guessed older than either of them, but it seems that Irving and Wynne were always close friends, so I'd estimate a similar age.

[Tishina]

Oh, I understand, but you have to expect teasing in return because age actually does have everything to do with it. No one gets creeped out at the idea of a pair of 20 year olds having sex unless there's some other major issue. Now, the idea of actually imagining any two other people in the act of having sex always struck me as a bit unusual. I have no trouble with the idea that elderly relatives of mine had active, happy sex lives into their 70s and 80s (I don't think anyone lived into their 90s...,) but I wouldn't want to actually imagine it, any more than I'd want to actually imagine my daughters having sex, but that's because it's intrusive, not because of age. Regardless, just wanted to remind ya'll that if you make those jokes, some of us old farts will make the jokes right back.

 

Yeah, I was disappointed they de-grayed Blackwall too. I like salt-and-pepper hair.

[Rascoth]

I'd love to have an older love interest in the games and was a little disappointed that we weren't able to flirt with Wynne in Origins (especially when she revealed her preference for younger men) and when got rid of those streaks of grey in Blackwall's hair from his concept art.

 

Yeah, I was disappointed they de-grayed Blackwall too. I like salt-and-pepper hair.

+1 Even his romance tarot card has some grey hair.

 

Alistair was supposed to be a grizzled veteran too, originally.

Really? Look how many things I can learn in one day!

[Ariella]

Oh, I understand, but you have to expect teasing in return because age actually does have everything to do with it. No one gets creeped out at the idea of a pair of 20 year olds having sex unless there's some other major issue. Now, the idea of actually imagining any two other people in the act of having sex always struck me as a bit unusual. I have no trouble with the idea that elderly relatives of mine had active, happy sex lives into their 70s and 80s (I don't think anyone lived into their 90s...,) but I wouldn't want to actually imagine it, any more than I'd want to actually imagine my daughters having sex, but that's because it's intrusive, not because of age. Regardless, just wanted to remind ya'll that if you make those jokes, some of us old farts will make the jokes right back.
 
Yeah, I was disappointed they de-grayed Blackwall too. I like salt-and-pepper hair.

Figured as much, but wanted to be sure. And now that you mention it, not really big one thinking too hard about ANYONE I know having sex.

Fictional couples are fair game. And Blackwall looks grey to me, though it may be the Xbox. It's his voice though that really sells he's older, even without the grey hair. It's not Sean Connery, but it's got the same sort of gravelly touch. And despite knowing his backstory now, Blackwall has a gravitas that speaks of someone who's lived and lived hard.

Cullen always struck me as being young. I've played through the Mage Origin recently and Greg's voice is that of a very unsure, little naive teen. That morphs of course, until we get Cullen in DAI, though there are a few moments were he backslides to that teenager, which is just wonderful.

[Sifr]

Alistair was supposed to be a grizzled veteran too, originally.

I can't find anything that's specific about her age, but I'd put her at about 53-55. Greagoir, I'd say, would be in his early sixties. Irving I would have guessed older than either of them, but it seems that Irving and Wynne were always close friends, so I'd estimate a similar age.

 

I always find it funny that Alistair was written to be a grizzled vet and Varric as a sleazy used car salesman.

 

I like to imagine there's an entire region of the multiverse filled with the bad original concepts like that... so the resident version of Back to the Future starred Dan Ackroyd and Eric Stoltz and instead of a De Lorean, had the time machine in a fridge that would get struck by a nuclear blast. Still, at least that movie showed it was such a stupid idea, it would never get dusted off and reused for another Spielburg-produced project in 20+ years.

 

(If you're curious, our region of the multiverse is the one of bad sequels and reboots)

 

I always figured that Irving is the same age as Wynne, but the stress of the job, couple with the beard adding about 20 years, as well as Steve Blum giving him a gravelly voice, is why he appears to be far older than that. Would have liked to have heard something about Irving and Greagoir in Inquisition and whether they survived the Mage-Templar conflict, it's a shame the Cullen never mentioned them.

[riverbanks]

We now have a birth year for Cullen (9:11 Dragon)

Do we know this for sure? Is this new information post-WoT2?

Because we never did get an exact birth year for him in WoT, and the last we heard of Brienne was only "around thirty," and placing him at exactly 19 in DAO still sounds like a rather literal interpretation of his blurb, which is vague enough that he could still easily be interpreted as quite older than 29 at the time of DAI.

(I know I'm stubborn but until official source comes out to say Cullen is officially and unquestionably 29 in Inquisition, I still think that's way too young and doesn't fit his larger storyline... :3)

[Ariella]

Do we know this for sure? Is this new information post-WoT2?
Because we never did get an exact birth year for him in WoT, and the last we heard of Brienne was only "around thirty," and placing him at exactly 19 in DAO still sounds like a rather literal interpretation of his blurb, which is vague enough that he could still easily be interpreted as quite older than 29 at the time of DAI.
(I know I'm stubborn but until official source comes out to say Cullen is officially and unquestionably 29 in Inquisition, I still think that's way too young and doesn't fit his larger storyline... :3)

Wiki say World of Thedas Vol 2 page 224 as the citation, so I'm think it's legit.

I've never had a problem with him being young, it makes sense to me. First posting and he's pretty much so shiney he squeeks. All the honest wide eyed enthusiasm of someone who believes but hasn't ever been tested.

Then, as so colorfully put in The Matrix, he gets a severe mind job. A templar's worst nightmare gets dropped on him, and somehow he survives with his mind intact.

And now, with what has to be a major case of PTSD, he's sent to a place that supposedly better suits his new outlook on his calling, but really turns out to be the Thedas version of a Hellmouth.

Talking to Cullen post personal quest, he points out that Meredith was feeding his anger, something I have trouble believing she'd be able to do if he was older with more life experience.

* shrug*

[riverbanks]

Wiki say World of Thedas Vol 2 page 224 as the citation, so I'm think it's legit.

Ive never had a problem with him being young, it makes sense to me.

Well I have WoT2 and it does not give an exact date. The relevant page has been posted several times in the thread too. If this birth year comes from the wiki, it has been added there by someone who intepreted Cullen's bio in the most literal way (meaning taking the age at which he decided to be a Templar as a kid as the year he immediately joined the Order as a recruit), but no, it's still not legit canon.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not banging a drum against personal interpretations that he's quite young, only saying that fanon shouldn't be taken for canon, specially when Brienne has gone to great lenghts to stay vague enough that people can interpret the character in whichever way makes them more comfortable. If he makes more sense older to me and younger to you, that's ok, Cullen is a difficult enough character to round up, it's a good thing that Brienne is generous enough to let us stretch him in whatever direction makes more sense for each of us.

Talking to Cullen post personal quest, he points out that Meredith was feeding his anger, something I have trouble believing she'd be able to do if he was older with more life experience.

I'll just have to disagree with this particular point, because it's actually a quite dangerorous assumption to think that older people can not be manipulated or enter abusive relationships (which is essentially what Meredith and Cullen have). There's no magical age threshold or amount of life experience that protects you from being used and emotionally manipulated as Cullen was by someone as cunning as Meredith could be.

Anyway, carry on, I just wanted to make sure no new info had come out about Cullen that I wasn't aware of, and that his age is still up for personal interpretation.

[Ariella]

Well I have WoT2 and it does not give an exact date. The relevant page has been posted several times in the thread too. If this birth year comes from the wiki, it has been added there by someone who intepreted Cullen's bio in the most literal way (meaning taking the age at which he decided to be a Templar as a kid as the year he immediately joined the Order as a recruit), but no, it's still not legit canon.

I'm curious then how they got the year 9:11? That's pretty specific.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not banging a drum against personal interpretations that he's quite young, only saying that fanon shouldn't be taken for canon, specially when Brienne has gone to great lenghts to stay vague enough that people can interpret the character in whichever way makes them more comfortable. If he makes more sense older to me and younger to you, that's ok, Cullen is a difficult enough character to round up, it's a good thing that Brienne is generous enough to let us stretch him in whatever direction makes more sense for each of us.



I'll just have to disagree with this particular point, because it's actually a quite dangerorous assumption to think that older people can not be manipulated or enter abusive relationships (which is essentially what Meredith and Cullen have). There's no magical age threshold or amount of life experience that protects you from being used and emotionally manipulated as Cullen was by someone as cunning as Meredith could be.

Anyway, carry on, I just wanted to make sure no new info had come out about Cullen that I wasn't aware of, and that his age is still up for personal interpretation.

Well, considering that the whole Architect is yet another Magister thing getting dropped on us in WoT after being vaguer than hell, and having absolutely no setup (not that I'm bitter or annoyed or anything or just loath the character on general principle) I have no problem believing they dropped a year on us for Cullen, even if she was trying to be vague. That and the year is very specific, unlike Hawke whose estimated to be 24-25 at the beginning of DA 2, per David Gaider iirc. Then there's the fact there's a citation, which is specific. There's also the fact that prior to WoT 2 coming out his background information was sparse. Mentioning only Mia, and two other sibs but no names. That's been expanded including things like the fact that Mia was Cullen's biggest supporter when he decided to become a Templar, after initial ribbing at least. It also mentions he was eight when he announced that fact.

So either someone is serving up a rather large piece of bull, considering the specifics of the whole thing, and no one has called them or it's a thing. As I said, 9:11 is pretty specific and I don't see anyone pulling that out of thin air.

As for his age. Yes, any age can be manipulated, but that doesn't strike me as Cullen. Considering the fact he did make it through Broken Circle without turning into a player character from Call of Cthulhu, he's got a hell of a lot of metal to him. If this had happened to him five maybe ten years down the road, I doubt Meredith would have been able to play him. There still needed to be just enough uncertainty, just enough vulnerability that Meredith could use.

It's as much a question of life experience as age, but Cullen doesn't strike me as having enough experience in DAO either. I have trouble believing that a templar could be in the Order for any period longer than say a year without coming up against the grim realities such as failed Harrowings. He's not haunted enough when he talks to the mage warden about it. It's an intellectual thing. The only way a templar could be as shiny and wided eyed as he is in the Mage Origin is if he hasn't been tested yet.

[SgtSteel91]

Were there any scenes with Cullen you didn't like or wanted to change? For me, I didn't like how angry he got when you allied with the Mages. For someone who says they are trying to distance themselves from Kirkwall and the Templars and who says that they were wrong for distrusting Mages so much, he sure is acting like how he was in DA2, which doesn't show much growth at all.

 

If I could change it, it could be him not be as angry over it as he was originally but just debating about having Templars watch the allied Mages in case of abominations and not "It's not a matter for debate, there will be abominations among them." And not yelling at the Inquisitor what they were think "turning Mages lose with no oversight" but something like "I'm glad you foiled the Magister's trap but you really should have discussed offering an alliance with the Mages with us first," like how he is at the end of Champions of the Just.

[Ariella]

Were there any scenes with Cullen you didn't like or wanted to change? For me, I didn't like how angry he got when you allied with the Mages. For someone who says they are trying to distance themselves from Kirkwall and the Templars and who says that they were wrong for distrusting Mages so much, he sure is acting like how he was in DA2, which doesn't show much growth at all.

People backslide sometimes, and he does have legitimate issues. Vivienne brings it up as well, that the Breach will attract demons to everyone, not just mages. There's a huge risk of possession and the Inquisition just doesn't have enough templars to fight it.

Cullen's always struck me as the kind of person who channels their fear into anger, because anger is easier to deal with. Not saying that's healthy, but that's my read. And thus you have very pissed off Cullen watching a massive horde of mages come over the horizon and not enough templars to deal with problems if things go sideways.

For me, I would have liked to know what the hell the four Inquisition leaders were arguing about after Haven. Freaking stupid of all of them to be having it out in the middle of camp. You'd think Cullen or Cassandra would know that such a show would be bad for morale.

Otherwise my complaints are mostly needing a little tweek here and there, a rough edge needing sanding.

[Tishina]

Well I have WoT2 and it does not give an exact date. The relevant page has been posted several times in the thread too. If this birth year comes from the wiki, it has been added there by someone who intepreted Cullen's bio in the most literal way (meaning taking the age at which he decided to be a Templar as a kid as the year he immediately joined the Order as a recruit), but no, it's still not legit canon.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not banging a drum against personal interpretations that he's quite young, only saying that fanon shouldn't be taken for canon, specially when Brienne has gone to great lenghts to stay vague enough that people can interpret the character in whichever way makes them more comfortable. If he makes more sense older to me and younger to you, that's ok, Cullen is a difficult enough character to round up, it's a good thing that Brienne is generous enough to let us stretch him in whatever direction makes more sense for each of us.



I'll just have to disagree with this particular point, because it's actually a quite dangerorous assumption to think that older people can not be manipulated or enter abusive relationships (which is essentially what Meredith and Cullen have). There's no magical age threshold or amount of life experience that protects you from being used and emotionally manipulated as Cullen was by someone as cunning as Meredith could be.

Anyway, carry on, I just wanted to make sure no new info had come out about Cullen that I wasn't aware of, and that his age is still up for personal interpretation.

Thank you, I was trying to think how to say that. A lot of people continue to let themselves be manipulated or abused in very similar ways throughout their lives, depending on why they're manipulable in the first place. Experience can make a difference, but not always.

 

I personally headcannon him at least a couple of years older than 30 because until DAI came out, I thought he'd been in his mid-20s in DAO because of his appearance, then his position of authority in DA2 (I know people who aren't much more comfortable with flirting than he was in DAO in their 60s  ) But that doesn't make other people's view of him as 30 or even a couple of years younger any less valid. As Riverbanks said, Brianne intentionally left it a bit vague. I admit I was a little startled at the "official" birth year since I didn't remember anything in his WoT2 entry that was specific and seemed to contradict Brianne's statement, but it wouldn't be the first time.

[Ariella]

Thank you, I was trying to think how to say that. A lot of people continue to let themselves be manipulated or abused in very similar ways throughout their lives, depending on why they're manipulable in the first place. Experience can make a difference, but not always.

You're right, and somebody pops right into my head for this: Sam Seaborn. A senior advisor to the President, he's somehow still extremely idealistic and he's gotten played on a number of occasions because of it.

On the other end of the spectrum you have say Jimmy the Hand from the Riftwar series. Saw his mother murdered before his eyes, raised by a guild of thieves. Because of that hard experience, he's not easily manipulated, even when the people doing the manipulating are doing it to keep him safe.

 

I personally headcannon him at least a couple of years older than 30 because until DAI came out, I thought he'd been in his mid-20s in DAO because of his appearance, then his position of authority in DA2 (I know people who aren't much more comfortable with flirting than he was in DAO in their 60s  ) But that doesn't make other people's view of him as 30 or even a couple of years younger any less valid. As Riverbanks said, Brianne intentionally left it a bit vague. I admit I was a little startled at the "official" birth year since I didn't remember anything in his WoT2 entry that was specific and seemed to contradict Brianne's statement, but it wouldn't be the first time.

As I said, considering the citation and the fact his bio was greatly expanded based on WoT references, plus the specifics of the year, I just have a problem believing those numbers were pulled out of someone's...

Generally I'd be willing to go as high as twenty one, but for the fact some of the polish we saw in Origins would have come off.

And, God forgive me, I'm now seeing Ann Bancroft as Meredith. I know it didn't happen that way, but Mrs. Robinson is iconic as the abusive older woman.

[BevH]

His writer, Brianne Battye, stated that Cullen is around 30ish in DAI. Cullen states that he was 18 when he took his final vows. From this, I'm assuming he was about 19 during DAO. *shrugs*

[Vanalia]

I started again DA2 (need to finish DA:I first, of course), this time in english so I can hear Greg's voice 

 

I forgot a lot of things about that game, but I remembered Kirkwall and the Gallows. 

 

I never sided with Mages in DAI, so I wonder when Cullen gets angry? at the war table?

Oh, and I have another question: are there scenes we can't see when we romance Cullen, but where Cullen appears? (like the scene with him entering the bedroom where the IQ and Iron Bull are, in Iron Bull's romance)

[Rascoth]

I never sided with Mages in DAI, so I wonder when Cullen gets angry? at the war table?

Oh, and I have another question: are there scenes we can't see when we romance Cullen, but where Cullen appears? (like the scene with him entering the bedroom where the IQ and Iron Bull are, in Iron Bull's romance)

Yep, if you ally with them, he gets a bit angry when you return from Redcliffe.

There's that one from IB romance. I don't remember one like that from Blackwall romance nor Solas romance. Can't tell about other romances or no-romance Quizzy.